The New Visa Enforcements

[NamKangMan]

I hope genuine tourists will not be inconvenienced. It is a very normal situation young backpackers come in on a 30 days airport visa free entry stamp, and decide to extend their holiday later on. They should not be hassled about confirmed hotel bookings, travel plans and so on. Flipping briefly through their passports should make clear immediately they are Germany, France or wherever based, and certainly not residing in Thailand permanently. I am eagerly awaiting field reports from Ranong.

"I hope genuine tourists will not be inconvenienced" - and this is the question, what is a "genuine tourist?"

For me, a genuine tourists is a 2 week holiday maker, or a 6 month South East Asia backpacker.

Everyone else is not a tourists, including myself.

It's quite rare a mature aged western person will "holiday" for 60 days. Most western countries only give 4 weeks of holiday from employment. Sure, it can be accrued and there is long service leave etc, but in general, mature aged people, with responsibilities back home, will not holiday here for 60 days, extend that by another 30 days, and then go and try to do it again.

So, if these people are not working illegally, and are not committing crime, what do we call these people, and why is there no visa class for them?

It's quite rare a mature aged western person will "holiday" for 60 days. Most western countries only give 4 weeks of holiday from employment.

Odd most of the Mature aged people I know come here for the winter for 4 months or so..

on the other hand in the next Village one old boy [78] hated the boarder hops and the pain of getting to BKK to get a bus.. he opted for a retirement Extension here, about 5 years ago, he spends around 4 months here only every winter.

Most friends and relatives that visit me or use my house as a base come for 6 - 8 weeks.. Mature aged people don't what such a long trip for 3 weeks, there children or grand children can look after there home while there away.

Allow me to clarify.

When I say, "mature aged people" - I am talking about 30 year olds to 50 year olds. Anyone over 50 can get a retirement visa and come and go as they please.

I am not talking about someone who is 78 years of age who holidays in Thailand for 4 months of the year, because they qualify for a retirement visa.

The people in their late teens to early 20's will backpack around South East Asia either before starting university, or working, or just after completing university. These people will "holiday" around South east Asia for 4 to 6 months.

In general, someone between 30 and 50, gets 4 weeks holidays a year, and will not come to Thailand on a 60 day visa, extend that visa by 1 month and then go to a neighbouring Thai Embassy to do it all again.

Given that some people between 30 and 50 can afford to reside here, and these people do not work illegally, and are not committing any crime here, what do we call these people?

Currently, there is no proper visa class for them, and they have done nothing wrong.

[NamKangMan]

True in places like Phuket, Khao Lak, Hua Hin, Pattaya, Koh Samui and Krabi there are loads of mostly elderly westerners who spend every winter there, some of them stay almost 6 months. Quite a few of them rent a house the whole year round, or they have a Thai wife who owns the house. Also if some of these people don't qualify for a non imm O (retirement/marriage), they shouldn't have problems getting at least a double entry tourist visa in their home country. They are spending less than half of the year in Thailand, so IMO they are tourists and not residents.

Whilst typing this, I remember the case of an elderly Norwegian who often spends like 7 months in Thailand. At the Thai embassy in Oslo they made a problem about issuing him a tourist visa again: "You are spending more than half of the year in Thailand, so you need a different type of visa".

Once again, if over 50 years of age, and spending several months of the year in Thailand, they should get the approproate visa.

I was talking about those who are under 50 years of age, doing the same, or living here permanently, for which Thai Embassy staff can offer no appropriate visa to, because they do not exist.

[NamKangMan]

Another thing.......Comparision: If my knowledge base is still up to date, both in Brazil and in India, you can stay max 9 months on a tourist visa. After that, you cannot hop over to Uruguay/Nepal to get a new tourist visa, you really have to stay out for a long time. For the sake of people like NKM, I hope Thai authorities will remain lenient. Or maybe introduce a new visa category.

The only problem with Thailand's current visa laws is the magical age of 50 they put on their retirement visa criteria.

If they did away with that age restriction, and allowed under 50's to meet the rest of the criteria involved, there would be no proplems.

I think two back to back 60 day visas, with the two extentions, giving 6 months in Thailand, is long enough for a backpacker, and is long enough for someone who works 6 months of the year in their home country and does nothing in Thailand for the other 6 months of the year.

After the two back to back 60 day visas, you have to get the appropriate visa, which means showing financial capacity, details of residence etc etc, but you would be able to, because the age of 50 no long applies.

I think it will go back to business as usual here, but time will tell.

Edited May 15, 2014 by NamKangMan

[bubblegum]

I'm expecting a lot of mini van sales.

[NamKangMan]

Okay, I'm 33, single, no kids or family in Thailand and don't work there either. I work overseas in oil and gas for usually 6 months of the year but not usually on a fixed rotation like month on month off. I'm a contractor, freelance so I come and go when the jobs come up which can be anytime. I've always stayed on 30 day visa exempt stamps so occasionally had to do 3 or 4 runs in a row when the works been quiet. Sometimes I might do one get the 30 days but then have to leave a few days later, What type of visa should i look to get now? The way things stand now it's looking like I'm screwed! I feel a bit hard done to to be fair as I was hassled at hkt immigration and threatened with refusal of entry by some woman who was clearly having a bad day a couple of months ago. I emailed issues and answer in the gazette who contacted head of immi who said there's no probs doing multiple runs for 30 day stamps as long as your not working in Thailand. The way I see it I'm lucky enough to only work half of the year, I'm a British citizen who rents a holiday home in Phuket year round and spend all of my free time there. Is anyone else in the same boat as me? All suggestions welcomed. Cheers folks

I would say you are going to have to make your way to a Thai Embassy and get a 60 day visa before entering again, and pay the 1900 baht to extend it for 1 month.

Whether they allow you to do that again, back to back, is the big question at the moment.

If they are serious about enforcement, the next step will be denying back to back 60 days tourist visas.

The young Russian girl denied entry because of several back to back visa exemption stamps, I'm sure 1000 baht at a Thai Embassy for a 60 visa is not problem for her, so, they will then start to look at stopping them.

There are many guys like you, living here in between offshore/onshore contracts.

I am in the same boat as you, but older and have stopped working.

Edited May 15, 2014 by NamKangMan

[ignis]

i pulled this off of ; <removed> forum and is also on the hua hin forum

so i am not 100% sure its correct BUT

Whalen should know,

so lets see if they respond

It has com from Whalen, see http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/691465-stricter-requirements-new-application-forms-for-ed-visa-extensions/

[ignis]

Allow me to clarify.

When I say, "mature aged people" - I am talking about 30 year olds to 50 year olds. Anyone over 50 can get a retirement visa and come and go as they please.

I am not talking about someone who is 78 years of age who holidays in Thailand for 4 months of the year, because they qualify for a retirement visa.

The people in their late teens to early 20's will backpack around South East Asia either before starting university, or working, or just after completing university. These people will "holiday" around South east Asia for 4 to 6 months.

In general, someone between 30 and 50, gets 4 weeks holidays a year, and will not come to Thailand on a 60 day visa, extend that visa by 1 month and then go to a neighbouring Thai Embassy to do it all again.

Given that some people between 30 and 50 can afford to reside here, and these people do not work illegally, and are not committing any crime here, what do we call these people?

Currently, there is no proper visa class for them, and they have done nothing wrong.

Thank for Clarifying,

I would call myself a "mature aged person" someone in there 30's to me is a young person, not at all sure I would have best pleased in my 30's to be called a "mature aged person"

[NamKangMan]

I read this the other day.

He paid up front. I suspect the 6000 quid would be for all inclusive package. Eg. accommodation, meals, personal trainer, gym fees etc etc.

I guess he was on a Muay Thai ED visa for 1 year.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/726048-obese-brit-lost-so-much-weight-thai-immigration-refused-to-believe-he-was-same-person/

Maybe this might be the answer for some members here, including myself. Getting an ED visa just to go to the gym and do a workout a couple of times a week, which I do anyway.

Edited May 15, 2014 by NamKangMan

[Old Croc]

A special category, long term visa for people under 50 of independent means (rich) could be an answer.

However, I think there are a lot less of these people in Thailand than boast about it on Thai Visa.

Edited May 15, 2014 by Old Croc

[NamKangMan]

A special category, long term visa for people under 50 of independent means (rich) could be an answer.

However, I think there are a lot less of these people in Thailand than boast about it on Thai Visa.

If the criteria for hundreds of thousands of over 50's living in Thailand is ok for a retirement visa - why wouldn't that same criteria be ok for those under who are under 50?

Unless, you are suggesting the financial criteria be raised for over 50's for the retirement visa.

[stevenl]

Allow me to clarify.

When I say, "mature aged people" - I am talking about 30 year olds to 50 year olds. Anyone over 50 can get a retirement visa and come and go as they please.

I am not talking about someone who is 78 years of age who holidays in Thailand for 4 months of the year, because they qualify for a retirement visa.

The people in their late teens to early 20's will backpack around South East Asia either before starting university, or working, or just after completing university. These people will "holiday" around South east Asia for 4 to 6 months.

In general, someone between 30 and 50, gets 4 weeks holidays a year, and will not come to Thailand on a 60 day visa, extend that visa by 1 month and then go to a neighbouring Thai Embassy to do it all again.

Given that some people between 30 and 50 can afford to reside here, and these people do not work illegally, and are not committing any crime here, what do we call these people?

Currently, there is no proper visa class for them, and they have done nothing wrong.

Thank for Clarifying,

I would call myself a "mature aged person" someone in there 30's to me is a young person, not at all sure I would have best pleased in my 30's to be called a "mature aged person"

I still would not like to be called that (small chance it will happen as well )

[NamKangMan]

Allow me to clarify.

When I say, "mature aged people" - I am talking about 30 year olds to 50 year olds. Anyone over 50 can get a retirement visa and come and go as they please.

I am not talking about someone who is 78 years of age who holidays in Thailand for 4 months of the year, because they qualify for a retirement visa.

The people in their late teens to early 20's will backpack around South East Asia either before starting university, or working, or just after completing university. These people will "holiday" around South east Asia for 4 to 6 months.

In general, someone between 30 and 50, gets 4 weeks holidays a year, and will not come to Thailand on a 60 day visa, extend that visa by 1 month and then go to a neighbouring Thai Embassy to do it all again.

Given that some people between 30 and 50 can afford to reside here, and these people do not work illegally, and are not committing any crime here, what do we call these people?

Currently, there is no proper visa class for them, and they have done nothing wrong.

Thank for Clarifying,

I would call myself a "mature aged person" someone in there 30's to me is a young person, not at all sure I would have best pleased in my 30's to be called a "mature aged person"

This thread is really for those under 50 years of age, because those over 50 can get a retirement visa.

Would you call someone who is 49 years of age, a "young person" or a "mature person" or a "middle aged person?"

At 49, they can not get a retirment visa, because they MUST be working here illegally - but at 50, they can get a retirement visa. Amazing Thailand.

Anyway, I am sure you know what I mean.

[KarenBravo]

"Mature, aged" sounds more like a cheese.

[nedkellylives]

I hope genuine tourists will not be inconvenienced. It is a very normal situation young backpackers come in on a 30 days airport visa free entry stamp, and decide to extend their holiday later on. They should not be hassled about confirmed hotel bookings, travel plans and so on. Flipping briefly through their passports should make clear immediately they are Germany, France or wherever based, and certainly not residing in Thailand permanently. I am eagerly awaiting field reports from Ranong.

"I hope genuine tourists will not be inconvenienced" - and this is the question, what is a "genuine tourist?"

For me, a genuine tourists is a 2 week holiday maker, or a 6 month South East Asia backpacker.

Everyone else is not a tourists, including myself.

It's quite rare a mature aged western person will "holiday" for 60 days. Most western countries only give 4 weeks of holiday from employment. Sure, it can be accrued and there is long service leave etc, but in general, mature aged people, with responsibilities back home, will not holiday here for 60 days, extend that by another 30 days, and then go and try to do it again.

So, if these people are not working illegally, and are not committing crime, what do we call these people, and why is there no visa class for them?

It's quite rare a mature aged western person will "holiday" for 60 days. Most western countries only give 4 weeks of holiday from employment.

Odd most of the Mature aged people I know come here for the winter for 4 months or so..

on the other hand in the next Village one old boy [78] hated the boarder hops and the pain of getting to BKK to get a bus.. he opted for a retirement Extension here, about 5 years ago, he spends around 4 months here only every winter.

Most friends and relatives that visit me or use my house as a base come for 6 - 8 weeks.. Mature aged people don't what such a long trip for 3 weeks, there children or grand children can look after there home while there away.

Allow me to clarify.

When I say, "mature aged people" - I am talking about 30 year olds to 50 year olds. Anyone over 50 can get a retirement visa and come and go as they please.

I am not talking about someone who is 78 years of age who holidays in Thailand for 4 months of the year, because they qualify for a retirement visa.

The people in their late teens to early 20's will backpack around South East Asia either before starting university, or working, or just after completing university. These people will "holiday" around South east Asia for 4 to 6 months.

In general, someone between 30 and 50, gets 4 weeks holidays a year, and will not come to Thailand on a 60 day visa, extend that visa by 1 month and then go to a neighbouring Thai Embassy to do it all again.

Given that some people between 30 and 50 can afford to reside here, and these people do not work illegally, and are not committing any crime here, what do we call these people?

Currently, there is no proper visa class for them, and they have done nothing wrong.

Check the PG newspaper, law firm advertises 1 year visa's for 25K baht no problems

[NamKangMan]

@ nedkellylives

"Check the PG newspaper, law firm advertises 1 year visa's for 25K baht no problems" - what type of visa?

[ttthailand]

A special category, long term visa for people under 50 of independent means (rich) could be an answer.

However, I think there are a lot less of these people in Thailand than boast about it on Thai Visa.

Yes, from the people I have met who are under 50 most do not really have the means to live here and are working in some faction to stay here, no WP. This group is not all bad but many are lowlifes and are breaking the law. Most could not put together the required funds to stay even if the same option was offered to them as the over 50 group.

I would guess that 95% of the farangs under 50 working in the bars don't have work permits.

[ttthailand]

Look at the age of the people goi g on visa runs. Many are over 50, why ? No funds to get a retirement visa so are also working without WP.

[nedkellylives]

@ nedkellylives

"Check the PG newspaper, law firm advertises 1 year visa's for 25K baht no problems" - what type of visa?

Why dont you buy the newspaper, phone the law firm and find out

Its you who needs a visa not me

[Old Croc]

A special category, long term visa for people under 50 of independent means (rich) could be an answer.

However, I think there are a lot less of these people in Thailand than boast about it on Thai Visa.

Yes, from the people I have met who are under 50 most do not really have the means to live here and are working in some faction to stay here, no WP. This group is not all bad but many are lowlifes and are breaking the law. Most could not put together the required funds to stay even if the same option was offered to them as the over 50 group.

I would guess that 95% of the farangs under 50 working in the bars don't have work permits.

You clarified what I was saying.

Very likely, most of the long termers below retirement age would be unable to meet the 800,000 in the bank clause and are probably working illegally. I know I didn't have that sort of money in my 20s or 30s. Again, most are probably very nice people and are not really harming the local economy, but the rat bags and the criminals have made it impossible for them to continue.

I know I won't be sorry if I never see another timeshare tout.

[LivinginKata]

Inflammatory post removed

[NamKangMan]

Why turn them, and their money, away? Why make illegal immigrants out of them?

There are many self funded under 50's living here.

What about the contract workers? The guys that work for 6 months in their home country and live here for the other 6 months? The various FIFO oil/gas and miners who have made their base here? What about the many merchant ship workers.

I have just named a few of the demographic that would easily qualify for an appropriate visa, should one exist.

The same visa laws just can't keep serving Thailand forever. The country needs to move with the times.

Don't you think it ridiculous that a guy like David Beckham couldn't even live here, if he was not playing/coaching football, simply because he is under 50 years of age?

In what decade do you think Thailand should review their visa laws?

Edited May 15, 2014 by LivinginKata
quotes removed

[NamKangMan]

@ nedkellylives

"Check the PG newspaper, law firm advertises 1 year visa's for 25K baht no problems" - what type of visa?

Why dont you buy the newspaper, phone the law firm and find out

Its you who needs a visa not me

I'll look into it. I was just after a little more information from you, considering you have seen the ad, and we are good friends and all.

[N47HAN]

No ones mentioned yet the resurection of the elite card ?

2 million baht to join gives you a 5 year visa .

Anyone thought about buying one ?

Sent from my GT-N7100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[NamKangMan]

A special category, long term visa for people under 50 of independent means (rich) could be an answer.

However, I think there are a lot less of these people in Thailand than boast about it on Thai Visa.

Yes, from the people I have met who are under 50 most do not really have the means to live here and are working in some faction to stay here, no WP. This group is not all bad but many are lowlifes and are breaking the law. Most could not put together the required funds to stay even if the same option was offered to them as the over 50 group.

I would guess that 95% of the farangs under 50 working in the bars don't have work permits.

You clarified what I was saying.

Very likely, most of the long termers below retirement age would be unable to meet the 800,000 in the bank clause and are probably working illegally. I know I didn't have that sort of money in my 20s or 30s. Again, most are probably very nice people and are not really harming the local economy, but the rat bags and the criminals have made it impossible for them to continue.

I know I won't be sorry if I never see another timeshare tout.

I don't know how old you are OC, but what was the average monthly salary when you were in your 20's and 30's, compared to now? What about property prices back then, compared to now?

I'm gathering when you were in your 20's and 30's there were no computers, internet, mobile phones etc etc.

Remember the dot com bubble? Thousands of young people made millions of dollars during that bubble. The smart ones got out, before it burst. They could retire, if they so wanted to, before the age of 30. I didn't make my money from this, I am using it as an example.

Mark Zuckerberg - the founder of Facebook, is a billionaire. He could retire tomorrow, but Thailand would turn him away, because he MUST be working here illegally here, right?

There are many high net worth individuals under the age of 50. The current "app" developers are making a killing - a lot of them are millionaires already, and only in their 20's.

Check this kid out. Sold his app to Yahoo for $30 million - aged 17.

http://www.technobuffalo.com/2013/03/27/nick-daloisio-teen-yahoo-staffer-app-developer-and-millionaire/

[nedkellylives]

@ nedkellylives

"Check the PG newspaper, law firm advertises 1 year visa's for 25K baht no problems" - what type of visa?

Why dont you buy the newspaper, phone the law firm and find out

Its you who needs a visa not me

I'll look into it. I was just after a little more information from you, considering you have seen the ad, and we are good friends and all.

Since i only pay 1900 baht for my visa, at the cost of 25000 baht it is a bought visa and has been advertised

for years,i though every long term stayer new about it, especially people who do not qualify for other types of visa's

Cheap for wealthy people under 50, no more visa runs

You only have to be able to read,write, speak and count in thai and be able to sing the royal and national anthems

Should be no problem for you

[NamKangMan]

@ nedkellylives

"Check the PG newspaper, law firm advertises 1 year visa's for 25K baht no problems" - what type of visa?

Why dont you buy the newspaper, phone the law firm and find out

Its you who needs a visa not me

I'll look into it. I was just after a little more information from you, considering you have seen the ad, and we are good friends and all.

Since i only pay 1900 baht for my visa, at the cost of 25000 baht it is a bought visa and has been advertised

for years,i though every long term stayer new about it, especially people who do not qualify for other types of visa's

Cheap for wealthy people under 50, no more visa runs

You only have to be able to read,write, speak and count in thai and be able to sing the royal and national anthems

Should be no problem for you

This link is from the PG website.

http://www.a1legal.co.th/immigration/one-year-visa/

Notice the asterisk. "depending on on the purpose of visit."

You still have to leave the country every 90 days, which I do anywy, but if they seriously enforce the back to back tourist visas, it could be an option.

I'll look into it - thanks.

Edited May 15, 2014 by NamKangMan

[EBlair48]

So will thay pile on the border runs for B visa holders to make up for the tourists? Business owners have to leave every 30 days? Egads!!

However, I'm betting this will blow over, just like the last 3 or 4 times I've witnessed " Visa crackdowns" Seems to be a 3 year cycle of Thai authorities threatening to enforce sensible laws.

The border run is just to lucrative, for too many. This is just Thai-Thalk for the embarrassing stolen passport revelations.

Regardless, I do get sick of the 15 time runner bragging on his border runs while I try to do things by the rules, and am essentially punished for it by having to make 90 day runs while having a work permit and a one year B visa .

[EBlair48]

Why turn them, and their money, away? Why make illegal immigrants out of them?

There are many self funded under 50's living here.

What about the contract workers? The guys that work for 6 months in their home country and live here for the other 6 months? The various FIFO oil/gas and miners who have made their base here? What about the many merchant ship workers.

I have just named a few of the demographic that would easily qualify for an appropriate visa, should one exist.

The same visa laws just can't keep serving Thailand forever. The country needs to move with the times.

Don't you think it ridiculous that a guy like David Beckham couldn't even live here, if he was not playing/coaching football, simply because he is under 50 years of age?

In what decade do you think Thailand should review their visa laws?

Beckham could reside here on an investment visa, 10 million baht in a FD at Govt Bank- and would pay tax on the interest., Or he could put his kids in school and have a guardian visa . Fact is, Thailand wants foreigners to work, to pay taxes and hire Thais for their businesses. Fairly sound policy for a developing country.

When they don't enforce the rules, and allow , even encourage this border running, year in and year out , and don't have any modern facilities to check for criminals (and " check box if o you have been convicted of a crime" is not a valid method,) then they look to be monkey-mouse.

[stevenl]

So will thay pile on the border runs for B visa holders to make up for the tourists? Business owners have to leave every 30 days? Egads!!

However, I'm betting this will blow over, just like the last 3 or 4 times I've witnessed " Visa crackdowns" Seems to be a 3 year cycle of Thai authorities threatening to enforce sensible laws.

The border run is just to lucrative, for too many. This is just Thai-Thalk for the embarrassing stolen passport revelations.

Regardless, I do get sick of the 15 time runner bragging on his border runs while I try to do things by the rules, and am essentially punished for it by having to make 90 day runs while having a work permit and a one year B visa .

Get an extension and you don't have to do the runs anymore.

I don't think this will blow over, besides the embarrassment this has much more to do with illegal workers. The Koreans and Russians are really unpopular at the moment, and this will dent their workforce.

[stevenl]

Why turn them, and their money, away? Why make illegal immigrants out of them?

There are many self funded under 50's living here.

What about the contract workers? The guys that work for 6 months in their home country and live here for the other 6 months? The various FIFO oil/gas and miners who have made their base here? What about the many merchant ship workers.

I have just named a few of the demographic that would easily qualify for an appropriate visa, should one exist.

The same visa laws just can't keep serving Thailand forever. The country needs to move with the times.

Don't you think it ridiculous that a guy like David Beckham couldn't even live here, if he was not playing/coaching football, simply because he is under 50 years of age?

In what decade do you think Thailand should review their visa laws?

You're turning things around.

The Thai authorities are not making illegal immigrants out of them, they are doing that to themselves by living here without meeting the requirements.