Holland Euro 2012

[rickthailand]

The Dutch are skating on very thin ice now. They will have to get at least a draw against Germany. Van Persie was very poor today.

they had so many chances but if it doesnt go in what does it matter

[LuckyLew]

Such a good team when you look at the individuals

IMO the big problem you have came out last night

When the Dutch go behind, Robben decides he wants

to be the hero and he forgets how to pass the ball.

It happens all the time with him even when playing for

Bayern.

His team goes behind, he forgets how to pass, he goes

to the side, tries to dribble back into the middle and he

shoots .................. way wide too often

Happened v Chelsea and happen again last night

[smokie36]

Spot on there luckylew. Still it was a clear penalty at the end. Well done to the Danish defence, and the keeper in particular.

[SantiSuk]

The Dutch are skating on very thin ice now. They will have to get at least a draw against Germany. Van Persie was very poor today.

Actually I could see Germany winning all their games and the others all getting 3 points - in which case Netherlands could qualify on goal difference (or whatever the criteria is) without getting any points from Germany. Works if Netherlands beats Portugal and Portugal beats Denmark and Germany beats Denmark. Each of those scenarios individually sound the most likely result, but football never works like that of course.

Pedant

Kantharalak

[MiG16]

We weren't very sharp at the front. Lots of chances and nearly but...

And yes about Robben. I was ready to strangle him!

[carmine]

Doesn't look like this threads going to run for long!

Last couple of times i've watched Robben play he's looks like a total liability. The guy just isn't a team player.

[Abrak]

The Dutch are skating on very thin ice now. They will have to get at least a draw against Germany. Van Persie was very poor today.

Actually I could see Germany winning all their games and the others all getting 3 points - in which case Netherlands could qualify on goal difference (or whatever the criteria is) without getting any points from Germany. Works if Netherlands beats Portugal and Portugal beats Denmark and Germany beats Denmark. Each of those scenarios individually sound the most likely result, but football never works like that of course.

Pedant

Kantharalak

The rules of qualification are quite complicated but head to head takes first priority. So, on that basis, Denmark only really need a draw tonight to force Holland to need a win against Germany to qualify. In any case, it should be a cracking match.

[SantiSuk]

The Dutch are skating on very thin ice now. They will have to get at least a draw against Germany. Van Persie was very poor today.

Actually I could see Germany winning all their games and the others all getting 3 points - in which case Netherlands could qualify on goal difference (or whatever the criteria is) without getting any points from Germany. Works if Netherlands beats Portugal and Portugal beats Denmark and Germany beats Denmark. Each of those scenarios individually sound the most likely result, but football never works like that of course.

Pedant

Kantharalak

The rules of qualification are quite complicated but head to head takes first priority. So, on that basis, Denmark only really need a draw tonight to force Holland to need a win against Germany to qualify. In any case, it should be a cracking match.

Interesting (to geeks like us). I looked up the competition rules. We are both wrong I think

Head to head (the first criteria to look to in a level points situation) means that you look to the result only of the teams on level points, so if Denmark had drawn against Portugal, Holland would have only needed a draw against Germany and a win against Denmark.

If Germany end on 9 and all others on 3 - as looks increasingly likely as I write at half time in the Germany v Holland game - then none of the three level teams will have gone through using the first head to head criteria and you would then look to the second criteria - goal difference. As I read the competition rules ("superior goal difference in the matches among the teams in question (if more than two teams finish equal on points)"), only the goals scored between the three runners up would figure in the goal difference calculation, so Holland could be trounced by Germany and still go through if they achieve a higher goal difference than the Danes and Portugese, counting only the matches between the three of them.

[salty]

That would be what I understand as well.

[SantiSuk]

The Dutch are dead if Germany soft peddle to a draw against Denmark in some deal to get both teams through with a chance to rest the heavy guns, or (more likely) in an on-pitch decision by both teams to avoid banging heads in the later stages. Somehow I can't see that being in the German mentality.

If Germany play to win against Denmark the Dutch are very much still in it - perhaps the press have not focussed on the competition rules.

Edited June 14, 2012 by SantiSuk

[smokie36]

Holland weren't bad...the German keeper had a good game I thought. If they are to qualify they need to dtart taking more of their chances and get players forward quicker.

Lethargic on the whole so far I'm afraid.

[Sophon]

Interesting (to geeks like us). I looked up the competition rules. We are both wrong I think

Head to head (the first criteria to look to in a level points situation) means that you look to the result only of the teams on level points, so if Denmark had drawn against Portugal, Holland would have only needed a draw against Germany and a win against Denmark.

But since Holland is meeting Portugal and not Denmark in the last round (they have already lost to Denmark), had Denmark drawn against Portugal a draw for Holland against Germany would have done them no good.

But all that is academic now. Holland will probably need a two goal win against portugal and hope that Denmark don't get a draw or better against Germany in the last match.

Sophon

[StevieH]

The Dutch are dead if Germany soft peddle to a draw against Denmark in some deal to get both teams through with a chance to rest the heavy guns, or (more likely) in an on-pitch decision by both teams to avoid banging heads in the later stages. Somehow I can't see that being in the German mentality.

If Germany play to win against Denmark the Dutch are very much still in it - perhaps the press have not focussed on the competition rules.

in italy they call that a 'biscotto', where both teams have an understanding about the result of the match. think germany have form in that regard don't they? '82 world cup? albeit they were west germany then.

[MiG16]

Last chance. If we don't win this one, then I guess I can have early nights for the next couple of weeks

[smokie36]

Last chance. If we don't win this one, then I guess I can have early nights for the next couple of weeks

Best of luck migsy....I think you'll need it against the Portuguese!

[MB1]

Interesting (to geeks like us). I looked up the competition rules. We are both wrong I think

Head to head (the first criteria to look to in a level points situation) means that you look to the result only of the teams on level points, so if Denmark had drawn against Portugal, Holland would have only needed a draw against Germany and a win against Denmark.

But since Holland is meeting Portugal and not Denmark in the last round (they have already lost to Denmark), had Denmark drawn against Portugal a draw for Holland against Germany would have done them no good.

But all that is academic now. Holland will probably need a two goal win against portugal and hope that Denmark don't get a draw or better against Germany in the last match.

Sophon

Well it went like this. Germany 2 Denmark 1.

Portugal 2 Holland 1.

Sent from my GT-N7000 using Thaivisa Connect App

[cardholder]

A pale shadow of the Dutch Masters of the past.

Good to see Ronaldo finally hitting good form.

[nev]

Bloody miss Ronaldo !!! two well taken goals and back on form and Nani was excellent too, have to fancy Portugal after that performance.

The Dutch well what can you say out without a win with all those stars in the team. but to be fair they was in the hardest group.

[StevieH]

dear ronaldo, please enjoy the freedom of the pitch and just attack as you like, we won't bother trying to defend against you or mark you or anything. yours, the dutch team.

shocking stuff from the oranje really. proper basics.

[SantiSuk]

I wonder which way the Chinese and Malaysian big money was being bet prior to the tournament. The Dutch were so bad I suspect match fixing!

Their midfield (VdV excepted) did not show up last night so the ball rarely reached the strikers. When the midfield (Van Der Vaert, Scneider and Robben) got the ball they took it up front and had a shot themselves - greedy ba$tards. Wesley Schneider - most disappointing player of the tournament.

For years to come coaches will be using videos of the Dutch series of 3 games to demonstrate what happens when great individual players lose their sense of team-play.

The Portugese have been very good at the back and middle all tournament - most impressed by their back 4 (Pepe you expect but Alves was great too). Mereles has been immense in midfield

[StevieH]

heard a think this morning which was surprising and interesting - the holland team last night had players from eleven different clubs in it. so no club partnerships, relationships at all etc. which has got to impact on your fluidity and cohesion.

[carmine]

I wonder which way the Chinese and Malaysian big money was being bet prior to the tournament. The Dutch were so bad I suspect match fixing!

Their midfield (VdV excepted) did not show up last night so the ball rarely reached the strikers. When the midfield (Van Der Vaert, Scneider and Robben) got the ball they took it up front and had a shot themselves - greedy ba$tards. Wesley Schneider - most disappointing player of the tournament.

For years to come coaches will be using videos of the Dutch series of 3 games to demonstrate what happens when great individual players lose their sense of team-play.

The Portugese have been very good at the back and middle all tournament - most impressed by their back 4 (Pepe you expect but Alves was great too). Mereles has been immense in midfield

Wesley S and the diver are classic examples of footballer mercenaries that play for themselves, their ego's and their bank balance.

[MrMuddle]

For me, the difference between this Dutch team and the one that got to the World Cup final, is the absence of Van Bronkhurst. He was outstanding a couple of years ago, and offered the team much greater options in wide positions. His work rate, passing and leadership have been sorely missed at international level.

[MrRed]

Last chance. If we don't win this one, then I guess I can have early nights for the next couple of weeks

Console yourself with sleep migsy....on a plus i don't thin RVP did himself any favours either.

[carmine]

Last chance. If we don't win this one, then I guess I can have early nights for the next couple of weeks

Console yourself with sleep migsy....on a plus i don't thin RVP did himself any favours either.

Of the potential stars that he was i reckon him the biggest disappointment of the tournament so far

[SantiSuk]

Last chance. If we don't win this one, then I guess I can have early nights for the next couple of weeks

Console yourself with sleep migsy....on a plus i don't thin RVP did himself any favours either.

Of the potential stars that he was i reckon him the biggest disappointment of the tournament so far

On the grounds he was a slightly bigger star than Wesley Schneider I have to agree.

[smokie36]

Good consistent performances from the Dutch team so far.

No wait....

[mrbojangles]

Good consistent performances from the Dutch team so far.

No wait....

Played 3, lost 3. Fairly consistent to me smokes

[smokie36]

Good consistent performances from the Dutch team so far.

No wait....

Played 3, lost 3. Fairly consistent to me smokes

You have to search out the positives mrboj...that took me ages!

[Abrak]

Good consistent performances from the Dutch team so far.

No wait....

Played 3, lost 3. Fairly consistent to me smokes

You have to search out the positives mrboj...that took me ages!

Yeah must be difficult for you, Smokie....

I see that Craig Thomson is slipping in the betting...