Bangkok: Expat shocked by 'foam-filled' condominium wall

[mania]

Not defending poor building practices but looking at the pictures

it looks like it was the R.O. ( rough opening ) for the window & was just

sized wrong.

In one picture you can see the header beam is in place albeit too high

for this size window/fixed pane of glass.

All the foam was used for is furring the size down to the correct opening.

cheap slip shod fix yes of course that is obvious. But by the same token they could not just stack

bricks in there as that would be as bad or worse because it would weight the glass stressing it.

It is actually proper construction to not have the header above a window touching the actual window frame because

of course all homes & building can settle over the course of years again stressing the glass with weight.

Of course a proper fix would have been another lower header beam in place but for that

to be correct they would need to also add two side supports for the header which in turn would reduce

the windows width by the width of the left & right support.

I guess they could not just add a taller window as it is a frameless corner glass & it would be obvious from outside

that room was somehow different

Bad all around but not structurally reducing the buildings strength as some have suggested.

Any opening if it has a proper header does not weaken the building.

If it did then the front door would also be guilty as any opening in an exterior wall would be.

Again this post is not meant in any way to justify the builders choices

[orchidlady]

I wondering if the contractors of the building where I live dumped extra building materials in our walls. I haven't had a problem with my toilet being clogged but several down the hall from me have had problems... The workers dumped all the extra concrete/cement bits into the toilet thinking they could flush it away. The owners (all second hand purchasers of units that were vacant for months--wonder why) have had to pay for the floors to be dug up to access/clean out the plumbing lines. Again builder said it was too long after sale for them to be responsible. I think the original owners knew and just sold at a discount to others.

[chooka]

We used to Dream of living in a foam filled condo!

And if you tell the young people that today, they won't believe you!!! :-)

ah Monty Python.

[chooka]

We used to Dream of living in a foam filled condo!

And if you tell the young people that today, they won't believe you!!! :-)

Gotta love the python boys.

[DocN]

Rumor on facebook is saying the development is part of the Shin family business.

Well it is in line with their government policy. Fill your pockets and dam_n the consequences.

Yeah...no one else in Thailand ever did nor ever will do it. Just Thaksin and the PT!

[slipperylobster]

You can get a refund.... I got one on the girl I met because her bra was filled with the same. I got my money back !

Thailand...the hub of foam filled stuff !

[Emdog]

"wanted plasterboard on inside walls but got render ...and the list just goes on and on will be doing article in pantip if this is the way to blame and shame builders...we will name them and ...can't be sued if it is the truith"

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think Thai law is such that you can be sued for slander even if it is the truth, for damaging someone's "face" or reputation. I recall Australia Chamber of Commerce rep was arrested for that a year or so ago, for telling truth to some Thai Chinese business mafia type. Had her arrested, even tho was a private phone call!

Truth is no protection in this country, and often seen as a liability. TIT.

[spacebass]

Thailand cheap for a reason .......... but as becoming less cheap reason still there ............. So value becoming poor.......... like everything else !!!!

Lose Lose Thailand,but will the rich lose enough to make any difference?

[Torrens54]

Would this be a good time to invest in Foam Insulation?

[planetdweller]

You can get a refund.... I got one on the girl I met because her bra was filled with the same. I got my money back !

Thailand...the hub of foam filled stuff !

lmao !!

[bangon04]

it is a very well run company

Based on this story apparently not, irrespetive of who the subcontractor is...this company is accountable for the actions of their subby's, and obviouly there is no effective QC or QA by the development company, if there is foam in the wall, what other short cuts have been taken ?

One or a number incidents like this does not mean it is poorly run. Every company in the world has issues with service, but if they take the appropriate measures to remedy and the appropriate measures to reduce the instances of problems for me it is sign of a good company. It is physically impossible to oversee every second of work of every subby. The very fact that one of the most senior persons in the company is straight away facing up to the issue and not hiding again is a good sign. However i do note his comment regarding that unit being the only one was a bit stupid, but that is just corporate PR. Either way, they are a very successful company and very well thought of by the Thai buyers, so that in itself shows me that whatever they are doing they are doing successfully.

Yep he has reassured everyone this is an isolated incident and building rubbish is only packed behind one wall in the entire building, that unfortunately was the wall of a farang who has the audacity to complain.

I suppose it must be expected when you hire cheap Burmese labourers.. No Thai would ever cut corners that way. Again it will be the foreigners giving Thaland a bad name...

[planetdweller]

Adherence to building codes and standards do not exist in Thailand.

I wouldn't think that would come as a surprise to anyone.

[Johnnie99]

Considering that surely buyers of condos have been here a few years, are they truly surprised by substandard construction?

The cheapest routes are taken, and the purchasers are fooled into trusting Thai builders at every turn. Standard Thai construction philosophy.

The building I work in had a fifth floor added last year, and the list of faults is too long to include here, but they range from cardboard walls (genuine cardboard though - you can still read the company logos), through an inadequate electrical supply to doors which have dropped so far as to remain open (or stubbornly closed) since the second week of occupancy.

The elevator has not worked since the second month.

[Johnnie99]

it is a very well run company

Based on this story apparently not, irrespetive of who the subcontractor is...this company is accountable for the actions of their subby's, and obviouly there is no effective QC or QA by the development company, if there is foam in the wall, what other short cuts have been taken ?

One or a number incidents like this does not mean it is poorly run. Every company in the world has issues with service, but if they take the appropriate measures to remedy and the appropriate measures to reduce the instances of problems for me it is sign of a good company. It is physically impossible to oversee every second of work of every subby. The very fact that one of the most senior persons in the company is straight away facing up to the issue and not hiding again is a good sign. However i do note his comment regarding that unit being the only one was a bit stupid, but that is just corporate PR. Either way, they are a very successful company and very well thought of by the Thai buyers, so that in itself shows me that whatever they are doing they are doing successfully.

Thai people are trained to accept substandard work if it means it's cheap. Nothing to do with success.

[BigSkip]

What?? No mention of free repair????????

[bander]

Mr. Uthai Uthaisaengsuk, Managing Director of the prestigious property group, insisted that his company had investigated the case and said that Mr. Houston′s room was the only room facing the problem.

I like the way Mr. Uthai Uthaisaengsuk lie and think we all believe his BS.

All the rooms in the condo is full of foam and paper until he prove otherwise.

The profit from this scam was probably split 50/50 between himself and the contractor who now will take the fall, no need to be Sherlock to figure this out

[newermonkey]

"said that Mr. Houston′s room was the only room facing the problem."

Yes the rest of the condo walls were packed with superior cardboard.

[newermonkey]

What?? No mention of free repair????????

Never mind "repair" How about a full refund of the price of the apartment ?

[fasteddie]

Luxury! when I were a lad, we lived in a cardboard box.

[Patje]

"Mr. Houston′s room was the only room facing the problem"

<deleted>

Yeah right !!!! And if you not believe that I will tell you another story !!

[Sung Ham]

Wait til he finds out the 'wall' under the window is actually made out of M150 bottles and menthol nasal sticks.

[giggles]

building regs are a joke in thailand.

always expect the very worst you can imagine

[bigbamboo]

Luxury! when I were a lad, we lived in a cardboard box.

A cardboard box?

You were lucky.

[geriatrickid]

Rumor on facebook is saying the development is part of the Shin family business.

Facts show that Sansiri is a public company. Did you make an effort to see who the major shareholders were, before spreading an unsubstantiated rumour?

Would it have killed you to go and look at who the directors are of the company?

Please tell who of these major shareholders holds the controlling interest for the "Shin family business".

http://www.sansiri.com/en/investor/major.aspx

[CNXTim]

Polystyrene is used all over the world as a first rate building insulation material. The poster did not say whether he was qualified to know that the wall in question was or was not structural.

But in most cases in Thailand,structural integrity of a building is performed by steel reinforced concrete pillars and beams so the use of polystyrene in a wall cavity is perfectly normal,

And BTW,100 mm of polystyrene will outperform R12 rated insulated brick veneer with drywall interior as both a sound and temperature barrier.

The leaking sounds like another issue entirely,

[geriatrickid]

So, which one of you is a qualified civil engineer and has inspected the building?

As of now, there is an allegation of poor construction on one unit. Have any other unit holders made a complaint?

Yes, foam is used in construction, often for insulation. Yes, some insulation is paper backed. There is often plastic membrane. The report is missing some key information specifically that of an actual expert who has assessed the nature of the claim.

However, do not let me get in the way of the usual TVF frenzy of finger pointing.

I am always impressed that so many retired lorry drivers, taxi drivers, and clerical workers are experts in so many areas. I'm not in the building trades and will wait until someone with some actual condo building construction in the local region offers his/her opinion. Heck, I'd settle for someone with some actual building trade experience.

There are a few qualified people in TVF but on the specialty forums,

[Chrisswe]

Typical Thai CORRUPTION !!!!

[smutcakes]

it is a very well run company

Based on this story apparently not, irrespetive of who the subcontractor is...this company is accountable for the actions of their subby's, and obviouly there is no effective QC or QA by the development company, if there is foam in the wall, what other short cuts have been taken ?

One or a number incidents like this does not mean it is poorly run. Every company in the world has issues with service, but if they take the appropriate measures to remedy and the appropriate measures to reduce the instances of problems for me it is sign of a good company. It is physically impossible to oversee every second of work of every subby. The very fact that one of the most senior persons in the company is straight away facing up to the issue and not hiding again is a good sign. However i do note his comment regarding that unit being the only one was a bit stupid, but that is just corporate PR. Either way, they are a very successful company and very well thought of by the Thai buyers, so that in itself shows me that whatever they are doing they are doing successfully.

From a QA/QC standpoint the majority of local company's view supervision and quality control as an incumbance in profitability. Good PR rhetoric would have been an undretaking to review other units that were constructed by the same sub contractor along with a promise to make good on any substandard work. The arms lenght small sub contracor is a standard ploy by these company's in order to cut costs and avoid blame for negligent work. Bullshit like this is an everyday occurance in Thailand and regardless of how they are thought of by the Thai buyers they are by no stretch of the immagination compotent or good and the only thing I see them doing succesfully is enhancing profitabiity and dodging the bullet.

Sansiri are a development company, not a construction company.Every project they build they have sub contractors to build it for them. Normally i would presume they have a main contractor, who would then sub contract for certain works if necessary, which is fairly standard in the construction industry, the quality of work would fall under the main contractor.

Construction faults, defects are an everyday occurrence in every building site across the globe- of course good Project Management is supposed to alleviate these, but even the best companies in the world would not be able to eradicate them completely. The guy who commented did say they have reviewed the other units, so i am prepared to take him at his word, I am sure it will come out pretty damn quickly if this is not an isolated case. (i concede it is unlikely to be an isolated case though, so we will see in the coming days)

For the amount of projects they have built, this is the first high profile incident i can remember, so it seems they build to a decent quality. I am not sure how YOU would measure a good company, but one that is profitable, has limited negative publicity, has a good loyal customer base to sell out all their developments, I would certainly say are competent at the very least- I am sure their share holders agree with that.

For my reference as to what you are comparing them with, perhaps you could suggest a competent and well run company?

[phantomfiddler]

No-one seems to have mentioned the tremendous step it would take to fix the problem. Surely this would be of paramount importance, and the responsibility of the main builder ?

[marcher]

Well at least the condo had good sound insulation...LOL

Completely wrong!!! Foam give good heat insulation and very poor sound insulation. Density is needed for sound, ie concrete or brick