Mormons proselytizing in Thailand

[Jingthing]

It's simple. People who don't drink coffee just can't be trusted.

Edited May 21, 2014 by Jingthing

[scoutman360]

Gosh, I am just quite surprised at the distain and hate from the TV members over someone's religion. I am not a Mormon, but I have no problems with their church, anymore than Buddhist, or any other religion. I would much rather have more of them in the world that are teaching children good behavior and priciples. I hope we remember that the missionaries are just young kids (barely 19), and don't know any better. Sure, they make mistakes and don't always use the best approach, but like the rest of us did at that age, they will learn. I just say "no thanks".

[Sheryl]

Yes, seems some of these posters have a chip on their shoulders of rather enormous proportions. I can't help but wonder if this is what attracts/holds the missionaries interest....they can sense there is not indifference there. Because when one really is indifferent, it is very easy to politely and convincingly say so and in my experience they quickly move on.

As some posters have pointed out, these young men are required to do this, it is mandatory (unlike some religions where missionaries are a self-selected group). Their only option would be to leave their church, and likely break with their families, which is a lot to ask of someone so young. So cut them some slack.

[arthurwait]

Good work OP.

After years of living in East Grinstead I have my F - offs and door slamming in face to perfection.

[arthurwait]

It's simple. People who don't drink coffee just can't be trusted.

funny_coffee_mug_definitely_not_a_mormon-raf3afadf0a97403d92e0f71b8e9a3569_x7jsg_8byvr_324.jpgfunny-coffee-meme.jpg

[landslide]

The best solution I always found was tell them your Roman Catholic, even if your not and for some reason they run a mile...don't know why that is..

That has been my stock response (I am Roman Catholic) with the Mormon Missionaries, Jehovah's Witness and other proselytizers. Exactly the same reaction.

[Jingthing]

When I tell them I'm a gay Jewish atheist with a fetish for young men in dark suits the fun begins!

[Old Stud]

A teaching based on LOVE does not need to fight wars to defend it, or send brain-washed drones out into the world to spread it.

[Expattaff1308]

Just say Sorry Im a Christian, works equally well with the Jehovahs Witness

[Beetlejuice]

This is the only ways to deal with it:

[Colonel_Mustard]

A teaching based on LOVE does not need to fight wars to defend it, or send brain-washed drones out into the world to spread it.

Personally I think any teaching (not matter what it is) that is truly based on love for others should be spread as widely as possible.

Edited May 21, 2014 by Colonel_Mustard

[kennypowers]

Alas! Someone else who has encountered these cretins of late. Every day outside my station they are there, approaching Thais, trying to spread their evil in a Buddhist country.

Two lads were really peeing off Thais on the train, chatting up women in Thai and then whipping out the God calling card and asking if they believe.

I think on some level this is illegal, and eventually, with enough complaints, will be shutdown. Why? Because essentially they are against the current status quo of nation-religion-king. They are trying to convert Thais to denounce their religion (way of life) - which, as we know, is closely linked to the monarchy and highly respected monks - and adopt a new leader in Christ. This behaviour insults Thailand and its people.

I find it highly offensive.

[Chonburiram]

Faith is the belief in something without evidence or proof. Hopefully there will be a day when ppl are rational enough to treat religious faith in the same way they treat holocaust deniers.

Care to elaborate?

[peterb17]

My dad as a hobby spent a great deal of time researching the family tree.

The Mormons have a huge genealogical database that you can access, not the best of resources, but interesting.

Anyway he discovered that my great grandfather and also great great grandfather had been baptised into the Mormon church. This is done after death.

Considering that GG grandfather was a Church of England vicar, he was a bit surprised. ( my dad- not the Rev John)

How would you feel that after you die will be baptised into another faith. Personally in a way I could not care less- there is no supreme being-but it is a bit weird feeling that many of us will continue to exist on some bonkers vast data base.

I think they do some good charitable work- but on the whole total nutters

[tw25rw]

Gosh, I am just quite surprised at the distain and hate from the TV members over someone's religion. I am not a Mormon, but I have no problems with their church, anymore than Buddhist, or any other religion. I would much rather have more of them in the world that are teaching children good behavior and priciples. I hope we remember that the missionaries are just young kids (barely 19), and don't know any better. Sure, they make mistakes and don't always use the best approach, but like the rest of us did at that age, they will learn. I just say "no thanks".

No hate. Slight disdain in that I don't want to talk to them. I actually have some admiration for them learning foreign languages from scratch then having to go door to door in some potentially hazardous 3rd world country. I used to see them in Melbourne and wonder if they realised how cushy they had it. On the other hand, their belief system has no basis in fact and they are doing it all for a false promise.

[tw25rw]

When I tell them I'm a gay Jewish atheist with a fetish for young men in dark suits the fun begins!

Joyce McKinney had nothing on you.

[Old Stud]

Faith is the belief in something without evidence or proof. Hopefully there will be a day when ppl are rational enough to treat religious faith in the same way they treat holocaust deniers.

Care to elaborate?

I read this 1000 page book years ago - a highly respected British religious scholar spent his life searching for proof that Jesus actually lived. Couldn't find any. I think it was called 'John, the Brother of Jesus."

And still there are 2.2 billion people who believe this story is true. You think those two Mormon boys can prove it?

I agree with Kenny Powers.

[philw]

They only bring misery and sadness.

The emotionally and spiritually weak preying on the emotionally and spiritually weaker.

Go back to America, you do no good things here.

[Chonburiram]

Old Stud = justjoined?

[tw25rw]

Faith is the belief in something without evidence or proof. Hopefully there will be a day when ppl are rational enough to treat religious faith in the same way they treat holocaust deniers.

Care to elaborate?

I read this 1000 page book years ago - a highly respected British religious scholar spent his life searching for proof that Jesus actually lived. Couldn't find any. I think it was called 'John, the Brother of Jesus."

And still there are 2.2 billion people who believe this story is true. You think those two Mormon boys can prove it?

I agree with Kenny Powers.

I'm happy to believe he existed, just not the mythology around him.

There's an interesting theory that a man know to have existed could have been Jesus.. He was a holy man in Kashmir (which was on the trading route to the Middle East) who appeared having been tortured at some point. The local symbol used for him is of 2 feet with holes in them. He is known as Yuz Asaf. The Ahmadhi Muslims look up to him. His tomb is in Srinagar.

[arjunadawn]

It's simply maturity. I personally have no use for them or the proselytizing by any faith, but the free exchange of ideas by people who firmly believe- in anything- makes for a far more productive and useful world then if we all wore grey suits, worshiped Gaia, and ate lentils. There's many places where people cannot do this, and while you might at first glance say "great," it's these same places where people are put to death for not believing what they are ordered to believe; other places ones not permitted to believe anything at all. So, have a degree of context for the couple of Mormon boys whose faith suggest they go out in "pairs" to spread their word. Nearly all men will do a term of this service while young.

My ex wife, aka "The Darkness," was a MoreMen... Ah, sorry, Mormon. She was incidentally one and then increasingly developed a rediscovered commitment. After repeaedtedly inviting me to learn I finally picked up a series of books, one being No Man Knows My Story, a biography of Joseph Smith. It was to be the single undoing of my marriage. The more I learned, I asked questions. The more I asked, the more I was able to focus. The more I focused questions on the bishop, my Wife, these pairs of men who came around on Sunday, the more I realized this was a farce (to me), and intellectually unsustainable to even topical questions. In order for me to believe in such nonsense I would have to go back way younger than infancy. Also, theologically, it was about as mysoginist and offensive as any other faith that enforces a two tier system of salvation for men and women, while affirming what is created on earth is binding in heaven. In other words, they f___k women over forever! I left The Darkness, and have been in the light since.

However, having been in the other camel's armpits of the world, I would prefer to see these boys peddling their fantasy rather than deserted intellectual streets.

Edited May 21, 2014 by arjunadawn

[AYJAYDEE]

It's simply maturity. I personally have no use for them or the proselytizing by any faith, but the free exchange of ideas by people who firmly believe- in anything- makes for a far more productive and useful world then if we all wore grey suits, worshiped Gaia, and ate lentils. There's many places where people cannot do this, and while you might at first glance say "great," it's these same places where people are put to death for not believing what they are ordered to believe; other places ones not permitted to believe anything at all. So, have a degree of context for the couple of Mormon boys whose faith suggest they go out in "pairs" to spread their word. Nearly all men will do a term of this service while young.

My ex wife, aka "The Darkness," was a MoreMen... Ah, sorry, Mormon. She was incidentally one and then increasingly developed a rediscovered commitment. After repeaedtedly inviting me to learn I finally picked up a series of books, one being No Man Knows My Story, a biography of Joseph Smith. It was to be the single undoing of my marriage. The more I learned, I asked questions. The more I asked, the more I was able to focus. The more I focused questions on the bishop, my Wife, these pairs of men who came around on Sunday, the more I realized this was a farce (to me), and intellectually unsustainable to even topical questions. In order for me to believe in such nonsense I would have to go back way younger than infancy. Also, theologically, it was about as mysoginist and offensive as any other faith that enforces a two tier system of salvation for men and women, while affirming what is created on earth is binding in heaven. In other words, they f___k women over forever! I left The Darkness, and have been in the light since.

However, having been in the other camel's armpits of the world, I would prefer to see these boys peddling their fantasy rather than deserted intellectual streets.

From what I can see, they arent interested in the free exchange of ideas. They are selling theirs and only theirs.

[GentlemanJim]

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Yes, seems some of these posters have a chip on their shoulders of rather enormous proportions. I can't help but wonder if this is what attracts/holds the missionaries interest....they can sense there is not indifference there. Because when one really is indifferent, it is very easy to politely and convincingly say so and in my experience they quickly move on.

As some posters have pointed out, these young men are required to do this, it is mandatory (unlike some religions where missionaries are a self-selected group). Their only option would be to leave their church, and likely break with their families, which is a lot to ask of someone so young. So cut them some slack.

Just have a close look at your last paragraph. You are 100% helping to perpetuate the misery of the lives of these 'slaves' to an unloving Church. Would you want your children baptized into a church that would demand you sever all links with them if they decided to follow a different 'path'? Just what kind of Church, supposedly based on a loving God, would cast out their children from the care of their parents because they refused to obey Church doctrine and gospel.

Perhaps the best thing you could do for these young guys is allow them to break free from what is little short of enslavement. With the exception that it does not carry the death penalty, it is no worse than apostasy in Islam. If you dare to change faith from Allah then you will be cast away from your family for ever and if they (the religious authorities) catch you, you will be executed. The Mormons just do away with the execution bit.

You have got me thinking now. Maybe the next time they come and say "are you coming to our church this Sunday" we should say, I tell you what, I will come to your church on Sunday, if you come out for a curry and a pint with me on Friday. Maybe if they saw that you dont need slaves in a Church to provide friendship and love they would see the light themselves.

[GentlemanJim]

Faith is the belief in something without evidence or proof. Hopefully there will be a day when ppl are rational enough to treat religious faith in the same way they treat holocaust deniers.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but that method has already been tried. It was the period of the Spanish Inquisition.

We jail holocaust deniers, are you advocating we jail people who refuse to believe in a deity?

[sustento]

I think on some level this is illegal, and eventually, with enough complaints, will be shutdown.

The Thai Constitution section 9 reads:

"Section 9 The King is a Buddhist and Upholder of religions."

Notice the 's' on the end of 'religions'. All religions are afforded constitutional protection in Thailand and HM the King is protector of them all.

[Jingthing]

When I tell them I'm a gay Jewish atheist with a fetish for young men in dark suits the fun begins!

Joyce McKinney had nothing on you.

Ya Mon!

[speedtripler]

if they invite me to church on sunday i always ask how much will i get paid for it ?

if they say you will get the everlasting rewards etc i just say sorry ,i only accept cash payments

another line ive said to them is i am God/Devil ,you guys should worship me and give them a crazy look

[arjunadawn]

It's simply maturity. I personally have no use for them or the proselytizing by any faith, but the free exchange of ideas by people who firmly believe- in anything- makes for a far more productive and useful world then if we all wore grey suits, worshiped Gaia, and ate lentils. There's many places where people cannot do this, and while you might at first glance say "great," it's these same places where people are put to death for not believing what they are ordered to believe; other places ones not permitted to believe anything at all. So, have a degree of context for the couple of Mormon boys whose faith suggest they go out in "pairs" to spread their word. Nearly all men will do a term of this service while young.

My ex wife, aka "The Darkness," was a MoreMen... Ah, sorry, Mormon. She was incidentally one and then increasingly developed a rediscovered commitment. After repeaedtedly inviting me to learn I finally picked up a series of books, one being No Man Knows My Story, a biography of Joseph Smith. It was to be the single undoing of my marriage. The more I learned, I asked questions. The more I asked, the more I was able to focus. The more I focused questions on the bishop, my Wife, these pairs of men who came around on Sunday, the more I realized this was a farce (to me), and intellectually unsustainable to even topical questions. In order for me to believe in such nonsense I would have to go back way younger than infancy. Also, theologically, it was about as mysoginist and offensive as any other faith that enforces a two tier system of salvation for men and women, while affirming what is created on earth is binding in heaven. In other words, they f___k women over forever! I left The Darkness, and have been in the light since.

However, having been in the other camel's armpits of the world, I would prefer to see these boys peddling their fantasy rather than deserted intellectual streets.

From what I can see, they arent interested in the free exchange of ideas. They are selling theirs and only theirs.

Yea... Your right of course, even where they to entertain your points, it would only be insofar as they could reorient. I guess I use the phrase "free exchange of ideas" because I heard it in school and think it means a place where people can freely believe or discuss as they wish, or not. I generally don't respond with rude comments but once when a kid I was asked on the a Train in Brooklyn by a man handing me a salvation pamphlet, "Do you know where you'd go if you were to die right now on this train?"

Without pause I said "207th Street, last stop!" and stole his thunder. I know we all got these stories. I guess I just have the other places on this earth in the back of my head where women are not only covered from head to toe but also have steel and brass traps on their mouth with locking key held by another.

Or, like the woman in Sudan currently sentenced to death. Been Christian her whole life. Married a Christian, has one boy, and pregnant currently. But her dad was Muslim therefore, she could not be a Christian the court reasoned because you cannot leave their faith. Ipso facto she is not properly married to the Christian man and the presence of children evidences sex out of wedlock= adultery, and subsequent sentence of death. These places are the rule rather than the exception throughout the world. So my mind tolerates the Mormons, relatively (and we know what I really think of them).

[Torrens54]

Right up front, I am not interested in the Mormon Religion but I've interviewed a number of them on Television in the past, and found them to be very polite and not anything like what was described above.

I also tend to question the veracity of the alleged conversation, based on what I have heard them say many times in the past. They seem to work from a "tried and trusted SCRIPT."

Opening up with: "Do you want to come to our church on Sunday?"

I can't imagine that as an opener to a conversation, surely there was some prelude?

"Church of latter day saints."

I've always heard them say. "Church of Jesus Christ, of latter day saints."

Just those two lines, make me wonder if you are telling us exactly what was said?

While living abroad, Mormons and various others knocked on our door and when my wife said politely, that she is a Buddhist and not interested in "converting," they were in turn very polite, wished her well and departed.

When we arrived back in Thailand, a couple of people from a Christian Centre in our village left some advertising in our letter box. I phoned them and requested that they remove our house from their "mailing list." We've never been bothered by them again but I have to admit, they all look very decent and we are pleased to have them as neighbours.

Reckon there is more than enough hate and bigotry in the world, so just let them be.

Edited May 21, 2014 by Torrens54

[kwestroc]

Yes, they are allowed to do this.

Your handling of it on the second day was provocative. By asking questions -- any questions - and trying to bait you create the impression of interest.

Exactly the same dynamic as with a salesperson.

"Just say no",firmly, leave it at that, and move on.

Whether promoting a religion or selling a product, such people have no desire to waste their time on someone who is not receptive. Just make it clear you aren't and don't engage or prolong the encounter.

Sorry but you are wrong, very wrong. It is not allowed in Thailand, and I do so wish the police would arrest some of them.

Saw the security at BTS Asoke chase them away once.