Relationship with Thai woman

[Dancealot]

Kuhn Moo Curt: I praise you for talking about this delicate issue en publique.

I hope this discussion will become more productive, eventually.

[edit] Please not, the reason responses are so rigid and fierce is because many members here(like meself) can identify with your issue.

Edited November 20, 2013 by Dancealot

[Guitar God]

It's difficult to summarize a relationship in a few paragraphs, if I'd included all the minutia I'd probably have bored everyone to sleep and not gotten any replies.

She was a slightly reluctant business partner, I thought she'd appreciate being given a stake in a company for nothing, she's concerned that her being Thai, she'd be on the hook if the business failed and I bailed. I explained her involvement in the business to give background to her character. I said I'd buy a business, hire someone to manage it and we'd both take a salary so the business would justify my work permit and she'd get some spending cash from the business, not from my pocket.

When I bought the business, the manager left to work for the old owner, I wasn't in a a good position to find a replacement and she met a very nice older Thai woman who has been doing a great job running it. A relative she raised recently died in a MC accident and she had to leave for a week, my gf used her vacation days to go there and run the place and when our mae ban left, she even cleaned and did laundry and other shit jobs she wasn't used to being the head of a large government department. She spent many nights calling in favors from friends and doing work herself designing business cards, brochures, advertisments and doing liason with contractors for me, all while she worked full time and helped with her parents farm and her mom's shop. She placed ads online for new employees when a couple more left to go work for the former owner. She did it to help me, not because of any interest in taking over. She'd prefer I'd sell the business and keep the money. I make much more from other sources than this ever will here.

She didn't provide a CV, I spoke with her ex on Facebook, he had nothing bad to say about her, he felt back he <deleted> around on her and said he just wanted to stay in his home country and work and make money while he could (hard construction work) and it wasn't time for him to move to Thailand and start a family.

Her previous bf, also a farang, left her for a bargirl, good luck to him on that. I can hardly fault her for his poor decisions.

Her first bf was Thai, they met in college, he also cheated on her and they broke up. Her second bf turned out to have a wife in another city. She was turned off by Thai men and didn't have much better luck with the next two foreigners. She isn't attracted to Thai men, she likes big stong men and prefers older men because they're more mature (and have more money). I've always attracted younger women and not because of money. I was 37 and had an 18 yo girl in the US pursue me until we got together for a year. We broke up due to lack of common interests and while she was cute, she wasn't that bright and our relationship lacked the intellectual stimulation I desired.

My Thai gf is bright, well educated, we have similar values, interests, like the same music and activities and even though our age difference is slightly more than in the relationship above, she's a mature woman and not a teenager so the age gap is not an issue for me, or for her.

I'm not looking to convince myself, or anyone else, sure I have questions but I've never been involved with a woman in another country with such a foreign culture. You hear horror stories about westerners involved with Thai women who are out only to grab as much money as they can. Sure there are red flags but some have plausible explanations.

Her sisters and some of her friends are fluent in English, I'm not fluent in Thai. If she was just a golddigger or serial farang hunter I think I would have discovered evidence of this by now.

I think some people who grow up poor overvalue the importance of money. I usually have more than enough to live within my means so I never think about it but if you live on a modest government salary and have car payments, support your parents and sisters (as I understand the eldest sister is expected to do ), you are going to place more importance on security for your future in an uncertain world.

[Guitar God]

Regarding the mathmatics of sex for money, I follow your calculations but I'm not a bar hopping, beer-swilling, hoi-licking sex tourist. I've had enough strange pussy in my life and I'm ready to settle down, so is she. I'm a serial monogamist, 8 years and almost 20. If she waits any longer to start a family she'll be past the best child bearing age, if I wait any longer I won't be around to see them grow up.

I'm sure many other members here can identify with aspects of my situation, some with bad experiences, a few with positive experiences.

I posted it in this sub forum because my intent is marriage, not entertainment and I wanted to hear others experiences.

One important detail that's missing from the people who are saying she's only interested in me for the money is where they met the women they had negative experiences with. Was it at work, school, church, through a mutual friend, or was she half naked twirling around a pole?

[Dancealot]

Thanks for taking most comments from Thailand-experts here briefly into consideration...

You say your intent is marriage.. What will be the benefit for you, technically, besides easier visa documents?

[GrantSmith]

Not used to being the head of a large government department?

Prefer you to sell the business?

[Guitar God]

I don't even know if marriage will make visa applications easier. In the countries I'm most familiar with, if a foreigner marries a citizen, they're pretty much intitled to live there for as long as they want. In Thailand from what I understand, I could be married, have children, own a condo, have a business, employ Thai workers but if I don't have 400k in the bank and prove I made 60k a month, I'm outta here. I could qualify for a retirement or business visa but I'm not aware of any major advantages of a visa through marriage.

Marriage is is the goal, having children in the reason. I don't want our children to be bastards and don't expect a proper Thai lady to shack up with me.

Being married would also make it easier to spent part of the year together in the other countries I have residence/citizenship in.

[grin]

Not used to being the head of a large government department?

Prefer you to sell the business?

DangerWillRobinson.jpg

Probably left out a comma:

jobs she wasn't used to, being the head of a large government department

[Guitar God]

Not used to being the head of a large government department?

Prefer you to sell the business?

DangerWillRobinson.jpg

Yes I did miss a comma, better than missing a period though...

I'm not sure of your question, or if it is one but she has a fairly cushy desk job and quite a few people who report to her. When she filled in at my/our business she was a manager/ mae ban. She's not used to sweeping up and cleaning at her goverment job. She has her own minions there for that.

She's concerned that it's going to "fall down" due to new competition and difficulty in finding and retaining good employees, cause us stress and I'm going to loose money on it.

For a few weeks we were leaving money on the table because we were turning away business due to being understaffed. Like I said, my intention was for her just to be a silent partner and get a few baht for being on the paperwork but due to unexpected circumstances (that I probably should have expected) it's turned into another part-time job for her. She just sent me a text from work a few minutes ago to ask me to edit some text that she was working on, that I didn't ask her to do and wasn't aware she was doing, for some new promotional material for the business.

Edited November 20, 2013 by Khun Moo Curt

[GrantSmith]

Probably left out a comma:

jobs she wasn't used to, being the head of a large government department

Yes.. "probably"

[GrantSmith]

Yes I did miss a comma, better than missing a period though...

Well only if you're concerned about having "bastard" children

[Dancealot]

Yes I did miss a comma, better than missing a period though...

Well only if you're concerned about having "bastard" children

Kuhn Grant.. Cut him some slack, please. He is new to this.

[FiftyTwo]

Her first bf was Thai, they met in college, he also cheated on her and they broke up. Her second bf turned out to have a wife in another city. She was turned off by Thai men and didn't have much better luck with the next two foreigners. She isn't attracted to Thai men, she likes big stong men and prefers older men because they're more mature (and have more money).

This is of course complete <deleted> that every serial farang hunter spouts.

The ugly truth is, it's hard to get the money she wants from a Thai guy, they buy houses and cars in their own names.

If she earns 25k/month in a government job, she can get a 100% home loan for 2MBaht (the money you pay her will up that loan), repayments about 12k/month. If she is so keen to own a house, get her to buy one using her own credit and you make the payments for the next 25 years.

When I married a Thai girl, she had no problem at all living in a rented house with me for three years.

She just purchased a home using a home loan, on her own, I make the payments for her.

You seem to be extremely gullible, which is a bad sign over here.

Edited November 20, 2013 by FiftyTwo

[Guitar God]

I don't want to live in a 2m baht house and neither does she, for her to get a mortgage for a place we'd both like I'd need to put down 2m. I've talked to lawyers and banks and that's the best case answer I received.

She did suggest a cheaper house in a development that would require only a small downpayment but I thought we could find something nicer with a real yard and more space between the neighbors but it's more difficult than I expected in the areas we're looking at. Her original option also would have taken 10 months for them to finish before we could move in and now they're all sold out.

According to the advice I've received, no matter if we're married, no matter if I have Thai income, the mortage for a house (other than a condo) has to be in her name only. I have been told that I can buy a car in my name however.

I can understand why she prefers a foreign partner, her best friend was married to a Thai for 6 years they had three children, he beat her and put her in the hospital, then he divorced her. I know both of them personally and I've seen her black eyes and brusies.

He's still living in his house with two kids and she's out on her ass living with her mother with one child. What are the chances of a homeless 30+yo Thai woman with 3 children getting remarried? I can see why my gf wants to avoid a situation like this.

A 30+30 year lease is good enough protection for me, and she's fine with that.

From what I understand, Thai divorce is usually blamed on the woman, even if the man's at fault and there isn't gender equality.

I've lived with girlfriends without being married, in houses I've rented and owned before but nobody in her family has and she doesn't want to be the first. Both of her married sisters, who married Thai men, got married and moved into houses they owned. They didn't live together first and they didn't rent. If you have the means, renting can convey a lack of confidence in the relationship.

I believe her when she says she wants approval of her parents. She goes to great lengths to please them, she'll drive her mom to market at 2 am even though she has to help her mom at 7am and be at work from 8:30 to 5:00. Many times she's chosen working to help her parents over luxurious travel with me. One month she spent all the money I gave her for herself to send her sister to school, and never asked for more. Another month she bought her other sister a scooter so she could commute to her new job, and didn't even mention it until months later.

[FiftyTwo]

A 30+30 year lease is good enough protection for me, and she's fine with that.

You can't get that either, maximum lease is 30 years.

Only available on cash purchase, home loan bank won't allow.

Lease can't be from your wife, so again you would be forced to buy her a house, for cash, before marriage.

Giving money away to family is another really bad sign (and you say she's doing it secretively).

Imagine how much of your money she will want to give away, when she gets access to it.

PS

What's wrong with a 2M baht house?

View from the front of mine my wifes, near CM, is great (and it was only 1M8).

Edited November 20, 2013 by FiftyTwo

[Totster]

but I'm not a bar hopping, beer-swilling, hoi-licking sex tourist.

And yet you use vulgarities found in establishments that sex tourists frequent...

totster

[transam]

Thai culture ? handing over lots of dosh, hmmmmmmmmm, no wonder the other guy bailed out.

[transam]

I don't want to live in a 2m baht house and neither does she, for her to get a mortgage for a place we'd both like I'd need to put down 2m. I've talked to lawyers and banks and that's the best case answer I received.

She did suggest a cheaper house in a development that would require only a small downpayment but I thought we could find something nicer with a real yard and more space between the neighbors but it's more difficult than I expected in the areas we're looking at. Her original option also would have taken 10 months for them to finish before we could move in and now they're all sold out.

According to the advice I've received, no matter if we're married, no matter if I have Thai income, the mortage for a house (other than a condo) has to be in her name only. I have been told that I can buy a car in my name however.

I can understand why she prefers a foreign partner, her best friend was married to a Thai for 6 years they had three children, he beat her and put her in the hospital, then he divorced her. I know both of them personally and I've seen her black eyes and brusies.

He's still living in his house with two kids and she's out on her ass living with her mother with one child. What are the chances of a homeless 30+yo Thai woman with 3 children getting remarried? I can see why my gf wants to avoid a situation like this.

A 30+30 year lease is good enough protection for me, and she's fine with that.

From what I understand, Thai divorce is usually blamed on the woman, even if the man's at fault and there isn't gender equality.

I've lived with girlfriends without being married, in houses I've rented and owned before but nobody in her family has and she doesn't want to be the first. Both of her married sisters, who married Thai men, got married and moved into houses they owned. They didn't live together first and they didn't rent. If you have the means, renting can convey a lack of confidence in the relationship.

I believe her when she says she wants approval of her parents. She goes to great lengths to please them, she'll drive her mom to market at 2 am even though she has to help her mom at 7am and be at work from 8:30 to 5:00. Many times she's chosen working to help her parents over luxurious travel with me. One month she spent all the money I gave her for herself to send her sister to school, and never asked for more. Another month she bought her other sister a scooter so she could commute to her new job, and didn't even mention it until months later.

So your cash is taking care of the extended family . Think you really must open your eyes a little. If your a rich guy then no problem I suppose. BUT, this bleeding money will be your future.

PS. If sister has a new job, why couldn't she buy her own bike on credit ? Thats why people work, to buy what they need.

[FiftyTwo]

Also

Thai culture, part of the culture is shagging around, everyone does it, men and women.

So she's also trying to cherry pick the bits of Thai culture she participates in.

Thai culture ..... man being unfaithful, using prostitutes, giks, mia nois ...... doesn't want.

Thai culture ..... giving (your) money to family (secretively) ........ that's good.

Thai culture ..... not marrying foreigners ............ we'll forget that one.

Etc.

Edited November 20, 2013 by FiftyTwo

[Guitar God]

Thanks for the info, I'll have to look into that. Thailand seems to favor Thais, a lot.

I knew she was helping her sisters, she's always done it so it wasn't anything sneaky. She could have spent it on clothes or something for herself but instead she choose to help her sisters. It's not like she said she spent it on them and then came to me to ask for more money.

Her parents paid for part of the scooter, she paid for the rest, her sister only worked there a couple weeks then moved to take another job. She has one self sufficient sister and two who aren't. I've convinced her to help them help themselves rather than depend on her for handouts and it's been working recently.

I wish we could find a nice place like that for 2m here, for some reason anything under 4m is either old and run down or right in the middle of the city and also old and run down, or in an area that floods every year.

A 30+30 year lease is good enough protection for me, and she's fine with that.

You can't get that either, maximum lease is 30 years.
Only available on cash purchase, home loan bank won't allow.
Lease can't be from your wife, so again you would be forced to buy her a house, for cash, before marriage.

Giving money away to family is another really bad sign (and you say she's doing it secretively).
Imagine how much of your money she will want to give away, when she gets access to it.

PS
What's wrong with a 2M baht house?
View from the front of mine my wifes, near CM, is great (and it was only 1M8).
2013-10-26 10.02.53.jpeg

[Guitar God]

I actually read that on TV in another forum, and it wasn't even a sex related thread. Even the thread about funny Thinglish expressions had people arguing about bar girls. 0,3% of the population sure give the rest a bad name.

but I'm not a bar hopping, beer-swilling, hoi-licking sex tourist.

And yet you use vulgarities found in establishments that sex tourists frequent...

totster

[Gsxrnz]

OP - At the risk of getting shot down in flames and being accused of having rose tinted glasses, I will say that from your postings you seem to be highly intelligent, very well informed, have reasonably well balanced opinions, and able to draw reasonable conclusions based on facts/information that you have researched and evaluated.

On that basis you don't need any advice from either the pro or con element on this forum. Any further dialogue would seem superfluous to me. It seems that you have done more due-diligence than most and that you are going into this from a well informed perspective. Many (not all) of the negative response here come from those that possibly didn't do sufficient (or any) due-diligence and had their rose tinted glasses ripped off their face because of it.

However I would assess your situation as being quite different. Your investigative skills as explained thus far make me accept that you're nobody's fool, that you would not suffer fools gladly, and that in most things in life you are generally cautious and speculative, but still prepared to take calculated risks.

Therefore, follow your own path and do what you think is right. If you are taken for a fool at a later date, you can't say that you didn't do the research first and make the investment in your relationship from an informed position. There are some on here that believe ALL Thai women, without exception, are rip-off merchants - they're wrong of course, and much more wrong than they will ever know or accept.

If it all goes swimmingly and she turns out to be your dream come, you picked a winner and good luck to you.

Chock-Dee.

[transam]

OP - At the risk of getting shot down in flames and being accused of having rose tinted glasses, I will say that from your postings you seem to be highly intelligent, very well informed, have reasonably well balanced opinions, and able to draw reasonable conclusions based on facts/information that you have researched and evaluated.

On that basis you don't need any advice from either the pro or con element on this forum. Any further dialogue would seem superfluous to me. It seems that you have done more due-diligence than most and that you are going into this from a well informed perspective. Many (not all) of the negative response here come from those that possibly didn't do sufficient (or any) due-diligence and had their rose tinted glasses ripped off their face because of it.

However I would assess your situation as being quite different. Your investigative skills as explained thus far make me accept that you're nobody's fool, that you would not suffer fools gladly, and that in most things in life you are generally cautious and speculative, but still prepared to take calculated risks.

Therefore, follow your own path and do what you think is right. If you are taken for a fool at a later date, you can't say that you didn't do the research first and make the investment in your relationship from an informed position. There are some on here that believe ALL Thai women, without exception, are rip-off merchants - they're wrong of course, and much more wrong than they will ever know or accept.

If it all goes swimmingly and she turns out to be your dream come, you picked a winner and good luck to you.

Chock-Dee.

Some of us want to open eyes so stuff we have seen doesn't happen to another. Thats why we post.

[Gsxrnz]

OP - At the risk of getting shot down in flames and being accused of having rose tinted glasses, I will say that from your postings you seem to be highly intelligent, very well informed, have reasonably well balanced opinions, and able to draw reasonable conclusions based on facts/information that you have researched and evaluated.

On that basis you don't need any advice from either the pro or con element on this forum. Any further dialogue would seem superfluous to me. It seems that you have done more due-diligence than most and that you are going into this from a well informed perspective. Many (not all) of the negative response here come from those that possibly didn't do sufficient (or any) due-diligence and had their rose tinted glasses ripped off their face because of it.

However I would assess your situation as being quite different. Your investigative skills as explained thus far make me accept that you're nobody's fool, that you would not suffer fools gladly, and that in most things in life you are generally cautious and speculative, but still prepared to take calculated risks.

Therefore, follow your own path and do what you think is right. If you are taken for a fool at a later date, you can't say that you didn't do the research first and make the investment in your relationship from an informed position. There are some on here that believe ALL Thai women, without exception, are rip-off merchants - they're wrong of course, and much more wrong than they will ever know or accept.

If it all goes swimmingly and she turns out to be your dream come, you picked a winner and good luck to you.

Chock-Dee.

Some of us want to open eyes so stuff we have seen doesn't happen to another. Thats why we post.

Yep, I agree with that TransAm. I certainly didn't mean to be critical of those that post to open the eyes of the "blind" and ill-informed. And as you imply, many of the posts similar to the OP's are from the most blinded individuals imaginable.

But the OP (despite what we may all think as individuals about the wisdom or lack thereof of what he is/wants to do) does appear to have his head screwed on and certainly doesn't appear to be leaping with blind faith.

Cheers

[transam]

OP - At the risk of getting shot down in flames and being accused of having rose tinted glasses, I will say that from your postings you seem to be highly intelligent, very well informed, have reasonably well balanced opinions, and able to draw reasonable conclusions based on facts/information that you have researched and evaluated.

On that basis you don't need any advice from either the pro or con element on this forum. Any further dialogue would seem superfluous to me. It seems that you have done more due-diligence than most and that you are going into this from a well informed perspective. Many (not all) of the negative response here come from those that possibly didn't do sufficient (or any) due-diligence and had their rose tinted glasses ripped off their face because of it.

However I would assess your situation as being quite different. Your investigative skills as explained thus far make me accept that you're nobody's fool, that you would not suffer fools gladly, and that in most things in life you are generally cautious and speculative, but still prepared to take calculated risks.

Therefore, follow your own path and do what you think is right. If you are taken for a fool at a later date, you can't say that you didn't do the research first and make the investment in your relationship from an informed position. There are some on here that believe ALL Thai women, without exception, are rip-off merchants - they're wrong of course, and much more wrong than they will ever know or accept.

If it all goes swimmingly and she turns out to be your dream come, you picked a winner and good luck to you.

Chock-Dee.

Some of us want to open eyes so stuff we have seen doesn't happen to another. Thats why we post.

Yep, I agree with that TransAm. I certainly didn't mean to be critical of those that post to open the eyes of the "blind" and ill-informed. And as you imply, many of the posts similar to the OP's are from the most blinded individuals imaginable.

But the OP (despite what we may all think as individuals about the wisdom or lack thereof of what he is/wants to do) does appear to have his head screwed on and certainly doesn't appear to be leaping with blind faith.

Cheers

Agreed, just hope he reads all, food for thought.

[timtscott]

I agree that you seem intelligent and have done your research. What concerns me is after all is said and done you must still have plenty of doubts to even pose the question on here.

Just ask yourself what advice you would give a friend who is in a similar situation? I think you would probably more skeptical than you are being right now.

In any event I wish you the best.

PS I was under the impression you could get a decent house for 2 million B. Maybe I need to take another look at the housing market there.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Edited November 20, 2013 by timtscott

[FiftyTwo]

I agree that you seem intelligent and have done your research. What concerns me is after all is said and done you must still have plenty of doubts to pose the question on here. Just ask yourself what advice you would give a friend who is in a similar situation? I think you would probably more skeptical than you are being right now. In any event I wish you the best. PS I was under the impression you could get a decent house for 2 million B. Maybe I need to take another look at the housing market there.

Maybe there is a 'gf house filter' in operation.

Where he is only shown unsuitable properties in an effort to up his investment levels.

Or the gf is having his house prices 'doubled' in expectation of a big commission.

Maybe the OP needs to take a look at the housing market without the gf around.

Edited November 20, 2013 by FiftyTwo

[Shancloudy]

Money can't buy true love. She only wants money. She is working and let her to shoulder all responsibilities to her sister. If she really loves you she will buy something for you and not let you to pay all expenses. Love is give and take not only man will give.

My boyfriend visited me here last month and I never let him to pay anything we never go to money changer to change the dollar to baht because I told him you spent money to buy a plane ticket so let me to pay our expenses while you're here and he said okay..

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[Water Buffalo]

Sounds like money and standard of living play a big role in this relationship. Doesn't sound good to me.

And the Thai culture thing sounds like nonsense. Is it possible she only wants to marry you if she can get a house?

Edited November 20, 2013 by Water Buffalo

[transam]

Sounds like money and standard of living play a big role in this relationship. Doesn't sound good to me.

And the Thai culture thing sounds like nonsense. Is it possible she only wants to marry you if she can get a house?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=8JdCP7vPUQc

[Shancloudy]

If you really want to give what she wants it's your choice but be aware to the people in a family/relatives maybe one of them is her boyfriend.

I'm doing a part time job as a private tutor in a village after my class in a Business school and I know some stories that if the husband is not here there's a thai guy living in the house.

Be aware.....