Poland fury at Holocaust comment by FBI's James Comey

[webfact]

Poland summons US envoy over FBI head's Holocaust comments
MONIKA SCISLOWSKA, Associated Press

WARSAW, Poland (AP) — Poland's Foreign Ministry urgently summoned U.S. Ambassador Stephen Mull on Sunday to "protest and demand an apology," saying the head of the FBI suggested that Poles were accomplices in the Holocaust.

FBI director James Comey made the remarks in an article about the need to educate about the Holocaust that was published by The Washington Post on Thursday. It was adapted from a speech he gave Wednesday at the U.S. Holocaust Memorial Museum.

In the article, Comey said, "In their minds, the murderers and accomplices of Germany, and Poland, and Hungary, and so many, many other places didn't do something evil. They convinced themselves it was the right thing to do, the thing they had to do."

The words raised a storm among politicians in Poland, where the elderly still remember the brutality of the German occupation during World War II, in which more than 6 million Polish citizens were killed.

Prime Minister Ewa Kopacz said Comey's words were "unacceptable" in Poland.

"To those who are incapable of presenting the historic truth in an honest way, I want to say that Poland was not a perpetrator but a victim of World War II," Kopacz said. "I would expect full historical knowledge from officials who speak on the matter."

Tomasz Nalecz, an aide to President Bronislaw Komorowski, in a debate on TVN24 called Comey a "blockhead," but added that the "stupidity of one official does not erase the friendship between Poland and the U.S."

But Auschwitz survivor, 93-year-old Wladyslaw Bartoszewski, a Pole, said he was concerned that he could hear "stupid words" coming from a politician close to the U.S. president.

After meeting with Deputy Foreign Minister Leszek Soczewica on Sunday, Mull said he would urgently contact the FBI and Washington about the matter. Earlier in the day, Mull said in Polish that Comey's words were "wrong, harmful and offensive," and didn't reflect the U.S. administration's views.

The meeting was held shortly after Mull attended ceremonies marking the 72nd anniversary of the Warsaw Ghetto uprising against the Nazi Germans, who transported tens of thousands of the residents who remained in the ghetto to their deaths at the Majdanek camp operated by the Germans near the Polish city of Lublin.

Nazi Germany brutally occupied Poland from 1939-45, and ran death camps here, killing millions of Jews, Poles and others.


-- (c) Associated Press 2015-04-20

[ukrules]

I have a feeling this is going to escalate quickly

[simon43]

So are the Poles saying that there was not a single Pole who was a German accomplice?

Sorry - they are deluding themselves if they believe that. If the comment by Corney is as quoted, then I don't see what all the fuss is about - unless people don't want to face the ugly truth.

[zaphod reborn]

The FBI has no business commenting on international affairs. That's not their area of responsibility. Comey needs to be reprimanded.

[NeverSure]

The head of the FBI. That would be another one of Obama's brilliant appointments and immediate subordinates.

He may actually believe what he said.

[zydeco]

The Poles should have kept their mouths shut. Now, the protests will lead to open inquiry of a subject that isn't much discussed these days. And it's going to leave the Poles looking very, very bad.

[pedro01]

Even German Jews helped kill in the holocaust.

This is well known.

But I think that you need to understand the context in which they were helping.

[hard124get]

Yes, they should educate themselves and read "The Holocaust Industry" by Norman Finkelstein.

[NanLaew]

Bad grammar? Speed reading a prepared speech? The first reading of the quote does infer that whole nations were accomplices in the genocide but surely nobody believes that to be the case? Assuredly there were individuals both from and in these named nations that were Nazi accomplices and I would hope that was what this FBI 'talking head' meant to say. He was talking at the U.S. Holocaust Memorial Museum after all. It seems like some people are misreading this as something akin to what that Iranian buffoon Ahmadinejad said at the UN.

[bitcoinbob]

once again the Europeans want to deny that the middle east jewish problem is and was not a European problem but it is. at the end of world war 2 when the jews were trying to return to their homes and farms the poles who were not sent to camps had taken all the possessions they even had bounties on returning jews 5 lbs of sugar to kill jews. that is why they had to return to the american admin refugee camps and eventually find there way to Palestine. the poles at the end of the war are just as bad as the nazis- they just dont want to accept responsibility for what they did to these poor jews returning from death camps.

[NeverSure]

I think we're missing something. The guy has no business commenting at all about other nations in this context.

It's above his pay grade.

It's a major international faux pas.

[ALLSEEINGEYE]

The head of the FBI. That would be another one of Obama's brilliant appointments and immediate subordinates.

He may actually believe what he said.

And how many Bush appointees believe the world is 6000 years old or that while being raped a woman's vagina can fend off the sperm from this specific type of attack?

[ABCer]

Ask any Russian, Ukrainian or a Jew.

Poles were and still are the greatest anti-semites in Europe... BEFORE Germans.

This is a fact. Sorry if it offends somebody's political correctness.

As to the propriety of the J. Comey remark - it depends on the circumstances, place and time of it.

A Head or a Bum of FBI - he still has the right to speak his mind, especially if it is truth.

[Cats4ever]

Anti Semitism was alive and cooking in Poland. Whether they would have gone as far as the germans is another matter. Ukrainians and Russians were not too good either. "Beyond the Pale" is a saying from pogrom era Russia. Some Ukrainians were a great help to the einsatzgruppen.

Primitive atavism is deep within humans. Most cope with it better than the vicious haters that crop up against various groups, breeds or political trends.

[Beetlejuice]

I am not psychic but can easily predict how this thread is going to progress.

The theme is the US envoy`s Holocaust comments regarding Poland`s attitudes toward the Jews during WW2. My guess is that this thread will transpire into a debate about the middle east, the Jews in general, a platform for the right wingers amongst us and then jingthing coming to the offensive.

Be interesting to see if this thread can stay on topic.

[Humberstone]

Anti Semitism was alive and cooking in Poland. Whether they would have gone as far as the germans is another matter. Ukrainians and Russians were not too good either. "Beyond the Pale" is a saying from pogrom era Russia. Some Ukrainians were a great help to the einsatzgruppen.

Primitive atavism is deep within humans. Most cope with it better than the vicious haters that crop up against various groups, breeds or political trends.

Anti semitism has been prevalent in every European country at one time or another. And the phrase 'beyond the pale' has nothing to do with the pogroms, it's derived from Irish history

[StasD]

Poland is "the hyena of Europe" -Sir Winston Leonard Spencer-Churchill. I think the american said the truth of them

[Jingthing]

I am guessing that haven't dealt with this in their education system which might mean that Poles actually believes their lies. Sad thing. But that said, Poland in general was definitely a very huge victim of WW2 in so MANY ways from multiple sides.

As far as the FBI guy's role I wonder if the speech was done officially or in some private capacity. Americans have the right of free speech.

Anyway, I am happy that there is a great alliance now between modern Poland and the USA and I really doubt this will seriously impact that.

Edited April 20, 2015 by Jingthing

[Baerboxer]

I am not psychic but can easily predict how this thread is going to progress.

The theme is the US envoy`s Holocaust comments regarding Poland`s attitudes toward the Jews during WW2. My guess is that this thread will transpire into a debate about the middle east, the Jews in general, a platform for the right wingers amongst us and then jingthing coming to the offensive.

Be interesting to see if this thread can stay on topic.

You psychic powers let you down, or is it just your reading comprehension.

Since when as the Head of the FBI been a US envoy?

The US envoy, HE the Ambassador to Poland has made a statement after being summoned by Polish authorities in reaction to the FBI chiefs speech,

[Baerboxer]

So are the Poles saying that there was not a single Pole who was a German accomplice?

Sorry - they are deluding themselves if they believe that. If the comment by Corney is as quoted, then I don't see what all the fuss is about - unless people don't want to face the ugly truth.

HE the American Ambassador to Poland says the FBI chief's words were wrong.

So you will be writing to him to put him right then?

[Baerboxer]

I am guessing that haven't dealt with this in their education system which might mean that Poles actually believes their lies. Sad thing. But that said, Poland in general was definitely a very huge victim of WW2 in so MANY ways from multiple sides.

As far as the FBI guy's role I wonder if the speech was done officially or in some private capacity. Americans have the right of free speech.

Anyway, I am happy that there is a great alliance now between modern Poland and the USA and I really doubt this will seriously impact that.

No idea what Poland teaches in it's history lessons, or how many Poles chose (many claimed were forced) to fight for Nazi Germany, or how many were SS or became part of the death camp and associated logistics organizations. Probability suggests there must have been some. I know that many of the guards on the transport trains and camps were Ukrainian or Croats (family members were involved in detention of those guards).

But Poland did suffer terribly. The Nazis and Russian Communists (which included Jews) carved Poland up and massacred huge numbers. Stalin's NKVD took out intellectuals, Army officers, teachers, academics, any they thought might be a threat - I doubt they cared whether they were Jew, Catholic, or atheist.

Stalin's refusal to help, or to allow the allies to use Russia as a base for help, of the Warsaw Ghetto uprising was a disgrace, one of his many.

Germany does teach and has taken massive steps to prevent this happening again in that country. Has Russia, Ukraine, Hungary, Poland - sorry don't know, but don't think so. Western European countries that were occupied by Nazi Germany also transported Jews and others to the camps. Do they all tell the details in their history. On the other side of the world Japan has never accepted, said sorry, or really been held accountable for it's war crimes and refuses to include them in it's history lessons.

At least there are organizations that work to show the true history and ensure it's not re-written to suit the politically correct or swept under the carpet.

[lostoday]

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/19/world/europe/poland-reconnects-to-jewish-past-with-museum.html?pagewanted=1&_r=3&ref=world&pagewanted=print

When 1,250 Warsaw high school students were recently asked which group suffered more in the war, Poles or Jews, nearly half, 44 percent, said the two groups had suffered equally; 28 percent answered Jews; and 25 percent said Poles.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/12/museum-of-the-history-of-polish-jews_n_3069613.html?utm_hp_ref=world

Among painful episodes that the museum will address in the permanent exhibition opening next year are pogroms in the late 19th century, boycotts of Jewish businesses in the 1920s and 1930s, and calls to deport Poland's 3.3 million Jews, the largest per capita Jewish population in any European country.

Its materials promise to tell the story of the Jedwabne massacre in World War II, when about 40 Poles hunted down the town's Jews, shut them in a barn and set it alight, killing more than 300 people.

Edited April 20, 2015 by lostoday

[HerbalEd]

I am not psychic but can easily predict how this thread is going to progress.

The theme is the US envoy`s Holocaust comments regarding Poland`s attitudes toward the Jews during WW2. My guess is that this thread will transpire into a debate about the middle east, the Jews in general, a platform for the right wingers amongst us and then jingthing coming to the offensive.

Be interesting to see if this thread can stay on topic.

Well, so far you're off topic.

[NeverSure]

A Head or a Bum of FBI - he still has the right to speak his mind, especially if it is truth.

Not true when he represents the USA and his statements can be taken as opinion of the USA. He's created a real problem.

"After meeting with (Polish) Deputy Foreign Minister Leszek Soczewica on Sunday, (US Ambassador Stephen) Mull said he would urgently contact the FBI and Washington about the matter. Earlier in the day, (Ambassador) Mull said in Polish that Comey’s words were “wrong, harmful and offensive”, and didn’t reflect the US administration’s views."

LINK

"FBI Director’s Washington Post Column Leads to Diplomatic Spat With Poland."

LINK

[arjunadawn]

The head of the FBI. That would be another one of Obama's brilliant appointments and immediate subordinates.

He may actually believe what he said.

And how many Bush appointees believe the world is 6000 years old or that while being raped a woman's vagina can fend off the sperm from this specific type of attack?

Wow! Such a thought provoking question; it stumped me. After googling both I did not find any information. Would you please follow through and tell us how many think the world is 6000 years old... and the vagina/sperm question? This one really evidences a depth of knowledge I do not have but would be pleased to learn more. Thank you. Oh, and please tie it in with the OP. I eagerly await you tying this in with a Polish political gaffe in the US.

My best...

[how241]

The FBI has no business commenting on international affairs. That's not their area of responsibility. Comey needs to be reprimanded.

+1....They should stick to solving crimes.

[lostoday]

The FBI has no business commenting on international affairs. That's not their area of responsibility. Comey needs to be reprimanded.

+1....They should stick to solving crimes.

What the Poles did to the Jews was a crime.

[CMBob]

Given he was the author of the article and did so as part of the FBI, I fully agree with the comments that he had no business whatsoever talking about international matters as the jurisdiction of the FBI is basically domestic and certainly doesn't include history lessons about WW II atrocities committed in Europe. On the other hand, his language is a bit confusing and I'm not sure he was really blaming Poland (as a government or generically as a people) for the events.

But I also agree that it wasn't real bright for the Polish government to so stridently attack what they think he said or meant as that opens the door for articles about Nazi collaboration which existed in many countries (and some at the governmental level). For example, the Vichy government of France helping the Nazis to round up Jews was horrible (and I actually wonder....but really don't know....how much this history is taught in France or elsewhere).

[Harveyg]

The head of the FBI. That would be another one of Obama's brilliant appointments and immediate subordinates.

He may actually believe what he said.

In reference to your last sentence, Zydeco, in a the post following this one, actually rebutts you much better than I would have.

[Jingthing]

I'm sorry, but a U.S. citizen made a speech at a museum in the U.S. He was speaking about history. He was acting as a free American citizen. I don't see how this could have been an official act of the FBI and he certainly had nothing to do with U.S. - Poland diplomatic relations ... again a speech at a museum. I'm sorry if actual U.S. diplomats have caved on this but that's what diplomats do sometimes, gloss over the truth with sugary lies just to calm things down.

Edited April 20, 2015 by Jingthing