Just bought an Isuzu Vcross space cab 2.5 4wd. Why do Thais go for the 2wd?

[mogandave]

I think people that want four wheel drive should buy it, and the people that don't want it should not buy it.

If you are not driving off road it is mostly useless.

If you are driving off road it is useful.

[wilcopops]

Tax - "These include the make and model of the vehicle, the age of the car and the engine size. Large and new cars will attract the higher rates. When the car is five years old the tax rate drops by 10% and this continues for another five years". - http://www.expatfocus.com/expatriate-thailand-car-tax-insurance

BUT

As I understand it Thailand will be changing to an emissions-based system very shortly.

[ktm jeff]

4WD is a big sefety feature (IMO) , providing more traction when needed , and engaged. Fuel consumption will be slightly (as in 2 or 3 %) higher. Priceless if your stuck or hauling loads on muddy roads. Resale values also higher , so the initial extra purchase price is not all lost. Mainly depends on your intended driving routes , your percieved extra smugness , and if the extra purchase cost makes the differenc between an affordable de-lux model or a more basic model. I would prefer a 4WD model than a higher spec 2WD model. Not saying only "posers" go the 2WD route , but 4WD suits my needs / preferences more. QUICK EDIT , dont know about the 2WD / 4WD tax situation , or insurance costs , but if someone is able to provide more information , it will be a great help. Thanks.

Edited December 4, 2014 by ktm jeff

[bkkjames]

I only use my 4wd to crawl up sidewalks to avoid heavy traffic, to remove various road hazards like shopping carts, traffic cones, soi dogs and other articles that get stuck under there. Used it once in the mud, but that was by chance...

[Kenny202]

Guys, there is no doubt I need a 4wd where I live and where I want to go. And the benefit of 4wd over 2wd (if u are in a rural area) is indisputable. I just couldn't understand why with what seems to me a minimal difference in price u would buy a 2wd. I'm not concerned about looks or showing off and if I thought a 2wd would do I would have saved the money. Nothing wrong with buying a more luxury or sportier looking model by the way if that is your priority. We have all bought cars because they look good or make us feel good. At the end of the day as the other guy said if u need it and u consider it good value for u buy it. I was only concerned I was missing something. Seemed to good to be true. In Australia 4wd 30% more expensive. Good luck for me :-)

[IMHO]

Surprised nobody have mentioned the difference in TAX ! I have a 4 door V-cross,and the tax is about 8000 if I remember it correctly. I did not know that beforehand;came as a bit of a chock to me!

I may be wrong but don't think there is a difference in tax between 2 and 4 WD. There is though between 2 and 4 doors.

You are correct - the only difference is taxes on pickups is 2 or 4 doors. If there were pickups with >3250cc engines they'd get taxed different, but there isn't.

[IMHO]

Guys, there is no doubt I need a 4wd where I live and where I want to go. And the benefit of 4wd over 2wd (if u are in a rural area) is indisputable. I just couldn't understand why with what seems to me a minimal difference in price u would buy a 2wd. I'm not concerned about looks or showing off and if I thought a 2wd would do I would have saved the money. Nothing wrong with buying a more luxury or sportier looking model by the way if that is your priority. We have all bought cars because they look good or make us feel good. At the end of the day as the other guy said if u need it and u consider it good value for u buy it. I was only concerned I was missing something. Seemed to good to be true. In Australia 4wd 30% more expensive. Good luck for me :-)

For Thai people, 80K baht is not small change - they look at that and think that the next 2-4 years diesel to run it.

[Kenny202]

Guys, there is no doubt I need a 4wd where I live and where I want to go. And the benefit of 4wd over 2wd (if u are in a rural area) is indisputable. I just couldn't understand why with what seems to me a minimal difference in price u would buy a 2wd. I'm not concerned about looks or showing off and if I thought a 2wd would do I would have saved the money. Nothing wrong with buying a more luxury or sportier looking model by the way if that is your priority. We have all bought cars because they look good or make us feel good. At the end of the day as the other guy said if u need it and u consider it good value for u buy it. I was only concerned I was missing something. Seemed to good to be true. In Australia 4wd 30% more expensive. Good luck for me :-)

For Thai people, 80K baht is not small change - they look at that and think that the next 2-4 years diesel to run it.

Of course. I understand that...But my point was many will pay that much more for the accessorised version of

the 2WD model. Their choice and good luck to them if thats what they like :-)

Edited December 5, 2014 by Kenny202

[mogandave]

80K is over a 10% increase as well, I think that is significant for something most people will never have a need for. If you live or plan to drive around places with a lot of mud, it is a benefit.

Service and repair costs are generally higher as well.

As far as resale, it will increase the resale value, but not by 80K. If you want to increase resale value, when you buy a pickup, put the 80K in a high yield fixed account and and cash it in when you sell the pickup.

As far as traction, it will provide better traction in the mud, but it will not help on rain slick roads. There are AWD systems that will help on slick roads, but they don't come on most pickups.

In my opinion, the V-Cross is a good looking unit. It looks better and rides a little higher than the Highlander, I'm sure you'll love it. I'm on my third Isuzu daily driver since I been here. The first was 4WD the second and third (current) were Highanders. All were top-model with AT.

I also have a Spark that I love driving, but I would like to see Isuzu (or Toyota) come with a nice high-spec standard cab, long bed 4WD.

[bkkjames]

80K is over a 10% increase as well, I think that is significant for something most people will never have a need for. If you live or plan to drive around places with a lot of mud, it is a benefit.

Service and repair costs are generally higher as well.

As far as resale, it will increase the resale value, but not by 80K. If you want to increase resale value, when you buy a pickup, put the 80K in a high yield fixed account and and cash it in when you sell the pickup.

As far as traction, it will provide better traction in the mud, but it will not help on rain slick roads. There are AWD systems that will help on slick roads, but they don't come on most pickups.

In my opinion, the V-Cross is a good looking unit. It looks better and rides a little higher than the Highlander, I'm sure you'll love it. I'm on my third Isuzu daily driver since I been here. The first was 4WD the second and third (current) were Highanders. All were top-model with AT.

I also have a Spark that I love driving, but I would like to see Isuzu (or Toyota) come with a nice high-spec standard cab, long bed 4WD.

I can assure you my truck is much better on wet, slick roads when in 4x4 mode. Combine this with the heavy rains we get here and even more noticeable.

[fullcave]

As far as traction, it will provide better traction in the mud, but it will not help on rain slick roads. There are AWD systems that will help on slick roads, but they don't come on most pickups.

4wd high gear in a downpour when hydroplaning is of concern makes a huge deference no question. Off road there is no comparisan as getting stuck in the wilderness is not even an option. Had to cross three rivers last time we had flooding in the south, road was closed to ALL 2wd vehicles. Resale is always better with the 4wd, service costs are the same. Used it to pull 2wds out of the mud or sand many times.. The 80k is peanuts for the peace of mind and you will get the money back when you sell...

[Kenny202]

Hard to believe people making comments 4wd of little benefit? In Pattaya or Bangkok maybe not. And of course on a slippery road in 4wd high range has to be better than 2wd? These are facts. It's only a matter of whether u consider it important or not. d max by the way can be driven to a max speed of 100m hour in 4wd high range. Not like the old days where you couldn't drive on a road at any speed in 4wd

[KhnomKhnom]

I have driven and seen all types of roads in Thailand. I have never seen a road that needed 4wheel drive. If the mud is that deep, a motor-driven winch is much more important than 4wheel drive and just what are you doing there anyway.... just wait til it dries up some.

Some highly engineered vehicles, like Porsche, do drive better with 4wheel, but that does not include pick up trucks. So, if 4w does not add any driving advantage, and if you do not want to ford muddy rivers, I ask what is the advantage?

I sense Thai have thought this one through and buy the cheaper 2wheel versions.

[Robert24]

to answer your question:

1) 2WD pick ups are cheaper

2) 2WD use less diesel

3) You hardly ever get into a situation where you need 4WD.

but if you are an offroad fan and like do some extreme roads then 4WD is great. Otherwise probably not worth it.

[Ace of Pop]

to answer your question:

1) 2WD pick ups are cheaper

2) 2WD use less diesel

3) You hardly ever get into a situation where you need 4WD.

but if you are an offroad fan and like do some extreme roads then 4WD is great. Otherwise probably not worth it.

Well said, just noticed the King Cab Navara costs 575K. Big price diff.

[Haecksler]

Kenny,

Interesting post and worth to give a comment.

I am searching for 2 years the same vehicle you just bought but the 3000cc version 2. Hand and find out they are rare. Very rare.

I think the reason that most of Thais do prefer 2WD is simple because of the costs.

As a poster mentioned before for a Thai 80k Baht is much and if they can avoid (or think so) they do.

For farangs 50 or 80K Baht only to upgrade to a 4WD is a no- brainer but not for the majority of Thais.

How ever starting of the rainy season you can discover several models upside down in the ditches as well as stacking in front of different steep slopes here in Phuket, therefore no need to discuss the sense or nonsense of 4WD Pick up.

But there are other down sides as the following which let me decide to purchase a 2WD Isuzu D-Max 10 years ago which I want to replace it now by a 4WD because of my boat. (some of them of course refers to the Isuzu D-Max only):

• When you not use the 4WD often the mechanism in the gear starts to getting jammed and you really struggling to get your Isuzu D-Max into ½ speed 4WD mode.

• At the former Models (I think up to the 2012 model) you have to scarify your coil spring at the front axle because the 4WD version has got a torsion bar spring.

• The angle of your wheels if full locked is much less at the 4WD version making your vehicle uncomfortable to park and manoeuvre into narrow entrances. (Probably the biggest disadvantage)

• There are several more moving parts of course which can be subject to failure as well as some more costs to maintain. (especially the annoying rubber cuff at the front axle shaft which last not more than 100K km)

• A bit higher weight and a bit more fuel consumption.

Therefore if you not have a use for a 4WD e.g. a boat to tow or a remote property it is worth to consider about 4WD or 2WD.

For the sake of safety of a unloaded pick-up in rainy weather there is also the possibility to have some ballast at the back of the truck.

Anyway congratulation to your purchase and drive save all the time!

[transam]

Twice now I have been stuck in mud and my 4x4 stuff got me out where others were stuck, once was in a Temple grounds.

4x4 is great in the rainy season where l live.........

When I bought my truck I could only get auto trans with the 4x4, I would not buy a manual truck, but the 4x4 thingy has been useful and if I had the cash would buy another. As for "high ride" comments, it is handy if on occasions your drive on dodgy ground and don't want to bottom out. Stability in the high ride is OK, noooooo probs.......

[Chwooly]

There are a few contributing factors.

You are certainly right about "looks" - that is extremely important in a Thai market.

Most pickups are available in standard 2wd or 2wd "hi-rider" versions and 4wd versions.

You need to bear in mind that the 4wd systems on a pickup are VERY basic and offer minimal advantages - especially over the "hi-rise" 2wd which has the same advantages of good road view, and that extra bit of ground clearance that you so often need when negotiating the roads and road works of Thailand. in fact for the rural roads of Thailand they are just about the perfect vehicle.

With the higher vehicles you do however sacrifice a bit of safety and handling - the Vigo hi-runner amorously failed the moose test in Sweden.

There is also the saving in cost.

What do you mean by 4w systems being basic? I would think the tech is the same, I could see cost being a factor and reliability maybe since it would be more expensive to service and fix the drivetrain if you have problems and I would think the average farmer thai 50k is a lot of money.

[dtrain5000]

IMO, unless you are living in a hilltribe village in Leoi, having 4WD is a waste of money, and even then most heavy 2WD trucks will still go where a 4WD would go. I speak from experience, having had the PreRunner, which was a fantastic bit of kit and went everywhere, including a moist 1/2 road outside Chiang Mai, 7 people up... no hint of spin. I've even seen standard, ancient pickups taking the back road up Doi Suthep in CM from the lake, and that route is unsealed and basically only doable by scrambler in that direction.

There is very little need for 4WD in Thailand (more ins/tax as well?) and there's more to go wrong and most people with it are driving along flat, sealed roads anyway. Sure, there is face to be gained in having a jack'd up vehicle like the PreRunner (not why I got one), but there is even more face to be gained from a 4WD sticker I would say. I personally find that sadder than sticking with 2WD but having the height advantage of seeing over traffic.

So, in coming on here on your high pony, you kind of look a bit silly having wasted money... IMO of course.

[bkkjames]

IMO, unless you are living in a hilltribe village in Leoi, having 4WD is a waste of money, and even then most heavy 2WD trucks will still go where a 4WD would go. I speak from experience, having had the PreRunner, which was a fantastic bit of kit and went everywhere, including a moist 1/2 road outside Chiang Mai, 7 people up... no hint of spin. I've even seen standard, ancient pickups taking the back road up Doi Suthep in CM from the lake, and that route is unsealed and basically only doable by scrambler in that direction.

There is very little need for 4WD in Thailand (more ins/tax as well?) and there's more to go wrong and most people with it are driving along flat, sealed roads anyway. Sure, there is face to be gained in having a jack'd up vehicle like the PreRunner (not why I got one), but there is even more face to be gained from a 4WD sticker I would say. I personally find that sadder than sticking with 2WD but having the height advantage of seeing over traffic.

So, in coming on here on your high pony, you kind of look a bit silly having wasted money... IMO of course.

yes why didn't i think of it, could have just bought a 4x4 sticker and saved myself 80-100k. lol

[dtrain5000]

I can count on one hand the amount of times I actually needed 4wd in the last 5yrs. A couple times in the mountains driving in Chiang rai (going up Doi Chang area during the rain) and driving around beaches and island like Koh Chang. If you have the money at the time of buying, go for it - if not, it's not really that important. The great thing is when I sold my truck earlier this year, I actually got most of the '4wd' money back. Had it been only 2wd, they would've given me only 310k but instead they gave me just under 400k on trade-in when I upgraded for a new model. I also have a 2wd mu-7 which drives just fine around town just for daily stuff- I wouldn't take it up Doi Chang in the rain or anything, but it has good clearance and I can shove a sofa in the back along with a 50 inch tv if I needed to. I didn't need 4wd for this model since I was using this one for a 'family' car and so I saved myself some money. Basically like everyone else said before, smart buyers get what they actually need -- not a high rise 2wd w/ 35's and custom 20" chrome rims pretending to be an off-road monster parked at Paragon.

Edited December 5, 2014 by dtrain5000

[fullcave]

There are a few contributing factors.

You are certainly right about "looks" - that is extremely important in a Thai market.

Most pickups are available in standard 2wd or 2wd "hi-rider" versions and 4wd versions.

You need to bear in mind that the 4wd systems on a pickup are VERY basic and offer minimal advantages - especially over the "hi-rise" 2wd which has the same advantages of good road view, and that extra bit of ground clearance that you so often need when negotiating the roads and road works of Thailand. in fact for the rural roads of Thailand they are just about the perfect vehicle.

With the higher vehicles you do however sacrifice a bit of safety and handling - the Vigo hi-runner amorously failed the moose test in Sweden.

There is also the saving in cost.

What do you mean by 4w systems being basic? I would think the tech is the same, I could see cost being a factor and reliability maybe since it would be more expensive to service and fix the drivetrain if you have problems and I would think the average farmer thai 50k is a lot of money.

Not really. The farmers down south are all using the 2 door standard cab 4x4 due to the extra payload but of course the cab is very small. In fact, there used the be a huge market for conversions before they became availible stock first from mitzu and now Isuzu in the 600k baht range. It’s perhaps their biggest seller in 4x4 range as 2wd is useless out in the field for palm or rubber farm business. Never heard of any complaints with regards to drive train, in general they will outlast the truck.

[billd766]

Of course if I really had my 'druthers I would druther have one of these with the 6.7 litre turbo diesel engine.

http://www.ford.com/trucks/superduty/trim/f250kingranch/

[samsensam]

i'd guess most people dont need 4wd and the 2wd suits them just fine. maybe they are smarter than you think...

[smotherb]

Am I missing something?

If you don't need 4WD, yep, about 80K Baht.

I grew up with four-wheel drive pick-ups, my first was a 1951 Willys when I was 16--still have a 1966 3/4 ton Jeep 4WD stored on my farm in West Virginia; it simply will not die. I have owned or issued a dozen or more 4WD vehicles--jeeps, pick-ups and SUVs, from the US, UK, and Japan; while in the US, Vietnam, Saudi Arabia, Iran, the Philippines, and Thailand. I am in the market for one now.

I'll say two things: 1) if you need 4WD, you'll wish you had it, and 2) if you don't need 4WD, you'll find a place to use it.

[monkeycountry]

I am guessing many Thais go for 2wd instead of 4wd for the same reasons the OP went for a 2.5 L instead of a 3.0 L. It costs more, and may not be needed.

[bheard]

You are missing something about the Thai mentality perhaps.

Thais will not pay for options of real value if they can get something which looks the same for less. For example they won't pay for airbags or other safety gear if they can get out of it. It's all about looks.

Take the bus chassis they buy from overseas manufacturers. Thais build the bus bodies (often illegally high) onto these chassis in Thailand. These chassis are 'Third world spec' - the most basic eqiuipment money can buy, no manufacturer in a western country would buy them.

4WD falls into the same category.

BTW, Ford Territories in Aus sell approx 30% 4WD, the rest 2WD.

[Ace of Pop]

Recon Ozzie's can put Forward a good case for 4W.D.... Ferangs on Beach Road, not much of one.

[daveAustin]

So, in coming on here on your high pony, you kind of look a bit silly having wasted money... IMO of course.

Whats that supposed to mean on my high pony? Like my question was arrogant?

I asked a simple logical question why Thais prefer 2wd over 4wd? I assume there must be a reason

not that I am smarter than everyone else. Are u for real or have I misread your reply?

Your op was kind of arrogant, old chum; have a re-read. I will apologise for biting your head off, however, as it seems you didn't mean to be.

[Kenny202]

Certainly wasn't meant to be. I have the utmost respect for thai people and culture. And like I said, IMO nothing wrong with buying a vehicle for looks or status. We all do that. As Jeremy Clarkson says...it's not about how fast or we'll a vehicle performs, it's how it makes you feel. Horses for courses :-)