Immigration clarifies and confirms overstay crackdown

[Jonathan Fairfield]

LIFE BAN ON OVERSTAY

Immigration clarifies and confirms overstay crackdown

BANGKOK: -- A senior Immigration official has now confirmed and clarified the imminent crackdown on people overstaying in Thailand.

After Thaivisa.com broke the story on Monday that individuals who overtay for more than 90 days will be blacklisted, Lt Gen Thatchai Pitaneelaboot, commander of Immigration Bureau’s Region 6 division, has confirmed the proposal to start blacklisting some overstayers has been submitted to the Ministry of Interior for approval reports the Phuket Gazette.

However, the penalties are not yet in effect.

Lt Gen Thatchai Pitaneelaboot, also confirmed that no date has yet been set for the commencement of the new blacklisting proposal but that it is expected to come into effect by the end of the month.

This follows an increasing number of reports coming to Thaivisa.com that foreigners are being asked to sign a form acknowledging the penalties for foreigners who overstay (see form below).

The first report we received on Tuesday was from Mukdahan Immigration office, with a further two coming to us from Sakhon Nakhon Immigration Office and Phuket Town Immigration Office, respectively.

The Phuket Gazette goes on to report that Lt Gen Thatchai confirmed the time has come for foreigners who continue to ignore and show disregard for the rules and regulations in order to stay in Thailand legally.

“It is time to stop. If you live in a country, you respect its rules.”

Gen Thatchai also warned that foreigners caught on overstay can expect no right of appeal to be granted.

Pictured above is “The Acknowledgment of Penalties for Visa Overstay”

from July 8, 2014 used at all Thai Immigration offices nationwide and will

later be required on entry via air or land border crossings as well.

Please note: this topic is regarding the overstay situation only. Please keep on topic. Off-topic posts will be removed. If your issue is not about overstay, please post in a relevant thread in our visa forum

-- 2014-07-08

[angsta]

Think of all the money that will be lost. This doesn't seem like a good idea. Taking money out of an economy rarely makes it grow. Strange.

[MJCM]

But still many questions left unanswered, but we just have to wait and be patience (as usual;))

Sent from my iPad so Please excuse any typos

[paz]

  On 7/8/2014 at 3:33 PM, angsta said:

Think of all the money that will be lost. This doesn't seem like a good idea. Taking money out of an economy rarely makes it grow. Strange.

Actually that will have Thailand make money. Overstay fees, visa fees, immigration fees, money wired in, ED courses, visa trips and all the related expenses one sustains in relation to maintaining legal status.

And some guys marrying just for the purpose of staying. You know which is the direction of the money flow in these cases.

[thailiketoo]

From the OP, "the proposal to start blacklisting some overstayers has been submitted to the Ministry of Interior for approval"

Does anyone know how long it takes to get approval from the Ministry of Interior?"

[crazykopite]

Can only see gloom and doom for the economy I would think that overstays. Must be in the 1,000s if not millions and who will foot the bill to deport all these people I would assume that if they cannot afford a visa then they would not have the money to leave the kingdom I would assume the biggest offenders would be those from neighbouring countries Burma,Cambodia,Malaysia all these people would be doing the jobs Thais won't touch

[MJCM]

  On 7/8/2014 at 3:42 PM, thailiketoo said:

From the OP, "the proposal to start blacklisting some overstayers has been submitted to the Ministry of Interior for approval"

Does anyone know how long it takes to get approval from the Ministry of Interior?"

in the OP it says: "is expected to come into effect by the end of the month", so approval would have to come before that time.

Sent from my iPad so Please excuse any typos

[anon467367354]

does this crackdown pertain to all foreigners or just westerners? (serious question)

[paz]

  On 7/8/2014 at 3:47 PM, crazykopite said:

Can only see gloom and doom for the economy I would think that overstays. Must be in the 1,000s if not millions and who will foot the bill to deport all these people I would assume that if they cannot afford a visa then they would not have the money to leave the kingdom I would assume the biggest offenders would be those from neighbouring countries Burma,Cambodia,Malaysia all these people would be doing the jobs Thais won't touch

These people are daily deported by bus anyway, not a big deal for Thailand.

For other countries, Thailand does not pay for deportation, ever.

If anything, the measure will cause people seeking reduced ban terms to turn themselves in voluntarily and leave.

All in all, marginal or no difference in terms of IDC population.

[cacruden]

  On 7/8/2014 at 3:33 PM, angsta said:

Think of all the money that will be lost. This doesn't seem like a good idea. Taking money out of an economy rarely makes it grow. Strange.

I cannot see that being a very big issue, the long stay people that are overstaying are the ones that are probably on a shoestring budget and not contributing much to the economy anyway (for the most part). Tourists come in and spend a lot of money in a short amount of time; workers that can meet the pay requirements will be hired and have a proper visa and that money is in the economy; retirees that have sufficient funds will also qualify; that does not leave much money on the table.

[MJCM]

  On 7/8/2014 at 3:47 PM, crazykopite said:

Can only see gloom and doom for the economy I would think that overstays. Must be in the 1,000s if not millions and who will foot the bill to deport all these people I would assume that if they cannot afford a visa then they would not have the money to leave the kingdom I would assume the biggest offenders would be those from neighbouring countries Burma,Cambodia,Malaysia all these people would be doing the jobs Thais won't touch

I doubt that these overstay rules have anything to do with the nations you mention, as they are more a burden when caught (read no overstay fine to be had (500 thb a day HAHA forgot it, as they only get free Transportation back home) to the Thai government.

My guess is that these rules are brought into affect for us Westerners.

Sent from my iPad so Please excuse any typos

[Costas2008]

Sorry, but for me to understand better.

Before if you overstayed more than 40 days and up to whatever period after that, you had to pay 20,000 Baht to get out of Thailand, but you could come back any time you liked.

What is the change now?

You will be blacklisted and what?

You will not be able to come back to Thailand?

And for how long?

Do you still have to pay the 20K?

[paz]

  On 7/8/2014 at 3:57 PM, Costas2008 said:

Sorry, but for me to understand better.

Before if you overstayed more than 40 days and up to whatever period after that, you had to pay 20,000 Baht to get out of Thailand, but you could come back any time you liked.

What is the change now?

You will be blacklisted and what?

You will not be able to come back to Thailand?

And for how long?

Do you still have to pay the 20K?

At the top of this thread there is a picture, click on it to enlarge and read it.

Or you can browse in the many other threads.

Of course one will still have to pay fines in all cases.

[hemanrcr]

  On 7/8/2014 at 3:33 PM, angsta said:

Think of all the money that will be lost. This doesn't seem like a good idea. Taking money out of an economy rarely makes it grow. Strange.

How much money do you expect will be lost by chronic overstayers? They are hardly propping up the economy. The government wants to attract investors to employ and train Thai. I don't think these people fall into that category.

[Costas2008]

  On 7/8/2014 at 4:00 PM, paz said:

  On 7/8/2014 at 3:57 PM, Costas2008 said:

Sorry, but for me to understand better.

Before if you overstayed more than 40 days and up to whatever period after that, you had to pay 20,000 Baht to get out of Thailand, but you could come back any time you liked.

What is the change now?

You will be blacklisted and what?

You will not be able to come back to Thailand?

And for how long?

Do you still have to pay the 20K?

At the top of this thread there is a picture, click on it to enlarge and read it.

Or you can browse in the many other threads.

Of course one will still have to pay fines in all cases.

Thank you, it's very blurred on my screen, had to use the magnifying glass.

But got the answers.

[Bellacissa]

I foresee many outbound trips in the next three weeks. Just out of sheer curiosity, what percentage of the western expats do you think fall into the habitual overstayer category? 5%? 10%? Depends on the day?

[Jingthing]

The link in the OP appears to answer the question I have been asking about the detail of people APPREHENDED on overstay under one year getting a 5 year ban, even if the overstay is under 90 days.

It's odd though that the text people are now being asked to sign includes the text giving the apparently WRONG impression that an overstay of even one day would result in a 5 year ban IF APPREHENDED.

I am reading "caught" and "apprehended" (the word on the form) as being the same thing.

Hopefully, assuming this "crackdown" actually goes through, this correction can also be made on the form and well communicated to immigration enforcement and the foreigners potentially impacted.

  Quote

Lt Col Banphot Kittivira, Deputy Superintendent of the Immigration checkpoint at Sadao, on the Malaysian border, confirmed that his office received a copy of the new form.

“Although the form currently states that any foreigners caught overstaying by less than a year will be banned from re-entering the Kingdom for five years, please note that this will only apply to foreigners who overstay by more than 90 days,” he said.

“Any foreigners who overstay less than 90 days will be subjected to the normal 500-baht a day fine.”

- See more at: http://www.phuketgazette.net/phuket-news/Immigration-looks-enforce-life-ban-overstays-within/31105#ad-image-1

[paz]

  On 7/8/2014 at 4:10 PM, Costas2008 said:

Thank you, it's very blurred on my screen, had to use the magnifying glass.

You welcome. With most browsers, type "Ctrl +" to enlarge any screen,

[Suradit69]

  On 7/8/2014 at 3:47 PM, crazykopite said:

Can only see gloom and doom for the economy I would think that overstays. Must be in the 1,000s if not millions and who will foot the bill to deport all these people I would assume that if they cannot afford a visa then they would not have the money to leave the kingdom I would assume the biggest offenders would be those from neighbouring countries Burma,Cambodia,Malaysia all these people would be doing the jobs Thais won't touch

" I would assume that if they cannot afford a visa then they would not have the money to leave the kingdom"

I would assume that people subject to deportation would have to find a way to send themselves out of the country, which is usually the case. I doubt most of the over-stayers cannot afford a visa. Those who start threads on Thai Visa about overstaying almost always plan to pay their Baht 20,000 at Suvarnabhumi as they're flying out. Some simply post messages bragging about how they've lived here for donkey years without bothering to renew extensions or to do the 90 day report and some of them announce that it's easier just to pay the Baht 20,000 at the airport and they'll be back soon to start again.

If someone from certain countries has to be deported and can prove to his embassy he's not got the money, in some cases the embassy will contact relatives at home or even lend the ticket money and put a lien on the deportees' government pension / seize his passport until its repaid.

And if nothing else can be done, there's detention. People caught on overstay in the past have been detained and fined.

The people from neighboring countries who come here to do low paying jobs do not apply for tourist visas or the usual non-immigrant visas, some do not need any visa to enter the country. Those that need to be deported often are deported at little expense to anyone. If employers need labor, either they'll need to increase pay to attract locals or they'll manage to get more workers from Cambodia or Laos or wherever.

Farangs quite often see nothing but doom and gloom in the Thai economy, but it continues to grow and, considering all that's happened, it continues to be relatively prosperous. Tsunamis, floods, protestors, coups ... if the economy can weather all these things, a few deported prohibited immigrants won't be a major event.

  Quote

“It is time to stop. If you live in a country, you respect its rules.”

Exactly and the supply of retirees with sufficient funds to support themselves in Thailand is growing by the day as populations in wealthier countries rapidly age. What's happening now will prompt better compliance with the rules and regulations by those who wish to live here.

Everyone is eager to see the Army sort out the taxi drivers and jet ski operators, without any concern for the effect on the economy. Time to sort out the illegal residents of the country too, just like the US, UK, Australia and the Eurozone countries are struggling to do.

[Suradit69]

  On 7/8/2014 at 3:55 PM, gr8fldanielle said:

does this crackdown pertain to all foreigners or just westerners? (serious question)

With the exception of neighboring countries that have special agreements with the Thai government it would obviously apply to Asians, Europeans, Africans, Americans, et al.

Some of the recent brouhaha was supposedly aimed particularly at South Koreans and Russians, neither of which would be considered westerners.

[ilovebkk12345]

its about time they made some rules/laws for overstays.

20000 baht for a 5 or 10 year overstay was ridiculous.

it was a slap in the face to the thai immigration laws.

where are all the overstayers that used to brag, and think they were so smart? why arent any of them replying now LOL

(i am guessing they are on their way out of the country because SHHHHHHHHH hits the fan for them)

[arisaje]

  On 7/8/2014 at 3:33 PM, angsta said:

Think of all the money that will be lost. This doesn't seem like a good idea. Taking money out of an economy rarely makes it grow. Strange.

I don't think they care and the money loss will be minimal if they can eradicate all the criminals and drifters, improve the tourism market and encourage 'real paying' tourists to visit the country......because less face it, these rules only effect those who don't have a lot of money, are too lazy to get a real visa, or are not in a position to apply for a visa because they are wanted on some system somewhere!

[ronthai]

I just read the OP and 2 replies.

Sorry, DON'T overstay or DON't get caught when you do.

For the rest, it will be the usual 1000+ or 10.000+ posters that respond, ...

of who(M) a certain percentage is on overstay

[Mango Bob]

It's good to see Thailand trying to get rid of more of its trash.

[southcoast]

A lot happening in Thailand latley !!! i like the bit that says “ If you live in a country, you respect its rules.” Wish he would get a job here in the UK, it needs someone with a bit of common sense.

[Tycoon]

  On 7/8/2014 at 4:54 PM, Mango Bob said:

It's good to see Thailand trying to get rid of more of its trash.

Mango your 100% right, this country wants to move upward and its starts with stopping the trash of the world living and working here illegally.

[natway09]

Good in many ways,

The guy (or girl) who overstays are just a pain,

I got told off in Chiang Mai for this guy (basically a beggar) because I did not buy him a beer.

Overstay nearly 8 years, No money, living in the village, their kindness kept him alive.

The Thais have have enough trouble looking after themselves without us bludging on them,

Send the bludgers home,

Sorry, no sympathy

[apalink_thailand]

  On 7/8/2014 at 4:12 PM, Bellacissa said:

I foresee many outbound trips in the next three weeks. Just out of sheer curiosity, what percentage of the western expats do you think fall into the habitual overstayer category? 5%? 10%? Depends on the day?

10% is not too "inconcievable" I think.

[wolf5370]

  On 7/8/2014 at 5:58 PM, apalink_thailand said:

  On 7/8/2014 at 4:12 PM, Bellacissa said:

I foresee many outbound trips in the next three weeks. Just out of sheer curiosity, what percentage of the western expats do you think fall into the habitual overstayer category? 5%? 10%? Depends on the day?

10% is not too "inconcievable" I think.

Depends on what makes up the other 90%! If you include all (real) tourists, retirees, WP holders, expats on non imm visas/extensions, In would suggest it is much less than 1% (much less!). The "problem" is so small it's laughable - and the fine on the way home is the best way of dealing with it.

[gandalf12]

A 90 day overstay is not a lapse of memory. A day ok maybe that is but what they are doing is getting rid of the people who think the rules dont apply to them.

Despite what others on this forum think it will help the image of Thailand and that can only be a good thing.