Please Help us get out of Thailand

[Maestro]

Got people worked up has it not?.

All very simple

Every Thai person has to have an ID card and a Tabian Baan. Without those two life is very difficult

But they are easy to get, particularly, for a child.Granny? if you have a Thai Birth Certificate no problem

I fail to to understand why the OP has not protected/secured the future of his children in Thailand by their not having an ID card, and a Tabian Baan. Not difficult. Quick trip to the Amph0e/Tessuban

When we last went renew the childrens' passports in CM the only thing they were interested in was the mother's consent, ems reasonable...I take them out of Thailand regularly on their UK passports and return on n their Thai ones!

hotsoup, you seem to overlook the fact that the child in question was born in the UK and therefore did not get entered on a House Registration Book (tabian baan) at birth. You also seem to ignore the fact that the parents did get a Thai passport for their child, obviously in the UK, for which procedure the child did not have to be entered on a House Registration Book. It is when applying for a Thai passport in Thailand that the House Registration Book with the child entered in it is necessary, among other documents.

[JoeLing]

Would it be more expeditious to "lose" the Thai passport then apply for an emergency travel document from the British Embassy?

Will that defo work ?

No chance!

1. You would need to go to the police to report [Thai] passport stolen or lost.

2. With those papers you go to the British Embassy and they will shake their heads and say:

a:) "Sorry, we don't deal with Thai Passports" or

b:) "Sorry, as long as you have a valid UK passport, you can't have emergency documents."

3. Now just assume you told the police all passports were stolen or lost and the UK embassy would give your

entire family emergency documents. (your old passport number would be on it as well)

4. With those documents you'll have to go to immigration. They will try to find the TM [arrival] card you filled out

on arrival and very quickly see, your son and your wife entered on a Thai passport.

5. So after a week running from office to office, you will have the same problem as before, you can not exit on

a different nationality as you entered a country.

Having dual nationality is great if you want to explore the world and does have it's advantages but be aware,

there are some general rules. You can't enter then leave the country on different passports. Although it's not

illegal to have 2 or more passports, some officials don't know, so it's always advisable not to show or mention

your dual nationality as travelling on multiple ID's could look suspicious.

Some countries do not recognise dual nationality. So, although it's perfectly ok to have dual nationality in the UK,

it might not be OK in the country of your second nationality. Saudi Arabia has been known to have confiscated

foreign passports from it's citizens at the airport.

Not quite sure how Thailand handles dual nationality for it's subjects.

[oneday]

Isn't it so like Thai immigration to be almost happy to cause problems for foreigners and not offer any help at all. No phone calls to higher authorities as to how to solve the problem. Just deny you and turn their back on you like you are a nobody which just about all people are to them.

Is it possible the Ampere where you tried to add your son to the House Book was just looking for a bribe to get you a same day or next day appointment? Money is the grease this country runs on.

You might also go to the head immigration office in BKK and ask for help or advice. If they send you somewhere with a solution do not forget to ask if they can please call the place they send you and explain and get a name of who they talk to so you do not walk in cold.

I hope you resolve this soon.

Edited August 31, 2014 by oneday

[a99az]

We had that problem got to airport found out one daughters (Thai) passport was out of date tried to use UK passport to get on flight and was told "can Not" had to spend three extra days getting Thai passport renewed.

Best is to chill out do it right, one day at a time. Don't worry about school you have a sound excuse for him missing some school. If need be you could leave your wife to sort it and you could fly back and work.

Hope you get sorted soon all the best.

[Maestro]

Removed some off-topic posts and replies to them.

[me313]

I would suggest going to a lawyer specializing in this, they may be able to negotiate for you or help answer questions with expertise.

[StefanBBK]

As some suggested before, enter the kid in any house book. (Tabien ban) this really takes a few minutes and 20 baht.

Then go back to bangna. Passport takes less than 48 hours.

As for the I'd card, I believe child needs to be 12 to get one. So no other option than Tabien ban and non- provincial passport office.

If your wife's friend says 500 baht, go for it.

Good luck.

No, a child does not need to 12 years old to get a Thai ID card.

You are right. Before it was 15, but then it was dropped to 6 or 7.

[nithisa78]

3 cheers for Ubon Joe.

Good luck to you and your family.

[theoldgit]

Nonsense remark removed.

The OP has a problem and came to this forum for a advice and for the best part that's what he's got.

If you have nothing sensible to add then please don't post anything.

[Chuckles78]

Good luck!

[scorecard]

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StefanBBK, on 31 Aug 2014 - 09:57, said:

As some suggested before, enter the kid in any house book. (Tabien ban) this really takes a few minutes and 20 baht.
Then go back to bangna. Passport takes less than 48 hours.
As for the I'd card, I believe child needs to be 12 to get one. So no other option than Tabien ban and non- provincial passport office.
If your wife's friend says 500 baht, go for it.
Good luck.

I just double checked with my Thai adult son, as mentioned it takes just a few minutes (depends on queue of course) and 20Baht at the local amphur office. Son has done it twice to register his two kids onto the house book and to add his Thai wife when they got married.

A couple of years back we all moved from central area to North Thailand. Son took the house book to the local amphur (central area) and in a few minutes got some documents to transfer out and to be used to add our names to the new house in the north. And it took just a few minutes to put the names into the new book in the North.

This included same documents with my name in and out because I have PR.

No questions asked and need to provide any form of proof in either location of who owned the houses and/or where we actually lived.

All easy, fast and painless.

Good luck, hope you get it sorted quickly.

Edited August 31, 2014 by scorecard

[Chuckles78]

I was once leaving on my other passport. Immigration picked up on it and told me to show the other passport. Stupidly it was in the suitcase that was loaded on the aircraft already. So they let me through.

[samran]

I would suggest going to a lawyer specializing in this, they may be able to negotiate for you or help answer questions with expertise.

Lawyer isn't going to be able to do anything here which a person can't do themselves. The khet/ampur do registrations of overseas born Thai kids as a matter of course. I was one of them. Edited August 31, 2014 by samran

[samran]

Isn't it so like Thai immigration to be almost happy to cause problems for foreigners and not offer any help at all. No phone calls to higher authorities as to how to solve the problem. Just deny you and turn their back on you like you are a nobody which just about all people are to them.

Is it possible the Ampere where you tried to add your son to the House Book was just looking for a bribe to get you a same day or next day appointment? Money is the grease this country runs on.

You might also go to the head immigration office in BKK and ask for help or advice. If they send you somewhere with a solution do not forget to ask if they can please call the place they send you and explain and get a name of who they talk to so you do not walk in cold.

I hope you resolve this soon.

This is ultimately a civil registration matter. The child isn't registered in Thailand and needs to do so before Thai travel documents can be issued.

[hgma]

If you are hovering in NongKhai town.....and the situation gets out of hand........

Take C^)* the wellknown Lawyer.Notary.......US degree...bla bla....seems to have exceptional 'contacts'

You can PM me for more information.

[mrfaroukh]

What they say is true you must leave on the passport you enter. Myself have two passport and have same issues. The best you can do is to go to one of those people who help with getting all kind of visa. If you are in Pattaya, there is a lot of them in Soi Bukhao. They know many ways to help at different costs.

[paz]

I would suggest going to a lawyer specializing in this, they may be able to negotiate for you or help answer questions with expertise.

That is one of these pearls.

A lawyer for what? This is not a conflict of law.

[shaurene]

You do not need Tabian Ban to get a Thai Passport. Does your child have a Thai ID card? You need a House registrationto get that. It does not take 5 days to get a passport; 24 hours to have it delivered. There is no reason you cannot leave on your UK passports. If you leave on the Thai passports, without UK passports then there would be a need for visas for the uk, which is obviously nonsense, if you have UK passports. Children cannot overstay, and I have never heard of a problem with 'expired Thai passports' . As far as I know there is no regulation that requires you to enter and leave on the same passport. Much of this does not add up!

It is correct that you have to leave Thailand on the passport you entered on. It is a pity they did not check when his passport expired. I cannot see why they did not go through on his UK one and show his Thai one to get past the no visa. As far as I know you can get 30-60 days on a UK one issued on entry.

[Maestro]

As some suggested before, enter the kid in any house book. (Tabien ban) this really takes a few minutes and 20 baht.

Then go back to bangna. Passport takes less than 48 hours.

As for the I'd card, I believe child needs to be 12 to get one. So no other option than Tabien ban and non- provincial passport office.

If your wife's friend says 500 baht, go for it.

Good luck.

No, a child does not need to 12 years old to get a Thai ID card.

You are right. Before it was 15, but then it was dropped to 6 or 7.

I am not completely sure about this but I believe that since a year or two ago one can get a Thai ID card for a child of any age, ie from the age of 7 years onward, the ID is a legal requirement, at a younger age it is optional but can be obtained.

[ripstanley]

Thank you all ! My wife has managed to speak to a lady (friend of a friend) who works in a house book office in Nong Khai. She says it takes 2 to 3 days normally but the boss (who needs to sign apparently) will take a fee of 500 baht to get it done same day.

We are going to take the friend's house book to that office with the fee first thing Monday.

Cross fingers!

Our new born was added the same day as we applied. No fee was asked .We live in Phayao and that was 2012.

[samran]

Thank you all ! My wife has managed to speak to a lady (friend of a friend) who works in a house book office in Nong Khai. She says it takes 2 to 3 days normally but the boss (who needs to sign apparently) will take a fee of 500 baht to get it done same day.

We are going to take the friend's house book to that office with the fee first thing Monday.

Cross fingers!

Our new born was added the same day as we applied. No fee was asked .We live in Phayao and that was 2012.

We are talking about a Thai citizen born overseas. Process is slightly more cumbersome.

[RecklessRon]

IMHO: You must leave on the passport you entered on ONLY if you have a visa of some kind.

FYI: I am Canadian. I was born in Canada. As an adult travelled abroad several times on my Canadian passport then I left Canada for Australia on my British passport, returned to Canada on it and then left on my Canadian passport to Thailand and returned on it and then left on my British passport because my Canadian passport was expired. That's twice I left Canada on a different passport than I entered. I think that is because I was a citizen. Maybe they don't keep track of what passport a citizen returns on with respect to their next leaving - what would be the point? They certainly didn't in my case!

Since the boy is Thai he won't have any visa issues. Just show them his expired Thai passport to show he is not illegally in the county and say you never expect to return so you aren't renewing his passport. As he is travelling with both his parents his age should not be an issue. Therefore he should be able to leave Thailand on his British passport exactly the same way I left Canada on mine. If that is not the case then NO Thai with dual citizenship could EVER leave the country without having a Thai passport which is against the international agreements on the rights of dual-citizens and directly contravenes the Universal Declaration of Human Rights clauses on freedom of movement between countries.

That said immigration rules are flexible so you should try another exit point.

Edited August 31, 2014 by RecklessRon

[samran]

IMHO: You must leave on the passport you entered on ONLY if you have a visa of some kind.

FYI: I am Canadian. I was born in Canada. As an adult travelled abroad several times on my Canadian passport then I left Canada for Australia on my British passport, returned to Canada on it and then left on my Canadian passport to Thailand and returned on it and then left on my British passport because my Canadian passport was expired. That's twice I left Canada on a different passport than I entered. I think that is because I was a citizen. Maybe they don't keep track of what passport a citizen returns on with respect to their next leaving - what would be the point? They certainly didn't in my case!

Since the boy is Thai he won't have any visa issues. Just show them his expired Thai passport to show he is not illegally in the county and say you never expect to return so you aren't renewing his passport. As he is travelling with both his parents his age should not be an issue. Therefore he should be able to leave Thailand on his British passport exactly the same way I left Canada on mine. If that is not the case then NO Thai with dual citizenship could EVER leave the country without having a Thai passport which is against the international agreements on the rights of dual-citizens and directly contravenes the Universal Declaration of Human Rights clauses on freedom of movement between countries.

That said immigration rules are flexible so you should try another exit point.

Of you'd be good enough to show these so called international agreements on dual citizens we'd be much obliged.

You may have missed it, but it was a no go leaving on the non-Thai passport as he didn't enter on it. The best advice had already been given, that is to register the boy in Thailand.

[paz]

You may have missed it, but it was a no go leaving on the non-Thai passport as he didn't enter on it. The best advice had already been given, that is to register the boy in Thailand.

I agree with that in practice, at the same time I think there is no visible legal basis for Immigration to prevent a Thai from leaving on Thai passport different from then she has entered. And there is anecdotal evidence that shows that occasionally it happens.

In a western country there would some searchable published regulation, perhaps a ministerial circular, or even a precedent in court, nothing like that in Thailand and people is left with taking the most practical router or suffer the consequences if not.

[Maestro]

Removed a post with unsuitable advice and an off-topic post.

[Johpa]

The most important thing (aside from losing flight money, paying for accommodation, losing work money - I am self employed) is that my boy's education is going to suffer big time.

At the age of 5 your son's education will not suffer. And in fact, the extended stay in Thailand until this sorts itself out may solidify some bilingual abilities because this is the age where language is easily absorbed while at the same time formal education can quickly be replenished at a later date. During those first years of elementary school (in the USA) we always took our kids out for a few months, usually Nov-Jan, and it had little impact upon their overall education. Your wife will have to be the lead person in getting this straightened out, perhaps with the help of relatives or a local kamnaan. Your kid will have far more fun for a few weeks living in Nong Kai than would you. Kids at that age enjoy living within a Thai village setting. The main point is that the education at that age is not a concern, and in fact the situation is an opportunity as you spent too much time in tourist areas where your kid was able to rely on English.

[samran]

You may have missed it, but it was a no go leaving on the non-Thai passport as he didn't enter on it. The best advice had already been given, that is to register the boy in Thailand.

I agree with that in practice, at the same time I think there is no visible legal basis for Immigration to prevent a Thai from leaving on Thai passport different from then she has entered. And there is anecdotal evidence that shows that occasionally it happens.

In a western country there would some searchable published regulation, perhaps a ministerial circular, or even a precedent in court, nothing like that in Thailand and people is left with taking the most practical router or suffer the consequences if not.

Knowing the Thai government, there would be an internal handbook on the issue. Not public to be sure, but they wouldn't be stoping the child travelling otherwise.

[Maestro]

You may have missed it, but it was a no go leaving on the non-Thai passport as he didn't enter on it. The best advice had already been given, that is to register the boy in Thailand.

I agree with that in practice, at the same time I think there is no visible legal basis for Immigration to prevent a Thai from leaving on Thai passport different from then she has entered. And there is anecdotal evidence that shows that occasionally it happens.

In a western country there would some searchable published regulation, perhaps a ministerial circular, or even a precedent in court, nothing like that in Thailand and people is left with taking the most practical router or suffer the consequences if not.

The O's child was not trying to leave on a Thai passport different from the one with which he entered Thailand. He entered Thailand with his Thai passport and tried to leave with his British passport.

After getting his new Thai passport, the boy will of course be able to leave with this new passport even though he entered with his old Thai passport, and this has never been questioned in this thread.

[beechguy]

Isn't it so like Thai immigration to be almost happy to cause problems for foreigners and not offer any help at all. No phone calls to higher authorities as to how to solve the problem. Just deny you and turn their back on you like you are a nobody which just about all people are to them.

Is it possible the Ampere where you tried to add your son to the House Book was just looking for a bribe to get you a same day or next day appointment? Money is the grease this country runs on.

You might also go to the head immigration office in BKK and ask for help or advice. If they send you somewhere with a solution do not forget to ask if they can please call the place they send you and explain and get a name of who they talk to so you do not walk in cold.

I hope you resolve this soon.

Thai Immigration didn't cause the problem, the Op made a mistake and caused one for himself. He has good information on how to clear the situation now.

But, your comments aren't unusual, any excuse will do, to bash a Thai.

[RecklessRon]

FYI: We are talking about a Thai citizen leaving Thailand on a British Passport. That should not be a problem. I suspect you got the wrong immigration officer.

I beleive Thai Law states that you must EXIT AND ENTER on the same passport, which means he should legally be able to leave on his British!

As for international law see: Articles 9 and 13 http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/