Whats with restaurants refusing debit cards but not credit cards?

[masuk]

When paying with your credit card, don't let it out of your sight and always use your pin to pay.

When you give them your credit card it is too easy for them to use their mobile phone to photo the front and rear of your card to get the code numbers.

After they have got the front and rear numbers they can order anything on line, as they have all the info required to purchase goods.

In Australia on the 1st of July I think it is. All transaction done on any cards must be pinned, no signatures will be accepted after that date.

Just a warning.

I use a Bangkok Bank debit card, and was amazed that shops still require a signature, which they NEVER check, and no-one seems to use a PIN.

I keep precious little in that account, just enough for the weekly shopping.

Looks like OZ is on the ball.

[rtco]

All this talk of wanting Credit Cards!!! I had too many in the UK and was paying through the nose in interest. Debit Cards you only pay what you have ... a great leveler. Now I have two Thai Debit Cards and have never had a problem with paying for anything even online.

[OMGImInPattaya]

Yes its crazy ,try to pay for my air tickets online ,refuses debit card only take credit card ,for a falang to get a credit card we have to jump through hoops ,my brother in law ,who does not have a pot to piss in ,no problem sir . he is Thai i am a falang ,go figure.

Kasikorn Bank K-Web card. Virtual credit card that debits from linked savings account for online transactions. Has worked at all thai and foreign inline airline, hotel, and other online commerce sites.

[OMGImInPattaya]

I use my foreign home country) VISA or MC debit cards all the time in BKK to pay for restaurant bills.

Some places only take cash, of course. But I can't recall anyplace ever denying me to use a VISA or MC debit card, but accepting the same kinds of credit cards.

I never use Thai bank ATM, debit or credit cards to pay for anything here. Too much risk and no consumer protection if those cards are ever lost, stolen or cloned. You're on the hook for all fraudulent charges right up until the time you notify the bank -- even if you were not aware or couldn't have been aware of the fraud.

Not true...depends on bank. Also little risk of fraud...used thai ATM/debit cards for all manner of transactions without incident. Only have to set up account initial security settings correctly.

[Surasak]

When paying with your credit card, don't let it out of your sight and always use your pin to pay.

When you give them your credit card it is too easy for them to use their mobile phone to photo the front and rear of your card to get the code numbers.

After they have got the front and rear numbers they can order anything on line, as they have all the info required to purchase goods.

In Australia on the 1st of July I think it is. All transaction done on any cards must be pinned, no signatures will be accepted after that date.

Just a warning.

In years of living in Thailand, I've never yet had any bankcard transaction for a purchase (credit or debit card) handled via a PIN-based purchase. It's always swipe and sign.

ATM withdrawals of course involved the use of PIN codes. But point of sale (POS) purchases here typically don't. The cardholder here doesn't get to choose the type of transaction they want.

Have paid at Global House and HomePro with a debit card and on each occasion paid with a PIN. They are the only store I know of which use this with a Chip&PIN M/C

[wym]

Perhaps it's the fees?

Maybe you're right, and for some reason visa processing fees cost more for debit cards than credit cards. So restaurants prefer credit card.

But the bill was around 700 baht (2 pizzas and 2 beers, its a good place, I recommend it). I've paid by debit in villamarket for a 400 baht bill before now (when feeling lazy).

The rules as to what they will and won't accept are set by their payment processing network/bank, not up to the individual merchant.

Small merchants tend to go with the cheaper/simpler vendors, which means CCs only.

OT, but for online use (ONLY) the "virtual CC" offered by Kasikorn once you've set up online banking does work a treat, the online payment gateways can't tell it's pulling from your account like an ATM, to them looks just like a genuine full CC.

But for in-person use it is much harder to get in Thailand, much better off getting one back home and keeping an address with a good maildrop, and your credit line updated with regular transactions there.

Plus the back-home CCs have the nice consumer protection procedures, just let them know you were scammed and they instantly reverse the charges, then it's up to the merchant to prove otherwise, here it's usually the other way around.

Edited March 11, 2014 by wym

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Have paid at Global House and HomePro with a debit card and on each occasion paid with a PIN. They are the only store I know of which use this with a Chip&PIN M/C

That's interesting... I happened to be shopping at a HomePro just earlier today, and made a purchase with my U.S. VISA debit card. Swipe and sign. No PIN involved.

But, and this probably is the key difference, my debit card does have a PIN for ATM use and such. But it is not a chipped card, unlike yours. So the presence of the chipped card may account for the difference.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I use my foreign home country) VISA or MC debit cards all the time in BKK to pay for restaurant bills.

Some places only take cash, of course. But I can't recall anyplace ever denying me to use a VISA or MC debit card, but accepting the same kinds of credit cards.

I never use Thai bank ATM, debit or credit cards to pay for anything here. Too much risk and no consumer protection if those cards are ever lost, stolen or cloned. You're on the hook for all fraudulent charges right up until the time you notify the bank -- even if you were not aware or couldn't have been aware of the fraud.

Not true...depends on bank. Also little risk of fraud...used thai ATM/debit cards for all manner of transactions without incident. Only have to set up account initial security settings correctly.

Unfortunately, I'm afraid it IS true. All the Thai banks have pretty similar policies on this and I've read them: the cardholder is responsible for all fraudulent transactions posted against their card until AFTER they've notified the bank to freeze the card due to loss or theft or whatever.

If you think some Thai bank has a different liability policy than this, please do post the info here.

Meanwhile, not sure where you're getting your info, but Thailand is awash in ATM skimming, credit card fraud and everything that goes along with it. There's clearly a high risk of fraud here using any bank cards, whether Thai or home country.

That said, the cardholder can take steps to improve their security, such as setting low limits on ATM withdrawals, disabling POS purchases on the debit card, setting up SMS or email alerts when any transaction is made, keeping the bulk of one's funds in a non-carded account, etc etc.

But at the end of the day, if someone still ends up with a fraudulent charge on their Thai-based bank card prior to reporting the fraud, credit or debit, good luck in trying to get the funds restored. Because it isn't likely to happen.

Edited March 11, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[MyFriend You]

Perhaps it's the fees?

Same Same for American Express, they want to charge 4% above the price "to cover expenses'.........so I have been told.

[bina]

what we call credit cards here are: the payments come off your bank account on the 15th of the next month. you can pay in intstallments. anyone with a bank account can have one. a teenager can have one. as long as u have had three months of salary coming in to a bank account, u can get a credit card. it is also an atm card. u can also get just an atm card. here, we swipe and sign. no check, no pin number, no id card,nada.

some people have debit cards. works the same way. but cannot pay installments. and some folks have a pre paid card. fill and use as needed.

but then again, here we can still use third party checks and roll them along for months on end.

here if someone steals yoru card, u are responsible for freezing cancelling and paying.

credit, here, means paying with installments that are with interest.

most places wont take diners card .

majority of places prefer cash.

[speedtripler]

When paying with your credit card, don't let it out of your sight and always use your pin to pay.

When you give them your credit card it is too easy for them to use their mobile phone to photo the front and rear of your card to get the code numbers.

After they have got the front and rear numbers they can order anything on line, as they have all the info required to purchase goods.

In Australia on the 1st of July I think it is. All transaction done on any cards must be pinned, no signatures will be accepted after that date.

Just a warning.

I use a Bangkok Bank debit card, and was amazed that shops still require a signature, which they NEVER check, and no-one seems to use a PIN.

I keep precious little in that account, just enough for the weekly shopping.

Looks like OZ is on the ball.

ive signed my name as mike tyson , clint eastwood and a few others while paying for stuff and nobody ever gave a shit

ive lent my card to people to go and get stuff etc as well and they have no issues using my cards (even girls )

i dont think the merchant has any way to see your balance ,its either approved or it isnt by internet connecting the bank server

but security is a complete joke ,anyone can use anyones card

[jacko45k]

Yes its crazy ,try to pay for my air tickets online ,refuses debit card only take credit card ,for a falang to get a credit card we have to jump through hoops ,my brother in law ,who does not have a pot to piss in ,no problem sir . he is Thai i am a falang ,go figure.

No you don't, just go get one. I have 2.

[jacko45k]

OP...Thailand, likes cash, use the debit card, go to an ATM, and get some.

Particularly if you are eating out with friends, they are getting fed up of paying!

[featography]

They do take debit cards, but don't take Thai ones, but are happy to take international ones... from my experience as well.

Possible reason for this may be found in the lower left corner of the Thai debit cards. Small print it says for ATM transactions only. I thought it was due to my being farang, but found it on my wife's debit card as well.

I found it to be a minor inconvenience the one and only time I tried to buy something in a dept store, but after thinking about it, decided that is preferred. If lost or stolen, it cant be used to empty the account with purchases, and with no PIN # its useless in the ATM.

[wym]

Yes its crazy ,try to pay for my air tickets online ,refuses debit card only take credit card ,for a falang to get a credit card we have to jump through hoops ,my brother in law ,who does not have a pot to piss in ,no problem sir . he is Thai i am a falang ,go figure.

No you don't, just go get one. I have 2.

What are you talking about?

Need a work permit for a start, have to wait at least a few months before applying in some cases 6 months or a year.

And a decent salary.

And they check your (Thai) credit reports, if you've missed deadlines with electric cable phone bills etc you're SOL.

All seem pretty "hoopish" to me, just the first one counts out most here.

[theoldgit]

Yes its crazy ,try to pay for my air tickets online ,refuses debit card only take credit card ,for a falang to get a credit card we have to jump through hoops ,my brother in law ,who does not have a pot to piss in ,no problem sir . he is Thai i am a falang ,go figure.

No you don't, just go get one. I have 2.

What are you talking about?

Need a work permit for a start, have to wait at least a few months before applying in some cases 6 months or a year.

And a decent salary.

And they check your (Thai) credit reports, if you've missed deadlines with electric cable phone bills etc you're SOL.

All seem pretty "hoopish" to me, just the first one counts out most here.

As I said earlier, I have a Thai credit card, I received a mailshot, applied, and the card, with a decent credit limit, was couriered to me a couple of weeks later, certainly no hoops for me.

As I said earlier being retired I've never had a work permit, my income was just a UK occupational pension, they may have checked with the credit bureau, I really don't know, no deposit was required.

I may have slipped through the cracks, I really don't know.

Having a credit card certainly makes it easier to book cars, hotels and flights, I don't pay interest as I always pay it off in full.

[wym]

Which banks? You said two. . .

Both unsolicited? Did you already bank with them?

If not, belong to any high-end membership program, investment or insurance scheme? what do you think put you on their radar?

Very unusual in my experience here, sounds like they're starting to operate like back home.

Not a good sign for the Kingdom if true, lots say the household credit numbers portend a big bubble pop, , ,

Edited March 12, 2014 by wym

[theoldgit]

Which banks? You said two. . .

Both unsolicited? Did you already bank with them?

If not, belong to any high-end membership program, investment or insurance scheme? what do you think put you on their radar?

Very unusual in my experience here, sounds like they're starting to operate like back home.

Not a good sign for the Kingdom if true, lots say the household credit numbers portend a big bubble pop, , ,

I never said two, that was jacko45k.

Amex Thailand, as a Thai Airways ROP Gold Card holder.

I don't know if it's unusual or not, it's not something I've really studied, I was just responding to the posts suggesting that one of the criteria for foreigners to have a Thai credit is being in possession a Work Permit.

Not sure what you mean when you say "if true"?

[wym]

Sorry for the crossed wires.

Yes Amex is a very different beast from the local banks.

Used to know the guy ran their regional call centre, nice gig he had!!

"if true" was for:

>sounds like they're starting to operate like back home.

[jacko45k]

Yes its crazy ,try to pay for my air tickets online ,refuses debit card only take credit card ,for a falang to get a credit card we have to jump through hoops ,my brother in law ,who does not have a pot to piss in ,no problem sir . he is Thai i am a falang ,go figure.

No you don't, just go get one. I have 2.

What are you talking about?

Need a work permit for a start, have to wait at least a few months before applying in some cases 6 months or a year.

And a decent salary.

And they check your (Thai) credit reports, if you've missed deadlines with electric cable phone bills etc you're SOL.

All seem pretty "hoopish" to me, just the first one counts out most here.

What are you talking about?

Obviously something you do not know about.

I am retired.

Edited March 12, 2014 by jacko45k

[maccaroni man]

A debit card is an ATM card to draw funds from s bank restaurants are not ATM or Banks. KISS

[celso]

 

A debit card is an ATM card to draw funds from s bank restaurants are not ATM or Banks. KISS

So why is it I can use my debit card in department stores, supermarkets, bookstores, etc, with no fuss.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

They do take debit cards, but don't take Thai ones, but are happy to take international ones... from my experience as well.

Possible reason for this may be found in the lower left corner of the Thai debit cards. Small print it says for ATM transactions only. I thought it was due to my being farang, but found it on my wife's debit card as well.

I found it to be a minor inconvenience the one and only time I tried to buy something in a dept store, but after thinking about it, decided that is preferred. If lost or stolen, it cant be used to empty the account with purchases, and with no PIN # its useless in the ATM.

Also in answer to Celso's comment above:

ATM cards are one thing, and debit cards are a different thing.

ATM cards can only be used to withdraw money from ATMs, and not to make POS (Point of Sale) purchases because they don't carry a VISA or MC logo. Usually just the logo of the issuing bank.

Debit cards can be used to withdraw money from ATMs AND to make POS purchases, because they DO carry a VISA or MC logo.

I used to have some Thai bank ATM cards, but these days, it seems the banks mostly issue debit cards (that carry a VISA or MC logo).

Usually, though,a user can disable the POS purchase function on their debit card in the bank's online banking security settings. That way, even if lost or stolen, the thief can't use the card to POS purchase their way into draining your account.

All of my Thai bank debit cards have words on the front along the lines of "For Electronic Use Only." AFAIK, what that means is the card numbers on the card aren't embossed/raised (instead just printed flat on the card) so it can't be run through the older style card machines that physically transfer your card number onto a paper charge slip.

Edited March 12, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[theoldgit]

A debit card is an ATM card to draw funds from s bank restaurants are not ATM or Banks. KISS

Surely a debit card is just that, a card that debits money from your account, be it at an ATM, a shop, restaurant or, in some circumstances, online.

I know that I have never ever encountered a problem using my Kasikorn Debit Card in a shop or restaurant in Thailand, Asia or Europe.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Re issuing credit cards to farangs here:

I'd say the normal bank practice is to require a work permit and some level of salary, certainly more than they'd require of Thai cardholders. That creates a hassle and burden for retirees here who might want a Thai credit card.

There are ways around that: putting your funds on frozen deposit in the bank's savings account is one way some Thai banks will issue credit cards to farangs without work permits. So you can almost think of that as a kind of pre-paid credit card, where the bank is holding your deposit as a guarantee of repayment.

Some people here like Thai credit cards and talk about the points/perks they can accumulate. But for me, with the Thai banks having a standard 20% APR on their credit card balances and pretty much zero protection against fraudulent charges, I'll stick with my home country credit cards: half or less an APR % rate on balances, and full protection against fraud.

.

[wym]

I am retired.

So could you answer please?

------------

Which banks? You said two. . .

Both unsolicited? Did you already bank with them?

If not, belong to any high-end membership program, investment or insurance scheme? what do you think put you on their radar?

[wym]

 

A debit card is an ATM card to draw funds from s bank restaurants are not ATM or Banks. KISS

So why is it I can use my debit card in department stores, supermarkets, bookstores, etc, with no fuss.

Already answered - because usually lower-volume restaurants contract with the less picky, less expensive payment processor networks.

The decision as to what they take and what they don't is with the PP not the merchant.

[Jonmarleesco]

I had a similar issue with Costa in Paragon. I get the impression they think the card reader is only for credit cards, as opposed to Visa, Mastercard, etc., though God knows why. That said, I don't often get the problem, in restaurants or elsewhere.

[I Like Thai]

It's happened a few times. I get to the bill, and the restaurant won't let me pay by debit card , even though they have a card reader.

Like yesterday I was in a Japanese place in Siam Centre. I didnt have enough cash so I offered my TMB card. 'Oh sorry sir, we cant take that'. Ok, offer my kasikorn card. 'Sir we dont take debit card, do you have credit card?'.

At this point my friend offers his UK bank card, which the waitress takes. It was also for a debit account but I guess no-one realised, because we paid and left.

What's the reason for this? I've had the same experience several times. Debit or credit, both cards do the same thing. Other shops never have a problem with it, just restaurants.

Is this your scam to get your friends to pay for your meals ? If you know they don't accept Debit cards, then why do you leave yourself short on cash and attempt to use it ?

Edited March 12, 2014 by I Like Thai

[jacko45k]

I am retired.

So could you answer please?

------------

Which banks? You said two. . .

Both unsolicited? Did you already bank with them?

If not, belong to any high-end membership program, investment or insurance scheme? what do you think put you on their radar?

Sorry, I did not see a question to answer!

Go back and re-read please.

I said 2 cards... Bangkok Bank gave me both a Mastercard and a Visa.

Yes I did already bank with them, to be honest, I would expect that.

A sign, in English in my branch caught my attention, I had felt a need for a Thai based card for some time.