Are Thai Ghosts/spirits Different ?

[BillyBobThai]

As someone who did quite a bit of acid/LSD in my younger days, it is amazing what the mind can make you think is real.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

As someone who did quite a bit of acid/LSD in my younger days, it is amazing what the mind can make you think is real.

Being a cop taking witness reports will give you the same enlightenment, and without as much brain damage.

[Neeranam]

As someone who did quite a bit of acid/LSD in my younger days, it is amazing what the mind can make you think is real.

Being a cop taking witness reports will give you the same enlightenment, and without as much brain damage.

There are some health benefits in taking LSD - can help cure alcoholism, for example.. Also it can give greater awareness to the ultimate reality. It certainly was a life-changing experience for me. There are some risks and a much safer way would be through meditation.

Steve Jobs said that taking LSD was one of the two or three most important things he'd ever done. "He said there were things about him that people who had not tried psychedelics — even people who knew him well, including his wife — could never understand," John Markoff reported for theTimes.

He'd allegedly ask interview candidates in the early days how many times they'd taken it. Why, and why did he recommend it to others?

Edited November 1, 2012 by Neeranam

[BigJohnnyBKK]

There are some health benefits in taking LSD - can help cure alcoholism, for example.

Sure but as you say there are safer ways to get the same results, in that case 12-step programs work well for a reasonable percentage of drunks, and have many constructive side-benefits as well.

IMO hallucinogenics in general are most useful as a way to help some people - those who are most deeply asleep - realize that there's a lot more to life and reality than the values indoctrinated by mainstream programming, especially in our modern very effectively brainwashed consumer/hedonist cultures.

But once that realization has arrived, I think the dangers outweigh the benefits - like any shortcut substance, it has consequences, and ultimately short-circuits the mental resources and subtler energies that are required to make any substantial progress on the very difficult process of waking up.

Edited November 1, 2012 by BigJohnnyBKK

[kblaze]

Be wary anyone who claims to be absolutely sure on this subject(Karen Bravo..et al). The fact that there is no proof (in the physical, court-related sense) supporting or disproving soul/ghost/God/afterlife means the only reasonable stance to be taken regarding absolute truth on the matter is;

I don't know.

Now you can have a "belief" in the sense that you tend to lean in one direction or the other on the issue, but to speak in absolutes regarding an, as of yet, unproven matter is as the Brits say "poppycock".

[KarenBravo]

Be wary anyone who claims to be absolutely sure on this subject(Karen Bravo..et al). The fact that there is no proof (in the physical, court-related sense) supporting or disproving soul/ghost/God/afterlife means the only reasonable stance to be taken regarding absolute truth on the matter is;

I don't know.

Now you can have a "belief" in the sense that you tend to lean in one direction or the other on the issue, but to speak in absolutes regarding an, as of yet, unproven matter is as the Brits say "poppycock".

So....the best answer to "is Father Christmas, or the flying spaghetti monster real?", is "I don't know".

Edited November 2, 2012 by KarenBravo

[kblaze]

Be wary anyone who claims to be absolutely sure on this subject(Karen Bravo..et al). The fact that there is no proof (in the physical, court-related sense) supporting or disproving soul/ghost/God/afterlife means the only reasonable stance to be taken regarding absolute truth on the matter is;

I don't know.

Now you can have a "belief" in the sense that you tend to lean in one direction or the other on the issue, but to speak in absolutes regarding an, as of yet, unproven matter is as the Brits say "poppycock".

So....the best answer to "is Father Christmas, or the flying spaghetti monster real?", is "I don't know".

Well obviously there are things we know and there are things we believe. Im saying it is the degree of your belief that is important. 100% is hard to justify in things that exist in the "believe" realm as opposed to the "know" realm.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

So....the best answer to "is Father Christmas, or the flying spaghetti monster real?", is "I don't know".

Why on earth would you consider the set of all things in which you don't believe to be homogeneously certain of non-existence?

Both of these were known to have been intentionally invented, one for commercial reasons and the other for proselytism.

[KarenBravo]

Surely, if someone doesn't believe in something, then they are certain (in their own mind) that it doesn't exist. Logic innit.

If Father Christmas and the flying spaghetti monster are inappropriate subjects there are thousands of subjects that are. Things that people actually believe in that are just as ridiculous. Take your pick.

[kblaze]

Surely, if someone doesn't believe in something, then they are certain (in their own mind) that it doesn't exist. Logic innit.

If Father Christmas and the flying spaghetti monster are inappropriate subjects there are thousands of subjects that are. Things that people actually believe in that are just as ridiculous. Take your pick.

I guess its how you define "belief"; my interpretation is that it still allows a degree of uncertainty.

[nietzche]

Ghosts?

Speak for yourself.

I would love to see a ghost. It would mean that they were indeed real, and I could focus my time on figuring out how to become one after death.

Once this was accomplished, I would haunt the s**t out of some people I don't like.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

Things that people actually believe in that are just as ridiculous. Take your pick.

Well I'm sure there are hundreds of phenomena that modern western governments and very respected scientists have invested millions of dollars studying, not just whether they exist or not, but how to apply them for intelligence or military purposes, which you would consider ridiculous and lump in the same category as the FSM.

I'm not arguing in favor of their reality, just saying that out of the vast number of things you don't believe in, there are some with a higher likelihood (even if slight) of being real than others.

If you have a loved one with an "incurable" illness according to the kind of medical practice that you believe in, and someone offered to have a go at an alternative treatment, or even if I offered to say mentally heal her at a distance without any cost or risk to yourself, might you give it a go?

If so then you're more open minded than you're pretending.

If not, then IMO you're a fool. Miracles (great things of which we don't understand the cause) do happen all the time, ask any doctor specializing in terminal illnesses.

[Neeranam]

Things that people actually believe in that are just as ridiculous. Take your pick.

Well I'm sure there are hundreds of phenomena that modern western governments and very respected scientists have invested millions of dollars studying, not just whether they exist or not, but how to apply them for intelligence or military purposes, which you would consider ridiculous and lump in the same category as the FSM.

I'm not arguing in favor of their reality, just saying that out of the vast number of things you don't believe in, there are some with a higher likelihood (even if slight) of being real than others.

If you have a loved one with an "incurable" illness according to the kind of medical practice that you believe in, and someone offered to have a go at an alternative treatment, or even if I offered to say mentally heal her at a distance without any cost or risk to yourself, might you give it a go?

If so then you're more open minded than you're pretending.

If not, then IMO you're a fool. Miracles (great things of which we don't understand the cause) do happen all the time, ask any doctor specializing in terminal illnesses.

Good post BigJohnnyBkk - you are an educated voice voice of reason on this thread. Although we differ in what we believe, I thank you for your contributions. They are very welcome considering one poster is the total opposite.

I'm sure a few atheists have prayed when the shit hits the fan or if a loved one is close to death.

[ravip]

The Haunted Gadsden Hotel

Ghosts said to mingle with guests at haunted Arizona hotel

[BigJohnnyBKK]

I'm sure a few atheists have prayed when the shit hits the fan or if a loved one is close to death.

IMO most people who pray may very well profess to believe, but don't live their day-to-day lives as if they do.

While I don't believe, I try to live my life in accordance with what I see as pretty universal principles behind most religions, hence validated by humanity's historical experience during its still continuing evolution. I am sure there is a lot of truth and wisdom in the words of the true prophets and founders of the major ones, and probably those of the thousands of lesser ones living amongst us we don't even know about.

Thanks for the kinds words, appreciated, and of course such courtesy should have nothing to do with the degree to which we agree or disagree with each other.

[McMagus]

It would be interesting to see how many farangs here 'do not believe in ghosts' but do believe in 'the holy ghost.'

Just thinking

[Rsquared]

I don't know either.......but I have enjoyed reading all the posts.

I am in the same frame of mind as BJBKK, and in the same breath am in allegiance with KB.

I believe there are many things within the universe that we still do not understand.....but I do not believe in something that has generated from some other persons imagination.

I too require scientific proof....or at least something that I can experience myself. Take gravity.....we all know it exists, we can all feel it's effect, yet no-one can say for certain "how" it exists.

I find religion to be peoples' figment of their own imagination.....with a handfull of brain-washing thrown in, so that they can feel good within themselves.

I want to "know"....not just believe, that if there is life after death....or that we are a free spirit that is occupying this body for a short time...and this spirit can carry on.

But I just don't know.....but I will not succumb to all the trash that is belted out in the name of religion.

I hope I am wrong, but as a previous poster said......once we die, that's it nadda, no more, finnito...end of story.

I hope to see you all next time.

Cheers.

[Rob8891]

I don't know either.......but I have enjoyed reading all the posts.

(BIG BIT DELETED TO SAVE SPACE!!)

I hope I am wrong, but as a previous poster said......once we die, that's it nadda, no more, finnito...end of story.

I hope to see you all next time.

Cheers.

I'd go along with your post in its entirety..... only your last sentences scares the cr@p out of me....... Are you implying that there is another Thaivisa on the other side??

[KarenBravo]

Certainly not proof that ghosts don't exist, but, certainly a "sign-post" to intimate that they're products of the human mind; why are many ghosts clothed? Ghosts of people are one thing but ghost clothes?

Shouldn't all ghosts be naked?

[Rsquared]

Certainly not proof that ghosts don't exist, but, certainly a "sign-post" to intimate that they're products of the human mind; why are many ghosts clothed? Ghosts of people are one thing but ghost clothes?

Shouldn't all ghosts be naked?

excellent observation!

[boggle]

Back on topic.

Yes thai ghosts are different. Like meny things in LOS us farangs just dont understand it. I have had many conversations about why only thai see thai ghosts and if they can see farang ghosts.

It is good sport until I take it to far and end up in the ghost dog house.

Take some food and sit in a crossroads at night and tap the bowls with a spoon. See what happens.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

Take some food and sit in a crossroads at night and tap the bowls with a spoon. See what happens.

I suspect I'm not alone in wanting to know more about what you think will happen without having to actually do the experiment myself. Crocodiles, Phi Krasue or what?

At all the crossroads around here I'm very likely to get run over, almost as likely if I stick to the footpath.

[Rob8891]

Certainly not proof that ghosts don't exist, but, certainly a "sign-post" to intimate that they're products of the human mind; why are many ghosts clothed? Ghosts of people are one thing but ghost clothes?

Shouldn't all ghosts be naked?

NO! Not the fat old farang ghosts!!

Back on topic.

Yes thai ghosts are different. Like meny things in LOS us farangs just dont understand it. I have had many conversations about why only thai see thai ghosts and if they can see farang ghosts.

It is good sport until I take it to far and end up in the ghost dog house.

Take some food and sit in a crossroads at night and tap the bowls with a spoon. See what happens.

I'm guessing you summon up thai ghosts?? I wonder what happens if you clink 2 Chang bottles together.....

[Screws]

In two hundred years science will look back upon our current state of knowledge with the same sense of superior disdain, as we now look upon using leeches in medicine.

Yet we are now using leeches in the 21st century. They are used to help heal skin grafts. They are also used for their blood anti-coagulant properties when re-attaching or, grafting on body parts.

Maggots I think.

PS. Belief in ghosts and spirits is for the weak-minded and superstitious.

Problem is we are all weakminded and superstitious if our surrounding culture is - look at the crap that passes for TV programming here.

When typical Thai kids watch typical Thai TV, their IQ goes down.

Edited November 4, 2012 by Screws

[BigJohnnyBKK]

They don't get their supernatural beliefs from mass media, it's taught to them directly by their parents much earlier on.

When typical Thai kids watch typical Thai TV, their IQ goes down.

I somehow think the average farang kid gets the same effect from the average programming back home.

But you're right, they don't call it an idiot box for nothing. I only let people I don't care about watch a broadcast signal in any household I've headed, most of the time haven't had any hookup at all, and currently the Thais of the house have to pay for the subscription themselves out of their pocket spending money. Too bad it's so cheap, would be better if they couldn't afford it.

Still not allowed to watch it until all their chores and homework are finished, except for those few that have proven records of self-discipline in that regard. . .

My dad was in the business from it's beginning, and he forbade us from watching more than five hours a week, that should tell you something. . .

[Synastry]

Doesn't matter what one thinks. Each has their own mind with its own reality.

[HerbalEd]

In the west most people know that there are no ghosts/spirits.

They may know in their rational mind, but meanwhile who is 100% rational?

[BigJohnnyBKK]

They may know in their rational mind, but meanwhile who is 100% rational?

Only using the rational component of your mind is like never unfurling the sails on your 70' yacht, crossing the oceans with your little put-put motor designed just for getting you into your parking spot at the marina.

[chiangmaikelly]

They may know in their rational mind, but meanwhile who is 100% rational?

Only using the rational component of your mind is like never unfurling the sails on your 70' yacht, crossing the oceans with your little put-put motor designed just for getting you into your parking spot at the marina.

The little put put motor would not push the boat through even a small sea (waves). What is rational about that?

[BigJohnnyBKK]

Only using the rational component of your mind is like never unfurling the sails on your 70' yacht, crossing the oceans with your little put-put motor designed just for getting you into your parking spot at the marina.

The little put put motor would not push the boat through even a small sea (waves). What is rational about that?

Exactly my point, but maybe you missed the fact that I'm using something called an analogy. You see, the little put-put is the logical part of the mind, makes a lot of noise and a bit smelly but doesn't have much power, the rest of the mind is the quiet, elegant and powerful part, etc.