Immigration Confirms The End Of Border Runs From Oct 1, 2006

[zeusbheld]

I suspect a lot of people will be washing or losing their passports. Maybe this is a plot hatched by the USA and UK to increase passport issuance.

At 70 dollars per passport (USA) it could amount to a lot of money.

New passport, no stamps.

Not sure that's as true as it once was. The computer system, though it's on-line at only 15 locations, is designed to track, and at some stage you either have to get the visa transfered from old to new passport, or present both passports at exit.

Regards

additionally, if you are american and lose your passport too many times, especially if you travel to asia a lot, the feds will keep a close eye on you. they'll start wondering if you've been selling them to passport-fakers.

[jezchesters]

I SEE THE FRENZY CONTINUES TODAY AS WELL

The Bangkok Post and the Forbes articles misquoted the term VOA for US/UK/EU nationalities. A visa is NOT required for citizens from those countries enterting the Kingdom . On arrival you are issued a 30 day permission to stay stamp, which is being called a VOA. Seeing as there is no visa stamped into your passport it's not that at all, it's more a "Permitted To Stay Until" stamp. US/UK/EU are VISA EXEMPT entry countries.

Tourist Visa's, either 30 or 60 day stays, can be had easily in any Asian country bordering Thailand, even w/multiple re-entrys (albeit they are not free, nor is the multiple re-entry). I even believe at Don Muang there is a counter where you can fill out a Tourist Visa application before getting into the line at immigrations, although I could be wrong.

Those same valid Tourist Visas (30 or 60 day) can be extended at Thai Immigrations twice, first for 30 days, then again for an additional 15 days (granted at a cost of 1900B per extension). In theory that would give someone on a 60 Day Tourist Visa a total stay in the Kingdom of 105 days before they'd have to even leave the Kingdom. No border run, no nothing. Once the 105 days have expired you then would have to leave the Kingdom, apply for another Tourist Visa, and do the procedure again.

There has been no mention of curtailing or limiting the number of VALID Tourist Visas in a person's passport, so you should still be able to get them as easily as you can now, and have pages of them in your passport.

The "loophole" on the countries who are visa exempt and issued 30 day "Permitted To Stay" stamps has had the law in place for a while to curtail chronic offenders the endless entries, but not been inforced.

If people switched to VALID 30 or 60 Day Tourist Visas, (again; not to be confused w/Visa Exempt "Permitted to Stay" stamps) I think it would be a work around to the coming changes.

Again, while the new enforcement doesn't affect me I am sympathetic to the many people who's lives are affected.

It will be interesting to see how this all pans out.

If anyone can offer a valid explanation why what I outlined concerning Tourist Visas won't work, please let me know, as I perused the articles closely. I saw nothing mentioned about any other type of Visa aside from the misquoted VOA. (which as I've said are Visa Exempt 30 day "Permitted to Stay" stamps for most "First Worlders").

take care,

tod in Krung Thep

Well done Todd! Finally someone that has calmed down enough to read what has actually been written on the subject!

I had a lot of dealings with the IND whilst managing a language school back in the UK, so have some idea about the terminology involved. From the original article we have quotes such as:

"Currently, tourists from http://www.thaivisa.com/479.0.html can enter Thailand without visas and stay in the kingdom for up to 30 days. They can extend their stay by checking out of the country, mainly by crossing the borders of neighboring Cambodia and Laos, and returning with new entry stamps."

"Tourists are taking advantage of the visa exemption law"

OK - first things first - this only applies to people that don't have a visa. It doesn't apply to people with tourist visas.

This has nothing to do with Visa on Arrival. If you are a citizen from anyone of the 41 countries mentioned and you arrive in the Kingdom, you are automatically given 30 days Leave to Remain. This saves you the hassle of applying for a visa if you are coming over for a short holiday. If you are coming for longer, all you have to do is apply for the appropriate visa before coming to Thailand.

Secondly, if you do decide to not apply for a visa, but decide to renew your Leave to Remain by crossing a border and then returning, we have the question of whether we are talking about 90 aggregate days.

Again, look at the original article:

"From October, tourists from the designated countries can still enter Thailand without visas and stay for up to 30 days, but their entry stamps will be renewable twice at most for a maximum stay of 90 days."

In other words, 3 seperate periods of stay in Thailand, not totalling more than 90 days.

eg: 30 day stamp - stay in Thailand for 20 days - leave Thailand for 10 days - return and get a new 30 day stamp - stay in Thailand for 3 days - leave Thailand for 1 day - return and get a new 30 day stamp - stay in Thailand for 15 days - leave Thailand

In all, you would have spent 38 days in Thailand out of 49 days. Follwing this, you would then have to leave Thailand for a minimum of 90 days - but only if the next time you returned, you did so without a visa and wanted to use the 30 day Leave to Remain again. If you returned with a valid visa, this would not apply.

This is because, as mentioned in the article, you would have had your entry stamps renewed twice at most

As mentioned by other posters, I'm guessing that the reason for this is that it encourages people to apply for the appropriate visa if they intend to stay in Thailand for an extended period of time. This serves two purposes: firstly you have to go through the application process at the relevant consulate, thus aiding security; and secondly, the govenment actually makes some money out of your visa fees, rather than some privately owned visa-running company.

Funnily enough, the IND did a very similar thing in the UK when it came to granting Student Visas for non-EU and Commonwealth citizens...

Hope that all made sense!

Jez

Hello,

This is my first posting here so if I mess it up - please be nice to me people!

I have been following this thread for 2 days with it open on my PC at work (sorry Boss!) and I'm struck, as are others, by not only the amount of Fear Uncertanty and Doubt but also the facetious replies from some people on what is to many, a serious issue. I have a very good friend in Thailand who is just getting by on his UK pensions, supporting a family in rural Thailand and has no choice but to do monthly visa runs. I don't think he's aware of all this, as he isn't on line - how ever am I to break it to him?

May I also seek an opinion on my personal situation please.

I live in UK and am preparing to retire to Thailand - Under the current rules (!) I will qualify for a retirement visa (by way of age, finance etc.)

MEANWHILE, I like to visit Thailand as often as possible so I get a 2month TOURIST visa from the UK consulate, extend it by 1month in Phuket or Pattaya thus giving me 90 days total in Thailand. In the past IF I wish to stay longer in Thailand, I've then hopped over to Burma for a day with friends and gone back to Thailand getting a 30day permission to stay stamp on entry.

(I realise I can renew for 15 days but have preferred to "go for the 30" as it's more cost-effective.)

This means that I have 90days in Thailand on Tourist Visa+extension and a further 30 days with just the permission to stay.

My question is - will this still be allowed or MUST I get a double-entry tourist visa in UK before I leave?

I haven't seen this asked so far - sorry if adding yet more FUD but I really would like to know.

Mike in UK

As far as I understand it yes. You will leave the Kingdom as a visa holder, and then return under the Leave to Remain. If so required, you could do this once more...

[mrtoad]

Well, it appears that the plot is slowly unravelling - limits on Visa, property ownership, foreign investment, foreign development etc, etc....

Anyway, I'm not going to say I'm allright jack, cos the rate this is going that could change to in the next few days.

Where will this end?

Koh Samui

Phuket

Koh Samet

Bangkok Herald-Examiner

22 Feb 2007

Predictable News of the Future Department

*edit*

Forget to add in:

"cue lonely crickets chirping in the background"

LOL

LOS - Land of Silence

[steveromagnino]

Does anyone think they are done, or are they in the proccess of revamping all visa classes?

Ray

excellent question. this could be a complete overhaul of all visa types. wonder how the high and mighties will feel about potenially being affected as well. That would be justice I suppose to those who thought they were comfy in their visa situations while looking down at those in a predicament over these developments. All i can say is watch your back, you may be next

I would hope nobody is looking down on anyone here; that isn't how I have read the responses in this thread really at all. It has more been a case of recommending that people get the visa fitting why they are here, and emphasizing that the economic fall out of enforcing the spirit of the law is probably insufficient to get it overturned. (e.g. enforcing the existing laws on say prostitution or gambling would have such massive impact, that realistically enforcing those over night would just not be possible; I don't see that as the case here).

You have to look at this in the context of a political party seeking to get into power. Be that as it may that in fact the ruler of said party has himself been selling out to foreigners, by implementing this it is a bit of a no loss strategy; the people with even a small amount of money can still find ways to stay and the impact of those unable to stay is going to be slight. Perhaps not slight for sectors of the economy e.g. english schools, dive industry apparently, Thermae, but overall I'd say slight to the point of not easy to even measure. Compare that to dealing with the price of oil dropping $10 USD a barrel or a rubber glut or the shrimp anti dumping charge in USA and it isn't a big deal.

You could argue that if there weren't a bunch of people:

- using shell corporations and nominees to bypass Thai company ownership law restrictions

- using company structures to bypass land ownership law

- using tourist visas to stay here indefinitely including working illegally and specifically two newsworthy individuals one of whom was an english teacher

that there wouldn't be this stream of heavy handed decrees coming out. Incidentally, the foreign ownership thing is an existing thing, to use legalese. The property ownership issue ditto. It just wasn't really enforced before.

The hyper market thing was clamped down on some years ago, and is also an election winner, so not much is changing there; in fact AFAIK it is the hyper markets trying to open the market back up!

The investment one is much more of a shock, and the major change in the mix. No idea how many are using that method though.

[Jim Abbott]

for what it is worth, i just recieved werd from my guy in penang, and he has been told that he is unable to get the double/triple entry visas as of today....single entry only (which could mean two months only, as that third extension is at the discretion of the Imm.Officer...)

any confirmation for this from anyone else?

hmm

It sounds to me that a lot of people will start looking at other countries to live in. Count me among them. I wish I hadn't just signed a 1 year Apt lease with a rather large 100K deposit that I stand to lose should I be forced out beforehand. I'm a 39 y/o retiree in Bangkok with thankfully no investment here. I feel for like people bolted down with condos. I will be putting my personal effects I can't carry with me up for sale. I knew it was a mistake to buy this big bulky desktop computer. Oh well, it's only 30K down the toilet. The rest of my junk I can leave behind. So I guess my total loss will be 100K + 30K + household effects. Not the end of the world. I'll get over it. Sorry to all who stand to lose a lot more physically and mentally

[VanZam]

Sub lease your condo to get a refund on the deposit from the new tenant.

Sell your computer on Thaivisa.

It sounds to me that a lot of people will start looking at other countries to live in. Count me among them. I wish I hadn't just signed a 1 year Apt lease with a rather large 100K deposit that I stand to lose should I be forced out beforehand. I'm a 39 y/o retiree in Bangkok with thankfully no investment here. I feel for like people bolted down with condos. I will be putting my personal effects I can't carry with me up for sale. I knew it was a mistake to buy this big bulky desktop computer. Oh well, it's only 30K down the toilet. The rest of my junk I can leave behind. So I guess my total loss will be 100K + 30K + household effects. Not the end of the world. I'll get over it. Sorry to all who stand to lose a lot more physically and mentally

[Jim Abbott]

I pulled this piece of bad news from the other thread on the investment visas. It sounds like monetary requirements for both retirement and marriage visas will be updated shortly. See post below. This stinks to high heaven.

Hi,

QUOTE(KronbergTH @ 2006-09-12 14:55:08)

We have just called Immigration and they told us that renewal still will be possible?

From Jomtien Immigration Office (Pattaya) about 2 hour ago :

"The 3 million baht investment visa will no longer be available in October...

... but a 10 million baht investment visa will substitute it."

"The renewal will be possible by investing 7 million baht more..."

"Most visa financial requirement will be "updated" before the end of 2006"

"The 2 border runs limitation will not concern people arriving in thailand by plane"

There was an "unofficial meeting" this afternoon at the Immigration Office

with several people of the "Pattaya Expat Club".

I suppose they will make soon a complete report on their web site.

Wait & see...

Pataya46

[sjaak327]

I pulled this piece of bad news from the other thread on the investment visas. It sounds like monetary requirements for both retirement and marriage visas will be updated shortly. See post below. This stinks to high heaven.

Hi,

QUOTE(KronbergTH @ 2006-09-12 14:55:08)

We have just called Immigration and they told us that renewal still will be possible?

From Jomtien Immigration Office (Pattaya) about 2 hour ago :

"The 3 million baht investment visa will no longer be available in October...

... but a 10 million baht investment visa will substitute it."

"The renewal will be possible by investing 7 million baht more..."

"Most visa financial requirement will be "updated" before the end of 2006"

"The 2 border runs limitation will not concern people arriving in thailand by plane"

There was an "unofficial meeting" this afternoon at the Immigration Office

with several people of the "Pattaya Expat Club".

I suppose they will make soon a complete report on their web site.

Wait & see...

Pataya46

Interresting comment about the border run limitation not being valid for people arriving by plane. That's antother loophole right there. Instead of visa runs, you could easily get a plane ticket to Singapore or Kuala Lumpur, and return the same day. To be extra sure, get another ticket to Singapore after 30 days, to comply with the onward ticket requirement (in case that is also going to be enforced in the future).

[Heng]

by implementing this it is a bit of a no loss strategy; the people with even a small amount of money can still find ways to stay and the impact of those unable to stay is going to be slight. Perhaps not slight for sectors of the economy e.g. english schools, dive industry apparently, Thermae, but overall I'd say slight to the point of not easy to even measure. Compare that to dealing with the price of oil dropping $10 USD a barrel or a rubber glut or the shrimp anti dumping charge in USA and it isn't a big deal.

Agree. IMO, those who are going with the 'negative economic impact' argument are doing so emotionally and not logically. I certainly sympathize with those trying to find arguments that might convince the powers that be to not enforce this latest announcement though.

I don't think anyone is saying there will be no negative economic impact (I myself for example will probably lose a few falang tenants who pay a little more than the going rate), but in the end, this whole thing probably won't even merit more than a 2-3 paragraph article in the Asian Wall Street Journal.

[dog412]

well, let's put it this way. reading the various threads concerning on this evolving topic, and if all the "new" qualifications are put into practice, it is certainly going to affect EVERY foreigner, significantly! and thailand also. wealthy foreign investors will also take heed.

[LivinLOS]

From the gazette

On-arrival visas: 90 days and you’re out!

PHUKET: Phuket’s Immigration Chief has confirmed that Thailand will crack down on foreigners working illegally in the country by ending its policy of issuing an unlimited number of consecutive “visas on arrival” – tourist visas that allow the holder to stay a maximum of 15 or 30 days.

The crackdown is intended to stop foreigners – typically bar owners and other small businessmen without work permits – from using the visas to stay in the country indefinitely while working illegally.

Pol Col Bunphot Kongkrachan, Acting Superintendent of Phuket Immigration Office, told the Gazette that, from October 1, onward Immigration checkpoints around the country will limit to three the number of consecutive visas on arrival they will grant a single visitor.

After the third consecutive visa on arrival has expired, the passport holder must leave the country and wait 90 days before being allowed back into Thailand on the same type of visa.

The move effectively limits the length of stay for those entering the country using this visa class to 45 or 90 days.

The 41 countries whose citizens qualify for visas on arrival include Thailand’s top sources of tourists, including almost all Western European countries, the United States, Canada, Australia, Japan, Singapore and many more.

Col Bunphot said that all Immigration chiefs nationwide have been ordered to attend a meeting at Immigration headquarters on September 15, during which the new stricter regulations will be explained in detail.

“I will make a more detailed statement about the new situation within a week of returning from the meeting,” he said.

Suwalai Pinpradab, Director of Tourism Authority of Thailand’s South Region 4 Office in Phuket, downplayed the potential impact of the new rule on Phuket’s all-important tourism industry.

“ I don’t think it will affect tourism revenue in Phuket very much because foreign businessman holding work permits will still be able to work. The only ones who will be affected will be people who are working illegally and prolonging their stays by making visa run after visa run,” she said.

“My concern is about the coming high season. I sympathize with Immigration, which has too few officers. I am afraid that they will be swamped with work and that there will be a slowdown in service [at Immigration checkpoints],” she said.

Executive Visa Run conducts visa runs to Ranong and recently started a service to Penang in Malaysia. A representative there, who requested anonymity, told the Gazette that word of the new regulations had created a great deal of confusion.

“Immigration here in Phuket doesn’t know what going on because they’ve not received any guidelines yet from Bangkok … Yesterday when we made inquiries, nobody there could tell us anything,” he said.

When asked if there were a lot of people making “visa hops” to get new visas on arrival, he said, “Oh, there’s a lot. Really. It’s unbelievable, the amount.”

He added, “I think it will have a huge impact. You listen to all this about how they only want the rich people to stay here. There are a lot of people who stay here on low incomes – and they cause no problems, they just get on with their lives,” he said.

Brought to you by:

The Phuket Gazette

17:42 local time (GMT +7)

Edited September 12, 2006 by LivinLOS

[Chopperboy]

I see Malaysia is giving 10 year visas as part of its "Malaysia My Second Home" scheme. They also allow foreign ownership of houses as part of it. Applicants just need to deposit equivalent 3M baht and can use upto 2.4Mb to legally buy a house. OK Malaysia doesn't quite have the straight bar scene that some are here for, but there's still plenty going on.

[kiakaha]

could be a lot of cheap condos coming on the market soon for those expats who can stay long term legally

[Hermano Lobo]

So the answer is to get the "ThaiEliteCard" with all the benefits it brings, I reckon it's Toxin way of getting his projected numbers

Link

SPECIAL VISA PRIVILEGE

All Thailand Elite Members will be granted a special entry visa when applying at any Thai Embassy, Thai Consulate Office, or at the Thai Immigration Office at any point of entry. This special entry visa is a five year multiple entry visa and is renewable when your passport expires or it is replaced. You will not be required to pay any fees since you are a Thailand Elite Member. You are granted a 90 day stay each time you visit Thailand.*

Obtaining a new visa after the first five year visa

All members are welcome to obtain a new special entry visa after the first five year visa has expired, free of charge.

Is Thaksin behind all this ??

Is the "ThaiEliteCard" worth 1 Million Baht ?

The knowledgeable amongst you must know ?

Edited September 12, 2006 by Hermano Lobo

[sibeymai]

Not that I would ever suggest making false declarations to the authorities and not having read through this whole thread I wouldn't be surprised if someone has already suggested reporting your passport as lost and getting a new one issued, then having two passports, use each one alternatively in a rotating 90 days on/90 days off scenario. No doubt someone has already thought of this, but I would expect the computers used by immigration must have some way of detecting this and the free accommodation you will end up with as a result may not be to your liking.

[newworks]

With 5 pages of posts, I'm surprised no one yet has put forth the question of why now. I'm betting that this is a response to the idiot Karr of Jon Bonet Ramsey fame.

Anyone disagree?

Agree of course. Also its election season and hassling foreigners is a no lose decision politically. If this is partly about English teachers, it really does need to be easier for teachers to get work permits or there won't be nearly enough English teachers, now that this loophole is being closed.

I still think there is nothing morally or ethically wrong with a person staying indefinitely on a 30 day stamps or tourist visas as long as they are not doing anything else illegal. My understanding is that in the Philippines, that is what most expats are doing. They just pay a periodic fee to immigration and must exit and re-enter once annually. Why persecute people about this? Why not just go after criminals based on the crimes rather than their visa strategy? I think this is a real shame.

The pool of farangs in Thailand on non-long term visas is large. No money from people with 30 day stamps? I bought an expensive condo with one of those stamps in my passport and I know I am not the only one. Also consider the pool of people who eventually do settle on long term visas has got to start somewhere! That pool often comes from the pool of people testing the waters on shorter term visas such as stamps and tourist visas.

The overall result of this is a less fun Thailand. Its funny. Singapore is becoming more fun, Thailand less so.

interesting post. cheers

agreed. i'd love to go into a rant about how a country with real good government and an educated populace are long-term far more stable and "fun-friendly" than a country with so much endemic corruption and disparities between rich and poor and city and country folk, but i will refrain because it's off-topic and i also don't feel like sparring with all the people who will take huge offense at the suggestion.

[cclub75]

We have just called Immigration and they told us that renewal still will be possible?

From Jomtien Immigration Office (Pattaya) about 2 hour ago :

"The 3 million baht investment visa will no longer be available in October...

... but a 10 million baht investment visa will substitute it."

"The renewal will be possible by investing 7 million baht more..."

And the third year : 28 millions more, and then the fourth year, 1 billion etc. Nice.

"The 2 border runs limitation will not concern people arriving in thailand by plane"

Well... This last piece of information looks highly strange...

Many people use plane to do visa run... With low cost airlines, Phnom Penh and Laos at 1 hour from BKK....

[lopburi3]

Please read this thread for latest information - there have been changes:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=82975

[sriracha john]

The posts are still coming in to and fro...

so I'll have to wait a second or two in order to know...

Nothing to do but wait and see...

IF I timed it right in order to be...

The 500th post to this thread..................

-------------------------------

now then,

who'll be the lucky winner in the 50,000th view of the thread Lottery?

===============

*edit* ah well, 501 it is....

Just how do you propose knowing who's the 50,000th viewer of this thread? Could be lots of people trying to claim that prize.

Good luck on trying to make the 1,000th post to this thread. At this rate it shouldn't be long before you'll have the opportunity.

well, as luck would have it... I was the 50,001st viewer of this thread... always missing out by 1.

and the lucky lottery winner as the 50,000th viewer was.... Donz

well, I'll have to try to be the 100,000th viewer.... which as far I know, is unprecedented territory in the annals of thaivisa history.

[Maestro]

Please read this thread for latest information - there have been changes:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=82975

The saga continues. One minute George gets told one thing by Immigration (90-day stay based on three back-to-back visa-exempt entries), the next minute Sunbelt gets told something quite different.

There goes the plan of those who thought they could get away with staying a day or two in a neighbouring country before returning endlessly on a new visa-exempt entry.

I don’t think, though, that immigration will refuse entry to the businessman who needs to stop over in Thailand for a few days more than three times in six months. This is a new guideline, after all, not a new law.

---------------

Maestro

[mitrapaap]

VISA ON ARRIVAL

- According to the Interior Ministerial Announcements, passport holders from 20 countries may apply for visas at the immigration checkpoints for the purpose of tourism for the period of not exceeding 15 days.

- The applicant must possess means of living expenses at the amount of 10,000 Baht per person and 20,000 Baht per family accordingly.

- The applicant must present full paid ticket which is usable within 15 days since the date of entry

- Visa on arrival is provided at 23 designated international checkpoints and applicants should submit the application form duly filled out and to which his/her recent photograph (2 ½ inches) is attached. The application fee is 1,000 Baht.

- Visitors who enter the Kingdom with Visa on Arrival generally cannot file an application for extension of stay except in special cases such as illness which prevents them from travelling, etc. They can submit an application at the Office of Immigration Bureau , Immigration Division 1, Soi Suan Plu, South Sathorn Road, Bangkok 10120. Tel. 02 287-3127 or 02 287-3101-10 ext. 2264-5 or at website http://www.immigration.go.th

The operative word here is tourism. It makes sense that a "tourist" should not mean a tourist in perpetuity. Agree? For people like me who are here not on a tourist visa but on a non-immigrant O or B visa, this should be a non-event.

I'm curious about one thing. When I arrived, they gave me a departure card. I have no intention of using it, and didn't fill it in. No one say "boo" about my not filling it in, I guess they assume I'm here for the long haul if I come on a non-immigrant O visa. What do the guys who have been doing visa runs for years do? Do they keep a ticket with them all the time, or is it not even asked for?

Does the "Boxer Rebellion" come to mind to anybody?

It will get worse BEFORE it will ever get better. Thailand adopts changes that are easy, but all the while going backwards, keep the things necessary for existance... Farming and that comunity will always be #1... Technology is so WAY BACKWARD to this country.

Students are becoming more lazy and westernize(and we know the school systems in Western countries go), not to mention that their is a lack of love for the English language now amongst them.

So this matter will taper...

So what does this change mean for the Teacher who changes to another school and their visa extension expires and has to make a border run to be able to stay legal in the country and all the while wait for the red tape needed to get a Non-B and Work Permit? What will this rule do for us?

I Hope a comment will ensue!

Regards,

C

what does this change mean for the Teacher who changes to another school and their visa extension expires and has to make a border run to be able to stay legal in the country

Funny, isn't it? There are people who work (as a teacher) and still believe that making the border run is the way to stay legal in the country, and probably work leagally in the country too...

Well, that's exactly this kind of people immigration wants to get out of the country.

[threelegcowboy]

question

"Not that I would ever suggest making false declarations to the authorities and not having read through this whole thread I wouldn't be surprised if someone has already suggested reporting your passport as lost and getting a new one issued, then having two passports, use each one alternatively in a rotating 90 days on/90 days off scenario. No doubt someone has already thought of this, but I would expect the computers used by immigration must have some way of detecting this and the free accommodation you will end up with as a result may not be to your liking."

answer

You can not do this because............To get a new passport you also have to get a new passport number and the old passport is cancelled. When you go to the thai immigration in BKK you have to get your existing visa or stamp transfered into your new passport. Now Thai Imm knows your old passport has been cancelled.

[dog412]

VISA ON ARRIVAL

- According to the Interior Ministerial Announcements, passport holders from 20 countries may apply for visas at the immigration checkpoints for the purpose of tourism for the period of not exceeding 15 days.

- The applicant must possess means of living expenses at the amount of 10,000 Baht per person and 20,000 Baht per family accordingly.

- The applicant must present full paid ticket which is usable within 15 days since the date of entry

- Visa on arrival is provided at 23 designated international checkpoints and applicants should submit the application form duly filled out and to which his/her recent photograph (2 ½ inches) is attached. The application fee is 1,000 Baht.

- Visitors who enter the Kingdom with Visa on Arrival generally cannot file an application for extension of stay except in special cases such as illness which prevents them from travelling, etc. They can submit an application at the Office of Immigration Bureau , Immigration Division 1, Soi Suan Plu, South Sathorn Road, Bangkok 10120. Tel. 02 287-3127 or 02 287-3101-10 ext. 2264-5 or at website http://www.immigration.go.th

The operative word here is tourism. It makes sense that a "tourist" should not mean a tourist in perpetuity. Agree? For people like me who are here not on a tourist visa but on a non-immigrant O or B visa, this should be a non-event.

I'm curious about one thing. When I arrived, they gave me a departure card. I have no intention of using it, and didn't fill it in. No one say "boo" about my not filling it in, I guess they assume I'm here for the long haul if I come on a non-immigrant O visa. What do the guys who have been doing visa runs for years do? Do they keep a ticket with them all the time, or is it not even asked for?

Does the "Boxer Rebellion" come to mind to anybody?

It will get worse BEFORE it will ever get better. Thailand adopts changes that are easy, but all the while going backwards, keep the things necessary for existance... Farming and that comunity will always be #1... Technology is so WAY BACKWARD to this country.

Students are becoming more lazy and westernize(and we know the school systems in Western countries go), not to mention that their is a lack of love for the English language now amongst them.

So this matter will taper...

So what does this change mean for the Teacher who changes to another school and their visa extension expires and has to make a border run to be able to stay legal in the country and all the while wait for the red tape needed to get a Non-B and Work Permit? What will this rule do for us?

I Hope a comment will ensue!

Regards,

C

what does this change mean for the Teacher who changes to another school and their visa extension expires and has to make a border run to be able to stay legal in the country

Funny, isn't it? There are people who work (as a teacher) and still believe that making the border run is the way to stay legal in the country, and probably work leagally in the country too...

Well, that's exactly this kind of people immigration wants to get out of the country.

i think you're missing the facts. it's the employers who are required to arrange the work permit. are they going to be made responsible to do this? most employers are thai.

[PeaceBlondie]

what does this change mean for the Teacher who changes to another school and their visa extension expires and has to make a border run to be able to stay legal in the country

Funny, isn't it? There are people who work (as a teacher) and still believe that making the border run is the way to stay legal in the country, and probably work leagally in the country too...

Well, that's exactly this kind of people immigration wants to get out of the country.

I don't think the right hand of Immigration, the left hand of MFA, the middle finger of the MoE or the middle leg of the MoL, know what one another is doing. One minute some functionary will tell the press, "We're going to encourage 10,000 teachers of English, native speakers, to come to Thailand": the next day, the same official will rant against the illegal aliens that include the same teachers, whilst the various agencies will not make it legal for even the 810 teachers of English who answer the call.

If I didn't believe I had to love my enemies, I'd convince my worst enemy that Thailand is the paradise of foreign teachers.

[dog412]

VISA ON ARRIVAL

- According to the Interior Ministerial Announcements, passport holders from 20 countries may apply for visas at the immigration checkpoints for the purpose of tourism for the period of not exceeding 15 days.

- The applicant must possess means of living expenses at the amount of 10,000 Baht per person and 20,000 Baht per family accordingly.

- The applicant must present full paid ticket which is usable within 15 days since the date of entry

- Visa on arrival is provided at 23 designated international checkpoints and applicants should submit the application form duly filled out and to which his/her recent photograph (2 ½ inches) is attached. The application fee is 1,000 Baht.

- Visitors who enter the Kingdom with Visa on Arrival generally cannot file an application for extension of stay except in special cases such as illness which prevents them from travelling, etc. They can submit an application at the Office of Immigration Bureau , Immigration Division 1, Soi Suan Plu, South Sathorn Road, Bangkok 10120. Tel. 02 287-3127 or 02 287-3101-10 ext. 2264-5 or at website http://www.immigration.go.th

The operative word here is tourism. It makes sense that a "tourist" should not mean a tourist in perpetuity. Agree? For people like me who are here not on a tourist visa but on a non-immigrant O or B visa, this should be a non-event.

I'm curious about one thing. When I arrived, they gave me a departure card. I have no intention of using it, and didn't fill it in. No one say "boo" about my not filling it in, I guess they assume I'm here for the long haul if I come on a non-immigrant O visa. What do the guys who have been doing visa runs for years do? Do they keep a ticket with them all the time, or is it not even asked for?

Does the "Boxer Rebellion" come to mind to anybody?

It will get worse BEFORE it will ever get better. Thailand adopts changes that are easy, but all the while going backwards, keep the things necessary for existance... Farming and that comunity will always be #1... Technology is so WAY BACKWARD to this country.

Students are becoming more lazy and westernize(and we know the school systems in Western countries go), not to mention that their is a lack of love for the English language now amongst them.

So this matter will taper...

So what does this change mean for the Teacher who changes to another school and their visa extension expires and has to make a border run to be able to stay legal in the country and all the while wait for the red tape needed to get a Non-B and Work Permit? What will this rule do for us?

I Hope a comment will ensue!

Regards,

C

what does this change mean for the Teacher who changes to another school and their visa extension expires and has to make a border run to be able to stay legal in the country

Funny, isn't it? There are people who work (as a teacher) and still believe that making the border run is the way to stay legal in the country, and probably work leagally in the country too...

Well, that's exactly this kind of people immigration wants to get out of the country.

i think you're missing the facts. it's the employers who are required to arrange the work permit. are they going to be made responsible to do this? most employers are thai.

[terryp]

For almost the past 20 odd years, Sept/Oct have been the immigration shake-up months ...just before the high season kicks in.

I think many of you are paniking just as the Immigration guys want you to.

All this has been said before many times as it is the law, but enforcement is going to be very difficult...without fully computerised immigration portals at ALL the Thai border points then it can't work....oh i lost my passport i need a nice new clean one, available from any of the neighbouring countries (if your country has a consulate or embassy there)

Remember the dodgy visa stamp panic from 2-3 years ago...all those passports that were accidently washed but sadly the poor fall guys that were deported as an immigration show of face

Unforgettable LOL

[Geesus]

This is all very confusing to me, so if I could get a clear answer, I´d be more than happy.

I have been in thailand for over 3 months now, I came with a tourist visa and has been on 2 visa runs after it expired. I´ve planned to stay here until april next year, am not married to a thai and not over 50. Is there something I can do to stay until april, e.g. going to malaysia over and over for new visas, or do I simply have to pack my shit and go back to europe again?

Thanks

[Mobi]

This is all very confusing to me, so if I could get a clear answer, I´d be more than happy.

I have been in thailand for over 3 months now, I came with a tourist visa and has been on 2 visa runs after it expired. I´ve planned to stay here until april next year, am not married to a thai and not over 50. Is there something I can do to stay until april, e.g. going to malaysia over and over for new visas, or do I simply have to pack my shit and go back to europe again?

Thanks

In theory, there is no reason why you can't go to Malaysia, or indeed any foriegn Thai Consulate and get a new tourist visa.

However, Sunbelt have already intimated that letters will be sent out telling the embassies to tighten up on the issuance of visas to applicants who have spent a long time in Thailand. So you may end up without a visa, or you may have to jet hop across the region trying to find an embassy that will give you a visa.

No doubt all will become clearer in due course, but it is unlikely to be good news.

I really do feel for you poor guys who are caught up in all this.

It shouldn't happen in this way. There are better ways to tighten up the rules without causing all this sudden anguish and distress.

[k1w1]

Anyone notice Air Asia have raised their prices to Penang by 200 Baht in the last coupl eof hours?

What'll it cost next week?

[moebius]

I say everyone meet at Koa San Road, march on the Visa Ministry and camp out front till they all resign and drop this totalitarianist plan to keep foreigners from 'moving' freely to and from and within and about this great democratic nation! Look to Taiwan! Look to last spring! Democracy as only democracy can be inacted; rule by the people (or some people) for the people (or some people)!

Ooops...I live in China. Used to live in Bangkok as a hub for travel in SEA. Doing visa runs on the off-months was a real pain in the ass. And for those of us who never know where we are going to be till the next call, the no-visa stamped entry was actually pretty convenient. Took up a lot of pages in the passport though.

China has a rational mulitple-entry business visa class and taxation policy for extended stays over the year for business visa travellers and semi-residents doing business out of China. Something far too difficult to do in Thailand to make it worthwhile using as a 'hub' for business in SEA as far as I'm concerned.

I guess one could say Mainland China is a little more advanced and evolving even more quickly.

I'll still be back to Thailand for business and tourism. Maybe someday I may even retire there once they allow foreigners to actually buy something at market value. Great place to lay back beachside.