Has Anyone Ever Used Img For Expat Health Insurance?

[CWMcMurray]

I have been looking into buying Medical insurance and to be honest would prefer to use International Insurance carrier rather than local.

I have received some quotes from various providers and the below seems to be the best I have found. Looking at their IMG GOLD PLUS plan.

http://www.imglobal.com/img-insurance/international-health-insurance/global-medical-insurance.aspx

The premium prices seem very reasonable and the coverage includes, IP , OP & Chronic conditions, would would normally mean huge premiums, but in this case not so...

I would guess it is because they place a max lifetime claim amount of 5 million USD while most other plans have max annual claim amount of usally between 1-2 million USD

That being said, medical costs in Thailand are not that high... for instance Bumrungrad offers a package for heart bypass (most expensive thing I could thing to check) for 499,000 thb.

So if max policy lifetime payout is 5 million and even if I was under the policy for 50 years... that would mean USD 100,000 or 3 million THB per year.... Even counting for inflation and future rises in medical costs, it seems to me that it is very likely that I may never come close to policy life time limits ...

What are your thoughts and has anyone ever heard anything about this company?

[Godfree]

You don't need OP, since OP charges here are minuscule UNLESS you have--or intend to get--cancer or dialysis.

Maximum payout is interesting but more interesting, if you intend to grow old in Thailand, the maximum age to which they will cover you...

[CWMcMurray]

I wasn't asking for OP, but the insurance broker sent a comparison of about 10 policies and this was one of them... Most of the others did not have OP

[madmitch]

Look at the cost of OP before dismissing it.

A lot of cancer treatment is done on an out-patient basis and more and more operations are performed on an OP basis as well. If you need a colonostomy, endoscopy, CT scan, biopsy etc. they are not that cheap and would be covered under most OP sections.

I had not taken out OP until recently when for the amount payable it was worth it. But check the terms and conditions; not all health policies are the same.

[CWMcMurray]

Mad Mitch.

That is definitely worth thinking about... Most policies Seem to have the premium double or triple if OP is added

The IMG policy is only aprox 2,500 usd per year for a family of 4 (2 kids under 5) and seems to have very few exclusions other than pre-existing conditions , although still waiting for some more detailed info from broker

So which carrier are you using? How do you find it

[madmitch]

I use LMG Pacific Healthcare. They have a website. They are OK as a company with the backing of Liberty Mutual, a large US insurer, but they can be a pain with premium increases and load factors following claims, and like all health insurance companies, they don't want you as you get older and the rates go up quite unreasonably. But as an ex-underwriter, I understand this, even if I don't like it.

In the past I have taken the OPD exclusion discount of 20%. This year I left in the coverage but had a couple of minor pre-existings excluded for OPD only, which is perfectly reasonable and expected. As you can see, 20% of the overall premium for OPD is not bad: it's not double or triple. Coverage is pretty good as well.

Check the price including and excluding OPD with your proposed companies and make a call. Better still speak to an independent insurance broker who should do all this work for you.

[kurnell]

I use LMG. They just refused to pay for one of the tests on my daughter who was in hospital with pneumonia. I am disputing their reasons for refusing to pay. If I am not happy I will take my business elsewhere.

[xylophone]

I have been searching for an alternative to my current Bupa policy, as outlined in another post of mine and I have looked IMG as a possible alternative because the price was very reasonable.

I did some research on the Internet about IMG and the feedback was not very promising with one particular trend evident throughout the complaints………the non-payment of claims on the basis that they were "pre-existing conditions", however when some complainants had stated the circumstances of the claim, most of them could never be construed as "pre-existing".

One actually suggested that because the company was registered in Indiana, USA, and the company states in its policy that any liabilities/claims against the company will be handled by the legal system in Indiana, then there is not a lot that one can do to try and overturn what is seen to be an incorrect policy decision by the company, i. e. once the company has made its decision you are pretty well helpless to challenge it.

One or two posts regarding poor service I could handle, but the more I searched the more I found so that did not give me any confidence.

I am pretty well resigned to renew my Bupa policy as I have been with them for a few years and any pre-existing conditions are now fully covered, so to change at this particular juncture could be quite dangerous because new policies require a stand-down period for pre-existing conditions of perhaps a couple of years or thereabouts.

With the one experience I did have here regarding Bupa (dengue fever) I just handed my Bupa card to the hospital administration folk and everything was taken care of without me having to do a single thing, so a good experience so far and of course I have a local representative who can handle any queries I have.

My thoughts for what they are worth.

[CWMcMurray]

Well I received a bit more feedback from broker on the IMG Gold Plus program and it was not great news...

The coverage on paper looks good, but it seems that you have to advance all charges and then they will take 30 days to try and find justification not to refund charges (or at least that is how I read the below)

Also since based upon small groups, could increase greatly.

I have copied below for benefit of others.

Basically, the reason that the IMG Global Fusion plan is so inexpensive is that they put you in small groups based on when you join the plan. The groups are completely random and you are not sure how many there are in your group. The renewal rates each year are based on the claims/loss performance of those in the group, rather than everyone covered with their insurance as a whole. This means that over a long period of time, the rates can increase quite a bit. Also, they are slower when it comes to payout of claims (in that they take at least 30 days) and they are strict in terms of investigation on whether or not what you are claiming for is pre-existing. However, if your medical history hasn’t changed and your renewal rates are too high, you can always essentially “re-apply” and have the first year rates onto the plan.

[CWMcMurray]

I received a PM from a fellow member introducing me to a company named AA Insurance brokers that offer a plan from ACS / Allianz that is specifically designed for Southeast Asian countries (& Taiwan?) below:

Cambodia, Indonesia, Laos, Malaysia, Philippines, Taiwan, Thailand, and Vietnam

You must be based in the above countries only, although it does cover emergency services for up to 7 weeks if traveling elsewhere and to be honest the coverage and premium costs seem pretty decent.

Still checking on a few more points, but looks like this may end up being the best option.

Still also waiting on some feedback from some other policies and companies as well and will advise more details once received.

[CWMcMurray]

You can find premiums and coverage information on their website below...

http://www.aainsure.net/health.html

Anyone ever use them?

[CWMcMurray]

Look at the cost of OP before dismissing it.

A lot of cancer treatment is done on an out-patient basis and more and more operations are performed on an OP basis as well. If you need a colonostomy, endoscopy, CT scan, biopsy etc. they are not that cheap and would be covered under most OP sections.

I had not taken out OP until recently when for the amount payable it was worth it. But check the terms and conditions; not all health policies are the same.

Many of the policies advise coverage for IP and 'Day-care' from asking some of the brokers have been advised that Day care normally includes what is referred to as OP surgery.

Some policies also have a rider for Oncology (treatment of cancer)

I am asking AA above about the 2 above and should have their response tomorrow.

Bangkok bank also offers Cancer Insurance that is not too expensive and likely much cheaper option than buying an OP policy just in case of cancer... link to Bangkok bank cancer insurance below:

http://www.bangkokin...-seller_en.html

[thepanom]

Here in Hua Hin many foreigners are using the service from AA insurance and are very happy with their good service

[CWMcMurray]

Thepanom...

Thanks for your posting, have you ever had to claim?

Is so, how did it go? Any issues?

[CWMcMurray]

Latest update on IMG... Answer from agent

Generally speaking you just need to be aware of the fine print details with IMG Global Fusion. They have a huge number of clients in the region because it is inexpensive, but they do not tell you that this is how they do their renewals until people start questioning down the line as to why their renewal rates are so high. Others are completely happy because they are lucky and were put into good pools where everyone stayed on the plan (so the number in the pool didn’t decrease).

For all inpatient care there is always direct billing (as long as pre-authorization is received for planned treatment). This is true for all the insurers. The reason you would need to be reimbursed for care with IMG Fusion is that they have outpatient coverage so you would need to pay first for that and then claim for reimbursement and wait for them to transfer the money back to your account. Please note, in an emergency inpatient situation, you would just want to have someone contact the insurer as soon as possible so direct billing payment can be set up right away.

When you look at an international insurer, it is relatively safe to say that the premium is directly related to the service on the plan. With IMG, we have seen that it is more of a battle than with other insurers (which makes sense because they have to be careful on payout of claims since their annual premiums are so much lower). However, if it is a legitimate claim that is not pre-existing IMG will pay out. Please note, we do not work with any of the very low in insurers where you are not sure if the claim will be paid out. You can see that we tend to work with the higher end international insurers, so it’s just that IMG is more on the bottom of our list.

[CWMcMurray]

I have also added some of the questions and answers to questions sent to AA below, as I know others may also be interested..

1. I notice in the attached it states room rate as 100% actual expenses max USD 250, but I saw on the website that it mentioned that max room rate for 500 k policy was only USD 50. Can you please reconfirm on this. The plan we have in Thailand is slightly different from the internet version so please ignore and look at the details I emailed to you – yes at $250

2. Also it mentions that Hospitalization is only allowed with "prior consent", how does this work? What if in an accident or if I am not able to contact insurance in advance? Is this something that hospital admin will handle on their own? Misleading: For emergency cases then obviously straight in BUT for ‘elective’ surgery i.e. when the Doc asks you to come back in a few days for the operation, then the hospital (or you) should contact the claims department in order for the claims department to pay the hospital direct – basically the same as with any insurance company.

3. Will insurance pay hospital directly or will I have to advance funds and then later claim back with insurance carrier? If ponly limited hostipals will allow for direct billing, which hospitals will allow for this? Is there a list? Can use any hospital – not limited to list – yes will pay direct (as long as there is time for the hospital to contact the insurance company) For a quick overnight stay where there is no time then pay and reclaim the money

4. Doesthis also cover emergency treatment overseas? For example, if we went back to US for 2 weeks to visit my family and their was an accident?Yes, >7 weeks for emergencies only – always suggest taking a Travel Insurance when travelling overseas as not expensive.

5. As you have multiple offices in Thailand, do you also have Thai speaking staff hat could assist, in the case that I was incapacitated and my wife needed to contact your office to arrange for handling any claim issues? Yes, many Thai girls on the staff ! However do not worry, the hospital will contact the insurance department

6. Is renewal of policy gauranteed if utilizing benefits? Yes

7. How are rate increases managed ? Is it based upon personal use or by assigning "small groups upon joining" or by looking at world Policies and medical costs? Do you have any information on the aprox rate increases that were incurred over the last 5-10yrs? The increase are in line with medical inflation (as with most medical plans) but your personal premium will not increase due to any claims you may have (unlike the Thai companies)

8. What is the maximum age for this policy. What happens once reaching this age? Can the policy be "rolled over" into a different Allianz product without starting over from scratch with all things that may have happened over the years now becoming "pre-existing conditions"? This is guaranteed up to 75 years and yes you can change to a ‘for life’ at any policy renewal date i.e. Jan 1st

9. Can payment be made via credit card? If so, any additional charge? Yes by CC and no extra charge

10. Are Day-patient services covered? If you just pick the IPD then ‘say surgery’ is but should you chose IPD + OPD then everything is included

11. Are any oncology treatments covered ? Yes subject to the above

12. Are Chronic conditions covered? If so, is it only for acute phases only? Again yes depending on the plan i.e. IPD + OPD yes

13. Any medical exams needed for sign up? How about if also choosing to purchase life insurance or Income insurance? No exams for any of the options/plan

14. Is there a moratorium period, after which if no treatment is needed, conditions are no longer considered as pre-existing?

This is at the discretion of the Underwriters – should you need to change (example) an exclusion then one needs to write before the end of the policy year for them to consider.

15. Are there any deductibles for any of the coverage areas? No

16. Is it possible to make any changes to the riders in subsequent years? For example if wanting to change life insurance amount or disability amount or from policy limit of 500k to 1 mil policy etc..? Or do you have to stick with amounts on original policy when first signing up in the first year? Yes changes can be made at the start of the policy year – Jan 1^st+

[CWMcMurray]

I have received quotes from 14 different international insurance carriers and have narrowed down to the 2 policies above.. IMG & AA

They are slightly different....

The base IP is roughly the same benefit wise, but if getting OP for the AA product it is quite a bit more than I am budgeting. But if the AA product for IP only the price is quite good and could then add some additional "other types of coverage" for aprox same as the cost of the IMG policy for both IP & OP.

So would be a trade off ... which of the two below would you go for? (family of 4- 2 kids under 5)

For roughly the same cost (IMG= USD 2,311 vs AA=USD 2,366)

IMG (deductable USD 1000 per yr) AA (no deductable)

1. IP 5 million USD lifetime 500 K USD per yr

2. OP(including chronic conditions) Coverage but rep for trying to label as pre-existing None

3. Coverage area everywhere but US* Southeast Asia*

4. Emergency 30 days anywhere ww upto 7 wks ww

5. Medical evacuationcoveredcovered

6. Life Insurance none 50 K usd

7. Incapacity/Disability Insurrance none 50 USD per day after 90 day

8. Cancer Insurance (Bangkok Bank) none 200k THB (wife & I only)

I realize that I could still buy additional life and disability insurance even if going with IMG, but I have a budget... would like to stay under USD 2,400 per yr, which both of the above options will do.

After writing all of this out... I think I know which way I am now leaning, but would welcome input from others...

[CWMcMurray]

Just as FYI ...

If readin the above on iPhone app, the spacing is all messed up making it unreadable

You may want to sign on using computer of interested in reading the above comparison

[Sophon]

Look at the cost of OP before dismissing it.

A lot of cancer treatment is done on an out-patient basis and more and more operations are performed on an OP basis as well. If you need a colonostomy, endoscopy, CT scan, biopsy etc. they are not that cheap and would be covered under most OP sections.

I had not taken out OP until recently when for the amount payable it was worth it. But check the terms and conditions; not all health policies are the same.

Many of the policies advise coverage for IP and 'Day-care' from asking some of the brokers have been advised that Day care normally includes what is referred to as OP surgery.

Some policies also have a rider for Oncology (treatment of cancer)

I am asking AA above about the 2 above and should have their response tomorrow.

Bangkok bank also offers Cancer Insurance that is not too expensive and likely much cheaper option than buying an OP policy just in case of cancer... link to Bangkok bank cancer insurance below:

http://www.bangkokin...-seller_en.html

The maximum cover for Bangkok Bank's cancer insurance seems entirely inadequate. From what I hear cancer treatment can be very expensive and can easily ending up costing (multiple times) more than the 500k covered by the BB plan.

Sophon

[Clipper747]

I have used Seven Corners worldwide Insurance for the past 5 years, they are excellent, I never had any problems with them and they rates are very reasonable They have many plans to choice from. Long and short term plans. You can also include the USA and Canada, but then the rate will go up.

For Thailand I use the Reside plan.

The most interesting Plan is called Reside Prime, and Reside. Enclose is a link that you can get a quote and you can purchase from the site.

https://www.sevencor...surance/HG75SSK

http://www.sevencorners.com/interactiveguide/HG75SSK

Hope this helps,

Kevin

[CWMcMurray]

The maximum cover for Bangkok Bank's cancer insurance seems entirely inadequate. From what I hear cancer treatment can be very expensive and can easily ending up costing (multiple times) more than the 500k covered by the BB plan.

Sophon

Yes but would not expect the BKK bank insurance to cover all expenses

IP would be covered by insurance policy and both my wife and I are in the Thai SSI program

I have investigated and been told that cancer treatments would be covered by SSI. Only issue being that some of the most recent drugs may not yet be on the Thai listed medicines covered

But if you want the new drugs, you can pay just the cost of medicine and all other costs would still be covered

Given the above, believe that coverage is there "just in case" of cancer

[kurnell]

In short, I have used LMG for 3 years and have had no issues until I had to make a claim, which they did not honour so I will be looking elsewhere in 2013. I am lucky that it was only a few hundred dollars, so lesson learnt.

[BobTH]

After looking into many options, I ended up getting a policy here in Thailand from Thai Health Insurance Co. Ltd. I have been very happy with their service and have submitted three claims so far. I bought the policy early this year and so far they have paid 100% of all claims with no deductions. On another note I have been using the Chulalongkorn Hospital which is affiliated with the Red Cross and have been very pleased with the service and the staffing at a very reasonable price. I am told that the health care at this hospital is second to none in Thailand and the costs are far below what you can expect to pay in a private hospital. This is truely something to consider and I have even considered being self insured in the future at the prices I have seen. My premium for insurance with Thi Health Insurance is somewhere around $1,200 US dollars annually for your information. I am single, retired and will be turning 60 years old this year. Good luck.

[CWMcMurray]

I have used Seven Corners worldwide Insurance for the past 5 years, they are excellent, I never had any problems with them and they rates are very reasonable They have many plans to choice from. Long and short term plans. You can also include the USA and Canada, but then the rate will go up.

For Thailand I use the Reside plan.

The most interesting Plan is called Reside Prime, and Reside. Enclose is a link that you can get a quote and you can purchase from the site.

https://www.sevencor...surance/HG75SSK

http://www.sevencorn...veguide/HG75SSK

Hope this helps,

Kevin

I took a look at the Seven Sea resident prime policy and it is almost identical in terms of costs and benefits as the IMG plan advised above. Which is a pretty comprehensive plan, but in the end I have decided to go with the Asia Expat package offered through AA above.

[Searat7]

I had IMG for 3 or 4 years but the annual premium increases got to be ridiculous. The last increase they proposed would have taken me from $4500 a year to $6500. I said no way and told AAInsure that I wanted another option. They hooked me up with April in Paris at a much lower price. Claims service is ok...no deductible.. annual increase is not based on your personal claims but of the insured group as a whole. My first premium increase was a bit high but I am still well below where I would have been with IMG.

[Tanaka]

Just remember that AA is an insurance broker and not an insurance company. If you compare figures from AA make sure you know what insurance company they quote.

[mran66]

i have also been looking at health insurance and found this seven corners reside prime as good coverage/competitive price option (compared to many others)

what are your experiences on seven corners in terms of claims acceptance and customer service in general?

[tinfoilhat]

Mad Mitch.

That is definitely worth thinking about... Most policies Seem to have the premium double or triple if OP is added

The IMG policy is only aprox 2,500 usd per year for a family of 4 (2 kids under 5) and seems to have very few exclusions other than pre-existing conditions , although still waiting for some more detailed info from broker

So which carrier are you using? How do you find it

the question is what are the excesses?

[tangcoral]

Maybe its just me noticing but IMG is different from LMG? I see some posters posting about one or the other.

[balanced view]

I have had a bad experience with LMG Pacific, They rejected a travel claim in the US with a dubious rationale and it took 6 months to get decision. It didnt help that they misplaced paperwork. My suggestion is to look for options with more established insurance carriers. It's frustrating to buy travel insurace for peace of mind--only to find out that a reasonable claim is rejected. I would suggest staying away from LMG in Bangkok. I am sure they will deny this--but this is my experience.