ATM Scam in Pattaya

[generealty]

I have just returned to Thailand after working in India for a while and decided to check into Pattaya for a few days holiday, whilst my home had some ceramic tiling done. While I was using an ATM machine in Soi 5 (Immigration soi) Jomtien, a farang from one of the eastern bloc countries came up beside me and started talking to me to try to distract my attention. I got very uncomfortable and asked him to step back. I withdrew 5,000 baht and my receipt and card (which I had already processed) and quickly checked all and walked away. This guy kept talking all the time, even when I was walking away. I had heard of scams but never really understood how they can carry out them. Anyway, I got my mobile telephone out and started to make a call while I stood very close the the ATM machine as I felt very uneasy about the whole thing. He walked away, but I stayed they for at least another 10 minutes just in case he returned.

He never returned to the machine while I was there, so I walked away. About 6 days later I withdrew another 5,000 baht from another ATM machine in the center of Pattaya, but when I received my atm slip it showed that I was 42,000 baht down on last slip. I started to remember this guy and started to feel numb and sick. I rushed to the bank (siam commercial bank) to get a print out only to be shown that about 9 withdrawals had taken place over a 4 day period. 3 on the same evening as my Jomtien machine withdrawal. I instructed the bank to freeze my account immediately and stop my atm card. They instructed me to go to Police to get a Police Report so that the bank can carry out a fraud investigation. This is where the stress really kicked in......

First I went to Jomtien police as that was where I beleived this started, only to be told after a lengthy wait to go to Soi 9 Pattaya Police station. I then went to Soi 9 Pattaya Police station where I waited for some time, only to be told by the tourist police officer on duty that I am required to go to Nong Prue Police station as that is where my house is. I then went to Nong Prue Police station where a tourist police officer was informed I would be going- after waiting some considerable time without him showing up, the thai police told me that I am required to go back to bank to get them to identify all the withdrawals and their atm machine locations BEFORE they will tell me where I can get a Police Report done !!

Now after 3 days, I am so tired, fed up and stressed that I do not even think it is worth bothering with now that I have frozen my account.

I was so amased at how little any of the police stations did for a victim of crime and how uncaring they treated me. I will never go to any police station again. I have heard this before and read on thai visa, but this is first time I have witnessed it. You would think, that just getting a police report so that the bank can instruct internally for fraud investigation would be a simple thing- but NO !!

No wonder very many Thais have little if any respect for their own BIB.

Is this normal here and has any other thai visa members experienced similar ?

[2008bangkok]

Feel for you man, day to day dealings in general is stressful at times.

[FDog]

Just wondering how they got your pin. Did you cover the numbers with your other hand as you typed them in? Probably had a camera see you input the numbers and the slot was a skimming machine.

But I can't work out why the guy would hang around annoying you though.

[chrisinth]

You would think in his day and age that having reported the incident to the bank that they would contact the police and report the fraudulent actions.

Then, after the bank has made the contact then you formerly report the crime hopefully with a better insight of what is required from you and more importantly where to report. It seems strange that the police station covering the area where the ATM was, where the crime took place, didn't accept the initial report.

Edited October 18, 2013 by chrisinth

[CharlieH]

Thats why its good to have the sms warning when any money goes out or the balance changes, its immediate and gives good warning and a chance to act quickly.

Sorry for your troubles, hope ut works out for you but the road wont be easy or stress free thats fir sure.

Best of luck.

[potherb]

Has happened to me on a number of occasions. People on my shoulder when using ATM. The first thing I did was to go to another ATM and change password. Best to be safe than sorry.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[MrWorldwide]

12 months ago, almost to the day.

http://www.livingthai.org/i-got-robbed-at-an-atm-in-pattaya.html

[MrWorldwide]

From a similar incident back in April (Phuket):

She said that ATM users should use cover their hand when entering their pin on an ATM, to avoid being videoed if there was a camera set up.

“The bank also said it is better to use bank ATM machines as they are safer. I use the ATMs at Family Marts and 7-Elevens.”

I follow both tips, and to date have had no problems - as useless as most Bank security guards are, what skimmer in his right mind is going to be caught on camera trying to set up an ATM, then return to the bank to collect his skimming device, particularly when there are hundreds of ATMs within easy reach which they can tamper with under cover of darkness ?

I would also suggest keeping as little as possible on an ATM card, but that's common sense. Even as a weekend warrior, I just transfer the money as I need it.

[bartender100]

Is it possible to set up Kbank to send alert if an ATM is used, just been looking at the site and can't see anything

[CharlieH]

Is it possible to set up Kbank to send alert if an ATM is used, just been looking at the site and can't see anything

Kasikorn can be done in seconds via the ATM, you,ll get an sms the second the balance changes, what amount followed by a second message a little later with current balance.

Edited October 18, 2013 by CharlieH

[dave2]

re

Thats why its good to have the sms warning when any money goes out or the balance changes, its immediate and gives good warning and a chance to act quickly.

hes right !

i have sms alerts on all my accounts and the sms message telling you of a balance change usually arrives while you are still at the atm or the counter

it works a treat and saves me worrying

dave2

ps ... bangkok bank charge me 10 baht a month for the service !

i think tmb charge me 8 baht a month for each account but i dont care coz they give me peace of mind that moneys not moving that i dont know about

[Tolley]

re

Thats why its good to have the sms warning when any money goes out or the balance changes, its immediate and gives good warning and a chance to act quickly.

hes right !

i have sms alerts on all my accounts and the sms message telling you of a balance change usually arrives while you are still at the atm or the counter

it works a treat and saves me worrying

dave2

ps ... bangkok bank charge me 10 baht a month for the service !

i think tmb charge me 8 baht a month for each account but i dont care coz they give me peace of mind that moneys not moving that i dont know about

The SMS system is not foolproof. A this friend of mine had 20k baht taken from their bank account and she had the SMS functionality and it never alerted her with an SMS for that 20k illegal withdrawl.

I actually went to the bank with her and we showed them all the evidence and the bank still refused to accept any responsibiltiy but of course couldnt explain why the withdrawl didnt activitate any SMS message.

CAVEAT EMPTOR in Pattaya. Always use an ATM outside a bank or inside a shopping centre and only keep a limited balance on your account.

[2008bangkok]

It's wrong that the banks don't take more of an interest, after all the ATM machines are owned by the banks and there responsibility, if somebody has attached an illegal gadget to it then it should be down to them not the customer.

Nowadays with all the fraud about they should implement better security than 20 ur old standard pin security, if they used a OTP either by SMS or by an app provided by the bank that would make things more difficult for the skimmers, I'm sure it wouldn't be fool proof but it would certainly make it more difficult.

[dave2]

re

The SMS system is not foolproof.

fair comment but ive not lost a baht or penny in a thai or english bank in 8 years !

maybe ive been lucky

dave2

pic .. a wet doi suthep in chiang mai 5 minutes ago

Edited October 18, 2013 by dave2

[bender92]

Just wondering how they got your pin. Did you cover the numbers with your other hand as you typed them in? Probably had a camera see you input the numbers and the slot was a skimming machine.

But I can't work out why the guy would hang around annoying you though.

The guy may have put a card scanner where the card goes in, he would remove it before the police (ha ha) came or a bank employee. I always try to use ATMs in a mall, high traffic, and I cover the pad while I key my PIN.

[Mudcrab]

Just wondering how they got your pin. Did you cover the numbers with your other hand as you typed them in? Probably had a camera see you input the numbers and the slot was a skimming machine.

But I can't work out why the guy would hang around annoying you though.

The guy may have put a card scanner where the card goes in, he would remove it before the police (ha ha) came or a bank employee. I always try to use ATMs in a mall, high traffic, and I cover the pad while I key my PIN.

I do all the above...malls..banks hide the PIN etc...but I also try and pull the damn thing apart. My logic being that if they can come along and remove a scanner...so can I!!! get the fingernails under any part and give it a good pull. Might seem weird to some people but takes one or two seconds. There's bucket loads on YouTube how the scanners are attached. Most pretty done simply.

Give it a go!!

[bartender100]

Is it possible to set up Kbank to send alert if an ATM is used, just been looking at the site and can't see anything

Kasikorn can be done in seconds via the ATM, you,ll get an sms the second the balance changes, what amount followed by a second message a little later with current balance.

Just went to the ATM, could not see any setting to change for an ATM alert to be set, I will pop in my branch next time I am around the area

[rsumner]

I have had 93,000 B stolen ATM soi 9 next to 7/11. Police don't care and either did the bank. BKK Bank had me run arround every bank ATM and police made me get pictures of theft from ATM camera. My bank manager laughed at me. He said how we know you didn't have a friend take your money. Now the main branch in BKK will not even return my calls when i ask about the investigation. Real joke !

[HUAHIN62]

The only way they could have done this was with scanner to get your card info and then they will need your pin ??? One without the other is useless. The scanner must be attached to the ATM card slot and is clearly visible. Only draw money inside mall banks as there are CCTV cameras and normally fraudsters dont try their luck in malls.

[ajarnmarc]

re

The SMS system is not foolproof.

fair comment but ive not lost a baht or penny in a thai or english bank in 8 years !

maybe ive been lucky

dave2

pic .. a wet doi suthep in chiang mai 5 minutes ago

Thanks for the photo.

Nice to see what Chiang Mai is looking like these days.

Cheers

[shaurene]

Am a bit confused. I have SCB account and I have to put my bank card in the slot then my pin. How can they do this without the bank card?????

Thank God have never had this problem. I have a New Zealang bank Visa card and couple years back the bank called to to ask if I had made any purchases overseas, I said I had just come back from Hong Kong and paid for hotels and restaurants with my card, Why, they asked if I had been to UK or Spain and I said no. Some one had paid for parking with Wilsons in UK and had bought stuff from a department store in Madrid Spain, I said never been there. They cancelled my card and gave me a full refund, some bastard at the hotel or restaurant in Hong Kong made a copy of my card and some one else made a copy of my Visa card.

[Suradit69]

Just wondering how they got your pin. Did you cover the numbers with your other hand as you typed them in? Probably had a camera see you input the numbers and the slot was a skimming machine.

But I can't work out why the guy would hang around annoying you though.

The guy may have put a card scanner where the card goes in, he would remove it before the police (ha ha) came or a bank employee. I always try to use ATMs in a mall, high traffic, and I cover the pad while I key my PIN.

"he would remove it before the police (ha ha) came"

The police (ha ha) seem to arrest a lot of people (mostly foreigners incidentally) in Pattaya for ATM fraud including a few geniuses who have attempted to steal the entire ATM.

Very few things in life are completely fail safe, but the SMS service is quite helpful.

One time, due to a mistake on my part, I reported an ATM transaction that I thought was incorrectly charged to my account with Bangkok Bank. They promptly investigated ... by which time I realized it was my error in terms of the account balance I thought I should have at that point. No waffling on their part nor did they try to pack me off to get a police report.

[nachiket]

Better hire a criminal lawyer if you are getting upset.

[shaurene]

On a little bit different topic regarding banks in Thailand. I was at the airport leaving for Hong Kong and checked the New Zealand dollar exchange rates from 4 different bank exchanges. They all gave 24.56 baht to the dollar. When I got to Hong Kong I checked the tourist exchange rates on the SCB exchange site on Internet, they gave for cash 25.76. I came back to Bangkok and checked again in the airport and all of the different bank exchange booths had the very same rate, this time it was 24.47 when I got home to Khon Kaen I checked the SCB site and for cash they why were giving 25.54.

I is obvious that all the banks on their rates at the airport are price fixing, and in Europe countries, Australia and New Zealand they would be facing prosecution by the government.

So do not change any money at the airports in Thailand.

[skiller]

I would like to know how the scammer got a copy from your ATM card and the pin code. In Germany the Eastern Europeans from Romania or Bulagria, they put a fake board with a keypad over the original keypad from the atm.

They install a small cam which is monitoring and recording the pin code when you enter it. The fake board is using a card reader.

My advice is when you come to an ATM. Try to move the board with the keypad, if you can move it walk away and call the police. The scammer is comning back and take the board and the cam. So the police can wait for him.

Edited October 18, 2013 by skiller

[aymes]

I have had 93,000 B stolen ATM soi 9 next to 7/11. Police don't care and either did the bank. BKK Bank had me run arround every bank ATM and police made me get pictures of theft from ATM camera. My bank manager laughed at me. He said how we know you didn't have a friend take your money. Now the main branch in BKK will not even return my calls when i ask about the investigation. Real joke !

Its farcical that your bank is suggesting that you may of set up a scam getting a friend to withdraw the money & then you reporting that you've been scammed. The majority of bank ATMs in the UK have CCTV (the latest installed ATMs have a miniature camera built into the ATM itself) so that the bank can retrieve footage of withdrawals from ATMs, the ATM that was used to illegally withdraw the money can be traced & the recording can be backed up / viewed at a central office or at the bank branch itself. I am a security Engineer & we install & service these systems.

The weak link in this is the independent ATMs you see on the street or that are part of a shop & they don't have CCTV.

[Gsxrnz]

There is a variation on the typical skimmer scam mentioned in the OP.

They actually watch you (either physically, or with a camera) before the skimmer is attached. If they score your PIN number, they will quickly attach a skimmer to the ATM (possibly a second person involved) and then chase you waving a 100, or 1,000 baht note at you saying "mister, mister, you leave money in machine, here is your 1,000 baht. Maybe you better check your balance and make sure everything is OK'". This way they aren't chasing everybody with a possible low strike rate, they only follow up if they've got the PIN.

Of course, you stupidly insert your card, make sure they can't see your PIN, and check your balance. Surprise surprise....no problems, but they had the skimmer inserted and now have the card details as well as the PIN.. Been there, got the T -_shirt. Of course when I used the machine the first time I checked for skimmers as is my habit. On the 2nd time, was a bit confused and forgot my usual routine.

I've since met one bloke who had the same experience, and he was aware of the scam. He grabbed the 1,000 baht note and scarpered. The Russian followed him making all the suggestions to check the balance etc but he just declined and took refuge in a 7/11 until the Russian returned to the original ATM. The chap then went to another ATM and changed his PIN. He was 1,000 baht richer and wetting himself with laughter.

I've been dreaming of the time it happens to me again so I can do the same thing - three years and still waiting!! if anybody sees dodgy Eastern European "gentlemen" hanging around an ATM then please PM me the location so I can get some revenge on the sods.

[dotpoom]

YES

Is it possible to set up Kbank to send alert if an ATM is used, just been looking at the site and can't see anything

[pbeieio]

Sounds like they had a card scanner attached to the front of the ATM and a "spotter" to record your PIN.

Your card was ten cloned.

Unfortunately this scam is practiced worldwide.

Being fobbed off by the police is extremely frustrating.

Was the ATM is question covered by CCTV?

[Naroge]

You would think in his day and age that having reported the incident to the bank that they would contact the police and report the fraudulent actions.

Then, after the bank has made the contact then you formerly report the crime hopefully with a better insight of what is required from you and more importantly where to report. It seems strange that the police station covering the area where the ATM was, where the crime took place, didn't accept the initial report.

Why should the bank report the fraud? Of course it has to be the victim to report the fraud. Then with the police report in hand the bank has to act.

But I cannot understand why the police station closest to the fraud didn't accept to make the report. Probably just lazy. Referring the OP to the station closest to his house doesn't make sense at all. What if his house was in Phuket, or if he was a visitor?