Carrying Passport With You

[craigt3365]

You may get on the flight using a drivers license but the place you stay at, hotel, guest house or even privat recidense, at your destination are required by law to send your passport information (expiry date, visa type, TM number...) to the local police or immigration.

Excellent point. After those Iranian bombers we discovered to have stayed in Pattaya, they cracked down on this quite heavily. Passports required for checkin and the info is being passed on to the relevant authorities. As per Thai law.

[chiang mai]

You may get on the flight using a drivers license but the place you stay at, hotel, guest house or even privat recidense, at your destination are required by law to send your passport information (expiry date, visa type, TM number...) to the local police or immigration.

Excellent point. After those Iranian bombers we discovered to have stayed in Pattaya, they cracked down on this quite heavily. Passports required for checkin and the info is being passed on to the relevant authorities. As per Thai law.

That is a very good point, entirely valid. But I cannot recall the number of times I have produced my five years license as proof of ID in lieu of my passport where the other person has said, "oh, you Thai people", and relaxed slightly and smiled, it's almost as though the holder of a five years license is seen as a naturalised Thai. So, one has to wonder whether the request to produce a passport would be pushed further, in my experience it would not since I've never had to produce one anywhere in Thailand, for hotel/flight booking purposes.

[craigt3365]

You may get on the flight using a drivers license but the place you stay at, hotel, guest house or even privat recidense, at your destination are required by law to send your passport information (expiry date, visa type, TM number...) to the local police or immigration.

Excellent point. After those Iranian bombers we discovered to have stayed in Pattaya, they cracked down on this quite heavily. Passports required for checkin and the info is being passed on to the relevant authorities. As per Thai law.

That is a very good point, entirely valid. But I cannot recall the number of times I have produced my five years license as proof of ID in lieu of my passport where the other person has said, "oh, you Thai people", and relaxed slightly and smiled, it's almost as though the holder of a five years license is seen as a naturalised Thai. So, one has to wonder whether the request to produce a passport would be pushed further, in my experience it would not since I've never had to produce one anywhere in Thailand, for hotel/flight booking purposes.

Understood, but the point is it "could" happen. And if it does, I'm sure you'd be happier having your passport handy rather than spending hours at the local police station? Kinda like car insurance. I haven't had to use mine in over 25 years. But I'm glad I have it.

[Maestro]

That is a very good point, entirely valid. But I cannot recall the number of times I have produced my five years license as proof of ID in lieu of my passport where the other person has said, "oh, you Thai people", and relaxed slightly and smiled, it's almost as though the holder of a five years license is seen as a naturalised Thai. So, one has to wonder whether the request to produce a passport would be pushed further, in my experience it would not since I've never had to produce one anywhere in Thailand, for hotel/flight booking purposes.

This is the form that hotels must submit to immgration with detail of foreigners sho check in.

tm30.pdf

I wonder what information a hotel enters for a foreigner who gives his Thai driving licence. They probably don't register him at all on this form. As with so many other things, laws and regulations are one thing, their implementation an entirely different thing.

[harrry]

For the last few years all hotels I have stayed at including 4 star have on arival have suggested my wife signs the register and I am not recorded on the immigration form.

[mca]

That is a very good point, entirely valid. But I cannot recall the number of times I have produced my five years license as proof of ID in lieu of my passport where the other person has said, "oh, you Thai people", and relaxed slightly and smiled, it's almost as though the holder of a five years license is seen as a naturalised Thai. So, one has to wonder whether the request to produce a passport would be pushed further, in my experience it would not since I've never had to produce one anywhere in Thailand, for hotel/flight booking purposes.

This is the form that hotels must submit to immgration with detail of foreigners sho check in.

tm30.pdf

I wonder what information a hotel enters for a foreigner who gives his Thai driving licence. They probably don't register him at all on this form. As with so many other things, laws and regulations are one thing, their implementation an entirely different thing.

That is entirely correct Maestro. I just confirmed this by phone with my Thai friend who is RDM at one of the big international chain hotels in Bangkok. They take a photocopy of the d/l for their own records but don't register the guest on the form they send to immigration as the form requires TM number etc. etc.

BTW they send the form on a daily basis via the internet to immigration.

Edited July 4, 2012 by mca

[craigt3365]

http://www.pattayaone.net/pattaya-news/49044/iranian-bangkok-bomb-suspects-link-pattaya-investigated-immigration-police/

...an issue relating to Hotels reporting details of their guests to Immigration within 24 hours of their arrival has emerged and it appears this regulation is being largely ignored. Immigration Police Chief, Colonel Choosak, stressed how important it is for Hotels to send this information to Immigration to help with detection of possible foreign criminal elements that enter Thailand.

[tombkk]

http://www.pattayaon...gration-police/

...an issue relating to Hotels reporting details of their guests to Immigration within 24 hours of their arrival has emerged and it appears this regulation is being largely ignored. Immigration Police Chief, Colonel Choosak, stressed how important it is for Hotels to send this information to Immigration to help with detection of possible foreign criminal elements that enter Thailand.

Seeing the amount of information they have to fill in in the form, I think it is simply not possible for a medium to large hotel to submit this for each hotel guest every day.

Anyway, name and passport number should suffice, because the other data is in the immigration computer.

That said, I will not carry my passport because it is too valuable a document to risk losing it. It stays in the safe.

[ZZZ]

Hotels dont actually use the TM30form, they have a login account with immigration and send in a daily spreadsheet with all the info. No big problem for them as they have this information in their check in ledger.

The TM30 form can be used by private home owners to register a temporary guest. If you are living in your own condo you have to send in this form everytime you return to Thailand. If you live in a house in your wifes name she needs to send it in. Guess most people dont do this but I have heard about people getting cought for not doing it.

[craigt3365]

Seems there are checks going on in Bangkok now:

In the past week there has been 7 farangs arrested in the Nana area for visa overstay. I am at court this morning translating for 3 of them!

Big crack down on visa overstay at the moment in Nana area with lots of police stopping non Thai people to check visa validity.

I do not think hotels will report overstay but the chances of your being picked up are a lot greater walking the streets of upper Sukumvit at the moment.

[lopburi3]

That appears to be checking for overstay/legal stay - not that you carry your passport. It just makes it faster to prove if passport with you.

[Ravenwood]

Just on this, I was walking past Soi Cowboy yestersay and two police had pulled up two foreigners and were asked to produce their passports and were looking through their bags.

As I walked past, one of the officers gave me the look but was too preoccupied to pull me up, but I made sure to make clear of that area quick smart as I wasn't carrying my passport. Anyone in the Asoke area should be aware and ensure they carry their passport.

[chiang mai]

Are we certain this is not just another money spinner from the BIB on Sukhumvit?

[Arkady]

I would be grateful if anyone could cite the precise Thai law that mandates carrying of personal ID for Thais and foreigners.

[Crossy]

I would be grateful if anyone could cite the precise Thai law that mandates carrying of personal ID for Thais and foreigners.

Many others would be interested too.

It's common knowledge, to the point that when renewing a UK passport you are allowed not to send your existing PP, but I've yet to see an actual law stating the requirement.

[samran]

The most common quoted sources seems to be this British Embassy website warning:

"By law, you must carry your passport with you at all times in Thailand. Tourists have been arrested because they were unable to produce their passport upon request"

http://uk-passport-service-guide.com/british-embassy-thailand/

Having said that, I'm guessing there is some sort of law on the books. But I can't be arsed trawling through the bowels of the immigration and MOI websites. For most, a DL, or a scanned reduced size copy of the PP seems to be the way to go.

[Dork]

I would be grateful if anyone could cite the precise Thai law that mandates carrying of personal ID for Thais and foreigners.

Hi Arkady

Was wondering whether in fact there is no specific law requiring Thai's or Foreigners to carry ID but that Section 57 (Chapter 7) of the Immigration Act provides a catchall for everyone:

Section 57 : For the purpose of Chapter 7 miscellaneous ; whoever claims his nationality is Thai and if there is not enough evidence for the competent official to believe that he has Thai nationality , it is presumed that such a person is an alien until he can prove other wise.

An application for proof of nationality under Para.1 of this Section will be submitted to the competent official in the accordance with the form and fees as prescribed in the Ministerial Regulations. If such person does not satisfy the competent official’s order , he may apply to the Court asking for consideration.

In the case where there is an application to the Court upon receiving and application, the Court shall notify the Public Prosecutor, who may, in turn, have a right for objection thereto.

And then Sections 58 & 59 go on to say:

Section 58 : Any alien who has no lawful document for entering the Kingdom under Section 12 (1); or has no Residence Certificate under this Act; and also has no identification in accordance with the Law on Alien registration, is considered to have entered into the Kingdom in violation to this Act.

Section 59 :The Director General, or the competent official deputized by Director General, shall have the authority to arrest and suppress any person violating this Act. They shall also have the authority to issue a subpoena, warrant of arrest or search, make arrest , search , or detain. They shall also have the authority to conduct inquiry into the offense against the provisions of this Act in the same manner as the inquiry official under the Criminal Procedure Code.

[ubonjoe]

I think I have mentioned the immigration act before in one of these topics about carrying passport.

To be it makes it pretty clear they could charge under the immigration act for not having your passport with you.

[Dork]

I think I have mentioned the immigration act before in one of these topics about carrying passport.

To be it makes it pretty clear they could charge under the immigration act for not having your passport with you.

To me it looks like you could possibly be detained or arrested until the competent official was satisfied you were in Thailand lawfully but I don't see anything about being charged with any crime.

Really my post was in reply to Arkady's query about the often touted but never proven (that I've seen) law requiring anyone, Thai or Foreign to carry ID at all times.

[judokrab]

I have never tried checking in for a local flight with my driving licence and wonder if they would accept it with my photo of 40 years ago which I hardly resemble any more ( I started driving at the age of 18). The licences of those days have no expiration date.

Try it. I never take my passport when flying only within Thailand. In the US, I used my European DL and they accepted it. (The TSA officer asked, "What is this, a driver's licence?" and he was satisfied when I confirmed.) Next time, I shall try my Thai DL over there.

I, and others I know, have travelled on domestic flights in Thailand using Australian or UK drivers licences. I just showed the drivers licence and was not asked for my passport.

BTW... unlike Thailand, which requires a Thai DL or an International DL to drive there (for no more than six months, or three months for kiwis), Australia only requires (a) overseas licence, and ( a translation of that licence into English, if it is not in English. Here's the surprising bit: the translation does not have to be certified - you can do the translation yourself!

I've also checked into a Bangkok hotel with just a photocopy of the front page of my passport.

Also opened a bank account with just a copy of my passport (I may have given them a copy of the visa page too, and my Australian DL.) I did have a Thai "guarantor" which I presume made a difference, however one should not be allowed to open an account with such poor ID!

[Mario2008]

1 post removed, as the news article is already running in our news section and we would like to prevent multiple topics on the same.

[OJAS]

1 post removed, as the news article is already running in our news section and we would like to prevent multiple topics on the same.

A link to the relevant thread in the news section would be helpful.

//Edit: this is the link: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/631816-russian-tour-company-worker-freed-after-proved-legal/#entry6284821

Edited April 9, 2013 by Maestro
Added edit note.

[phutoie2]

I would not always bank on the TDL as last week I was stopped in a Highway Police patrol on Route 21 in LopBuri and produced my 5 year TDL. The officers wanted to see my passport as well which I did not have. When asked why, it was to check " I not stay too long". They let me off with the words, "next time we see you I want to check passport". Fair enough.

[Maestro]

From the article in Phuket Gazette today about the Russian woman who was arrested and held overnight in a police cell for allegedly being in Thailand illegally and working without a work permit but subsequently released when another person brought her passport showing a valid permission to stay and her valid work permit to the police station.

The article quotes a police officer saying that the police will nevertheless pass the case file to the public prosecutor to decide whether to press charges for not carrying her passport on her person. I hope the newspaper will follow up on this and publish the decision of the prosecutor. If charges are pressed and if the court finds the woman guilty, the court decision will have a reference to the law that she violated, a law for which I have searched for years, never found, and today still assume that no such legal clause exists.

[ubonjoe]

I think it will be a violation of the immigration act for illegal entry into country which is how the the act states it.

Section 58 : Any alien who has no lawful document for entering the Kingdom under Section 12 (1); or

has no Residence Certificate under this Act; and also has no identification in accordance with the Law on

Alien registration, is considered to have entered into the Kingdom in violation to this Act.

Section 12

1. Having no genuine and valid passport or document used in lieu of passport ; or having a

genuine and valid passport or document used in lieu of a passport without Visaing by the Royal Thai

Embassies or Consulates in Foreign countries ; or from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs , excepting if a visa

is not required for certain types of aliens in special instances.

Visaing and visa exemption will be under the learn and conditions as provided in the Ministerial

Regulations

[lopburi3]

Having and not having on person are two very different things. I do not believe there is any such law to require carry of passport and have never seen any reference to such. Believe the most that can be done is holding until such document is presented and even this is likely suspect if person has valid photo ID and no reason to believe overstay or illegal entry and have not seen any report of more than temporary detention reported. Obviously when travelling outside of home area you would want to take with you in the event detained or asked to prevent long wait to get.

[Dork]

Having and not having on person are two very different things. I do not believe there is any such law to require carry of passport and have never seen any reference to such. Believe the most that can be done is holding until such document is presented and even this is likely suspect if person has valid photo ID and no reason to believe overstay or illegal entry and have not seen any report of more than temporary detention reported. Obviously when travelling outside of home area you would want to take with you in the event detained or asked to prevent long wait to get.

I think confirmation that this is correct can be assumed by the fact that Section 58 has no mention of penalty. All other violations do.

[ubonjoe]

Section 81 : Any alien who stay in the Kingdom without permission or with permission expired or revoked shall be punished with imprisonment not exceeding two years or a fine not exceeding 20,000 Baht or both.

This one would fit the offence plus there are others they could use.

[harrry]

Section 81 : Any alien who stay in the Kingdom without permission or with permission expired or revoked shall be punished with imprisonment not exceeding two years or a fine not exceeding 20,000 Baht or both.

This one would fit the offence plus there are others they could use.

My guess is that this is the offence for which you would be charged if you did not produce your proof (Passport). It also gives a reason to detain you until you do. Edited April 11, 2013 by harrry

[Mario2008]

Not having your passport on you doesn't mean you are on overstay/illegally in the country. It is cause to check further if you are legally in the country and detain you so they can establish that, but section 81 is not grounds to fine you for not having your passport with you.