How Much Have You Had To Unlearn About Thailand?

[aneliane]

Most of my Thai female friends/colleagues have often admitted they think Thai guys are, overall, not that nice. They say it is normal for Thai guys to have affairs while in a relationship and to go out drinking most nights and domestic violence is fairly common too.

Of course Thais are racist! They are obsessed with skin colour, all Thai models and superstars are light-skinned regardless of whether they are actually beautiful or not. People are still employed here based on colour of skin, how is that not racist? Kids are often bullied if they have dark skin, not racist?

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Well most of your friends/colleagues are lying to you. Perhaps to make you feel better about something because, guess what, most Thai women end up with - wait for it - Thai men. Period

Their obsession with fair-skin has little to do with racism and almost everything to do with their idea of what is beautiful. I dunno about you but I've certainly seen dark-skinned Thais in high-ranking government and private sector posts.

Sorry but you should open your mind a little more

We've been here for a similar amount of time, what makes your opinion more 'right' than mine? I was replying to your initial post with my opinion based on what I've seen, heard and experienced myself, I don't need to open my mind any more. My time hasn't been spent in BKK, it has been up North so maybe that is why we have a different opinion or maybe it is you who needs to open your mind, your eyes too!

So every Thai girl/woman that told me Thai men are mai dee lied did they? For what purpose? That is their opinion based on what they have seen and experienced and comes from a wide range of females including successful businesswomen, university students, university professors & school teachers, single, married, divorced, unemployed, straight, Tom etc And of course most Thai women end up with Thai men as the vast majority of the male population are, guess what, Thai! I'm sure if I lived in Spain I would have a Spanish partner, if I lived in Japan I'd have a Japanese partner. Many (not all) of my Thai male friends/colleagues who have a steady girlfriend or wife have giks or a mia noi and those that don't wouldn't think twice about having a one-night-stand, sure this happens in every country but nothing like as much as here, it is pretty much condoned here and accepted as normal.

I know fair-skin is considered as beautiful here but that doesn't mean it is OK to employ someone based on the shade of their skin rather than their education, skills or ability. It doesn't mean it is OK for kids to bully their classmates who have dark skin. It doesn't mean a grandmother should say her beautiul 2yr old grandaughter isn't beautiful because she has dark skin, I've witnessed that twice in just the last few weeks in different families. Yes, there are some Thais who have dark skin that are in prominent positions but that doesn't mean that Thai sociey isn't racist because it is and, again, it is accepted as normal. There are very few countries where such blatant racism in everyday life and in places like schools, universities and a place of work would go unquestioned or unpunished.

Of course they are not racists, when the military officers make my student stand for 3 hours in the sun it must surely be because he's farang, that's only to give him a tan, so he look less farang right?

[farang000999]

The 'Thai men' are no good thing is a rumor perpetuated by bar girl types who are looking for a farang. It is basically true, but only in the context of their own experience. Most have been abandoned by a husband and the kids are up north with Granny. There may be good Thai men out there but they probably wouldn't be interested in a single mother. Also, any Thai male I have been around close enough has been unfaithful to his wife. This is a very paternal society and the whole 'Thai men' are no good is not soley a fairy tale cooked up for farang.

Edited May 27, 2012 by farang000999

[Ulysses G.]

I know fair-skin is considered as beautiful here but that doesn't mean it is OK to employ someone based on the shade of their skin rather than their education, skills or ability. It doesn't mean it is OK for kids to bully their classmates who have dark skin. It doesn't mean a grandmother should say her beautiul 2yr old grandaughter isn't beautiful because she has dark skin, I've witnessed that twice in just the last few weeks in different families. Yes, there are some Thais who have dark skin that are in prominent positions but that doesn't mean that Thai sociey isn't racist because it is and, again, it is accepted as normal. There are very few countries where such blatant racism in everyday life and in places like schools, universities and a place of work would go unquestioned or unpunished.

Thinking that fair skin is more attractive than dark skin is not "racism". It may be rather silly, but fashion often is.

Edited May 27, 2012 by Ulysses G.

[Rsquared]

I know fair-skin is considered as beautiful here but that doesn't mean it is OK to employ someone based on the shade of their skin rather than their education, skills or ability. It doesn't mean it is OK for kids to bully their classmates who have dark skin. It doesn't mean a grandmother should say her beautiul 2yr old grandaughter isn't beautiful because she has dark skin, I've witnessed that twice in just the last few weeks in different families. Yes, there are some Thais who have dark skin that are in prominent positions but that doesn't mean that Thai sociey isn't racist because it is and, again, it is accepted as normal. There are very few countries where such blatant racism in everyday life and in places like schools, universities and a place of work would go unquestioned or unpunished.

Thinking that fair skin is more attractive than dark skin is not "racism". It may be rather silly, but fashion often is.

All you need to do is glance at some commercials.....

In Oz they have skin creams to give you that "all over tan" look....

here in LOS there are skin whitening creams.....go figure

[poanoi]

The 'Thai men' are no good thing is a rumor perpetuated by bar girl types who are looking for a farang. It is basically true, but only in the context of their own experience. Most have been abandoned by a husband and the kids are up north with Granny. There may be good Thai men out there but they probably wouldn't be interested in a single mother. Also, any Thai male I have been around close enough has been unfaithful to his wife. This is a very paternal society and the whole 'Thai men' are no good is not soley a fairy tale cooked up for farang.

Yes that's true, but also every male falang i've been around here in Thailand is unfaithful to his rented wife/gf.

So perhaps the answer to this is in fact thai woman ?

Edited May 27, 2012 by poanoi

[skybluestu]

I know fair-skin is considered as beautiful here but that doesn't mean it is OK to employ someone based on the shade of their skin rather than their education, skills or ability. It doesn't mean it is OK for kids to bully their classmates who have dark skin. It doesn't mean a grandmother should say her beautiul 2yr old grandaughter isn't beautiful because she has dark skin, I've witnessed that twice in just the last few weeks in different families. Yes, there are some Thais who have dark skin that are in prominent positions but that doesn't mean that Thai sociey isn't racist because it is and, again, it is accepted as normal. There are very few countries where such blatant racism in everyday life and in places like schools, universities and a place of work would go unquestioned or unpunished.

Thinking that fair skin is more attractive than dark skin is not "racism". It may be rather silly, but fashion often is.

No that in itself isn't racist but being prejudiced towards someone because they have dark skin is and that happens on a daily basis here.

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[skybluestu]

The 'Thai men' are no good thing is a rumor perpetuated by bar girl types who are looking for a farang. It is basically true, but only in the context of their own experience. Most have been abandoned by a husband and the kids are up north with Granny. There may be good Thai men out there but they probably wouldn't be interested in a single mother. Also, any Thai male I have been around close enough has been unfaithful to his wife. This is a very paternal society and the whole 'Thai men' are no good is not soley a fairy tale cooked up for farang.

When I've heard negative comments about Thai men they haven't come from bar girls. Nurse, Teacher, Professor, Bank worker, Student, Housewife to name just a few but no bar girls, sorry.

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[canuckamuck]

Women saying men are pigs! That must be a Thai thing, I have never heard that before...

Edited May 27, 2012 by canuckamuck

[bendix]

Women saying men are pigs! That must be a Thai thing, I have never heard that before...

The thing I've had to unlearn is that other foreigners love Thailand as much as I do, yet bizarrely decide to stick around growing more bitter, angry, resentful and superior without doing anything about it.

[cooked]

Of course Thais are racist! They are obsessed with skin colour, all Thai models and superstars are light-skinned regardless of whether they are actually beautiful or not. People are still employed here based on colour of skin, how is that not racist? Kids are often bullied if they have dark skin, not racist?

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As far as I was aware, having dark skin indicates that you work in a field and are therefore a XXXXXX peasant. Wearing a hat against the sun is also considered to be peasant behaviour which is why you see chicks crossing the road with their laptops perched on their heads. Strange thing is that perversely, you sometimes see ladies working in the fields with hats, which they then take off when they go to town. I had difficulty persuading my wife to wear a hat but she looks really cool with it, she now likes it.

Edited May 27, 2012 by Rooo

[DrTuner]

Luckily when I first came here I knew FA, never had visited any internet forums nor read lonely planet. Got to make my own observations. I fully recommend the same to anyone planning their first trip.

[SimonD]

Luckily when I first came here I knew FA, never had visited any internet forums nor read lonely planet. Got to make my own observations. I fully recommend the same to anyone planning their first trip.

Think you have contradicted yourself with the last sentence but agree with the sentiment.

I also came here on a whim without any preconceptions and learned as I went along. Nothing to unlearn as such. Good to keep an open mind.

[Trembly]

From my own personal experience I only agree with number 1 from the 3 things you have had to unlearn and even then only to a certain extent as many Thais do believe all farang are rich.

Most of my Thai female friends/colleagues have often admitted they think Thai guys are, overall, not that nice. They say it is normal for Thai guys to have affairs while in a relationship and to go out drinking most nights and domestic violence is fairly common too.

Of course Thais are racist! They are obsessed with skin colour, all Thai models and superstars are light-skinned regardless of whether they are actually beautiful or not. People are still employed here based on colour of skin, how is that not racist? Kids are often bullied if they have dark skin, not racist?

Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect App

What has racism got to do with the fact that some Thais have dark skin while other Thais happen to prefer white skin for socio-economic or genetic reasons?

I grew up in Thailand and I've never seen anybody being bullied for having dark skin. Ribbed, teased, made fun of like fat kids, skinny kids, kids with thick glasses, kids with weird teeth, kids that are unusually small, kids that are unusually big, kids with speech impediments, yes - but never bullied exclusively for being dark.

[Trembly]

I know fair-skin is considered as beautiful here but that doesn't mean it is OK to employ someone based on the shade of their skin rather than their education, skills or ability. It doesn't mean it is OK for kids to bully their classmates who have dark skin. It doesn't mean a grandmother should say her beautiul 2yr old grandaughter isn't beautiful because she has dark skin, I've witnessed that twice in just the last few weeks in different families. Yes, there are some Thais who have dark skin that are in prominent positions but that doesn't mean that Thai sociey isn't racist because it is and, again, it is accepted as normal. There are very few countries where such blatant racism in everyday life and in places like schools, universities and a place of work would go unquestioned or unpunished.

Thinking that fair skin is more attractive than dark skin is not "racism". It may be rather silly, but fashion often is.

Not withstanding the inevitable common-reference-point adherents, it can also be a genuine attraction to genes that they want to make babies with.

[canuckamuck]

If they were pale they would want tans, human nature. The world of marketing makes sure we are unhappy in our own skin.

[eeeya]

Reading the Stickman website has damaged me.... dont know why anyone comes here after reading that website.

[LucidLucifer]

Luckily when I first came here I knew FA, never had visited any internet forums nor read lonely planet. Got to make my own observations. I fully recommend the same to anyone planning their first trip.

Personally I think you'd be making a mistake not to do your research on a place before visiting, you'd be leaving yourself open to a whole myriad of pitfalls and problems.

My advice would be to do your research, but go with an open mind.

[farang000999]

From my own personal experience I only agree with number 1 from the 3 things you have had to unlearn and even then only to a certain extent as many Thais do believe all farang are rich.

Most of my Thai female friends/colleagues have often admitted they think Thai guys are, overall, not that nice. They say it is normal for Thai guys to have affairs while in a relationship and to go out drinking most nights and domestic violence is fairly common too.

Of course Thais are racist! They are obsessed with skin colour, all Thai models and superstars are light-skinned regardless of whether they are actually beautiful or not. People are still employed here based on colour of skin, how is that not racist? Kids are often bullied if they have dark skin, not racist?

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What has racism got to do with the fact that some Thais have dark skin while other Thais happen to prefer white skin for socio-economic or genetic reasons?

I grew up in Thailand and I've never seen anybody being bullied for having dark skin. Ribbed, teased, made fun of like fat kids, skinny kids, kids with thick glasses, kids with weird teeth, kids that are unusually small, kids that are unusually big, kids with speech impediments, yes - but never bullied exclusively for being dark.

lol

um

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[skybluestu]

From my own personal experience I only agree with number 1 from the 3 things you have had to unlearn and even then only to a certain extent as many Thais do believe all farang are rich.

Most of my Thai female friends/colleagues have often admitted they think Thai guys are, overall, not that nice. They say it is normal for Thai guys to have affairs while in a relationship and to go out drinking most nights and domestic violence is fairly common too.

Of course Thais are racist! They are obsessed with skin colour, all Thai models and superstars are light-skinned regardless of whether they are actually beautiful or not. People are still employed here based on colour of skin, how is that not racist? Kids are often bullied if they have dark skin, not racist?

Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect App

What has racism got to do with the fact that some Thais have dark skin while other Thais happen to prefer white skin for socio-economic or genetic reasons?

I grew up in Thailand and I've never seen anybody being bullied for having dark skin. Ribbed, teased, made fun of like fat kids, skinny kids, kids with thick glasses, kids with weird teeth, kids that are unusually small, kids that are unusually big, kids with speech impediments, yes - but never bullied exclusively for being dark.

Sorry, you are right, there is no racism in Thai society whatsoever! There is a lot of prejudice towards people with dark skin from childhood right up to adulthood, people are often employed based on the lightness of their skin rather than their educational achievements, ability, personality, experience etc and people with dark skin aren't considered beautiful/handsome but none of that, plus a lot of other negative experiences people with dark skin have to put up with, means Thai people are racist. Now I understand, thank you.

[richard_smith237]

The logic in the myth that Thai women in general have negative feelings towards Thai men is fundamentally flawed, its quite obvious why.....

Any Thai lady with a decent Thai man is likely to remain with him and be quite happy about it. These very same women are not exactly clawing at the heels of westerners to date them and discuss their relationships... thus, in general as a group we as Westerners will only hear one negative perspective from those scorned women we might meet, the less intelligent of us will continue to perpetuate the myth.

What have I had to unlearn... That westerners are generally better educated with a greater level of common sense... this most certainly is not the case, ThaiVisa.com provides numerous examples of this all too often, perpetuation of daft myths being just one example....

[eeeya]

First encounters with thailand and its people are mostly with north eastern people, who are working in the tourist industry giving the feeling that the tourist dollar is the back bone of thailand and it would most certainly fail if not for the all mighty tourist.

[HardenedSoul]

Most of my Thai female friends/colleagues have often admitted they think Thai guys are, overall, not that nice. They say it is normal for Thai guys to have affairs while in a relationship and to go out drinking most nights and domestic violence is fairly common too.

Of course Thais are racist! They are obsessed with skin colour, all Thai models and superstars are light-skinned regardless of whether they are actually beautiful or not. People are still employed here based on colour of skin, how is that not racist? Kids are often bullied if they have dark skin, not racist?

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Well most of your friends/colleagues are lying to you. Perhaps to make you feel better about something because, guess what, most Thai women end up with - wait for it - Thai men. Period

Their obsession with fair-skin has little to do with racism and almost everything to do with their idea of what is beautiful. I dunno about you but I've certainly seen dark-skinned Thais in high-ranking government and private sector posts.

Sorry but you should open your mind a little more

We've been here for a similar amount of time, what makes your opinion more 'right' than mine? I was replying to your initial post with my opinion based on what I've seen, heard and experienced myself, I don't need to open my mind any more. My time hasn't been spent in BKK, it has been up North so maybe that is why we have a different opinion or maybe it is you who needs to open your mind, your eyes too!

So every Thai girl/woman that told me Thai men are mai dee lied did they? For what purpose? That is their opinion based on what they have seen and experienced and comes from a wide range of females including successful businesswomen, university students, university professors & school teachers, single, married, divorced, unemployed, straight, Tom etc And of course most Thai women end up with Thai men as the vast majority of the male population are, guess what, Thai! I'm sure if I lived in Spain I would have a Spanish partner, if I lived in Japan I'd have a Japanese partner. Many (not all) of my Thai male friends/colleagues who have a steady girlfriend or wife have giks or a mia noi and those that don't wouldn't think twice about having a one-night-stand, sure this happens in every country but nothing like as much as here, it is pretty much condoned here and accepted as normal.

I know fair-skin is considered as beautiful here but that doesn't mean it is OK to employ someone based on the shade of their skin rather than their education, skills or ability. It doesn't mean it is OK for kids to bully their classmates who have dark skin. It doesn't mean a grandmother should say her beautiul 2yr old grandaughter isn't beautiful because she has dark skin, I've witnessed that twice in just the last few weeks in different families. Yes, there are some Thais who have dark skin that are in prominent positions but that doesn't mean that Thai sociey isn't racist because it is and, again, it is accepted as normal. There are very few countries where such blatant racism in everyday life and in places like schools, universities and a place of work would go unquestioned or unpunished.

My opinion certainly isn't more valid than yours but it is based on my perceptions as a black man in BKK so maybe the divergence in our experiences has its roots in our locations. Nevertheless, I stand by my assertion that the overwhelming majority of Thai women do NOT think that Thai men are no good. I would venture that their lamentations are primarily based on the age-old war of the sexes and an erroneous "grass-is-greener" perception associated with foreign guys than any particular tendency among Thai men for being "bad".

I very much doubt that many wives actually condone their husband's acquisition of a mia noi. Isn't it more likely they begrudgingly accept her existence as the price of holding a family unit together provided it's kept very much on the downlow and doesn't result in a loss of face?

[TommoPhysicist]

My opinion certainly isn't more valid than yours but it is based on my perceptions as a black man in BKK ......

No your experience is as a foreigner in BKK who happens to have black skin.

Black men of the foreign variety usually get treated very well in Thailand.

Black men, dark brown men (Hill Tribe), and people who don't speak proper Thai' get treated in a very different way.

Edited May 27, 2012 by TommoPhysicist

[skybluestu]

My opinion certainly isn't more valid than yours but it is based on my perceptions as a black man in BKK ......

No your experience is as a foreigner in BKK who happens to have black skin.

Black men of the foreign variety usually get treated very well in Thailand.

Black men, dark brown men (Hill Tribe), and people who don't speak proper Thai' get treated in a very different way.

Exactly! Just because the OP hasn't personally experienced any racism himself doesn't mean Thais aren't racist. I had a good friend from LA who was black and living in Chiang Mai but he recently went home, one of the main reasons was constantly being called farang dum and hearing comments like 'dum mak mak' while out shopping or at restaurants by kids whose parents just laughed.

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[garrya]

Most of my Thai female friends/colleagues have often admitted they think Thai guys are, overall, not that nice. They say it is normal for Thai guys to have affairs while in a relationship and to go out drinking most nights and domestic violence is fairly common too.

Of course Thais are racist! They are obsessed with skin colour, all Thai models and superstars are light-skinned regardless of whether they are actually beautiful or not. People are still employed here based on colour of skin, how is that not racist? Kids are often bullied if they have dark skin, not racist?

Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect App

Well most of your friends/colleagues are lying to you. Perhaps to make you feel better about something because, guess what, most Thai women end up with - wait for it - Thai men. Period

Their obsession with fair-skin has little to do with racism and almost everything to do with their idea of what is beautiful. I dunno about you but I've certainly seen dark-skinned Thais in high-ranking government and private sector posts.

Sorry but you should open your mind a little more

We've been here for a similar amount of time, what makes your opinion more 'right' than mine? I was replying to your initial post with my opinion based on what I've seen, heard and experienced myself, I don't need to open my mind any more. My time hasn't been spent in BKK, it has been up North so maybe that is why we have a different opinion or maybe it is you who needs to open your mind, your eyes too!

So every Thai girl/woman that told me Thai men are mai dee lied did they? For what purpose? That is their opinion based on what they have seen and experienced and comes from a wide range of females including successful businesswomen, university students, university professors & school teachers, single, married, divorced, unemployed, straight, Tom etc And of course most Thai women end up with Thai men as the vast majority of the male population are, guess what, Thai! I'm sure if I lived in Spain I would have a Spanish partner, if I lived in Japan I'd have a Japanese partner. Many (not all) of my Thai male friends/colleagues who have a steady girlfriend or wife have giks or a mia noi and those that don't wouldn't think twice about having a one-night-stand, sure this happens in every country but nothing like as much as here, it is pretty much condoned here and accepted as normal.

I know fair-skin is considered as beautiful here but that doesn't mean it is OK to employ someone based on the shade of their skin rather than their education, skills or ability. It doesn't mean it is OK for kids to bully their classmates who have dark skin. It doesn't mean a grandmother should say her beautiul 2yr old grandaughter isn't beautiful because she has dark skin, I've witnessed that twice in just the last few weeks in different families. Yes, there are some Thais who have dark skin that are in prominent positions but that doesn't mean that Thai sociey isn't racist because it is and, again, it is accepted as normal. There are very few countries where such blatant racism in everyday life and in places like schools, universities and a place of work would go unquestioned or unpunished.

My opinion certainly isn't more valid than yours but it is based on my perceptions as a black man in BKK so maybe the divergence in our experiences has its roots in our locations. Nevertheless, I stand by my assertion that the overwhelming majority of Thai women do NOT think that Thai men are no good. I would venture that their lamentations are primarily based on the age-old war of the sexes and an erroneous "grass-is-greener" perception associated with foreign guys than any particular tendency among Thai men for being "bad".

I very much doubt that many wives actually condone their husband's acquisition of a mia noi. Isn't it more likely they begrudgingly accept her existence as the price of holding a family unit together provided it's kept very much on the downlow and doesn't result in a loss of face?

Mia Noi is condoned when the husband supports the primary wife. In this society it all depends on the money. Well-to-do Thai men tend to have mia noi (who is normally younger) sooner or later that the primary wife doesn't like, but accepts if supported properly. Poorer guys can't afford mia noi (they would also want), so they drink and have affairs instead.

At the beginning, I thought having a "mia noi" is a myth but unlearnt it after a while. It is a rampant phenomenon of the country.

[barefoot1988]

phuket wasn't what i was expecting when i went there

[Berkshire]

Poorer guys can't afford mia noi (they would also want), so they drink and have affairs instead.

This is one of the things that has always fascinated me. That is, how on Earth can these dirt poor Thai guys without a satang to their name, manage to have multiple affairs while already in a relationship with a young Thai gal? I mean, if they're doing this all over Thailand, there must be a ga-zillion young hotties willing to go with these poor, married, alcoholics, no? I mean, your typical farang has to pay out-the-a** and these girls don't even hang around most of the time. So how DO these guys do it?? Hmmmm.

[eek]

Thai men actually have a lot of charm. They know how to "Paak waan" women very well. The women then are either dumb enough to swallow and lap up the bs, or like him enough to pretend. Charming bsing men have successfully seduced (dumb, or lonely, or horny) women for centuries. Nothing new.

[aneliane]

Thai men actually have a lot of charm. They know how to "Paak waan" women very well. The women then are either dumb enough to swallow and lap up the bs, or like him enough to pretend. Charming bsing men have successfully seduced (dumb, or lonely, or horny) women for centuries. Nothing new.

Wait, I am confused

Is that the part you had to "unlearn"?

...Or you mean it lol !

[poanoi]

The women then are either dumb enough to swallow

Lets not denigrate woman who swallow,

more power to them