Just Told My 800K For Retirement Can't Be Moved Between Banks

[inquisitive]

I just got back from Chang Wattana Immigration feeling quite frustrated. I was renewing a retirement visa (OK, getting an extension of stay) for the umpteenth time. I had presented the nice lady behind the desk with three bank books and three letters from the banks. She still insisted that I go downstairs and deposit 100 baht in Bangkok Bank to get an update from within the last ten minutes. When I came back she announced that I had let my money drop too low last November when I did a 400k withdrawal.

The story is that I added 400k to one account and then two days later when I was sure everythign had "cleared", I removed 400k from one of the other accounts. Except for the two days where it was increased by 400k, the total amount of money in the three banks didn't change one baht by the activity. Unfortunately, the kind lady kept saying the balance was too low and that the only way I could stay in the Kingdom was to get an income verification letter from my embassy. I was so stunned that I stupidly took her word for the math. It was only when I got back home and checked the total balance day by day for the last three months, that I saw the lowest balance during that time period was 970,000 baht!

I understand the rule to be that I must have 800,000 in Thai banks for at least three months before renewing. I understand that this can be spread between accounts and that I can move the money around so long as the total never drops below 800k for the three months before renewal. Did I get this wrong, or was she just mathematically challenged?

Also I will go to the US embassy in the morning. I have an appointment already, but I forgot to ask them if I needed to bring proof of my income. Last I heard, it wasn't necessary.

And finally, will the nice Immigration lady insist on a Thai translation of the income verification?

I just want to be prepared.

[Mario2008]

Depends on the immirgation officer, but others have reported no problem when changing the account where they kep the money in. The rules don't say it needs to be the same bank, so someone higer up the chain of command might have overruled her.

US embassy requires you to have the affadivid printed out, but not signed. You sign in front of the consular officer. No proof of income is required by the embassy.

Letters in English language do normally not have to be translated into Thai. Certainly not at CW-road.

[Jingthing]

I was told at Jomtien, definitely multiple banks are OK, but of course the sum of the accounts cannot ever drop under 800K during the seasoning period. Of course the legless man has already suffered a lot. I reckon he'll be going for sympathy.

[Jingthing]

I think it is fair to say however, that MOVING funds between qualifying accounts could be a complicating factor in immigration accepting multiple accounts.

[Mario2008]

1 off topic post has been rmoved.

[inquisitive]

I think it is fair to say however, that MOVING funds between qualifying accounts could be a complicating factor in immigration accepting multiple accounts.

Thanks for the information, all. I plan to follow up with the income verification in the morning and then off to Immigration by 9AM. I'll try to report back what happens.

[12DrinkMore]

I dunno why people mess around with their accounts like this.

Keep It Simple Stupid!

800,000 in one account for three months, is that such an issue?

How to make life difficult, just follow the OP.

"The story is that I added 400k to one account and then two days later when I was sure everythign had "cleared", I removed 400k from one of the other accounts. Except for the two days where it was increased by 400k, the total amount of money in the three banks didn't change one baht by the activity."

Three accounts in three different banks and moving money around in the three months prior to a visa extension?

You have to be kidding me.

One account, 800,000, three months.

Make life easy for yourself, FGS.

[Jingthing]

The reality is you don't usually NEED to keep it that simple. Multiple accounts should be accepted. I think the complexity of the OP's accounts made the officer's brain hurt. I think a simpler multiple account scenario with no transfer between those accounts (might be seen as a trick), would have likely passed.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Feel sorry for the OP... And if I understand his post correctly,the sum of the balances in his three different accounts never dropped below the magic 800,000 baht figure during the required three month period.

That said, while multiple accounts certainly are supposed to be allowed, using that number and then moving funds in and out of the accounts during the 3 month period would seem to be risking potential grief from Immigration.

The more any of us complicate things in these kinds of endeavors, the greater the risk that some bureaucrat is going to decide to have a bad day.... at your expense. I agree, best and safest to keep it simple, even though the rules allow otherwise.

[Jingthing]

Yeah, that's my read. The officer just found the accounts too complicated. I think two accounts, no transfers during the seasoning period, would NOT have been too complicated.

[inquisitive]

I dunno why people mess around with their accounts like this.

Keep It Simple Stupid!

800,000 in one account for three months, is that such an issue?

How to make life difficult, just follow the OP.

"The story is that I added 400k to one account and then two days later when I was sure everythign had "cleared", I removed 400k from one of the other accounts. Except for the two days where it was increased by 400k, the total amount of money in the three banks didn't change one baht by the activity."

Three accounts in three different banks and moving money around in the three months prior to a visa extension?

You have to be kidding me.

One account, 800,000, three months.

Make life easy for yourself, FGS.

I guess you're one of those guys that eat only one thing for breakfast and one other thing for lunch every blessed day. That's pretty simple, too, but my brain can handle a bit more. Too bad you think a professional isn't up to adding three numbers. I guess we all just see the world through our own eyes, "FGS", as you impatiently say, try to temper your narrow view of the world with a little compassion for your fellow man. And maybe even accept that there might be some other correct point of view besides your own. FGS, I mean. Sheesh!. Perhaps your attack reflects more about yourself than the situation.

[Fgis]

I dunno why people mess around with their accounts like this.

Keep It Simple Stupid!

800,000 in one account for three months, is that such an issue?

How to make life difficult, just follow the OP.

"The story is that I added 400k to one account and then two days later when I was sure everythign had "cleared", I removed 400k from one of the other accounts. Except for the two days where it was increased by 400k, the total amount of money in the three banks didn't change one baht by the activity."

Three accounts in three different banks and moving money around in the three months prior to a visa extension?

You have to be kidding me.

One account, 800,000, three months.

Make life easy for yourself, FGS.

I guess you're one of those guys that eat only one thing for breakfast and one other thing for lunch every blessed day. That's pretty simple, too, but my brain can handle a bit more. Too bad you think a professional isn't up to adding three numbers. I guess we all just see the world through our own eyes, "FGS", as you impatiently say, try to temper your narrow view of the world with a little compassion for your fellow man. And maybe even accept that there might be some other correct point of view besides your own. FGS, I mean. Sheesh!. Perhaps your attack reflects more about yourself than the situation.

No, I think he is just less stupid than many others....

Just as the ones who are robbed and wonder why when they are the reason of all the troubles that happen to them !!!

[wayned]

I taught math in a goverment high school for 6 years. One of the subjects in the math cirriculum is "REASONING". I found the very few Thais are good at math, or maybe they are just not interested, but when it comes to reasoning it's totally beyond their comprehension. I suspect the officer just didn't comprehend what ws happening with the multiple accounts OR just didn't want to try to figure it out.

[Osiris]

I think it is fair to say however, that MOVING funds between qualifying accounts could be a complicating factor in immigration accepting multiple accounts.

Thanks for the information, all. I plan to follow up with the income verification in the morning and then off to Immigration by 9AM. I'll try to report back what happens.

Please, also report the value of your time, and the resulting time/money you lost as a result of the time spent on an unnecessary task. I'm doing a mathematical study to determine if Thai p_$$y, and Thailand in general, is worth the effort. Stay tuned for the book.

Yeah, I know already, I'm a bit cynical.

[Pawpcorn]

Maybe you should consider drawing pictures to aid "the nice Immigration lady" in understanding the money transfer information.

You could have the picture of the Banks with 400K be half the size of the 800K Bank.

Have a different group of pictures for EACH date that the financial picture changed, and include the DATE in Thai format.

Just picture that you're trying to explain the situation to a FIVE year old... and go from there.

Just a thought.

[mahjongguy]

I sympathize with the OP who carefully and logically dealt with his banking needs in a way which conformed to the stated requirements.

I also sympathize with the Immigration officer, who has to deal every day with people that try to scam her on this issue, exercising her prerogative to reject the evidence provided. She is not obligated to "do the math".

[DiNiro]

I was sent away once.

My bank letter stated 860,000Bt. and my bank book stated 840,000Bt. ( I had withdrawn 20,000Bt.)

"Nope. Bank book and bank letter must match exactly" I was told.

I politely argued that the requirement of 800,000Bt. had been met and in fact exceeded by 40,000Bt.....

"No, go back to the bank and get another letter that matched the bank book exactly"....

[pmugghc]

I was sent away once.

My bank letter stated 860,000Bt. and my bank book stated 840,000Bt. ( I had withdrawn 20,000Bt.)

"Nope. Bank book and bank letter must match exactly" I was told.

I politely argued that the requirement of 800,000Bt. had been met and in fact exceeded by 40,000Bt.....

"No, go back to the bank and get another letter that matched the bank book exactly"....

Happened to me too in Jomtien last December. The letter and bankbook must match. Forget about logic or reasoning.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[IMA_FARANG]

Not sue if it is still available or not .... but in Chaengwattana at least for Bangkok bank accounts they used to issue a current bank letter inside the Bangkok Bank branch office on the first floor with no prior notice.

You will need your bank passbook and a proof of identity also (your passport will do).

They can verify your current amount in the account and print you a bank letter right there in less than 15 minutes from start to finished letter.

And that letter is acceptable upstaies in immigration.

Not sure about other banks, but Bangkok bank was able to do it all right there in that branch,

However, I haven't actually been in that bank branch in Chaengwattana for over a year ,,,, but I know they used to do the whole thing right there,

[DiNiro]

Not sue if it is still available or not .... but in Chaengwattana at least for Bangkok bank accounts they used to issue a current bank letter inside the Bangkok Bank branch office on the first floor with no prior notice.

You will need your bank passbook and a proof of identity also (your passport will do).

They can verify your current amount in the account and print you a bank letter right there in less than 15 minutes from start to finished letter.

And that letter is acceptable upstaies in immigration.

Not sure about other banks, but Bangkok bank was able to do it all right there in that branch,

However, I haven't actually been in that bank branch in Chaengwattana for over a year ,,,, but I know they used to do the whole thing right there,

Good info.

[meatboy]

so there's the answer guys dont complicate things,why did they never have bead boards in thailand,only used to counting out of brown envelopes,one thousand,two thousand,three thousand,four thousand hooooooooooooo i am happy.

[moe666]

When ever we have an issue at immigration it can be a pain for us and the officer, in the final analyst keep it as simple as possible so that there cannot be any doubt. Yes the OP can handle multiply accounts but as he has found out a lady at immigration cannot especially when there has been transfers. Good luck to him getting his letter and extension of stay

[steve down under]

3 bank accounts 3 seperate amounts to total up " nice immigration lady can't do the sums in her head " Farang customer brings small pocket calculator from pocket and turns on and says here luv use this to calculate the final total ! easy as ,unless "nice immigration lady can't figure out how to use said calculator of course in which case back to square one .

[RubbaJohnny]

Your time has no value to them

[lopburi3]

Post removed.

[marstons]

Depends on the immirgation officer, but others have reported no problem when changing the account where they kep the money in. The rules don't say it needs to be the same bank, so someone higer up the chain of command might have overruled her.

US embassy requires you to have the affadivid printed out, but not signed. You sign in front of the consular officer. No proof of income is required by the embassy.

Letters in English language do normally not have to be translated into Thai. Certainly not at CW-road.

Thats a great system the USA have if only the British Embassey made it so easy.

[marstons]

I dunno why people mess around with their accounts like this.

Keep It Simple Stupid!

800,000 in one account for three months, is that such an issue?

How to make life difficult, just follow the OP.

"The story is that I added 400k to one account and then two days later when I was sure everythign had "cleared", I removed 400k from one of the other accounts. Except for the two days where it was increased by 400k, the total amount of money in the three banks didn't change one baht by the activity."

Three accounts in three different banks and moving money around in the three months prior to a visa extension?

You have to be kidding me.

One account, 800,000, three months.

Make life easy for yourself, FGS.

I guess you're one of those guys that eat only one thing for breakfast and one other thing for lunch every blessed day. That's pretty simple, too, but my brain can handle a bit more. Too bad you think a professional isn't up to adding three numbers. I guess we all just see the world through our own eyes, "FGS", as you impatiently say, try to temper your narrow view of the world with a little compassion for your fellow man. And maybe even accept that there might be some other correct point of view besides your own. FGS, I mean. Sheesh!. Perhaps your attack reflects more about yourself than the situation.

Its not about what your brain can handle but what a thai immigration officers brain can handle. For me i would have left in 1 account having used thai immigration for 17 years I would have kept it as simple as possible, same would go for UK Embassey staff as well.

[inquisitive]

I sympathize with the OP who carefully and logically dealt with his banking needs in a way which conformed to the stated requirements.

I also sympathize with the Immigration officer, who has to deal every day with people that try to scam her on this issue, exercising her prerogative to reject the evidence provided. She is not obligated to "do the math".

To the contrary, she is paid to do the math. That is her job. If she is not up to the task, she should be working somewhere else.

That having been said, there is value in knowing ahead of time that even such a simple task as adding up three numbers could be beyond what Immigration is either able or willing to do.

FWIW, I just returned from there. I spent a couple of hours and $50 to get a verification of income. When I presented it, the agent seemed pleased and handled the paperwork smoothly and quickly. She commented that teh income verification was always better to use than the bank acount method. She seemed surprised to learn of the added cost.

Once all was finished, I asked her if it was OK to do what I had done with the accounts, but I acted as if it were a theoretical question, and not about my account in particular. Not recognizing that what I described was exactly what she had rejected just 24 hours before, she answered that of course it was allowed, but always teh income verification was better.

So almost everyone here is right. What I had done was supposed to be acceptable. The nice lady knew it was acceptable, but was either unwilling or unable to add three numbers or analyse the situation, so she took the easy route which was to put me off to another clerk on another day. I did finaly make her a graph that showed each and every single day for the last three months, what the deposits were in each bank, and what the total deposits were for all three accounts put together on each day. I also put that same information into a table. I made these to be used only as a last resort, however, if somenew some new and equally frustrating objection was raised over the balances. With the income letter, however, they never had to be mentioned.

[Jingthing]

My attitude is that if it isn't a major burden, use the clearest simplest method you can swing. For bank account method: one account. Someday I may need to try using two accounts for mechanical situational reasons, but I make an effort to avoid any complications like that if I CAN. I know the two accounts should be officially accepted but no reason to push my luck unless it's needed.

[TaoNow]

@Inquisitive:

You say you've been here "umpteen" years, yet you are surprisingly unsympathetic to the Thai civil servants who have to process scores of extensions every day for us ex-pat retirees.

Try to understand that we are allowed to stay here at the pleasure of the Immigration officers, not out of some right or privilege.

When you spread your 800K among three accounts, and shift the funds, you are at least tripling the paperwork and verification tasks that have to be processed by the official. (It is not a question of math or math ability.) You are making her life more difficult, regardless of what the assigned task is.

So, as JT suggests, be a helpful guy and make things as easy as possible for the Immo officer you see -- that little bit of goodwill will have ripple effects.