Problems having a pee

[papa al]

Some people have total faith in MDs despite MD directed therapies being the first or third leading cause of death in USA depending on which peer reviewed study you read.

My sister-in-law believes in MDs.

She takes 65 different prescription drugs. 65!

Buddha save us.

[Sheryl]

"MDs" are not a cult or religion. They are individual people who have completed a course of study and passed a licensing examination. As with all groups of professionals they vary widely in their skill.

It is more than extremely unlikely that a single doctor prescribed 65 different current medications to your sister in law. More likely she has made multiple trips to multiple doctors and failed to inform the new ones of what she was taking. Equally likely, many of these "65 different" drugs are just different brands of the same thing. She should bring the entire bag of it to a good GP and get it sorted out.

BTW the studies you refer to do not identify medical error as a primary cause of death but rather as a contributing factor, hence any attempt to the take that number and "rank" it as a "cause of death" is invalid (although mass media reports have done so). Which is not to say that medical errors do not happen or are not important, they do and they are, but it is not at all correct to say that it has been shown to be the 1st, 3rd or anything else cause of death. There is a huge difference between a contributing factor and an immediate cause of death.

[cheeryble]

But Sheryl, why do you have to spoil things by explaining it rationally?

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[giddyup]

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I had Turp surgery 6 months ago with absolutely no side effects not even bleeding.There are a few factors for this as my doctor explained.

1. There is now new equipment available for this surgery which the hospital just received

2. My doctor explained the reasons for retrograde ejaculation and other problems comes from the surgeon cutting too much of the prostrate or too deep winch happens 70% of the time. He said it all deepens on the skill of the surgeon..

3. He also explained there are different calibers of the cutting tool and it my case he used the smaller caliber which takes more skill and is more time consuming but leaves the patient with no pain or bleeding..

If anyone would like more information or advice please feel free to pm me.

Don't you love it when you are asked to make contact via a PM for more info, but then you never get a @#%& reply!

Edited June 11, 2014 by giddyup

[cheeryble]

At least we know he's not in the loo.

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[beau thai]

Can someone explain to me how my 'perceived' benefit of only getting up once in the night instead of 3 times if I stop taking saw palmetto can possibly be a 'placebo' effect as stated above?

I didnt realise I was clever enough to enjoy a placebo effect when fast asleep. You live and learn.

[atyclb]

You do understand that prostate surgery will most likely leave you impotent.

Sorry, but this statement is exaggerated. Yes, it CAN leave you impotent, when the surgeons have to remove the prostate and when they also have to remove (or damage during the surgery) the nerve bundles responsible for the erection. But the necessary treatment / surgery depends on the kind of problem you have with your prostate.

I also had a prostate surgery because of pee problems, diagnosis was a begnin tumor which could be scraped out through the urethra. The only thing that happend is that I now have a "dry" orgasm - no more fluid, no more sperms which of course makes me unable to have more kids (which is not an issue for me) but gives the advantage of having no more "mess" in the bed

of course, if one has a malignant tumor which might also require radiotherapy or agressive medical treatment, then the risk of getting impotent is much higher.

If after surgery one became very impotent, would that the person a VIP?

[CBR250]

Can someone explain to me how my 'perceived' benefit of only getting up once in the night instead of 3 times if I stop taking saw palmetto can possibly be a 'placebo' effect as stated above?

I didnt realise I was clever enough to enjoy a placebo effect when fast asleep. You live and learn.

Yes, the placebo effect works while you are sleeping. No one can really explain how this effect works, despite numerous experiements and elegant (and unproven) theories as to how and why it works. The actual neurological mechanisms underlying the effect are simply not able to be understood at present.

But the effect is demonstrably powerful, and can be observed in a wide range of medical conditions - even some where it seems next to impossible. These conditions include Parkinson's disease, angina, herpes, asthma. It has been shown to be a useful pain killer too. And patients taking pharmacologically inert substances (placebos) often report side effects, such as dry mouth, sweating, and nausea.

The placebo phenomenon is so powerful that it is the basis of pharamacological tests for new drugs. ALL new drugs are likely to seem to be effective because of this effect, even if they are not. So the efficacy of new drug is assessed by the degree to which its effects exceeds the improvements to be expected from a placebo alone. This is basically what was used to judge the efficacy of saw palmetto (ie the extent to which it is more effective than a sugar pill). The findings suggest that saw palmetto is in itself of no benefit. One of the components of saw palmetto (beta sitosterol) seems to have a beneficial effect on BPH. However, the amount of beta sitosterol in saw plametto is so small it is likely to only have - you guessed it - a placebo effect.

So this does not discount your experience. If saw plametto is helping you, keep taking it and enjoy the extra sleep!

[CharlesHH]

1. The only SURE way to know about cancer of the prostate is biopsy and then that indicates only in the area where the tissue is taken and sampled. The PSA test is only an indicator and not a sure thing nor is the digital exam. Xray type scanning can be a help.

2. Self medicating is always not a good idea, especially based on hearsay, so go to a good doctor. I doubt a real doctor would prescribe nor advise over the phone, maybe for a very trusted dear friend.

3. Enlarged prostate does cause urine flow restriction and reducing the size is very difficult, often requiring surgery; ask a good doctor. It can also negatively affect bowel movement and ejection of bowel waste.

4. Anyone who would leave the proven superior quality of Thailand medical care to go anywhere else should re examine their life priorities and degree of death wish. Money is no good in the casket with your body.

5. Prostate infection, which can yield bloody ejaculate, for example, is devilishly difficult to treat. Antibiotics are given over a long time because the delivery there is so slow and sluggish. The lucky ones do get it finally cured. Direct treatment like injection is dangerous and not done.

6. Retrograde ejaculation, where the ejaculate fluid is directed into the bladder, appears harmless. Some esoteric gurus recommend it.

7. You can have part of your prostate taken out by surgery and retain most of your erection and ejaculation functions. If the whole thing is removed, those problems arise most of the time.

Yes, getting old in body is the pits. (In mind not so bad because you dont know it, smile)

[giddyup]

As someone once said, "gettin' old ain't for pussies".

[JDGRUEN]

Concerning placebo effect as the only benefit of saw palmetto . I say until the so called research details are shown telling which form of saw palmetto was used and in what dosage was it taken, then the 'placebo only' claim is dubious information. See my previous post... One must use the concentrated extract form of SP or using SP in actual treatment or in SP research is worthless... And I would suspect any such research as intentionally deceptive similar to studying 81 mg aspirin for pain relief only to declare it does little good.

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Edited June 19, 2014 by JDGRUEN

[cobra]

... My personal understanding is that you can fix prostate problems through a nutritional and/or herb approach.

The AMA have some serious black marks against their name when one starts investigating their practices.

Steve Jobs tried that approach, he ended up dead.

Say what you will, but I'll take my chances with western medicine, instead of herbs and potions.

[JDGRUEN]

Ruling out the advice of a physician in dealing with medical problems is folly - but not getting self-educated on medical matters and thus creating a choice to decide one's own course of action and relying only on the advice of a physician is also folly. The use of supplements, herbs and vitamins to maintain health can be appropriate in preventing and solving health problems. Example... Many disorders and diseases are caused by inflammation - bowel, colon, bone joints, prostate, sinus, etc. Remove the inflammation and the disorder - even disease can be improved, stopped or prevented. There is nothing magical about herbs, supplements and vitamins other than they are not made in a laboratory - they are made in nature's laboratory. And there is nothing magical about pharmaceuticals because they are made in a laboratory. Many prescription drugs are too strong or have too many serious side effects. Natural remedies often have no side effects.

I wouldn't dream of turning my treatment regime completely over to any doctor, if I felt my personally knew a good answer with less likelihood of complications or side effects.

[cheeryble]

Just to broaden the informational scope of this thread I was just chatting with my sister.....an ex medical person....about my brother in law's decades long prostate cancer problem.

It was pretty malignant she said, and he had NHS radiation treatment whcih I remember at the time caused considerable bleeding problems bowel I think.

Long story short he is 84 and very fit.

Still runs, and if he has a hospital visit doesn't drive he goes by bus and walks back across Brighton England.....2 and a half hour brisk walk!

(I must add they have nothing but praise for the NHS)

After informing myself I'm still not quite sure that the best course.....bearing in mind a pretty small male lifetime statistical risk of prostate cancer death, and the likelihood of that death being in the upper ages....whether or not the best course of action may be to do the minimum possible, no PSAs, no biopsies, and take one's chances, but hopefully avoid urinary or incontinence problems and hopefully worry too.

Of course reduction may have to be done for BPH sometime, if so, so be it and they would not doubt do a pathology on the removed tissue.

My brother in law above however went the conventional route and is very much with us as is his 97 year old brother who works at something every day.

I am very much undecided despite the fact that as a trained scientist I tend to trust other scientists more than most....and I take Sheryl's advice seriously (I consider doctors to be scientists though am appalled at their measured abilities at interpreting statistical data or medical papers.)

As a matter of interest and another example of conventional wisdom being turned on it's head a serious new meta study this year finds no correlation between saturated fat intake and heart disease. I shall look it up to reference.

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[cheeryble]

Here it is sorry to put in this thread

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/behindtheheadlines/news/2014-03-18-saturated-fats-and-heart-disease-link-unproven/

QUOTE

"They found no significant evidence that saturated fats increase the risk of heart disease and no significant evidence that omega-6 and omega-3 polyunsaturated fats protect the heart."

(With modest reservations unlikely to affect the main result ie

"This study hasn’t “proved” that saturated fat isn't bad for the heart, rather that evidence of harm does not appear to be statistically significant."

Also this caveat

"However, some of the pooled studies involved people with cardiovascular risk factors or with cardiovascular disease, so the results may not necessarily apply to the population at large."

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Edited June 21, 2014 by cheeryble

[beau thai]

Can someone explain to me how my 'perceived' benefit of only getting up once in the night instead of 3 times if I stop taking saw palmetto can possibly be a 'placebo' effect as stated above?

I didnt realise I was clever enough to enjoy a placebo effect when fast asleep. You live and learn.

Yes, the placebo effect works while you are sleeping. No one can really explain how this effect works, despite numerous experiements and elegant (and unproven) theories as to how and why it works. The actual neurological mechanisms underlying the effect are simply not able to be understood at present.

But the effect is demonstrably powerful, and can be observed in a wide range of medical conditions - even some where it seems next to impossible. These conditions include Parkinson's disease, angina, herpes, asthma. It has been shown to be a useful pain killer too. And patients taking pharmacologically inert substances (placebos) often report side effects, such as dry mouth, sweating, and nausea.

The placebo phenomenon is so powerful that it is the basis of pharamacological tests for new drugs. ALL new drugs are likely to seem to be effective because of this effect, even if they are not. So the efficacy of new drug is assessed by the degree to which its effects exceeds the improvements to be expected from a placebo alone. This is basically what was used to judge the efficacy of saw palmetto (ie the extent to which it is more effective than a sugar pill). The findings suggest that saw palmetto is in itself of no benefit. One of the components of saw palmetto (beta sitosterol) seems to have a beneficial effect on BPH. However, the amount of beta sitosterol in saw plametto is so small it is likely to only have - you guessed it - a placebo effect.

So this does not discount your experience. If saw plametto is helping you, keep taking it and enjoy the extra sleep!

Thanks - I will and I do! Still dont understand how a placebo can influence my prostate whilst I sleep but from what you say, nobody else does either!

Whether saw palmetto works or is a placebo doesnt matter to me as you say, so long as I get up less often to pee...

[victor70]

Saw Palmetto.

Any reputable urologist will tell you this is rubbish.

So are you a reputable urologist, because I don't know one I can ask right now? However, I can tell you I have taken Saw Palmetto and with 100% certainty it worked for me. So I guess I have no need to speak with a urologist as it turns out.

where can you buy it in Pattaya???

[Sheryl]

Please let us drop the argument about saw palmetto. As I said earlier, studies have shown conflicting results. As a result it is currently classified as "possibly ineffective" which is not the same thing as proven ineffective.

Personally I suspect that there are some individual factors that explain why some men find absolutely no effect and others find it helps.

[victor70]

Please let us drop the argument about saw palmetto. As I said earlier, studies have shown conflicting results. As a result it is currently classified as "possibly ineffective" which is not the same thing as proven ineffective.

Personally I suspect that there are some individual factors that explain why some men find absolutely no effect and others find it helps.

with this I stil do not know where to buy it????? I used UROGINE produced in germany I used it for years help me very good but not to find in Thailand it is Bio

[beau thai]

Please let us drop the argument about saw palmetto. As I said earlier, studies have shown conflicting results. As a result it is currently classified as "possibly ineffective" which is not the same thing as proven ineffective.

Personally I suspect that there are some individual factors that explain why some men find absolutely no effect and others find it helps.

with this I stil do not know where to buy it????? I used UROGINE produced in germany I used it for years help me very good but not to find in Thailand it is Bio

I get mine shipped from Simply Supplements in Uk - where supplements are so much cheaper and more readily available than here. around 1200 baht for a year's supply and cheap shipping.

[victor70]

Please let us drop the argument about saw palmetto. As I said earlier, studies have shown conflicting results. As a result it is currently classified as "possibly ineffective" which is not the same thing as proven ineffective.

Personally I suspect that there are some individual factors that explain why some men find absolutely no effect and others find it helps.

with this I stil do not know where to buy it????? I used UROGINE produced in germany I used it for years help me very good but not to find in Thailand it is Bio

I get mine shipped from Simply Supplements in Uk - where supplements are so much cheaper and more readily available than here. around 1200 baht for a year's supply and cheap shipping.

thank you

[Sheryl]

You can get it by mail order within Thailand at several places including this one http://www.nananaka.com/store/product/Prostate_Health_Prostate_Cancer-1443367-en.html

No idea of the quality.

[loppylugs1]

Back from my trip,and what a disaster,got damned pneumonia yet again ,anyway bombarded myself up with amoxillian and has done the trick

For sure will have to get something done about the prostate,just takes over your life.cannot understand how bursting for a pee and only a spoonful (a teaspoons worth) only comes out,other times free flow and no urgency to perform.

Mind over matter perhaps,but when bursting for a pee and nowhere to pee can be a big problem. As #159 states "the proven quality of Thai medical care" I would put it the other way around, I have a profound admiration for Indian medical care,not so Thai care,have a couple of months before I can launch into that sphere but will be doing so

[giddyup]

Back from my trip,and what a disaster,got damned pneumonia yet again ,anyway bombarded myself up with amoxillian and has done the trick

For sure will have to get something done about the prostate,just takes over your life.cannot understand how bursting for a pee and only a spoonful (a teaspoons worth) only comes out,other times free flow and no urgency to perform.

Mind over matter perhaps,but when bursting for a pee and nowhere to pee can be a big problem. As #159 states "the proven quality of Thai medical care" I would put it the other way around, I have a profound admiration for Indian medical care,not so Thai care,have a couple of months before I can launch into that sphere but will be doing so

Keep us informed.

[djinn]

I take a french product based on plants extracts.Permixon 160 mg.No contra indications.

2 per day and perfect result

If you are in Pattaya area,dr Oliver Meyer has it in stock.

I am too lazy to read all the posts here.So ,I am sorry if ithas already been mentioned

[giddyup]

I take a french product based on plants extracts.Permixon 160 mg.No contra indications.

2 per day and perfect result

If you are in Pattaya area,dr Oliver Meyer has it in stock.

I am too lazy to read all the posts here.So ,I am sorry if ithas already been mentioned

How much does it cost and where can you find Dr Meyer?

[djinn]

I take a french product based on plants extracts.Permixon 160 mg.No contra indications.

2 per day and perfect result

If you are in Pattaya area,dr Oliver Meyer has it in stock.

I am too lazy to read all the posts here.So ,I am sorry if ithas already been mentioned

[djinn]

oups sorry for double posting

Please google dr Meyer Clinic for phone number for price as I order many medics. there and I ask a global receipt for my insurance

To arrive there:from sukhumvit road

-take Pattaya Tai road (south Pattaya road to city center)

-Go straight on intersection with Pattaya 3rd road (first red light)

-It is on the left side of the second soi after Tukcom (computer tower) about 100m from Pattaya Tai.

-parking in Day and Night hotel possible on the right hand side of the soi

Hope this helps

[Oscar2]

You do understand that prostate surgery will most likely leave you impotent.

Thinking about this too.

I take Thyroid,and Statins ,do not want to take any more,that is why I am looking for a permanent fix.

No point in being in Thailand excepting bashing the bishop on a frequency that at my advancing years surprises even me. I am here all on my lonesome,got great pensions,do not play golf or smoke so my only vice is ...vice.

Have to give it some thought though,but I like getting checked out medically wise in India,it is a great place for any procedures

I take "Lisinopril" for high blood pressure, a statin (cholesterol) and an enteric aspirin and the Saw Palmetto all once in the morning. They all work together just fine doing their own separate jobs. Naturally you would need to see a doctor for any combination you were taking or would consider taking.

the statin should be taken at bedtime, not in the morning.

[uptheos]

You do understand that prostate surgery will most likely leave you impotent.

Thinking about this too.

I take Thyroid,and Statins ,do not want to take any more,that is why I am looking for a permanent fix.

No point in being in Thailand excepting bashing the bishop on a frequency that at my advancing years surprises even me. I am here all on my lonesome,got great pensions,do not play golf or smoke so my only vice is ...vice.

Have to give it some thought though,but I like getting checked out medically wise in India,it is a great place for any procedures

I take "Lisinopril" for high blood pressure, a statin (cholesterol) and an enteric aspirin and the Saw Palmetto all once in the morning. They all work together just fine doing their own separate jobs. Naturally you would need to see a doctor for any combination you were taking or would consider taking.

the statin should be taken at bedtime, not in the morning.

I would think Lipitor info applies to all statins

Take LIPITOR each day at any time of day at about the same time each day. LIPITOR can be taken with or without food. Don't break LIPITOR tablets before taking.

http://www.lipitor.com/taking-lipitor

Edited August 5, 2014 by uptheos