Leaving Thailand for good

[VIPinthailand]

what is hard to understand?double taxation is for USA people., Europeans just need to not take any residence at all, and they become tax free.

What is this "double taxation of USA people" that you talk about?

I have US based income that potentially generates US income taxes (depending on the income amount, and after deductions, exemptions etc) and, as a US citizen, is not reported nor taxed in Thailand.

If I earned income outside the U.S., the first $99,200 (in 2014) is excluded from US income taxes, but do assume it would be taxed in Thailand.

Are you saying that US citizens don't have to report or pay taxes in Thailand whereas other non Thai nationals do.

I am not talking taxes from employment I am talking taxes from overseas investments imported into Thailand.

correct, you do not need to report your worldwide Income to Thai tax office if you are a tourist, or you remain less than 6 months, or you are on a work visa.

if you become a Thai resident, in this case I think you have to pay on your worldwide income. (not sure).

for US people, they have to report at least In the USA if they have no residence and pay tax to USA as USA tax on citizenship and not on residence.

for the rest of the world(all countries except USA & Eritrea ) , no need to report anything if you have no residence. you keep 100% of your cash and enjoy your freedom.( all you pay is VAT on your Apple/Samsung gadgets and landing fees.)

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpetual_traveler

Edited March 11, 2015 by VIPinthailand

[thaibeachlovers]

Lasted seven years, came back last fall.

Cost of living is cheaper here, better quality of life, and:

People smile without hoping for anything other than a smile back;

Haven't heard a single dog bark in three months, let alone been attacked by a pack of them;

No burning of plastic;

No loud music, caterwauling as the moon sets, or unbridled exhaust;

Haven't seen one person pick their nose. Nope, not even the person preparing my food ...

Were there good things about my time in Thailand? Sure, but no where near enough to consider living there any longer, let alone dying there.

My wife is joining me in April. We have a bucket list in the first month that includes:

The Grand Canyon- camping and rafting;

Las Vegas- attending a Cirque de Sol show, and, in the casinos, losing money;

Driving north from San Diego through Malibu, sailing to and about Catalina, then taking Hwy 1 up the coast into Washington State and eventually Victoria, B.C. We'll stop at wineries and cheese farms along the way, detouring for camping in Sequoia National Park, and Redwood National Forest. Then Yosemite and back over to the coast ….

Absolutely no way I would consider wasting another precious day of life in LOS.

It might seem strange, but for some of us, the difference is why we want to live here. For myself, anything is better than the PC riddled official culture that has infected my country. Can't do anything enjoyable, but they won't do anything about the thugs and hooligans, for reasons I can't go into here.

Thailand has it's faults, but at least I feel safe there, unlike back home.

Cost of living is cheaper here,

Unless you chose to live western style, with added import costs, there is no way it is more expensive to live in Thailand than the US.

Absolutely no way I would consider wasting another precious day of life in LOS

Life is what you make it. If you were wasting your life in LOS, that was down to you.

Edited March 11, 2015 by thaibeachlovers

[Keesters]

what is hard to understand?double taxation is for USA people., Europeans just need to not take any residence at all, and they become tax free.

What is this "double taxation of USA people" that you talk about?

I have US based income that potentially generates US income taxes (depending on the income amount, and after deductions, exemptions etc) and, as a US citizen, is not reported nor taxed in Thailand.

If I earned income outside the U.S., the first $99,200 (in 2014) is excluded from US income taxes, but do assume it would be taxed in Thailand.

Are you saying that US citizens don't have to report or pay taxes in Thailand whereas other non Thai nationals do.

I am not talking taxes from employment I am talking taxes from overseas investments imported into Thailand.

correct, you do not need to report your worldwide Income to Thai tax office if you are a tourist, or you remain less than 6 months, or you are on a work visa.

if you become a Thai resident, in this case I think you have to pay on your worldwide income. (not sure).

for US people, they have to report at least In the USA if they have no residence and pay tax to USA as USA tax on citizenship and not on residence.

for the rest of the world(all countries except USA & Eritrea ) , no need to report anything if you have no residence. you keep 100% of your cash and enjoy your freedom.( all you pay is VAT on your Apple/Samsung gadgets and landing fees.)

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpetual_traveler

Talking Thailand only.

You pretty much hit the nail on the head except.

In reality as a tax resident I pay no tax. There must be thousands in the same boat. In fact I doubt any farang who is tax resident and retired, or just living, not working pays tax. I tried. When the tax clearance system was in place I used to pay 2000 per year tax. As soon as it stopped I tried to pay the same but the tax officer said he had no mechanism to record it anymore. So while as a tax resident you should be liable to tax in fact you pay none. Hope you don't work for the TIRS.

[Naam]

question: when was the tax clearance system abolished?

[Keesters]

question: when was the tax clearance system abolished?

Been through my old passports. Last date I can find is 11 March 1991. So sometime within 90 days after that.

Hope that helps.

[Naam]

question: when was the tax clearance system abolished?

Been through my old passports. Last date I can find is 11 March 1991. So sometime within 90 days after that.

Hope that helps.

thanks!

[Penefattore]

I am here 2 years now and I have decided I will not renew my retirement visa next year.

I miss:

beautiful national parks in the US

beautiful coastlines that are not full of litter

forests that actually have abundant wildlife

fresh seafood in the Pacific Northwest

sea kayaking in the PNW being able to buy a real sea kayak, custom fitted to me

the best tasting beer in the world

the best mountain biking in the world and being able to buy a mountain bike in my size

being able to own land and a home in my name

having an intelligent conversation

being about to go listen to live music, going to a concert of someone famous

being able to call 911 and having a well trained paramedic arrive

reliable postal delivery of something important and expensive

I have great health care from my government pension so that is not an issue.

I understand the people that will stay here until the end are many are from UK.

There are some very beautiful places in the US/Canada.

I will take back my thai cooking skills and my defensive motorcycling skills are much better.

nothing here in LOS blew me away... it is not at all paradise to me. I enjoyed the chaos to some extent and loved going to the food markets. I enjoyed motorcycling some of the mountains up north and visiting the hill tribe people and the small villages along the off beaten roads. Cool people there.

BUT, I am cheating myself out a great retirement life living here. I also think it is unsafe and unhealthy living here.

I have many great memories and wonderful adventures awaiting me in the states and I can afford a good life there. This was a stop off to sort out my life after turning 50, retiring and getting a divorce... it has played out for me, time to go enjoy life and have fun.

I will most likely go to Bali for 2 months during the winter if I return to SEA, but more than likely my trips will be South America or Eastern Europe.

to sum it up in one word... you got andropause

[Penefattore]

Lasted seven years, came back last fall.

Cost of living is cheaper here,

Huh????

.

Please don't edit my posts. Forum rules require you quote them in their entirety.

You know, this particular misperception is an ongoing argument on TV. And it is usually made by people with mediocre job histories, and/or a miserable existence in their homeland, making retiring to Asia and "enjoying" forty baht meals out, 150 baht massages, and 1000 baht "girlfriends," a good deal.

All the foods I like are available here at no up charge. In Thailand they carry a 300% up charge---even before Villa or Foodland grab their own take.

On Friday, I bought a very nice Chilean Malbec, on sale, for $4.19. That's 125 baht. IN LOS, the same wine was close to 700 baht. I bought an excellent cheese on special, thick smoked bacon for a dollar a pound, and a steelhead trout filet for $4 (fresh, not farmed). That's far less than what I paid at Villa.

My gym does not require a membership, and so has no pesky salesman. It has a flat rate of $15 per month. I, like all members, have a key, making it available 24/7.

When I use UPS or FedEx here, they are reliable and reasonable. Nothing gets stolen, or nailed for extra fees.

When I pay a serviceman here to do work on my vehicle, or my lawnmower, or my plumbing or electric, it is almost always done expeditiously, safely and right, the first time. This, as opposed to going through a series of workers who not only don't get it right, but often make a problem worse.

In LOS, I never had my '65 Honda motorbike running correctly, because the mechanics were incompetent or dishonest. Or both. This increases a tradesman's "bargain" rates considerably, making them no longer a bargain.

One time when I went to pick up my bike after some work, I noticed the original Honda seat was replaced by junk, and my seat was on the bike of the mechanic's buddy. When I pointed this out, they did this: . When I insisted they put it back on my bike, they became confrontational. I had to pay a cop to get my seat back. I don't think I have never had that experience at a Honda bike shop in the USA.

I bought a new gas BBQ last week at Home Depot. Regular cost was $99. On sale for $69. What's a gas BBQ in Thailand? I know the answer: about 10,000 baht for junk. The price goes up from there. The dumbbells I bought in LOS? One there cost as much as six here.

If I buy something at most stores here, there is a no-questions-asked return policy. I have returned to the local Smith's Supermarket, a number of items I found unsatisfactory. Always a smile when handing back my money. As such, I am a loyal customer. In November after returning to the States, I was checking out some groceries, and the bill was fifty-some dollars. I jokingly asked the checker if he had any coupons. He reached in his apron pocket, and swiped one across the scanner, and my bill dropped to $32. This is now a regular occurrence.

Gas where I live is almost half the price it is in Thailand. It is lower in other states.

In Thailand used vehicles carry a ridiculous price. Last week, I bought a '66 Chevy Bel Air. It had sat in an old lady's garage for years, and has 38,000 original miles. I paid $3700 for it. Now I have my eye on a '65, fully restored Chev pickup. $7000. Far less than a used pickup in average condition in Thailand. Both are investments that will never lose me money.

The Asian market I shop in Salt Lake City, actually has lower prices than back at Rhek Thum's "fresh market." And they are the same brands.

Here the tennis courts are free, and in good condition.

Here, cops don't stop me when I'm driving legally, unlike Thailand where they attempt to extort money. And here, Avis doesn't even think of extorting me for a pre-existing scratch, when I return a rental to the airport, just because I speak English.

My dentist here does not try to drill out non-existent cavities, nor pull a cracked tooth that can be repaired (if you have good training), nor spends a mere 15 minutes "cleaning" my teeth. Here it takes a solid hour,and is done right, so I only have to go twice a year rather than every couple of months.

This summer I'm out to buy a piece of land and build a vacation home. It's mine when I'm done, though my wife's name will also be on it. And where we are building, land is cheaper per acre than the rubber tree land where I lived in Rhek Thum. Don't believe me? Do your due diligence and research it, and you'll find my claim holds water.

Most of the nutritional products I take that keep me free of those expensive American doctor bills, are not available in Thailand. The few that are, are substantially lower in price here than in LOS. After feeling like crap the past few years, I am once again healthy and have my vitality back. That has great economic value.

The firearms I buy to go hunting and target shooting are at the very least, 1/3 the price they are in Thailand. The books I read are cheaper when new at the store, and a once-read paperback bought at a garage sale is 10 baht.

The tools I will use to build my house, Makita, Ryobi, and Milwaukee, are much less expensive here in the States. And if they break, the warranty work is done locally and in days. Usually they just hand over a new tool. The building material selection is far more diverse here, enabling both short-term and long-term savings.

Are there exceptions? Are there things cheaper in LOS?

Sure. Instant water heaters, air conditioners, unhygienic meals out, short-time"girlfriends," and massages. There are others, such as contact lenses, but as a whole do not measure up to a genuine savings.

Many items may be cheaper, but are built so cheaply they have a crap service life. Water pumps, clothing, and electrical items are a good example. Speaking of clothing, I bought new Levis last month. On sale, plus a coupon, $22 a pair. Good luck with that in LOS.

Want to retire to a warm climate that has reasonable prices? Try Port Charlotte, Florida. Check out the land and housing prices, and all the free services and discounts for seniors. Thailand does not even come close.

I hear you do not even have to pay for food in the US, you can get food stamps for free, and many do

not to mention dumpster diving

[1BADDAT]

what is hard to understand?double taxation is for USA people., Europeans just need to not take any residence at all, and they become tax free.

What is this "double taxation of USA people" that you talk about?

I have US based income that potentially generates US income taxes (depending on the income amount, and after deductions, exemptions etc) and, as a US citizen, is not reported nor taxed in Thailand.

If I earned income outside the U.S., the first $99,200 (in 2014) is excluded from US income taxes, but do assume it would be taxed in Thailand.

Are you saying that US citizens don't have to report or pay taxes in Thailand whereas other non Thai nationals do.

I am not talking taxes from employment I am talking taxes from overseas investments imported into Thailand.

correct, you do not need to report your worldwide Income to Thai tax office if you are a tourist, or you remain less than 6 months, or you are on a work visa.

if you become a Thai resident, in this case I think you have to pay on your worldwide income. (not sure).

for US people, they have to report at least In the USA if they have no residence and pay tax to USA as USA tax on citizenship and not on residence.

for the rest of the world(all countries except USA & Eritrea ) , no need to report anything if you have no residence. you keep 100% of your cash and enjoy your freedom.( all you pay is VAT on your Apple/Samsung gadgets and landing fees.)

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpetual_traveler

Talking Thailand only.

You pretty much hit the nail on the head except.

In reality as a tax resident I pay no tax. There must be thousands in the same boat. In fact I doubt any farang who is tax resident and retired, or just living, not working pays tax. I tried. When the tax clearance system was in place I used to pay 2000 per year tax. As soon as it stopped I tried to pay the same but the tax officer said he had no mechanism to record it anymore. So while as a tax resident you should be liable to tax in fact you pay none. Hope you don't work for the TIRS.

You paid 2000 baht a year in thai tax on your offshore income? How much tax would you have paid that same year if you were a resident in your home country? Just a rough estimate would be sufficient.

[Keesters]

what is hard to understand?double taxation is for USA people., Europeans just need to not take any residence at all, and they become tax free.

What is this "double taxation of USA people" that you talk about?

I have US based income that potentially generates US income taxes (depending on the income amount, and after deductions, exemptions etc) and, as a US citizen, is not reported nor taxed in Thailand.

If I earned income outside the U.S., the first $99,200 (in 2014) is excluded from US income taxes, but do assume it would be taxed in Thailand.

Are you saying that US citizens don't have to report or pay taxes in Thailand whereas other non Thai nationals do.

I am not talking taxes from employment I am talking taxes from overseas investments imported into Thailand.

correct, you do not need to report your worldwide Income to Thai tax office if you are a tourist, or you remain less than 6 months, or you are on a work visa.

if you become a Thai resident, in this case I think you have to pay on your worldwide income. (not sure).

for US people, they have to report at least In the USA if they have no residence and pay tax to USA as USA tax on citizenship and not on residence.

for the rest of the world(all countries except USA & Eritrea ) , no need to report anything if you have no residence. you keep 100% of your cash and enjoy your freedom.( all you pay is VAT on your Apple/Samsung gadgets and landing fees.)

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpetual_traveler

Talking Thailand only.

You pretty much hit the nail on the head except.

In reality as a tax resident I pay no tax. There must be thousands in the same boat. In fact I doubt any farang who is tax resident and retired, or just living, not working pays tax. I tried. When the tax clearance system was in place I used to pay 2000 per year tax. As soon as it stopped I tried to pay the same but the tax officer said he had no mechanism to record it anymore. So while as a tax resident you should be liable to tax in fact you pay none. Hope you don't work for the TIRS.

You paid 2000 baht a year in thai tax on your offshore income? How much tax would you have paid that same year if you were a resident in your home country? Just a rough estimate would be sufficient.

That's a very hard question to answer as I had no intention of being a resident of UK as soon as I got an overseas posting at age 25.

Suffice to say it would have been a lot lot more than I paid in Thailand. But please remember you cannot just compare tax savings. UK has free medical & sickness benefit. Thailand does not for its foreign residents. Sorry I cannot give you a figure or even guess one. I don't know how to calculate it. So many factors to consider that I've never had to consider before.

Tax savings was not my reason for being here. There's lot more to life than just money.

[CharlieH]

off topic posts removed

[VIPinthailand]

yes, free medical in UK.

ask Nigel about his balls!

[The Dancer]

Second best decision of my life: move to the US. Studied at a great school, got a marketable degree, then a job that in 13 years made me not rich but comfortable. And then I made the best decision of my life. Get the hell out that miserable place and move to Thailand. Now, here in Bkk it's been 9 years and 0 regrets.

But to each his/her own. Whatever floats your boat: Thai street food or Whole Foods, rented gfs or coequal ones, ... And, of course, you've got to believe what you did is right and that where you are is best. Otherwise, you've been stupid which is not nice to believe at all.

[TIMMOC]

Means 'don't talk' -- I said toiletries above and didn't feel the need to detail items in what Walmart.com refers to the 'Sexual Wellness' department. Also last trip bought a Lodge cast-iron frying pan.

Even I knew that, and I haven't lived in Thailand since 1986.

[georgegeorgia]

Absolutely.......if the force be with me. The present moment is all I have so I'm here forever.

Thats sounds very sad you have no options.

[Naam]

what is hard to understand?double taxation is for USA people., Europeans just need to not take any residence at all, and they become tax free.

So can legally live in thailand and earn money from a source outside of thailand and not have to pay any tax in thailand by the official thai rules?

correct!

[jdinasia]

what is hard to understand?double taxation is for USA people., Europeans just need to not take any residence at all, and they become tax free.

So can legally live in thailand and earn money from a source outside of thailand and not have to pay any tax in thailand by the official thai rules?

correct!

Correct only regarding income tax

[Naam]

what is hard to understand?double taxation is for USA people., Europeans just need to not take any residence at all, and they become tax free.

So can legally live in thailand and earn money from a source outside of thailand and not have to pay any tax in thailand by the official thai rules?

correct!

Correct only regarding income tax

correct too!

[PHP87]

Lasted seven years, came back last fall.

Cost of living is cheaper here, better quality of life, and:

People smile without hoping for anything other than a smile back;

Haven't heard a single dog bark in three months, let alone been attacked by a pack of them;

No burning of plastic;

No loud music, caterwauling as the moon sets, or unbridled exhaust;

Haven't seen one person pick their nose. Nope, not even the person preparing my food ...

Were there good things about my time in Thailand? Sure, but no where near enough to consider living there any longer, let alone dying there.

My wife is joining me in April. We have a bucket list in the first month that includes:

The Grand Canyon- camping and rafting;

Las Vegas- attending a Cirque de Sol show, and, in the casinos, losing money;

Driving north from San Diego through Malibu, sailing to and about Catalina, then taking Hwy 1 up the coast into Washington State and eventually Victoria, B.C. We'll stop at wineries and cheese farms along the way, detouring for camping in Sequoia National Park, and Redwood National Forest. Then Yosemite and back over to the coast ….

Absolutely no way I would consider wasting another precious day of life in LOS.

I CANNOT believe your comment!

I mean, how did you ever last 7 years, or even 7 months, in the first place.

The first day I hit Thailand, I LOVED it.

There was not one day that went by that I did not like it.

I have lived for a time in the USA, but the Kooky Koche brothers mentality has pervaded the whole GD country.

People in the USA, now, and for the past 30 years since I left, have become really nuttier than fruitcakes.

I kid you not.

Well.....

As they say,

Each to his own,

And may you lie in it.

True. One look at the idiot that was voted into the Presidency not once but twice is proof that America is circling the drain.

Of course with his cheerleaders in the media and the continued dumbing down of America in media and academia, it's no wonder.

[Thai at Heart]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Used to.

Glad I woke up and left. If I was single maybe I could have done it, but parental responsibility meant I was honor bound to leave.

Good for you and your family, but please don't look down on those who feel Thailand is a better place to raise a child.

Don't look down, just glad for myself that I could find a way to get out. My kids loved it in Thailand. They love it in the UK too. They can always go back, they are Thai.

There is upbringing and education, neither place is perfect, but the education in Thailand is terrible.

[VIPinthailand]

USA has 100 millions unemployed. over 50 %

who want go back there? Europe is not much better.

Edited March 27, 2015 by VIPinthailand

[NCFC]

USA has 100 millions unemployed. over 50 %

who want go back there? Europe is not much better.

So you are in Thailand because you can't get a job in USA or Europe?

[PHP87]

I can't understand those that say the cost of living is cheaper in the US than in Thailand.

Perhaps if you compare living somewhere in Arkansas, Alabama or thereabouts compared to Bangkok, then perhaps.

But if you compare the cost of living of San Francisco/SF Bay Area compared to a city like Chiang Mai, the cost of living is far, far less in CM

Numbeo is a great resource for COL comparisons.

Numbeo Cost Of Living

Edited March 27, 2015 by PHP87

[SpokaneAl]

USA has 100 millions unemployed. over 50 %

who want go back there? Europe is not much better.

Wow, do you just make this stuff up?

[SpokaneAl]

I can't understand those that say the cost of living is cheaper in the US than in Thailand.

Perhaps if you compare living somewhere in Arkansas, Alabama or thereabouts compared to Bangkok, then perhaps.

But if you compare the cost of living of San Francisco/SF Bay Area compared to a city like Chiang Mai, the cost of living is far, far less in CM

Numbeo is a great resource for COL comparisons.

Numbeo Cost Of Living

I agree. I would be willing to talk about the many terrific advantages of living in the US but cost of living would not be one of them.

[thaibeachlovers]

I can't understand those that say the cost of living is cheaper in the US than in Thailand.

Perhaps if you compare living somewhere in Arkansas, Alabama or thereabouts compared to Bangkok, then perhaps.

But if you compare the cost of living of San Francisco/SF Bay Area compared to a city like Chiang Mai, the cost of living is far, far less in CM

Numbeo is a great resource for COL comparisons.

Numbeo Cost Of Living

I agree. I would be willing to talk about the many terrific advantages of living in the US but cost of living would not be one of them.

Certainly the thought of being able to legally shoot any home invader would be a great incentive for me to live there . Pity all the other stuff puts me off.

[WarpSpeed]

Lasted seven years, came back last fall.

Cost of living is cheaper here,

Huh????

That's right! Especially when considering quality. And he's mostly speaking of the west coast, the east coast is even less expensive.

[WarpSpeed]

I can't understand those that say the cost of living is cheaper in the US than in Thailand.

Perhaps if you compare living somewhere in Arkansas, Alabama or thereabouts compared to Bangkok, then perhaps.

But if you compare the cost of living of San Francisco/SF Bay Area compared to a city like Chiang Mai, the cost of living is far, far less in CM

Numbeo is a great resource for COL comparisons.

Numbeo Cost Of Living

If you compare quality versus cost it most certainly is cheaper to live stateside then Thailand, there are a lot of places besides the west coast which is prohibitively expensive to live, only a few things in Thailand work out cheaper but then it balances out in favor of the states eventually. And there is NO comparison to cleanliness, that's a wash in favor of the states. Forget it if you have children and want them to get a decent education at a reasonable cost, not happening in Thailand.

Edited March 29, 2015 by WarpSpeed

[WarpSpeed]

Lasted seven years, came back last fall.

Cost of living is cheaper here,

Huh????

It is for me, to live a Western lifestyle. I don't want to live "like a Thai."

Bingo!

[SpokaneAl]

With the size of the U.S. there certainly are many, many choices in climate, geography, population density, racial makeup, home pricing, job availability etc. If you can't find a place that meets your needs, you ain't looking hard enough.

To come half way around the world to a foreign country, with language and customs that are so different, while listing cost of living as the primary driver seems a bit sad to me.

I think many expats tend to post negatively about where they came from in order to rationalize and justify their own decision in their mind, and, hopefully, in the minds of others.

Edited March 29, 2015 by SpokaneAl