Bt20 Fares On Bangkok Electric Mass Transit Within 2 Years: M.R.T.A. Governor

[webfact]

Bt20 fares on Bangkok electric mass transit within 2 years: MRTA Governor

BANGKOK, Aug 21 - Mass Rapid Transit Authority of Thailand (MRTA) Governor Yongsit Rojsrikul said the government's policy to collect a Bt20 fee for travel all routes of the capital's underground and elevated electric mass transit trains will be in effect within two years.

MRTA has negotiated with its partners MRT underground operator Bangkok Metro (BMCL), and the Sky Train Bangkok Mass Transit System (BTS).

The timing is set within two years because the number of commuters will quickly increase due to the lowered fare, and in that case the number of trains should be sufficient to demand.

BMCL currently has 19 trains operating. It needs at least double that number to serve future demand once the Bt20 fee is effected, Mr Yongsit said.

He noted MRTA will continue rail line expansion in the capital. Blue and purple lines, now under construction, were delayed by last year's flood crisis. The Cabinet will be asked to consider an extension of another 180 days for construction responsible by the private sector, due to the resultant delays.

Related projects continue for green, orange, yellow, and pink lines, covering outer Bangkok in multiple directions.

With a budget of some Bt500 billion, the MRTA governor said, management and construction is covered for up to seven years.

Once completed, Bangkok will have an electric train network of more than 200 kilometers like other big cities.

MRTA will manage the system and related services for further investment without depending only on government funding. (MCOT online news)

-- TNA 2012-08-21

[Sateev]

Buhlee dat wen ah sees it!

[bkkjames]

Hmm perhaps I am a bit fuzzy today from lack of sleep but if ridership is due to increase across the board with forthcoming expansion, wouldn't the natural thing to do would be to not lower fares in such an environment.

So let me get out my abacus for this one. Today my 40 Baht trip costs 40 baht but in 2 years it will only cost 20 Baht because they will have 38 trains. Could I suggest a bump to 76 trains and everyone rides free?

[smokie36]

No James that would be 10 Baht.

One can only hope you have some more creative skills....

[bkkjames]

No James that would be 10 Baht.

One can only hope you have some more creative skills....

Where did you learn math Smokes from the Dan Levy School of Fine Arts? If 50% of 50 is 20. 100 increase of trains = half of 20 / 10. In fact if they increase the trains to 152, they will have to pay people to use them. Kinda like the tax rebate on cars under 1 million baht thingy but better.

[misterme]

I smell an election coming

[pomchop]

I smell an election coming

I smell ten new massive high rise condos at each of the new BTS MRT stations.

[bkkjames]

If anyone believes this will happen they should take two tablet computers and see their 30 baht DR in two years time.

[Ohyesuare]

I wonder if they will charge foreigners double to ride them.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

If what the above OP article is suggesting is a future single 20 baht flat fee to ride any of the BTS or MRT lines, I've never heard of any such policy before from the Thai government.... not even discussed, much less enacted.

It sometimes baffles me where these kinds of things arise from. The policy "will be in effect within two years"??? Does that mean the government's somehow/somewhere already adopted such a policy, or just that this guy is predicting such a policy will flow from the government sometime in the next two years?

And considering that 20 baht is just a bit above the lowest base fares on BTS and MRT now, and they're envisioning a bunch of new and expanded transit lines that will require much additional staff and trains, just where exactly is the money supposed to come from to support all that? Especially if the longer trips that now are 40 or 45 baht suddenly get cut to 20 baht.

Maybe I'm missing something, but just because they may have a future transit system expanded with added lines and more trains doesn't automatically mean the systems' current per passenger costs are somehow going to substantially decrease.

Unless they envision the standard for the future being the current mess on the BTS Sukhumvit Line, where the expanded route coupled with the older 3-car trains has seen those trains routinely operating with passengers packed in like sardines...and not just at rush hour periods.

[theoldgit]

If what the above OP article is suggesting is a future single 20 baht flat fee to ride any of the BTS or MRT lines, I've never heard of any such policy before from the Thai government.... not even discussed, much less enacted.

I seem to recall it being mentioned during the last election.

[lomatopo]

I thought Pheu Thai promised 20 baht trips on the BTS, MRT and ARL?

Has the BMA's granting of the 30 year contract awarded to the BTSC passed all the corruption inquiries?

FWIW, you can buy a 50 trip 30-day ticket on the BTS for 1,000 baht, so 20 baht/trip, exclusive of the On Nut - Udom Suk spur which is another 15 baht. Student trip tickets are under 20 baht/trip now.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/576448-thai-airways-new-777-300er-for-laxbru-route/

[WhizBang]

You are all wrong. The PTP intend to invalidate all current concessions so that they can give the new concession to a PTP pal. Hence your fares will increase to a staggering 100 baht per station.

[HerbalEd]

And so the Thai bashers go at it yet again. No surprise here.

I've never seen so many whiners in my life. There are way too many on TV who actually seem to have a pathological compulsion to always find something bad .. even in the good. Maybe they just can't help it ... kinda like telling a dog not to bark.

Get over it ... and yourself. Haven't you realized yet that Thailand is a developing, third-wold country? If Thailand, Thais and Thai ways irritate you so much, just get outta here and go back to your perfect country ..where ever that is ... I haven't found one yet.

But meawhile, I find the BTS and MRT incredibly efficient, clean ... and air conditioned ... and cheap. Definitely much better than NYC, Paris, London, etc., etc.

Yeah, there's lots to complain about in BKK, but the BTS or MRT ain't one of them.

Edited August 21, 2012 by HerbalEd

[KED]

I am definitely not supporting farang/thai pricing, but I do think the mass transit should serve the entire Bangkok community and it should not price itself out of the reach of the average Thai worker. Supply and demand should not be a factor because the BTS/MRT mission should be to move people around the city, not to create a luxurious environment for the rich to travel - of course, it would be great if they could combine the public service with more trains and reasonable cost.

I do feel the 20 baht proposal is just political pandering.

[soundman]

But meawhile, I find the BTS and MRT incredibly efficient, clean ... and air conditioned ... and cheap. Definitely much better than NYC, Paris, London, etc., etc.

I have always thought so too, that the BTS and MRT is world standard. Certainly beats the ones in Melbourne where you can wait an hour for a train.

[Ohyesuare]

It has to be better then the public transport in Toronto, Canada (TTC). Constant subway delays, no buses for 30 minutes and then 5 coming at once, bus drivers kicking out all passengers and switching on their no service sign if they are running behind schedule. Truly awful public transit system.

[lounger]

But meawhile, I find the BTS and MRT incredibly efficient, clean ... and air conditioned ... and cheap. Definitely much better than NYC, Paris, London, etc., etc.

I have always thought so too, that the BTS and MRT is world standard. Certainly beats the ones in Melbourne where you can wait an hour for a train.

Yes and when the fares drop and there are more trains to pay for and the overcrowding starts, will it still be world class?

[vijer]

And so the Thai bashers go at it yet again. No surprise here.

I've never seen so many whiners in my life. There are way too many on TV who actually seem to have a pathological compulsion to always find something bad .. even in the good. Maybe they just can't help it ... kinda like telling a dog not to bark.

Get over it ... and yourself. Haven't you realized yet that Thailand is a developing, third-wold country? If Thailand, Thais and Thai ways irritate you so much, just get outta here and go back to your perfect country ..where ever that is ... I haven't found one yet.

But meawhile, I find the BTS and MRT incredibly efficient, clean ... and air conditioned ... and cheap. Definitely much better than NYC, Paris, London, etc., etc.

Yeah, there's lots to complain about in BKK, but the BTS or MRT ain't one of them.

<snip>

I don't think anyone is bashing Thailand, they all seem to be questioning the logic of fares being reduced to 20 baht per trip.

I will be happy to bash Thailand for you so your post will be accurate.

Currently I ride the BTS three days a week and it is difficult to get on at many stops. So if fares were reduced and it spurred increased ridership there will be a serious problem. I agree the trains themselves are nice. BUT there are not enough trains even now. AND the whole design of the turnstiles is absurd. At Phloen Chit there are a total of four turnstiles and it takes time to get through in either direction, Asok and On Nut are equally congested to pass through. Also some idiot thought it would be a good idea to wedge the turnstiles between the cashier booths limiting the number or turnstiles that can be installed. And the turnstiles are very close to the ticket machines so everything is crammed together. Ques for the ticket machines interfere with the ques to get to the trains, ques for the cashier interfere with the ques for the ticket machines and the ques to get to the trains, and exiting and entering passengers have to pass through the ques or go around them. Plus all the vendors blocking the passageways. So can you imagine the mess if fares are reduced and ridership increases? Even if they double or triple the number of trains it will still be a major mess just getting on and off the platform (because of the impeccable Thai logic). Just wait there will be cones and rolling barricades put up everywhere to further increase congestion.

Yes Thailand is a developing country, but they seem to be totally incapable of learning from developed countries. Thailand seems to be intent on inventing the wheel albeit in the shape of an octagon, or some other crazy shape, because this shape will keep the ghosts away, bring good luck, a monk told them to, it uses more concrete and steel which is good for some politician or just because that is the way they have always done it.

Oh I did hear one thing they are trying to learn from America, give a tax break to the wealthy. Must be why they are increasing the tax on alcohol and tobacco. They need to offset the loss of income from the rich and get it from the poor.

Edited August 22, 2012 by soundman
No name calling please.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Lest my prior comments be misunderstood or misconstrued, I too think BTS and MRT are among the most efficient and best run services I've seen in Thailand.

The point of my comments was really to wonder, where are the funds going to come from to subsidize the notion of a systemwide 20 baht fare scheme for mass transit... I think it's a great idea.... I'm just wondering how the funds are going to be ponied up to support it... Or more direly, afraid that they won't be provided at all, promises notwithstanding.

Just having more lines, more trains and more passengers isn't by itself, I believe, going to somehow financially support a systemwide 20 baht fare model. And the OP news post in this thread seemed to be totally silent on the point of financial support.

[MaxLee]

Well how about investing more money into additional train compartments on BTS instead first, rather than lowering the price on BTS tickets so drastically? I would rather pay a slightly higher price for quality and safety in the first place?

Imagine if the price is lowered, without any additional compartments, BTS is gonna be stacked up like mini sardines more thanever, and workers will be later than ever because they can't get into the train because the previous stations are filled already. The people living in the "middle BTS stations will suffer the most" because the "beginning stations" will fill up like crazy, which will make it impossible to get on and squeeze into the filled BTS compartments...

Simply put it will mean, when the government lowers the fares, BTS workers would suffer immensely more from the already higher cost of living , quality will suck even more and there will be less safety, due to 'implementation of cheaper raw materials somewhere within the engineering and construction of additional trains and BTS tracks, which in other words means, in "lower safety standards"

Bottom line is, that lowering prices and EXPECTING labor force to survive on the higher cost of living, is a shot into ones balls

A very big reminder: 300 Baht increase wage policy

When the government tries to lower the price for the sake of the majority,... you know it ends up in a disaster...

Edited August 22, 2012 by MaxLee

[lomatopo]

Well how about investing more money into additional train compartments on BTS instead first, rather than lowering the price on BTS tickets so drastically? I would rather pay a slightly higher price for quality and safety in the first place?

I am fairly certain this has been addressed, somewhat, in that an additional (35 I think) sets for the Sukhumvit Line, expanding the current 3-car set to 4-cars, have been ordered (November , 2010 - the lead time from Siemens is quite long) and may already be in country, perhaps ready for deployment soon. They occasionally run a 4-car (CNR set) Silom Line train set on the Sukhumvit Line, presumably as a way of testing?

I think five (5) new CNR sets are on order to address increased ridership as a result of the Silom Line extension opening next August (2013). There are twelve (12) 4-car CNR sets on the Silom Line currently.

So capacity should increase, albeit in stages, on the Sukhumvit Line by 33% (assuming no changes in schedules/dwell times) and 41% on the Silom Line.

As with many semi-/quasi-official "pronouncements" here they may suffer from both poor translation, and any sort of background details. Hence we sometimes flail around trying to understand exactly what the heck they might be considering. I haven't been here long enough to judge, but my sense is that a lot of ideas get floated publicly without a lot of forethought, perhaps as a way to vet ideas, or to make the 'pronouncer' seem relevant and important?

Edited August 22, 2012 by lomatopo

[MaxLee]

As if BTS cares about us customers, either Thai or foreigners. If you're in traffic jam on Sukhumvit road, you're f*****ED, and if you squeeze into BTS trains in rush hour you're f****ED,....

.... either way you're f*****ED, as Bangkok is gonna be stacked and jammed with people in the near future, with more traffic jams and BTS and MRT jams than ever, stacked with people who only want to live in Bangkok "hoping to earn more money than they can ever earn in their home town provinces", but guess what... they're gonna be f*****ED anyway because the cost of living is gonna be too high, in order to make a good living,; the pressure is gonna be to high, as Bangkok people, and Bangkok bosses are going to be very rude to them as they abuse their pride and power to talk down to those poor people who once thought, Bangkok is the ultimate paradise... they're f****ED for life...

Bottom line is, no matter how much money people earn in Bangkok, the cost of living is gonna suck them up really badly, AND transportation is IMO THE HIGHEST COST that sucks up the most money, especially BTS. For example, the new rabbit pass with the 30-50 trip discounts options only works on the existing Sukhumvit lines, and for every trip to the "new Sukhumvit lines you have to pay 15 Baht extra, nonetheless." Imagaine if you live in either of the "new Sukhumvit line stations, How much more extra money will you lose, by paying for the 30-50 limtied days discountr trips AND the additional Sukhumvit line extension money of 15 Baht back AND forth?... Do you get the idea...

paying extra money for the new Sukhumvit line extension despite and an existing 30-50 trip which already has a limit of days, is a f****ED up rip-off

Bottom-bottom BOTTOM line: Transportation eats up all your salary if you are poor and middle class, when they take BTS: you have to either walk in order to eat, or you decide to starve in order to ride the BTS

or if you want it faster and slick, take a motorbike taxi, but get ripped off more money, ESPECIALLY IF you are a foreigner and you speak no freaking Thai language; btw the motorbike taxi in Bangkok downtown in Silom and Ratchadamri are one of the worst off-rippers I've ever faced, just for your information...

or if you want the cheapest mode of transportation you take a bus, but then you live in danger with the crazy bus drivers OR, ... you're gonna get yourself SHOT when vocational students are running amok

That's the reality life in Bangkok....

Edited August 23, 2012 by MaxLee

[necronx99]

It's all very simple. to improve efficiency and reduce overcrowding they will shut more stations.

In fact many new stations built to service new routes will be shut before they are opened.

The whole thing will be funded by a 1000% increase of ticket prices on the airport link. tourists will gladly pay this once they realize how cheap and easy it will all be once they get to Pratunam.