Stricter requirements, new application forms for ED visa extensions

[thaichalina]

thaichalina, you are fine, it is not a problem in your case.

That would also mean i don't have to get proof of income and show it at immigration when making an extension? Just the ones who are applying for ed visa have to send it to MOE?

Edited December 24, 2013 by thaichalina

[Asiantravel]

Things start from Bkk, don't they? Sent from my GT-I9190 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Not necessarily?

As far as I understand for example nearly 2 years ago Chiang Mai seemed to be the first location in Thailand to impose an upper limit on applicants . I was told, language schools had sent e-mails to older applicants (above 50) that they were no longer able to obtain an education visa in Chiang Mai.

And yet places like Bangkok and Pattaya didn't seem to have that restriction?

I think that was another unfounded rumour. I know lots of people over 50 in CM with ED visas.

It was also referred to in this thread and apparently Walen School confirmed it according to the original poster ? So apparently not a rumour ?

I have read somewhere that Ed visa for an over 50 person will not be extended after the first year (I am 62). This was confirmed by Walen school as being the policy of immigration in Chiang Mai. Does this rule apply for the rest of Thailand?

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/601367-ed-visa-extension-for-over-50s/

[arthurwait]

Why is there no stamp or heading on these papers ?

[Maestro]

Removed, and will continue to remove, off-topic posts and the replies to them. This topic is not the place to discuss the consequences of overstay, getting a new passport, definition of work and the need for a work permit, etc.

[Maestro]

Why is there no stamp or heading on these papers ?

My guess is because there is no law requiring the use of a form with a stamp or letterhead for the collection of information for this purpose. The forms serve the purpose of gathering some supplementary information that will help in arriving at a decision whether a student is a bona fide student and thus qualifies for the MoE's recommendation to a Thai consulate for a visa or an immigration office for an extension of stay. The alternative would be to summon the student for an interview, ask him the questions, and take note of his answers on a scrap of paper.

[thaichalina]

thaichalina, you are fine, it is not a problem in your case.

That would also mean i don't have to get proof of income and show it at immigration when making an extension? Just the ones who are applying for ed visa have to send it to MOE?

[Sceptict11]

thaichalina, you are fine, it is not a problem in your case.

That would also mean i don't have to get proof of income and show it at immigration when making an extension? Just the ones who are applying for ed visa have to send it to MOE?

Does showing evidence of income cause concern ?

[thaichalina]

thaichalina, you are fine, it is not a problem in your case.

That would also mean i don't have to get proof of income and show it at immigration when making an extension? Just the ones who are applying for ed visa have to send it to MOE?

Does showing evidence of income cause concern ?

Yes because my money stays on account that i'm using together with my thai girlfriend.It's a joint account.I don't have a separate account.So if they want evidence all i can show is that joint account.

MacWalen told that i shouldn't have problem with many tourist visas as i'm already on ed visa but just wanted to know if i need a proof of income at immigration when go make extension or is that only for people who are applying for ed visa?

Edited December 24, 2013 by thaichalina

[Sceptict11]

thaichalina, you are fine, it is not a problem in your case.

That would also mean i don't have to get proof of income and show it at immigration when making an extension? Just the ones who are applying for ed visa have to send it to MOE?

Does showing evidence of income cause concern ?

Yes because my money stays on account that i'm using together with my thai girlfriend.It's a joint account.I don't have a separate account.So if they want evidence all i can show is that joint account.

MacWalen told that i shouldn't have problem with many tourist visas as i'm already on ed visa but just wanted to know if i need a proof of income at immigration when go make extension or is that only for people who are applying for ed visa?

Best you get an account in your own name !

You will then be "safe" !

[Kitsune]

Agakure, we have not tested it yet but it seems people with a lot of tourist visas may find it difficult to obtain an ED visa. Sent from my GT-I9190 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

thats good as they are not students..just visa jumpers

Wrong.You can't say that for everyone,don't generalize.I have a lot of tourist visas but i actually have never missed a thai school lesson on my ed visa,and i'm eager to learn thai language.

It would be better to have some sort of test based upon how much months/years did you learn thai.Those who have ed visa for several years but can't speak even a word,those are the real problem.

As said so many times, please bring me an immigration officer to test my Japanese, I have a level 3 certification and 7 years of study, but somewhat they persist in talking to me in Thai, and it seems the case for every language beside Thai

[soomak]

This will effectively kill the ED business. If for example a book author, receiving money from abroad. What is his status?

He or she cannot get a work permit because the business has nothing to do with Thailand. The same with thousands of different freelancers out there, not working locally.

What if you have your own savings but the form asks for "the person who is supporting you financially". Then if you have a person, for example your wealthy uncle in Italy, who does not speak English. They are going to call him and speak Italian?

It will kill the business of procuring ED Visas when in reality that is not the reason the person has for living in Thailand.

You have to realise Thailand has no obligation to provide a means for everyone in the world to come and live here as they choose.

They are quite accommodating really.

You make it sound like anybody has a right to live wherever they choose and the country should not deny them.

Of course they don't have to allow anyone to live here; however the common notion is that foreigners living here pour their money into the Thai economy, so everybody wins.

The only westerners I know that work in Thailand illegally are English teachers. You can say they are taking jobs from Thais, but you and I both know that they actually teach English much better than 99% of Thai teachers, so the truth is that Thailand is benefiting from those (illegal) teachers as well.

The ED visa for studying Thai is indeed just a cover up for staying in Thailand for a few years, and I (ab)used it as well. But then again I've spent 2 million baht here, so I think the Thai economy surely benefited from my stay. And I never have any intention of working in Thailand, unless you count working online for my own (non-Thai) business as working in Thailand.

And finally, the number of people using ED visa for staying long periods can't be that high. In my school there are very few students, maybe a total of 30-40 at any given time. Even if there are dozens such schools in bkk, it would be maybe a total of 1,000 people in bkk, hardly a large scale problem.

Foreigners who stay here do so for their own benefit, not for Thailand's, but they are very creative is justifying their benefits to their host country.

I presume you don't know any Russian Westerners then as many are arrested working here illegally, and I assure you it goes far beyond the realms of English teachers.

It seems the Thai authorities regard abuse of the ED visa as a serious enough issue that they are attempting to address it. Likely there are a few who abuse say medical visas too, I have met those.

You believe spending 2 million baht justifies your breaking the laws of Thailand by utilising an ED visa incorrectly? I have certainly spent substantially more than that here, but lived here using a legitimate retirement extension, which do you believe the Thai authorities prefer?

Russian are not westerners, and in any case, if there is a problem with Russians working illegally, the authorities can easily deal with them, as they have Russian passports... (unless we believe one of the posters here that some have fake French passports).

I got an ED visa by going to a Thai language school, which is perfectly legal. So your allegations of breaking the laws are both wrong and rude, and please keep them to your self.

As for the Thais benefiting from my stay here, that is obviously true - my money comes from abroad and goes into Thai businesses and individuals, and would not have been there otherwise. It's not like there is a quota and I'm taking someones place...

And finally, there is a term called a Win-Win Situation, and perhaps you should familiar yourself with it in your advanced age - it's when both sides benefit from a situation. The foreigners that stay here do it for their own benefit, the same way as tourists come here for their own benefit; It does not mean that Thailand does not benefit from it as well.

Edited December 25, 2013 by soomak

[ubonjoe]

Removed several off topic posts and replies to them.

[Kitsune]

Russian are not westerners, and in any case, if there is a problem with Russians working illegally, the authorities can easily deal with them, as they have Russian passports... (unless we believe one of the posters here that some have fake French passports).

I got an ED visa by going to a Thai language school, which is perfectly legal. So your allegations of breaking the laws are both wrong and rude, and please keep them to your self.

As for the Thais benefiting from my stay here, that is obviously true - my money comes from abroad and goes into Thai businesses and individuals, and would not have been there otherwise. It's not like there is a quota and I'm taking someones place...

And finally, there is a term called a Win-Win Situation, and perhaps you should familiar yourself with it in your advanced age - it's when both sides benefit from a situation. The foreigners that stay here do it for their own benefit, the same way as tourists come here for their own benefit; It does not mean that Thailand does not benefit from it as well.

Does the new requirement say "westerners" ? No.

[mimithewoof]

To iMA - post 164

As regards your post, I'm getting pretty sick of reading that it's impossible to live here comfortably on less than 40 -50-60,000 etc baht a month.

OK, I don't (by design) live in BKK, Pattaya or Phuket and , yes, I did study Thai on an ED visa until CMU pulled the plug with disastrous consequences for many. For me it was easy - back onto a retirement visa.

Some of us came here to escape the over-commercial 'me-me-me want' society in Western countries, and prefer to live according to our needs, with our lifestyles related to the country in which we are living.

If I had an income of 40,000 per month, I'd be saving at least 10-12,000 of it! And, no, I wasn't a pauper in my own country as I had a successful business, I'm just a reflection of the standards given me by my parents and schooling.

I'm concerned that the new ED visa rules on income will prevent many from attempting to learn this difficult language as, say, they may not be able to satisfactorily prove regular ATM withdrawals from an overseas bank - I know several guys in this position.

[Time Traveller]

Proof of income? Aren't they studying, and not working?

Income from outside Thailand is what they want to see.

Income from who? Their parents? I still can't imagine how a full time student is expected to have an income from a foreign job, while studying full time in Thailand.

Doesn't matter who supplies the money, just as long as it comes from outside the country.

You do know the difference between savings and income, don't you? You can be a self funded student, but that doesn't mean you have any income to show. Thai immigration, when they say income, they mean just that. Not savings in the bank, not someone else's income.

[Loaded]

Not necessarily?

As far as I understand for example nearly 2 years ago Chiang Mai seemed to be the first location in Thailand to impose an upper limit on applicants . I was told, language schools had sent e-mails to older applicants (above 50) that they were no longer able to obtain an education visa in Chiang Mai.

And yet places like Bangkok and Pattaya didn't seem to have that restriction?

I think that was another unfounded rumour. I know lots of people over 50 in CM with ED visas.

So is what this guy says on his website is wrong?

This is written in the section “ New Forms “

NOTE: Education (Student) VISA's are no longer available for persons over

50 years of age.

http://donslifeinthailand.com/VISA_Student.html

I'm not sure 'don's life in Thailand' could be described as a reliable source. Was he a Walen customer?

[Loaded]

Not necessarily?

As far as I understand for example nearly 2 years ago Chiang Mai seemed to be the first location in Thailand to impose an upper limit on applicants . I was told, language schools had sent e-mails to older applicants (above 50) that they were no longer able to obtain an education visa in Chiang Mai.

And yet places like Bangkok and Pattaya didn't seem to have that restriction?

I think that was another unfounded rumour. I know lots of people over 50 in CM with ED visas.

It was also referred to in this thread and apparently Walen School confirmed it according to the original poster ? So apparently not a rumour ?

I have read somewhere that Ed visa for an over 50 person will not be extended after the first year (I am 62). This was confirmed by Walen school as being the policy of immigration in Chiang Mai. Does this rule apply for the rest of Thailand?

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/601367-ed-visa-extension-for-over-50s/

The only school I know that has mentioned over 50s not getting a non-immigrant ED visa is Walen. I know people aged over 50 who have recently obtained one in Chiang Mai. They didn't study with Walen.

Could Walen clarify does the over 50 limit apply only to his school or is it a universal requirement for all language schools? If an universal requirement, could he point to an official website (MFA, Immigration, Embassy, Consulate etc.) that confirms this?

[ubonjoe]

I cannot find any post by Mac Walen that said anything about those over 50 not being able to get an extension. It was made by somebody else.

[Loaded]

I cannot find any post by Mac Walen that said anything about those over 50 not being able to get an extension. It was made by somebody else.

I was going on the statement in this post

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/601367-ed-visa-extension-for-over-50s/?p=5886799

It isn't Walen stating this; it's someone quoting him.

I checked their website and it is unambiguous

"Do you have any age restrictions?

Students of all ages between 12 and 99 qualify to study at our school. Students below 12 years old can also become our students but we are not able to obtain the ED visa, the Student visa or any Thai visa for them."

[ubonjoe]

Others have already stated that information is not accurate because they are aware of people over 50 in Chiang Mai getting extensions.

[Asiantravel]

I cannot find any post by Mac Walen that said anything about those over 50 not being able to get an extension. It was made by somebody else.

The person who told me about this restriction almost 2 years ago now was warned by Pro Language School

[soomak]

I think that was another unfounded rumour. I know lots of people over 50 in CM with ED visas.

It was also referred to in this thread and apparently Walen School confirmed it according to the original poster ? So apparently not a rumour ?

I have read somewhere that Ed visa for an over 50 person will not be extended after the first year (I am 62). This was confirmed by Walen school as being the policy of immigration in Chiang Mai. Does this rule apply for the rest of Thailand?

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/601367-ed-visa-extension-for-over-50s/

The only school I know that has mentioned over 50s not getting a non-immigrant ED visa is Walen. I know people aged over 50 who have recently obtained one in Chiang Mai. They didn't study with Walen.

Could Walen clarify does the over 50 limit apply only to his school or is it a universal requirement for all language schools? If an universal requirement, could he point to an official website (MFA, Immigration, Embassy, Consulate etc.) that confirms this?

I had two people over 50 study with me last year (2012), and that was in bkk.

Don't know if the rules have changed since.

[kingstonkid]

I am sure that proof of income is going to be the same but on a financially lower level as that for Retirement which would mean that

a. if using a bank account here it will have to be in your name and how you got it.

That the income from outside will have to be verified by the embassy

I also understand that this policy is ot for peole already on an ED visa BUT for new people.

[DickFarang]

So proof of income...from how long into the past, 1 month, 3 months, 6 months or 10 years?

There is no info about amount or how long yet. Best to ask your school what is required.

Retirement visa has 65 000 Bath per month limit. If it is anywhere close to that, all schools will lose a lot of "genuine" students with meager savings. That is sure. Few will come up with 26500 dollars (= yearly sum) just to study Thai in Thailand and showing the same sum every 3 months to the officials. Most live with mere 20-40 000 Baht.

Retirement extensions are for 365/366 days, not for 3 months.

[DickFarang]

Is that for a year?

Visa is for 90 days.

Then you extend it for a year. Extension is 1,900 regardless of length. (12 months is the max you will get)

Is that for a year?

That is the visa fee, if you renew every year on time you do not have to apply for a new ED visa but your original one gets extended.

I have always heard that Education extensions were 1 year for studies at a university and 3 months (or 90 days) only for studying Thai language, which means 1,900 baht a year in the former case and 4 x 1,900 = 7,600 baht a year in the latter case.

[1ma]

I cannot find any post by Mac Walen that said anything about those over 50 not being able to get an extension. It was made by somebody else.

The person who told me about this restriction almost 2 years ago now was warned by Pro Language School

If people need the same financial requirement for an Ed Visa than they do for a retirement visa, then easier for all they just get a retirement visa. If they don't qualify for that they don't qualify for an Ed Visa. (if the financial requirements are the same).

[mataleo]

Proof of income? Aren't they studying, and not working?

When you study,you still need to support yourself. You need to pay for rent, food, etc.This is the same in any country. How can you come and study if you don't have any money. This is just common sense.

U can bring cash and declare on airport

mataleo

[Sceptict11]

Proof of income? Aren't they studying, and not working?

When you study,you still need to support yourself. You need to pay for rent, food, etc.This is the same in any country. How can you come and study if you don't have any money. This is just common sense.

U can bring cash and declare on airport

mataleo

How big a "wad" of cash would you suggest bringing ?

[Bkungbank]

I went to renew 90 days yesterday, they never ask anything yet about additional paper.

[impulse]

I cannot find any post by Mac Walen that said anything about those over 50 not being able to get an extension. It was made by somebody else.

The person who told me about this restriction almost 2 years ago now was warned by Pro Language School

If people need the same financial requirement for an Ed Visa than they do for a retirement visa, then easier for all they just get a retirement visa. If they don't qualify for that they don't qualify for an Ed Visa. (if the financial requirements are the same).

You're forgetting the age requirement. Gotta be 50 or older to get retirement.