SURVEY: Will the Thai government be able to reduce corruption significantly?

[Tomtomtom69]

The only way they are going to get rid of corruption is a way they won't can't do. The criticism and potential backlash from the international community, as misplaced as it would be, will ensure that any action taken will be of the kinder, gentler (and ultimately useless) kind.

Start treating corruption like they treat hard (Class 1) drug offences. Minor offences = minor prison sentences (and corresponding loss of privileges/rank/benefits/face depending on the position of the offender). Mid-level offences occur stiffer penalties. The highest levels of corruption get treated like the highest level of hard drug offences (i.e. death sentence, possibly commuted to life imprisonment).

But it won't work unless they start actually enforcing it, which would be rather difficult as we already know. ("Those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones." "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." etc. etc.)

Like in China under Xi Jinping? However, I have not heard or read one shred of evidence, either in the Thai or English language media that the current Thai government has any agenda to wipe out corruption along the lines of what China is doing. So while I agree with you, I think we can safely assume that while China is doing a pretty good job, Thailand won't be following in it's footsteps.

[NeilSA1]

Thailand needs to punish transgressors firmly and openly, regardless of their social position.

[sawadee1947]

As I said before: Thailand is/was ruled by CLANS. And every clan used their power to fill their [pockets by corruption. This time it's very bad because uneducated soldiers try to rule a country with no knowledge of everything

[Nobb]

How can you reduce corruption when instead of firing dirty police you move them to another district. Keeping the bad to do bad some where else!

[connda]

Fighting the 'war on corruption' is like fighting the 'war on drugs'. It sound great for media sound-bites, but the reality is that corruption in endemic. You have a military coup whose members say their going to end corruption - but whose corruption? Are they ending the corruption in the military, or is their focus elsewhere? I think it's more like they are eliminating competition by using legislation and the legal system, but in the end, those taken out will simply be replaced by a new generation or breed of corrupt individuals. Evil fighting Evil in the name of Good. Pretty laughable really.

This is really about maintaining power within the patronage system. The average Somchai in the rice field doesn't even add into the equation, well, except when it comes to purchasing a vote.

Edited June 8, 2015 by connda

[i claudius]

On reading this the first thing that springs to mind is WILL PIGS EVER FLY?

[ExPratt]

And there you have it , I don't think anyone or any party can reduce corruption significantly . It is ingrained in society and the political process, Not being Anti Thai , Malaysia is exactly the same if not worse , so maybe anti Malaysian as well ;o)

[ExPratt]

On reading this the first thing that springs to mind is WILL PIGS EVER FLY?

For me it was" Pi.........Urinating in the wind"

Edited June 8, 2015 by ExPratt

[Basil B]

It will happen but it will take time as you need to reprogram the mindset of Thai's.

[Eric Loh]

Somchai say how can the government reduce corruption when they corrupt power.

[DM07]

No, never!

Next!

[newatthis]

NO. It looks as if the General is trying but at the end of the day it wont happen.

Corruption is locked into society here and has been for hundreds of years.

It may get more expensive.

True. Corruption in Thailand is like inbreeding. There are just too many mutations of it.

[MobileContent]

If the Thai government would be serious they should look to Rumunia where thousands of government officials are currently been send to court for corruption including police officers that took money on the street for traffic delicts.

Their must be thousands of corruption cases in Thailand on a weekly basis.

[Assurancetourix]

48 members here who still believe Santa Claus exists

[Andrew65]

We seem to describe corruption in Thailand as small time. Government officials for permits, courts for reduced fines, police officer for not giving a ticket, customs officers for allowing drugs to come through.... We must remember every country in the world has corruption, and Thailand did not invent it. In the states, would you not recognize Lawmakers that have $20,000 in the bank, and a mortgage, leave office 4 years later, with a net worth of several million dollars. They have not been collecting aluminum cans on weekends. Maybe we need to clean in up in our own countries before we try to change other countries. Mexico could not survive without corruption. Oil companies world-wide could not obtain drilling licenses, Boeing & Airbus could not sell planes, McDonalds could not sell their crap as food. Just my 2 cents worth....

You're absolutely right there Stoli.

I believe the US, my own country the UK, Singapore, and a whole host of others are way, way more corrupt than they are made out to be!

Whenever I hear farangs banging on about how corrupt Thailand is, I often think that they should head back to their home countries and dig around a bit.

Just thinking of a Swiss and a French national in the news last week in relation to FIFA.

[KarenBravo]

We seem to describe corruption in Thailand as small time. Government officials for permits, courts for reduced fines, police officer for not giving a ticket, customs officers for allowing drugs to come through.... We must remember every country in the world has corruption, and Thailand did not invent it. In the states, would you not recognize Lawmakers that have $20,000 in the bank, and a mortgage, leave office 4 years later, with a net worth of several million dollars. They have not been collecting aluminum cans on weekends. Maybe we need to clean in up in our own countries before we try to change other countries. Mexico could not survive without corruption. Oil companies world-wide could not obtain drilling licenses, Boeing & Airbus could not sell planes, McDonalds could not sell their crap as food. Just my 2 cents worth....

You're absolutely right there Stoli.

I believe the US, my own country the UK, Singapore, and a whole host of others are way, way more corrupt than they are made out to be!

Whenever I hear farangs banging on about how corrupt Thailand is, I often think that they should head back to their home countries and dig around a bit.

Just thinking of a Swiss and a French national in the news last week in relation to FIFA.

Name a Thai government department or institution that isn't corrupt (we'll skip the private sector).

This is a question of scale and acceptance, not whether other countries practice corruption.

Edited June 8, 2015 by KarenBravo

[Andrew65]

We seem to describe corruption in Thailand as small time. Government officials for permits, courts for reduced fines, police officer for not giving a ticket, customs officers for allowing drugs to come through.... We must remember every country in the world has corruption, and Thailand did not invent it. In the states, would you not recognize Lawmakers that have $20,000 in the bank, and a mortgage, leave office 4 years later, with a net worth of several million dollars. They have not been collecting aluminum cans on weekends. Maybe we need to clean in up in our own countries before we try to change other countries. Mexico could not survive without corruption. Oil companies world-wide could not obtain drilling licenses, Boeing & Airbus could not sell planes, McDonalds could not sell their crap as food. Just my 2 cents worth....

You're absolutely right there Stoli.

I believe the US, my own country the UK, Singapore, and a whole host of others are way, way more corrupt than they are made out to be!

Whenever I hear farangs banging on about how corrupt Thailand is, I often think that they should head back to their home countries and dig around a bit.

Just thinking of a Swiss and a French national in the news last week in relation to FIFA.

Name a Thai government department or institution that isn't corrupt (we'll skip the private sector).

This is a question of scale and acceptance, not whether other countries practice corruption.

I have dealt with the Immigration Department umpteen times, at airports, Chaeng Watthana, Suanplu etc. In my personal experience I have never either offered, or been asked for a bribe, that's just in my experience obviously. I did however have to pay to the Customs Dept once.

Also, I first visited here in '85, and have been living here since '98. Never once been have I been stopped or hassled by police, tourist police, or anyone else in officialdom.

[Oziex1]

The answer is yes they can, but do they want to?

Are they visionary and brave?

[KarenBravo]

We seem to describe corruption in Thailand as small time. Government officials for permits, courts for reduced fines, police officer for not giving a ticket, customs officers for allowing drugs to come through.... We must remember every country in the world has corruption, and Thailand did not invent it. In the states, would you not recognize Lawmakers that have $20,000 in the bank, and a mortgage, leave office 4 years later, with a net worth of several million dollars. They have not been collecting aluminum cans on weekends. Maybe we need to clean in up in our own countries before we try to change other countries. Mexico could not survive without corruption. Oil companies world-wide could not obtain drilling licenses, Boeing & Airbus could not sell planes, McDonalds could not sell their crap as food. Just my 2 cents worth....

You're absolutely right there Stoli.

I believe the US, my own country the UK, Singapore, and a whole host of others are way, way more corrupt than they are made out to be!

Whenever I hear farangs banging on about how corrupt Thailand is, I often think that they should head back to their home countries and dig around a bit.

Just thinking of a Swiss and a French national in the news last week in relation to FIFA.

Name a Thai government department or institution that isn't corrupt (we'll skip the private sector).

This is a question of scale and acceptance, not whether other countries practice corruption.

I have dealt with the Immigration Department umpteen times, at airports, Chaeng Watthana, Suanplu etc. In my personal experience I have never either offered, or been asked for a bribe, that's just in my experience obviously. I did however have to pay to the Customs Dept once.

Also, I first visited here in '85, and have been living here since '98. Never once been have I been stopped or hassled by police, tourist police, or anyone else in officialdom.

Yet, most immigration departments have come under fire for charging for a certificate of residence, which is supposed to be free. I know Phuket and Bangkok did.

Or, how about the nice little earner of running passports down to Sadao for "visa runs". Each passport 2500 Bt.

They were caught in 2003, the practice stopped which was when all those signs went up saying that you couldn't use agents but, had to do visa runs in person.

Next!

Edited June 8, 2015 by KarenBravo

[geriatrickid]

It can be done, just look at what Singapore achieved. However I doubt the will is there as so many officials derive a significant benefit from being corrupt. What Thailand needs is someone like LKY. Love him or hate him LKY achieved zero corruption for those in government and public office.

Yes, let's look at what Singapore achieved. It transferred corruption off the street and elevated it to an activity that at times was a state sanctioned and supported activity. The assumption that there is no corruption in Singapore is FALSE. On the contrary, the corruption of Singapore is just as damaging and as deadly as the Thai variant. I direct your attention to the role of Singapore in the repeated busting of UN sanctions in respect to Myanmar, North Korea and Iraq.

North Korea sticks out because Singapore is the country where the North Koreans ran their regional arms purchasing program operation. They wouldn't have bene doing that, unless the local environment made it easy. Interestingly enough they didn't do it in China or Russia. This was because they needed access to banking facilities. Look up the oil sales sanction busting and see the role of Singapore merchants/shipping companies. Did anyone get prosecuted? Look at Myanmar and Singapore's role over the year of being a friendly conduit for financial support.

Singapore is a banking center that has facilitated international tax evasion. The laissez faire approach and secrecy laws have also made Singapore the money laundering capital of South East Asia. How about this headline from last summer's Singapore Business magazine? Financial criminals on a massive banking spree in Singapore: Bloomberg They have made the city their laundering home. - See more at: http://sbr.com.sg/financial-services/news/financial-criminals-massive-banking-spree-in-singapore-bloomberg#sthash.5BYEUqMA.dpuf I can cite many more examples, especially the very damaging extent of gambling both low tech and sophisticated schemes that make Thailand's small dice dens look primitive in comparison.

Please, don't repeat the Singapore state manufactured myth that there is no corruption because it is there. Because you don't know about it or see it, does not mean it isn't there.

Edited June 8, 2015 by geriatrickid

[Anon999]

The General is being proactive on corruption. Another, I understand from an informed source who is familiar with the situation, 152 officials, mainly in Isaan, were given the elbow today without benefit. That was in addition to the previous 135 recently. More are apparently in the firing line.

Those government civil servants involved in anti corruption for many years, were unable to do their job until the current government came into being. That goes back over 20 years so I understand. Consequently the country is now seeing the fruits of their work with high ranking officials feeling the effect of Kharma. More power to their elbow.

[KarenBravo]

Karma? Let's not bring religion into this.

A better word would be "justice".

[sirineou]

I love Ferangs in Thailand who complain about corruption yet readily accept all the positive results it provides them.

You are speeding, cop pulls you over, you pay a few hundred bht and are on your way,

Does that make you part of the corrupt system you complain,

would you rather pay 6,000 baht as you would in the west, points on your licence, and more expensive insurance?

Public servants complimenting their income with "tea money" because they are not paid enough.

You complain about the cost of living going up in Thailand,I wonder what better paid public servants would do to your cost of living?

Watch what you wish for you just might get it.

[likeaking]

Will pigs fly?

[Anon999]

I love Ferangs in Thailand who complain about corruption yet readily accept all the positive results it provides them.

You are speeding, cop pulls you over, you pay a few hundred bht and are on your way,

Does that make you part of the corrupt system you complain,

would you rather pay 6,000 baht as you would in the west, points on your licence, and more expensive insurance?

Public servants complimenting their income with "tea money" because they are not paid enough.

You complain about the cost of living going up in Thailand,I wonder what better paid public servants would do to your cost of living?

Watch what you wish for you just might get it.

Your comments are relating to 'small beer'. I'm referring to the 7 figure cases that are under investigation by anti-corruption officials. Comparing apples with pears is ridiculous. Furthermore I've never paid tea money since first coming here in the 90's, didn't have any points on my home licence, and haven't complained about the cheap cost of living here either so don't assume and accuse. Engage brain or provide evidence before posting, keyboard warrior!

Do I take it you have been guilty of all of those that you are so quick to accuse someone else of?

[Oziex1]

I love Ferangs in Thailand who complain about corruption yet readily accept all the positive results it provides them.

You are speeding, cop pulls you over, you pay a few hundred bht and are on your way,

Does that make you part of the corrupt system you complain,

would you rather pay 6,000 baht as you would in the west, points on your licence, and more expensive insurance?

Public servants complimenting their income with "tea money" because they are not paid enough.

You complain about the cost of living going up in Thailand,I wonder what better paid public servants would do to your cost of living?

Watch what you wish for you just might get it.

Your comments are relating to 'small beer'. I'm referring to the 7 figure cases that are under investigation by anti-corruption officials. Comparing apples with pears is ridiculous. Furthermore I've never paid tea money since first coming here in the 90's, didn't have any points on my home licence, and haven't complained about the cheap cost of living here either so don't assume and accuse. Engage brain or provide evidence before posting, keyboard warrior!

Do I take it you have been guilty of all of those that you are so quick to accuse someone else of?

No corruption is good and I agree with Anon, It's all about the bewildering arrogance of the top officials and the super rich.

The corruption that allows them to get away with murder, to get away with human trafficking the slavery in the fishing fleet. The ludacris computer crimes laws. The rorting of the public purse. it goes on and on.

[Cent]

NO. It looks as if the General is trying but at the end of the day it wont happen.

Corruption is locked into society here and has been for hundreds of years.

It may get more expensive.

Only way to do it is to have the same sort of punishment they have in China. And even then some will think it worth the risk.

[thedude82]

this is a nation that is rotten to the core. you can blame the government but ultimately it is the thai people.

[MockingJay]

Think the survey results speak for themselves... If Thailand is a hub for something at all, then it certainly is corruption!

[connda]

We seem to describe corruption in Thailand as small time. Government officials for permits, courts for reduced fines, police officer for not giving a ticket, customs officers for allowing drugs to come through.... We must remember every country in the world has corruption, and Thailand did not invent it. In the states, would you not recognize Lawmakers that have $20,000 in the bank, and a mortgage, leave office 4 years later, with a net worth of several million dollars. They have not been collecting aluminum cans on weekends. Maybe we need to clean in up in our own countries before we try to change other countries. Mexico could not survive without corruption. Oil companies world-wide could not obtain drilling licenses, Boeing & Airbus could not sell planes, McDonalds could not sell their crap as food. Just my 2 cents worth....

It's not even worth that.

This is a Thai governmental initiative regarding Thailand.

Nothing to do with us at all, or, cleaning up our own countries.

We are being asked to predict how effective the Thai government will be.

The diffirence between "our" countries is that the corrupt know that if they are caught, they will be punished.

Here, it's so normal, it would be like being punished for breathing. The system is set up this way. Corruption here isn't even seen as corruption. It is just the way things get done.

The diffirence between "our" countries is that the corrupt know that if they are caught, they will be punished.

So that's why the West has 'Too Big To Fail" and "Too Big To Jail" policies? Major banks get caught red handed laundering money for the drug cartels and a laundry list of other crimes, get a slap on the wrist by their respective Western governments, and absolutely no executives complicit in the crimes goes to jail. Well, with the exception of Iceland.

Sorry, I have to call BS on your assertion. Western countries have corruption honed to a science, legalized, and institutionalize. Thailand is still in the Stone Age in regard to corruption.