Civil War in Thailand? Anyone else afraid?

[Berkshire]

You trying to compare Thailand to other country makes you look a bit dull or blinded by your love for here. I am happy that you are happy but you might want to stop comparing these things you are not doing well.

You're way off, Scotty. Sometimes it's absolutely relevant, and perhaps even necessary to make these kinds of comparisons. Most of the negative remarks about Thailand made on this forum invariably comes with the implication that it only happens here and no where else. Or it's worse here. Or it's more frequent here. Whatever. So Thailiketoo's arguments are pretty sound, much more so than yours. If you even have an argument.

[Scottythai]

Your argument gets worse as this topic goes on. I see you are truly blinded with Thainess. As I said Thailand will figure out its own problems for good or bad it will be done. You trying to compare Thailand to other country makes you look a bit dull or blinded by your love for here. I am happy that you are happy but you might want to stop comparing these things you are not doing well.

You might want to debate my argument instead of snide remarks about me.

Ok here is the argument about your thoughts on Corruption here.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index This one has colors and scale. If you don't like Wiki then look at this. http://www.transparency.org/cpi2012/results Canada where Newfies are from rates 9th in the least corruption. Thailand is way down in 88th. So yea its much more likely that you see through your rose tinted glasses now Mr. 50$'s under the wallet.

[Scottythai]

You trying to compare Thailand to other country makes you look a bit dull or blinded by your love for here. I am happy that you are happy but you might want to stop comparing these things you are not doing well.

You're way off, Scotty. Sometimes it's absolutely relevant, and perhaps even necessary to make these kinds of comparisons. Most of the negative remarks about Thailand made on this forum invariably comes with the implication that it only happens here and no where else. Or it's worse here. Or it's more frequent here. Whatever. So Thailiketoo's arguments are pretty sound, much more so than yours. If you even have an argument.

Read my previous post and show me VIA real links not guesses that his argument is sound. If you read my first post here I neither bash no go for all on the civil war. I said Thailand is Thai and they will figure it out. It was not until some white knight tried to make jokes about other peoples home countries did I stop and take the time to read his allegations. Not once has he posted proof just said blah blah. I have now just token all of 5 minutes out of my life to show real proof. Would have been easier if he took the advice and stopped trying to compare with other countries. If you tried the 50$ under the wallet in BC you would end up in Jail. Here not so much....

[thailiketoo]

Is Thailand corrupt to the core? No. Not any more than a lot of countries and less than other countries.

The civil war is going to be between the haves and the have nots. It always is. Are the have nots any more corrupt than the haves? No. If the haves are corrupt we can't discuss it anyway.

Chicago was a corrupt city when I lived there but it ran well. That's all the folk care about. Daily made Chicago run.

Would I rather have a corrupt mayor like Daily or a mayor like Detroit or Washington DC? Chicago any day.

Thailand's problem is not corruption it is feudalism. Thailand is changing from a feudal society to a modern society that changes rulers by election and not by guns and bayonets. The rulers are elected. A large percent of Thailand and indeed ThaiVisa can't accept that.

[whybother]

Is Thailand corrupt to the core? No. Not any more than a lot of countries and less than other countries.

The civil war is going to be between the haves and the have nots. It always is. Are the have nots any more corrupt than the haves? No. If the haves are corrupt we can't discuss it anyway.

Chicago was a corrupt city when I lived there but it ran well. That's all the folk care about. Daily made Chicago run.

Would I rather have a corrupt mayor like Daily or a mayor like Detroit or Washington DC? Chicago any day.

Thailand's problem is not corruption it is feudalism. Thailand is changing from a feudal society to a modern society that changes rulers by election and not by guns and bayonets. The rulers are elected. A large percent of Thailand and indeed ThaiVisa can't accept that.

Any civil war in Thailand will be between two groups of Haves and their minions. That's what the mess has been about for the last 7-8 years.

[metisdead]

Off topic posts and replies have been removed. Posts containing overly derogatory generalizations toward Thais have been removed as well.

[MJP]

Is Thailand corrupt to the core? No. Not any more than a lot of countries and less than other countries.

The civil war is going to be between the haves and the have nots. It always is. Are the have nots any more corrupt than the haves? No. If the haves are corrupt we can't discuss it anyway.

Chicago was a corrupt city when I lived there but it ran well. That's all the folk care about. Daily made Chicago run.

Would I rather have a corrupt mayor like Daily or a mayor like Detroit or Washington DC? Chicago any day.

Thailand's problem is not corruption it is feudalism. Thailand is changing from a feudal society to a modern society that changes rulers by election and not by guns and bayonets. The rulers are elected. A large percent of Thailand and indeed ThaiVisa can't accept that.

One of the best posts I've read on here.

[AYJAYDEE]

Is Thailand corrupt to the core? No. Not any more than a lot of countries and less than other countries.

The civil war is going to be between the haves and the have nots. It always is. Are the have nots any more corrupt than the haves? No. If the haves are corrupt we can't discuss it anyway.

Chicago was a corrupt city when I lived there but it ran well. That's all the folk care about. Daily made Chicago run.

Would I rather have a corrupt mayor like Daily or a mayor like Detroit or Washington DC? Chicago any day.

Thailand's problem is not corruption it is feudalism. Thailand is changing from a feudal society to a modern society that changes rulers by election and not by guns and bayonets. The rulers are elected. A large percent of Thailand and indeed ThaiVisa can't accept that.

One of the best posts I've read on here.

perhaps, but i would have expected someone who lived in C

hicago and liked the mayor's style of running the city would at least know his name was Daley

[dao16]

Yeah, the corruption in the US is mostly at the top. You would be hard pressed to find a cop to bribe at a low level, although it does happen. I definitely wouldn't offer a Chicago cop a bribe....get myself in more trouble than my original expense. More common is with the people it is hard to get to. Chicago is pretty thoroughly corrupt, still. New Orleans is pretty intensely corrupt. New York and parts (or large swathes) of New Jersey have some. Washington and the real players...oh, don't get me started on those crooks.

[DrTuner]

Topic related and associated with Plachons post above, specifically the last sentence. Anyone with kids here have any emergency plans drawn up if things do go, well . . . wrong here?

It's something me and my Swedish neighbour were talking about only yesterday. An emergency exit plan.

Pack everything easily converted into cash in the car, drive to Cambodia border and cross, find a way to Singapore and apply for Visas to Europe for the family from there.

[thailiketoo]

Is Thailand corrupt to the core? No. Not any more than a lot of countries and less than other countries.

The civil war is going to be between the haves and the have nots. It always is. Are the have nots any more corrupt than the haves? No. If the haves are corrupt we can't discuss it anyway.

Chicago was a corrupt city when I lived there but it ran well. That's all the folk care about. Daily made Chicago run.

Would I rather have a corrupt mayor like Daily or a mayor like Detroit or Washington DC? Chicago any day.

Thailand's problem is not corruption it is feudalism. Thailand is changing from a feudal society to a modern society that changes rulers by election and not by guns and bayonets. The rulers are elected. A large percent of Thailand and indeed ThaiVisa can't accept that.

One of the best posts I've read on here.

perhaps, but i would have expected someone who lived in C

hicago and liked the mayor's style of running the city would at least know his name was Daley

That's the ThaiVisa style for sure. You do know he was the mayor 40 years ago? But what is that when you can correct my spelling. Did you know who I was talking about?

Why bother with communication when you can whing about spelling eh?

[MJP]

Topic related and associated with Plachons post above, specifically the last sentence. Anyone with kids here have any emergency plans drawn up if things do go, well . . . wrong here?

It's something me and my Swedish neighbour were talking about only yesterday. An emergency exit plan.

Pack everything easily converted into cash in the car, drive to Cambodia border and cross, find a way to Singapore and apply for Visas to Europe for the family from there.

Yup, that was my sister-in-laws plan a few yers back. Exodus.

[Scottythai]

Is Thailand corrupt to the core? No. Not any more than a lot of countries and less than other countries.

The civil war is going to be between the haves and the have nots. It always is. Are the have nots any more corrupt than the haves? No. If the haves are corrupt we can't discuss it anyway.

Chicago was a corrupt city when I lived there but it ran well. That's all the folk care about. Daily made Chicago run.

Would I rather have a corrupt mayor like Daily or a mayor like Detroit or Washington DC? Chicago any day.

Thailand's problem is not corruption it is feudalism. Thailand is changing from a feudal society to a modern society that changes rulers by election and not by guns and bayonets. The rulers are elected. A large percent of Thailand and indeed ThaiVisa can't accept that.

One of the best posts I've read on here.

perhaps, but i would have expected someone who lived in C

hicago and liked the mayor's style of running the city would at least know his name was Daley

That's the ThaiVisa style for sure. You do know he was the mayor 40 years ago? But what is that when you can correct my spelling. Did you know who I was talking about?

Why bother with communication when you can whing about spelling eh?

[thailiketoo]

perhaps, but i would have expected someone who lived in C

hicago and liked the mayor's style of running the city would at least know his name was Daley

That's the ThaiVisa style for sure. You do know he was the mayor 40 years ago? But what is that when you can correct my spelling. Did you know who I was talking about?

Why bother with communication when you can whing about spelling eh?

Good post. Topical well thought out. Crafted for mass appeal. TVS

[swissie]

Topic related and associated with Plachons post above, specifically the last sentence. Anyone with kids here have any emergency plans drawn up if things do go, well . . . wrong here?

It's something me and my Swedish neighbour were talking about only yesterday. An emergency exit plan.

Pack everything easily converted into cash in the car, drive to Cambodia border and cross, find a way to Singapore and apply for Visas to Europe for the family from there.

Not sure how to convert a 5 bedroom Mansion and 3 cars into cash in a hurry. Nevermind, Thai-Wifey will offer remedies.In favor of the Farang to protect his investment. Of course!

Cheers.

[DrTuner]

Topic related and associated with Plachons post above, specifically the last sentence. Anyone with kids here have any emergency plans drawn up if things do go, well . . . wrong here?

It's something me and my Swedish neighbour were talking about only yesterday. An emergency exit plan.

Pack everything easily converted into cash in the car, drive to Cambodia border and cross, find a way to Singapore and apply for Visas to Europe for the family from there.

Not sure how to convert a 5 bedroom Mansion and 3 cars into cash in a hurry. Nevermind, Thai-Wifey will offer remedies.In favor of the Farang to protect his investment. Of course!

Cheers.

Yeah, it's the old saying "never invest more in Thailand than you're willing to walk away from". But I think the financial loss wouldn't be on the top of your mind when you're in the middle of Thais armed with assault rifles.

[Long tang]

Is Thailand corrupt to the core? No. Not any more than a lot of countries and less than other countries.

The civil war is going to be between the haves and the have nots. It always is. Are the have nots any more corrupt than the haves? No. If the haves are corrupt we can't discuss it anyway.

Chicago was a corrupt city when I lived there but it ran well. That's all the folk care about. Daily made Chicago run.

Would I rather have a corrupt mayor like Daily or a mayor like Detroit or Washington DC? Chicago any day.

Thailand's problem is not corruption it is feudalism. Thailand is changing from a feudal society to a modern society that changes rulers by election and not by guns and bayonets. The rulers are elected. A large percent of Thailand and indeed ThaiVisa can't accept that.

One of the best posts I've read on here.

perhaps, but i would have expected someone who lived in C

hicago and liked the mayor's style of running the city would at least know his name was Daley

That's the ThaiVisa style for sure. You do know he was the mayor 40 years ago? But what is that when you can correct my spelling. Did you know who I was talking about?

Why bother with communication when you can whing about spelling eh?

You spelt whinge wrong.

[thailiketoo]

perhaps, but i would have expected someone who lived in C

hicago and liked the mayor's style of running the city would at least know his name was Daley

That's the ThaiVisa style for sure. You do know he was the mayor 40 years ago? But what is that when you can correct my spelling. Did you know who I was talking about?

Why bother with communication when you can whing about spelling eh?

You spelt whinge wrong.

"don't waste space correcting other members' grammar and spelling where it isn't necessary." Thai Visa forum rules. Did you understand what I meant? If so you posted a simple flame.

I posted "Thailand's problem is not corruption it is feudalism. Thailand is changing from a feudal society to a modern society that changes rulers by election and not by guns and bayonets. The rulers are elected. A large percent of Thailand and indeed ThaiVisa can't accept that."

[Showbags]

Why do they call it 'civil' when it will be anything but?

[thailiketoo]

Why do they call it 'civil' when it will be anything but?

Because it is a war between citizens of the same country, Civilians.

[Long tang]

perhaps, but i would have expected someone who lived in C

hicago and liked the mayor's style of running the city would at least know his name was Daley

That's the ThaiVisa style for sure. You do know he was the mayor 40 years ago? But what is that when you can correct my spelling. Did you know who I was talking about?

Why bother with communication when you can whing about spelling eh?

You spelt whinge wrong.

"don't waste space correcting other members' grammar and spelling where it isn't necessary." Thai Visa forum rules. Did you understand what I meant? If so you posted a simple flame.

I posted "Thailand's problem is not corruption it is feudalism. Thailand is changing from a feudal society to a modern society that changes rulers by election and not by guns and bayonets. The rulers are elected. A large percent of Thailand and indeed ThaiVisa can't accept that."

Sorry, just having a bit of childish fun.

It's interesting what you suggest and I agree that it's trying to change and probably will eventually, but as this won't necessarily be to the benefit of those who hold true power, will they simply accept their fate, stand down and allow it to happen without a fight. I don't think so.

Also if it were to happen are you suggesting that it would automatically become a less corrupt place?

Surely corruption and feudalism are two separate problems and not mutually exclusive. Although I can see how corruption is a very useful tool for those sitting at the top of the pyramid.

[MAJIC]

You trying to compare Thailand to other country makes you look a bit dull or blinded by your love for here. I am happy that you are happy but you might want to stop comparing these things you are not doing well.

You're way off, Scotty. Sometimes it's absolutely relevant, and perhaps even necessary to make these kinds of comparisons. Most of the negative remarks about Thailand made on this forum invariably comes with the implication that it only happens here and no where else. Or it's worse here. Or it's more frequent here. Whatever. So Thailiketoo's arguments are pretty sound, much more so than yours. If you even have an argument.

On the contrary! the classic answer for some on TV is: of all the bad things that happen in Thailand is: "never mind it happens all over the world "

B******S

[baboon]

War, god god yal, what is it good for? Absolutely nothing.

Saving Europe from the iron grip of a genocidal megalomaniac?

[impulse]

War, god god yal, what is it good for? Absolutely nothing.

Saving Europe from the iron grip of a genocidal megalomaniac?

Yeah, but that didn't work out. Stalin won.

[MrWorldwide]

War, god god yal, what is it good for? Absolutely nothing.

Saving Europe from the iron grip of a genocidal megalomaniac?

Yeah, but that didn't work out. Stalin won.

He did.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladimir_Putin

[Scottythai]

perhaps, but i would have expected someone who lived in C

hicago and liked the mayor's style of running the city would at least know his name was Daley

That's the ThaiVisa style for sure. You do know he was the mayor 40 years ago? But what is that when you can correct my spelling. Did you know who I was talking about?

Why bother with communication when you can whing about spelling eh?

Good post. Topical well thought out. Crafted for mass appeal. TVS

I see you missed the post where I put links up of an reputable survey on corruption in todays age. You say you have seen corruption in other places but still its just your word. No links? The dead hose is you posting your opinion and calling it fact seems to be what you are doing.

So again I openly would like to see you back some or all of your ideals with links so it can be shown not just to be a rose tinted belief...

[thailiketoo]

I see you missed the post where I put links up of an reputable survey on corruption in todays age. You say you have seen corruption in other places but still its just your word. No links? The dead hose is you posting your opinion and calling it fact seems to be what you are doing.

So again I openly would like to see you back some or all of your ideals with links so it can be shown not just to be a rose tinted belief...

I have run business in Chicago and Bangkok and Bangkok is less corrupt IMHO. But that has nothing to do with civil war. The civil war will not be about corruption.

India had a civil war based on religion (I’m not an expert but I think that was why) and they ended up with two countries and millions of dead.

Thailand’s civil unrest is based on laziness of the farmers and the hi so folks. The farmers want Bangkok and Rayong to pay them to drink lao khao and rock on the porch (rice subsidy and loans). Bangkok and Rayong don’t want to pay the farmers to sit on the porch and drink. Same thing in the States farmers and auto workers want to take a month off a year to go deer hunting and drink in the woods.

Both the farmers and the middle class in Bangkok want to stop paying taxes to the rich so they can go to high class clubs in Bangkok and drink expensive lao khao and run over common people in their big cars . The rich who control the army want to keep getting drunk and running over people but are tiring of paying so much money to the army .

The army has warned everyone to keep paying them or they will roll those old tanks again (they really do need new tanks).

As I see it there are three problem groups. The farmers want to sit on the porch and drink and the rich want to sit in clubs and drink and the army wants to drive tanks and drink and the middle class is tired of working to pay for all those people to sit and drink.

No one minds the corruption and thinks paying 200 baht is better than wearing a helmet anyway, homemade booze is OK and bars should really be open late and the give the girl a break she is only trying to support her family…… You get the picture?

[Denim]

The word Democratic seems to have been used for the most part recently in it's most liberal sense.

More like the literal sense as in ' Demo cratic ' ......inclined towards demonstrations.

There will never be a civil war here since most Thais are fairly politically apathetic, and who can blame them. As in Syria, there is no 'good ' option for them, just a lot of rich pigs squabbling around the political trough , all corrupt to a greater or lesser degree.

And should this be a surprise ? Not really, a lot of civil servants are corrupt and nobody seems to mind ( as ABAC polls show ) as long as everyone gets a cut.

Civil war ?? ............................never happen.

[Thainy Tim]

I wouldn't worry about it, the current situation is almost over, the Shinawatra regime is losing power - they are already getting desperate by resorting to extreme measures to oppress the opposition. Eventually, if the Shinawatras don't leave politics peacefully then there will be another bloodless coup d'etat but no civil war. They might have money but their real power comes from the people who are increasingly being disillusioned by their deceit.

Contrary to popular opinion the reds aren't directly driven by support money, I'm sure it helps but their cause is valid - Isaan has been milked dry since the Phibun regime in order to fund the growth of Bangkok - money which then filtered into the BKK economy leaving Isaan in poverty. This will need to be rectified before Thailand sees any long term peace but the Shinawatra regime was never going to help them.

There will be more elites taking advantage of their plight to strengthen their cause but over time, the older, generations are being replaced by the educated youth - they won't be as easily manipulated and in time will run for politics themselves. Only then will Thailand be truly prepared for democracy.

Can you please explain in detail how this was achieved?

I mean, I am not disregarding it, but how does one milk a region to fund another?

How would you set about achieving it?

[PaullyW]

I see you missed the post where I put links up of an reputable survey on corruption in todays age. You say you have seen corruption in other places but still its just your word. No links? The dead hose is you posting your opinion and calling it fact seems to be what you are doing.

So again I openly would like to see you back some or all of your ideals with links so it can be shown not just to be a rose tinted belief...

I have run business in Chicago and Bangkok and Bangkok is less corrupt IMHO. But that has nothing to do with civil war. The civil war will not be about corruption.

India had a civil war based on religion (I’m not an expert but I think that was why) and they ended up with two countries and millions of dead.

Thailand’s civil unrest is based on laziness of the farmers and the hi so folks. The farmers want Bangkok and Rayong to pay them to drink lao khao and rock on the porch (rice subsidy and loans). Bangkok and Rayong don’t want to pay the farmers to sit on the porch and drink. Same thing in the States farmers and auto workers want to take a month off a year to go deer hunting and drink in the woods.

Both the farmers and the middle class in Bangkok want to stop paying taxes to the rich so they can go to high class clubs in Bangkok and drink expensive lao khao and run over common people in their big cars . The rich who control the army want to keep getting drunk and running over people but are tiring of paying so much money to the army .

The army has warned everyone to keep paying them or they will roll those old tanks again (they really do need new tanks).

As I see it there are three problem groups. The farmers want to sit on the porch and drink and the rich want to sit in clubs and drink and the army wants to drive tanks and drink and the middle class is tired of working to pay for all those people to sit and drink.

No one minds the corruption and thinks paying 200 baht is better than wearing a helmet anyway, homemade booze is OK and bars should really be open late and the give the girl a break she is only trying to support her family…… You get the picture?

So here it seems that you have conceded the point that generally Thais accept and see nothing wrong with the corruption.

You also earlier confessed that corruption is bad.

I'm glad you now agree. But, I might caution you against posting overly negative views of Thais or Thailand.

Cheers

Edited November 23, 2013 by PaullyW