Is Pattaya More Dangerous Than It Used To Be...?

[tropo]

I am sure our crime rate is small compared with Pattaya Central.

I don't know about that. Some of the worst stories come from the dark side... and the bandits that hang out on the roads. It's no wonder people don't want to go there with a name like that.

A guy from my gym riding a bike from the dark side early morning was side swiped by a car and robbed at gunpoint while he was lying on the road with a broken back from the fall. You need a car to live there.

It may be nice to live out there in the quiet, but you can't avoid the congested and dangerous roads to get there. You also have no control over new developments which could spring up at a moments notice and turn your quiet lifestyle into noisy hell.

Edited February 5, 2013 by tropo

[BlackPuddingBertha]

I live on the Darkside, crime out here is out of control.

Pardon my ignorance, but WHERE on earth is "the dark side"?

I would like to know that too.

I find it hard to believe that residents of Pattaya don't know the Darkside.

Indeed.

I also find it hard to believe that someone failed to read the explanation of what it is that I gave in this very thread last week:

[pattayadingo]

I now live on the 'Dark Side' after living in the Arunothai area off Pattaya Klang.

Not wanting to put the mockers on things.... LOL ..... but ....

For almost 5 years I have been coming to Pattaya - mainly on weekends - and lived here for 2 years. In all that time I have never yet personally encountered or been the victim of any criminal activity.

I visit Beach road, LK Metro, Walking street and numerous other areas on a weekend until 2 or 3 a.m. I go to bars, drink, watch football and rugby, have a good time and then go home.

I've done this on my own many a time. Other times with company.

I have to admit that I try to take care and be aware of my surroundings as I would in any place at that time of morning, be it Zagreb, Pula, Winnipeg, Amsterdam, Helsingborg, or one of the myriad of places I've been to.

Being an ex-merchant seaman you learned where not to be, as in you would not walk through the docks after a certain time of night alone, or to flash money, gold or other items about.

Yes, you will sometimes be the victim of a crime at some point in your life, but you can take steps to minimise the risk if you are sensible.

[NaMah]

Besides, she likes the sea. So I could almost say that I'm planning to go to Pattaya for her sake!

What with that and the yoga and the early nights, I suspect that you might find Jomtien more suitable than Pattaya. You can easily get from there to Pattaya for 10B on the bahtbus if you want to.

Yeah, I was thinking similarly. If the OP has his elderly mother with him and he has a calm retiring lifestyle where he is getting up early, going to bed early and living somewhat, ah, virtuously then maybe living a short distance outside of Pattaya would work. I understand that finding somewhere that is *quiet* in Pattaya can be a bit of a challenge. Can a guy find a reasonably quiet condo or home in Jomtien?

He could live somewhere that is relatively peaceful with his mother but still have access to some nightlife or haute cuisine on occasion if he was so inclined.

[tropo]

I understand that finding somewhere that is *quiet* in Pattaya can be a bit of a challenge. Can a guy find a reasonably quiet condo or home in Jomtien?

I would recommend looking in the Pratumnak Hill region. There's a lot of very quiet streets there and you're right on the border of Pattaya/Jomtien.

I think a lot of you people seem to think that living in Pattaya or Jomtien means living on the main roads next to a bar. You don't have to go far off the main roads to find very quiet places to live. There's literally hundreds of very quiet streets all around Pattaya.

[balo]

I think Jomtien area is much safer , all you have to worry about is drunk Russians .

[ROBINPATTAYA]

I am sure our crime rate is small compared with Pattaya Central.

I don't know about that. Some of the worst stories come from the dark side... and the bandits that hang out on the roads. It's no wonder people don't want to go there with a name like that.

A guy from my gym riding a bike from the dark side early morning was side swiped by a car and robbed at gunpoint while he was lying on the road with a broken back from the fall. You need a car to live there.

It may be nice to live out there in the quiet, but you can't avoid the congested and dangerous roads to get there. You also have no control over new developments which could spring up at a moments notice and turn your quiet lifestyle into noisy hell.

I don't dissagree with anything you have said but I still think the crime rate on the Darkside is far less than inside Pattaya.

Most small crimes on tourists inside Pattaya will go unreported as it is just too hard dealing with the police & the system in Thailand.

There are robberies off bikes etc out here, my friend who is 135kgs & a big strong man was pushed off his bike but when they saw his size, they took off.

The pleasure of being in a quiet environment far outweighs the small discomfort of a bit of traffic.

I go into Pattaya (7klms) about once a month & stay in a hotel, easier than risking life & limb on a return trip late at night with a belly full of grog.

Cheers all.

[BlackPuddingBertha]

I would recommend looking in the Pratumnak Hill region. There's a lot of very quiet streets there and you're right on the border of Pattaya/Jomtien.

Some of the worst recent cases of violent crime have happened in that area, possibly because of the quiet streets and general lack of public transport. I'm not sure such an area would be ideal for an elderly mother with no car.

I'm neither elderly nor a mother and I also have a car, but still I am discouraged from moving to a building that I really like on Pratumnak because it is a 20 minute walk from the bahtbus route.

[smedly]

I am sure our crime rate is small compared with Pattaya Central.

I don't know about that. Some of the worst stories come from the dark side... and the bandits that hang out on the roads. It's no wonder people don't want to go there with a name like that.

A guy from my gym riding a bike from the dark side early morning was side swiped by a car and robbed at gunpoint while he was lying on the road with a broken back from the fall. You need a car to live there.

It may be nice to live out there in the quiet, but you can't avoid the congested and dangerous roads to get there. You also have no control over new developments which could spring up at a moments notice and turn your quiet lifestyle into noisy hell.

I don't dissagree with anything you have said but I still think the crime rate on the Darkside is far less than inside Pattaya.

Most small crimes on tourists inside Pattaya will go unreported as it is just too hard dealing with the police & the system in Thailand.

There are robberies off bikes etc out here, my friend who is 135kgs & a big strong man was pushed off his bike but when they saw his size, they took off.

The pleasure of being in a quiet environment far outweighs the small discomfort of a bit of traffic.

I go into Pattaya (7klms) about once a month & stay in a hotel, easier than risking life & limb on a return trip late at night with a belly full of grog.

Cheers all.

so let me get this right, you stay in a hotel when in pattaya for a night out 7kms away rather than risk your life travelling to the darkside late at night - that just confims a whole lot of what I thought about how safe it is over there - there have been many news stories of people being held up mugged bag snatches jewelery snatched guns murders etc from the east side of pattaya - it is by no means safer than central pattaya as some would have us believe, I for one would feel quite exposed travelling there late at night on my own - in fact I simply wouldn't do it unless I was in a car and that is a no no if I've been having a drink - the darkside would not be a place I would live at all

Edited February 6, 2013 by smedly

[LennyW]

I understand that finding somewhere that is *quiet* in Pattaya can be a bit of a challenge. Can a guy find a reasonably quiet condo or home in Jomtien?

I would recommend looking in the Pratumnak Hill region. There's a lot of very quiet streets there and you're right on the border of Pattaya/Jomtien.

I think a lot of you people seem to think that living in Pattaya or Jomtien means living on the main roads next to a bar. You don't have to go far off the main roads to find very quiet places to live. There's literally hundreds of very quiet streets all around Pattaya.

Seriously Tropo? I know you live in that area and are probably a little blinkered in your view, but the Pratumnak hill area has to have one of the highest crime rates around the Pattaya area, seems to be quite a lot of serious assault and robbery of Russians there lately.

A friend of mine stayed in a house right at the bottom of Pratumnak, next to where the princess stays, the police security detail encampment was right up against his wall and he still had a few attempted break in's, he has since moved from there.

[kevkev1888]

guys seriously is there an argument here

anyone that thinks pattaya crime rates are better than they were 1 2 ....10 years ago really needs to get with reality - this place is dangerous - very much more than it was one year or ten years ago, shootings rapes bag snatches gangs drugs scams guns corruption...............I recently heard from a good source that current initiation into a thai gang is to shoot a falang ???????? but they love us here don't they ?

Hmm so have there been ANY shootings of Farangs by Thai gangs in Pattaya?

Edited February 6, 2013 by kevkev1888

[ROBINPATTAYA]

I am sure our crime rate is small compared with Pattaya Central.

I don't know about that. Some of the worst stories come from the dark side... and the bandits that hang out on the roads. It's no wonder people don't want to go there with a name like that.

A guy from my gym riding a bike from the dark side early morning was side swiped by a car and robbed at gunpoint while he was lying on the road with a broken back from the fall. You need a car to live there.

It may be nice to live out there in the quiet, but you can't avoid the congested and dangerous roads to get there. You also have no control over new developments which could spring up at a moments notice and turn your quiet lifestyle into noisy hell.

I don't dissagree with anything you have said but I still think the crime rate on the Darkside is far less than inside Pattaya.

Most small crimes on tourists inside Pattaya will go unreported as it is just too hard dealing with the police & the system in Thailand.

There are robberies off bikes etc out here, my friend who is 135kgs & a big strong man was pushed off his bike but when they saw his size, they took off.

The pleasure of being in a quiet environment far outweighs the small discomfort of a bit of traffic.

I go into Pattaya (7klms) about once a month & stay in a hotel, easier than risking life & limb on a return trip late at night with a belly full of grog.

Cheers all.

so let me get this right, you stay in a hotel when in pattaya for a night out 7kms away rather than risk your life travelling to the darkside late at night - that just confims a whole lot of what I thought about how safe it is over there - there have been many news stories of people being held up mugged bag snatches jewelery snatched guns murders etc from the east side of pattaya - it is by no means safer than central pattaya as some would have us believe, I for one would feel quite exposed travelling there late at night on my own - in fact I simply wouldn't do it unless I was in a car and that is a no no if I've been having a drink - the darkside would not be a place I would live at all

on a return trip late at night with a belly full of grog.

Read the whole article & dont take things out of context please.

It isn't the danger that worries me, just my ability to drive or ride when drunk. I would rather stay in town & really engoy myself.

Edited February 6, 2013 by ROBINPATTAYA

[tropo]

Seriously Tropo? I know you live in that area and are probably a little blinkered in your view, but the Pratumnak hill area has to have one of the highest crime rates around the Pattaya area, seems to be quite a lot of serious assault and robbery of Russians there lately.

A friend of mine stayed in a house right at the bottom of Pratumnak, next to where the princess stays, the police security detail encampment was right up against his wall and he still had a few attempted break in's, he has since moved from there.

No quiet areas are without crime, but I have never witnessed any incidents first hand in 7 years in the area - in 2 different places. Break-ins can happen anywhere in Pattaya but break-ins will also happen everywhere (in cities) where I used to live in Australia if you don't take suitable precautions.

If you want a place that you can leave open at night without any risk, then I would agree that Pattaya is not your place. Having a secure place is important everywhere.

Edited February 6, 2013 by tropo

[PoodMaiDai]

I would not take my mother to Pattaya. Maybe look into Hua Hin or Cha Am if you want to take her to the beach.

[ibbillerose]

I left Costa Rica because of the crime and druggies, I have lived here for 8 yrs. When I first arrived you could leave your golf clubs ouside a bar, or your moter bike with the keys in it-no worry. Now, unless your a seasoned tourist, you better be hunkered down by 9:00 PM. If your set on coming to this area, try S.Jomtien or Na jomtien. Forget about the Dark Side, if you love your Mama.

[Awohalitsiktoli]

guys seriously is there an argument here

anyone that thinks pattaya crime rates are better than they were 1 2 ....10 years ago really needs to get with reality - this place is dangerous - very much more than it was one year or ten years ago, shootings rapes bag snatches gangs drugs scams guns corruption...............I recently heard from a good source that current initiation into a thai gang is to shoot a falang ???????? but they love us here don't they ?

Hmm so have there been ANY shootings of Farangs by Thai gangs in Pattaya?

It might help to go to the police station and get all of their records, sort them out, and do a statistical analysis......OR, listen to expats who have been her a long time, the vast majority of which will agree, totally, that crime has skyrocketed over the past 20 years. On your point, my first thought was of the two Russian women who were gunned down in cold blood while sitting on beach chairs in Jomtien. Did a Thai gang have anything to do with it? Maybe the Thai mafia. Who knows for sure. Just two days ago a man from the UK told me about a friend of his who was riding his motorcycle on the dark side at night and was approached by two Thai men on a motorcycle; they produced a gun and told him to stop and give them his money. He gave them his money while they were pointing a gun right at him! Those who think crime has not significfantly increased here over the past few decades are out of touch with reality or somehow connected to the real estate industry, IMHO.

[smedly]

guys seriously is there an argument here

anyone that thinks pattaya crime rates are better than they were 1 2 ....10 years ago really needs to get with reality - this place is dangerous - very much more than it was one year or ten years ago, shootings rapes bag snatches gangs drugs scams guns corruption...............I recently heard from a good source that current initiation into a thai gang is to shoot a falang ???????? but they love us here don't they ?

Hmm so have there been ANY shootings of Farangs by Thai gangs in Pattaya?

It might help to go to the police station and get all of their records, sort them out, and do a statistical analysis......OR, listen to expats who have been her a long time, the vast majority of which will agree, totally, that crime has skyrocketed over the past 20 years. On your point, my first thought was of the two Russian women who were gunned down in cold blood while sitting on beach chairs in Jomtien. Did a Thai gang have anything to do with it? Maybe the Thai mafia. Who knows for sure. Just two days ago a man from the UK told me about a friend of his who was riding his motorcycle on the dark side at night and was approached by two Thai men on a motorcycle; they produced a gun and told him to stop and give them his money. He gave them his money while they were pointing a gun right at him! Those who think crime has not significfantly increased here over the past few decades are out of touch with reality or somehow connected to the real estate industry, IMHO.

no disrespect but I read the first line of your post and no further

you mentioned police - I would replace that word with many things - it is a word that for most means justice integrerty and honor, - in thailand it is a word without meaning

[ROBINPATTAYA]

The topic of this forum debate isn't only related to Pattaya. It can be directed at every developing country where tourism is a main source of income for the majority of locals.

Every Thai in Pattaya is living off tourism either directly or indirectly, even if they are a street vendor selling Issan food to locals. Those locals will work in a bar, hotel, restaurant be a street sweeper or work in some other establishment dealing with tourists.

Without the tourist, what does Pattaya have to offer the majority of travellers to this city, not much apart from golf.

Crime is a natural partner with progress, particulary in under developed countries. Thailand is still verging on being a third world country because the majority of people don't have access to clean drinking water, that is a requirement by the UN. Thailand is also a known people smuggler country, something that we should all be more concerned about more than loosing a few personal items to an opportunist thief.

The crimes we are discussing are generally in the lower economies of the world unlike white collar crime that is more prevalent in developed nations.

Just accept that there will always be some crime around us & just be more aware of your surroundings particulary late at night.

Cheers all.

[smedly]

The topic of this forum debate isn't only related to Pattaya. It can be directed at every developing country where tourism is a main source of income for the majority of locals.

Every Thai in Pattaya is living off tourism either directly or indirectly, even if they are a street vendor selling Issan food to locals. Those locals will work in a bar, hotel, restaurant be a street sweeper or work in some other establishment dealing with tourists.

Without the tourist, what does Pattaya have to offer the majority of travellers to this city, not much apart from golf.

Crime is a natural partner with progress, particulary in under developed countries. Thailand is still verging on being a third world country because the majority of people don't have access to clean drinking water, that is a requirement by the UN. Thailand is also a known people smuggler country, something that we should all be more concerned about more than loosing a few personal items to an opportunist thief.

The crimes we are discussing are generally in the lower economies of the world unlike white collar crime that is more prevalent in developed nations.

Just accept that there will always be some crime around us & just be more aware of your surroundings particulary late at night.

Cheers all.

good post and couldn't agree more but to an extent you are stating the obvious and not really answering the OP, the worrying trend is that serious crime in pattaya is on the increase - the local authorities are aware of it hence the 30 day crack down, the issue here really is are the police proactivly doing enough to stop crime getting out of control ? in a word no, a lot of the crime here is drug related - locals needing to resort to crime to feed the habbit, a recent 2hr check point on the east side resulted in the arrest of some 80 individuals found to be positive for drugs - that rings very loud alarm bells for me, unfortunately the police are probably involved in the distribution network - that sucks

[simple1]

The topic of this forum debate isn't only related to Pattaya. It can be directed at every developing country where tourism is a main source of income for the majority of locals.

Every Thai in Pattaya is living off tourism either directly or indirectly, even if they are a street vendor selling Issan food to locals. Those locals will work in a bar, hotel, restaurant be a street sweeper or work in some other establishment dealing with tourists.

Without the tourist, what does Pattaya have to offer the majority of travellers to this city, not much apart from golf.

Crime is a natural partner with progress, particulary in under developed countries. Thailand is still verging on being a third world country because the majority of people don't have access to clean drinking water, that is a requirement by the UN. Thailand is also a known people smuggler country, something that we should all be more concerned about more than loosing a few personal items to an opportunist thief.

The crimes we are discussing are generally in the lower economies of the world unlike white collar crime that is more prevalent in developed nations.

Just accept that there will always be some crime around us & just be more aware of your surroundings particulary late at night.

Cheers all.

good post and couldn't agree more but to an extent you are stating the obvious and not really answering the OP, the worrying trend is that serious crime in pattaya is on the increase - the local authorities are aware of it hence the 30 day crack down, the issue here really is are the police proactivly doing enough to stop crime getting out of control ? in a word no, a lot of the crime here is drug related - locals needing to resort to crime to feed the habbit, a recent 2hr check point on the east side resulted in the arrest of some 80 individuals found to be positive for drugs - that rings very loud alarm bells for me, unfortunately the police are probably involved in the distribution network - that sucks

Regards the 80 arrested in Soi Nernplubwan, you are 100% correct, the local police are the main suppliers to the distributors. Cleaver really; sell drugs wholesale, then arrest the users for extra tea money - average cost to avoid going to rehab for first offense, about 15K baht, so the loan sharks will also see a business increase

[kevkev1888]

guys seriously is there an argument here

anyone that thinks pattaya crime rates are better than they were 1 2 ....10 years ago really needs to get with reality - this place is dangerous - very much more than it was one year or ten years ago, shootings rapes bag snatches gangs drugs scams guns corruption...............I recently heard from a good source that current initiation into a thai gang is to shoot a falang ???????? but they love us here don't they ?

Hmm so have there been ANY shootings of Farangs by Thai gangs in Pattaya?

It might help to go to the police station and get all of their records, sort them out, and do a statistical analysis......OR, listen to expats who have been her a long time, the vast majority of which will agree, totally, that crime has skyrocketed over the past 20 years. On your point, my first thought was of the two Russian women who were gunned down in cold blood while sitting on beach chairs in Jomtien. Did a Thai gang have anything to do with it? Maybe the Thai mafia. Who knows for sure. Just two days ago a man from the UK told me about a friend of his who was riding his motorcycle on the dark side at night and was approached by two Thai men on a motorcycle; they produced a gun and told him to stop and give them his money. He gave them his money while they were pointing a gun right at him! Those who think crime has not significfantly increased here over the past few decades are out of touch with reality or somehow connected to the real estate industry, IMHO.

So we have 2 Russians shot in 2007, 1 shooting in 6 years?

Hardly an indication that current initiation into a thai gang is to shoot a falang.

[Awohalitsiktoli]

I think you are missing my point, along with a previous poster who said something like, "no disrespect but I could only read the first sentence." My point is that statistical analyses of the type I mentioned would result in a quantitative assessment of the situation. But who is going to do that? And do the records actually exist in a form that would allow such an analysis? So, what do we do instead? We assess by proxy. People who claim that crime has not risen are living on a strange planet and wearing huge rose-colored glasses. Read Pattaya News. Talk with the police. Talk with friends, especially expats who have been here a long time and have no connection to the real estate industry. The answer is clear: Yes, crime has increased significantly. It is no longer a place where safety is something to take for granted, like it was for a very long time. I came here in 1986. I never even thought about crime until the mid-2000s. It really was not an issue. Most crime is Thai on Thai. Why? Maybe because Thais make up (my guess) at least 90% of the total population in Pattaya-Jomtien. But Thais do commit crimes against "farangs." If we listed each one here that has taken place since 1986, I am sure TV would run out of data storage. Add to that farang against farang and the place starts looking less and less secure. If we only focus on Thai gangs, we really distort the subject.

[tropo]

It might help to go to the police station and get all of their records, sort them out, and do a statistical analysis......OR, listen to expats who have been her a long time, the vast majority of which will agree, totally, that crime has skyrocketed over the past 20 years. On your point, my first thought was of the two Russian women who were gunned down in cold blood while sitting on beach chairs in Jomtien. Did a Thai gang have anything to do with it? Maybe the Thai mafia. Who knows for sure. Just two days ago a man from the UK told me about a friend of his who was riding his motorcycle on the dark side at night and was approached by two Thai men on a motorcycle; they produced a gun and told him to stop and give them his money. He gave them his money while they were pointing a gun right at him! Those who think crime has not significfantly increased here over the past few decades are out of touch with reality or somehow connected to the real estate industry, IMHO.

The OP was specifically asking if the crime is worse now than about 2 years ago when he was last here. That shooting was about 5 years ago.

[Awohalitsiktoli]

It might help to go to the police station and get all of their records, sort them out, and do a statistical analysis......OR, listen to expats who have been her a long time, the vast majority of which will agree, totally, that crime has skyrocketed over the past 20 years. On your point, my first thought was of the two Russian women who were gunned down in cold blood while sitting on beach chairs in Jomtien. Did a Thai gang have anything to do with it? Maybe the Thai mafia. Who knows for sure. Just two days ago a man from the UK told me about a friend of his who was riding his motorcycle on the dark side at night and was approached by two Thai men on a motorcycle; they produced a gun and told him to stop and give them his money. He gave them his money while they were pointing a gun right at him! Those who think crime has not significfantly increased here over the past few decades are out of touch with reality or somehow connected to the real estate industry, IMHO.

The OP was specifically asking if the crime is worse now than about 2 years ago when he was last here. That shooting was about 5 years ago.

Since two years is not statistically significant, he might as well of asked if crime is worse now that it was one month ago. In addition, crime covers a lot of territory. My guess is that the OP is concerned about violent crime, and not simply crime. On virtually every subject, we disagree, so there is nothing I can say that will make you believe that crime, including violent crime, has increased significantly in Pattaya-Jomtien over the past two decades. Personally, and only using proxy information, I think all forms of crime have increased over the past five years, especially in certain areas. I think a lot more police need to start patrolling Walking Street, all of the beach areas in both Jomtien and Pattaya, and the Dark Side, and start getting the "bad guys" (both Thai and farang) off the streets and out of the country. I guarantee you that there are other beach destinations that are far safer: Oman, Singapore, among others. But, lets face it, the bad guys do not come here for the "clean beaches," which do not exist here. If this place is ever going to take a step up, authorities will have to take a broom to alcoholism, mental illness, and the sex industry (itself stimulated by rural poverty). Given that will not happen, we can anticipate more crime as time goes on.

[BradWilkins]

Not being racist but since the large influx of russian tourists in the last few years especially in pattaya it seems to have gotten worse. Most do not speak english or thai are not well travelled and do not understand the culture differences. the russian mafia is another thing.