Camronwit's gun found to be unregistered

[Anthony5]

Oh my God, it never ceases to amaze me how many uneducated people post on this site..... Arabic numerals.... 1,2,3,4 and so on. This is common knowledge. The "arabic" numerals were put on the gun by the American manufacturer. Oh derrr....

As to whether he got the gun in Thailand or Japan. Let me ask this. Where are you most likely to be able to lay your hands on an unregistered weapon. Thailand or Japan?

Ever considered that someone who lives in an Arabic country, and who owns a private yet and has been in Japan not so long ago, might have deposited the gun for Camronwit to pick it up and transport to Thailand?

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….

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So you ridicule my theory, but at the same time post ( post #194) here that it is the weapon of choice for professional killers.

[Cake Monster]

The fact that this guy was in a position of high Authority within the RTP, is really beyond comprehension.

How could anybody of such " high standing " be so reckless / arrogant.

His buddies will be quick to turn away from him now, as they surely would not wish to associated with him.

[JAG]

Oh my God, it never ceases to amaze me how many uneducated people post on this site..... Arabic numerals.... 1,2,3,4 and so on. This is common knowledge. The "arabic" numerals were put on the gun by the American manufacturer. Oh derrr....

As to whether he got the gun in Thailand or Japan. Let me ask this. Where are you most likely to be able to lay your hands on an unregistered weapon. Thailand or Japan?

Ever considered that someone who lives in an Arabic country, and who owns a private yet and has been in Japan not so long ago, might have deposited the gun for Camronwit to pick it up and transport to Thailand?

I find it very improbable that a certain person, who has a very high profile, lives in an Arab country and has recently been to Japan on his private jet; would act as the bagman to provide this fellow with an illegal miniature firearm!

If he wished to supply weapons I'm sure that there are more secure channels available to him.

[Explorer Instructor]

Funny if you're not a higher level Thai such as a ex police chief you can walk through as though your poo doesn't stink. I went through and forgot I had a small multi tool for quick fix of dive gear that has a Philips head screw driver that was only 30 mm long,no blades and 3 Allen wrenches can fit in the palm of your hand. That's a deadly weapon but a .22 is okay. <deleted> over

[HeijoshinCool]

Oh my God, it never ceases to amaze me how many uneducated people post on this site..... Arabic numerals.... 1,2,3,4 and so on. This is common knowledge. The "arabic" numerals were put on the gun by the American manufacturer. Oh derrr....

As to whether he got the gun in Thailand or Japan. Let me ask this. Where are you most likely to be able to lay your hands on an unregistered weapon. Thailand or Japan?

Ever considered that someone who lives in an Arabic country, and who owns a private yet and has been in Japan not so long ago, might have deposited the gun for Camronwit to pick it up and transport to Thailand?

.

….

…

So you ridicule my theory, but at the same time post ( post #194) here that it is the weapon of choice for professional killers.

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Yep.

[sunshine51]

"Camronwit's gun found to be unregistered"

Bye-Bye You. Enjoy some hospitality courtesy of the Japanese prison system.

[retarius]

They should check the ballistics against guns/bullets used in murders/shootings here in Thailand.

[davejonesbkk]

They should check the ballistics against guns/bullets used in murders/shootings here in Thailand.

yeah I bet theye got loads of data on that and can cross check everything

[Jai Dee]

One flame post has been removed from this thread.

[stevenl]

Many people will disagree with you. Source please? In general when people are speaking of 'Arabic numbers' they mean these numbers:

From Wikipedia,https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arabic_numerals: Arabic numerals or Hindu-Arabic numerals^[1][2] or Indo-Arabic numerals^[3] are the ten digits: 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9. They are the most common symbolic representation of numbers in the world today.

Like I said earlier, at Kamronwit's trial, all the evidence will be presented and it will be proven if I am right or wrong. In the meantime, why does it matter to you if you are so sure I am wrong? I have the right to speculate the same as many who have been speculating on this subject for the last few days. Thank you, in advance, for allowing me to voice my opinion.

I thought the same as you but to be sure, I did a Bing Image Search and this if what I found when I typed in 'Arabic numbers': http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=arabic+numbers&qs=SC&sk=&FORM=QBILPG&pq=arabic%20mumbers&sc=8-14&sp=1&qs=SC&sk=&ghc=1

The numbering system the West uses now is usually referred to as Western Arabic/European numerals.

Modern-day Arab telephone keypad with two forms of Arabic numerals: Western Arabic/European numerals on the left and Eastern Arabic numerals on the right:

EgyptphoneKeypad.jpg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arabic_numerals

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You can speculate all you like, but don't correct others with incorrect specific and general information.

In the same vein as Thaksin when he famously said, "The UN is not my father", I tell you that, "You are not my father" so I am not bound by your command.

People have been correcting me on this thread; have you also been admonishing them to not correct others or is it OK for them as long as you agree?

If I respond to someone who replied to me first, am I correcting them or am I responding to let them know I am not persuaded by their argument?

You started this by responding to my opinion and I am not persuaded. If you perceive this as 'correcting' you or others, that is your problem. Bye, now.

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There are opinions and there are facts. You are disputing facts. Nothing new there I suppose, some even consider evolution a theory in stead of a fact.

[Artisi]

"Camronwit's gun found to be unregistered"

Bye-Bye You. Enjoy some hospitality courtesy of the Japanese prison system.

Care to explain why the weapon being unregistered will make 1 bit of difference to the outcome, the charge I would assume will be endeavouring to smuggle the weapon onto an aircraft. Registered or unregistered, brand, calibre, serial number, receipts, registration etc. has nothing whatsoever to do with the particular crime / charge.

[spidermike007]

So typical of a high ranking Thai cop to do something entirely beyond the law. Many of us really hope that he spends time in the Japanese slammer.

[Nigeone]

"Camronwit's gun found to be unregistered"

Bye-Bye You. Enjoy some hospitality courtesy of the Japanese prison system.

Care to explain why the weapon being unregistered will make 1 bit of difference to the outcome, the charge I would assume will be endeavouring to smuggle the weapon onto an aircraft. Registered or unregistered, brand, calibre, serial number, receipts, registration etc. has nothing whatsoever to do with the particular crime / charge.

Correct me if I'm wrong but he can be charged with possession of a unregistered firearm, attempting to board a plane with said weapon. In possession of bullets in said gun..attempting to deceive security personal about owner and registers of gun..possibly charged with entering country with said gun..admitted by him..and I'm sure there's more..all,those he can be charged with..multiple charges all against aviation regulations..oh also I guess failing to declare said gun at check in...if its unregistered it's has to be illegal no?? Edited June 29, 2015 by Nigeone

[lovelomsak]

"Camronwit's gun found to be unregistered"

Bye-Bye You. Enjoy some hospitality courtesy of the Japanese prison system.

Care to explain why the weapon being unregistered will make 1 bit of difference to the outcome, the charge I would assume will be endeavouring to smuggle the weapon onto an aircraft. Registered or unregistered, brand, calibre, serial number, receipts, registration etc. has nothing whatsoever to do with the particular crime / charge.

I can only speculate but i would think a unregistered gun as opposed to a registered gun gives the appearance of wanting to have a weapon that cannot be traced back to the shooter if used for crime. I also feel a loaded unregistered gun creats the image of preperation for committing a crime. This just my humble opinion though. Which would support the charges.

Edited June 29, 2015 by lovelomsak

[Artisi]

"Camronwit's gun found to be unregistered"

Bye-Bye You. Enjoy some hospitality courtesy of the Japanese prison system.

Care to explain why the weapon being unregistered will make 1 bit of difference to the outcome, the charge I would assume will be endeavouring to smuggle the weapon onto an aircraft. Registered or unregistered, brand, calibre, serial number, receipts, registration etc. has nothing whatsoever to do with the particular crime / charge.

Correct me if I'm wrong but he can be charged with possession of a unregistered firearm, attempting to board a plane with said weapon. In possession of bullets in said gun..attempting to deceive security personal about owner and registers of gun..possibly charged with entering country with said gun..admitted by him..and I'm sure there's more..all,those he can be charged with..multiple charges all against aviation regulations..oh also I guess failing to declare said gun at check in...if its unregistered it's has to be illegal no??

Oh to be so pedantic and thorough, just why would the Japanese care one iota of the weapon's status in Thailand - not their jurisdiction or concern - the point I was making.

The charges laid in Japan have no bearing what so ever with what went before in Thailand.

[sweatalot]

Oh my God, it never ceases to amaze me how many uneducated people post on this site..... Arabic numerals.... 1,2,3,4 and so on. This is common knowledge. The "arabic" numerals were put on the gun by the American manufacturer. Oh derrr....

As to whether he got the gun in Thailand or Japan. Let me ask this. Where are you most likely to be able to lay your hands on an unregistered weapon. Thailand or Japan?

Ever considered that someone who lives in an Arabic country, and who owns a private yet and has been in Japan not so long ago, might have deposited the gun for Camronwit to pick it up and transport to Thailand?

interesting idea - but why?

[Nigeone]

"Camronwit's gun found to be unregistered"

Bye-Bye You. Enjoy some hospitality courtesy of the Japanese prison system.

Care to explain why the weapon being unregistered will make 1 bit of difference to the outcome, the charge I would assume will be endeavouring to smuggle the weapon onto an aircraft. Registered or unregistered, brand, calibre, serial number, receipts, registration etc. has nothing whatsoever to do with the particular crime / charge.

Correct me if I'm wrong but he can be charged with possession of a unregistered firearm, attempting to board a plane with said weapon. In possession of bullets in said gun..attempting to deceive security personal about owner and registers of gun..possibly charged with entering country with said gun..admitted by him..and I'm sure there's more..all,those he can be charged with..multiple charges all against aviation regulations..oh also I guess failing to declare said gun at check in...if its unregistered it's has to be illegal no??

Oh to be so pedantic and thorough, just why would the Japanese care one iota of the weapon's status in Thailand - not their jurisdiction or concern - the point I was making.

The charges laid in Japan have no bearing what so ever with what went before in Thailand.

Okay I understand what your trying to say..but without dwelling on the issue it does make a difference.If the gun has been used for ..say murder elsewhere..if it was anywhere else than Thailand who I wouldn't think for one minute have much forensic evidence of guns used in crime , it could be very relevant if ballistics could trace this gun to be used in crimes..therefore it has great relevance with him in possession or what might turn out to be a murder weapon...incidently have just before googled gun registry ..in USA it's not illegal to own a unregistered gun...amazing but I guess not a surprise...in the UK you have to have a firearms certificate which lists the gun and it's illegal otherwise..learnt something today.. Edited June 29, 2015 by Nigeone

[Anthony5]

Oh my God, it never ceases to amaze me how many uneducated people post on this site..... Arabic numerals.... 1,2,3,4 and so on. This is common knowledge. The "arabic" numerals were put on the gun by the American manufacturer. Oh derrr....

As to whether he got the gun in Thailand or Japan. Let me ask this. Where are you most likely to be able to lay your hands on an unregistered weapon. Thailand or Japan?

Ever considered that someone who lives in an Arabic country, and who owns a private yet and has been in Japan not so long ago, might have deposited the gun for Camronwit to pick it up and transport to Thailand?

interesting idea - but why?

Because someone has to be removed from the scene?

[halloween]

BP says BIB are checking the old hand-written gun registration records(pre 2009) to see if there was a mistake in transferring to the digital database. Finding that the gun was registered but lost in transfer would be miraculous, if not actually a surprise.

[sweatalot]

Amazing that one minute his son is on the way with the registration certificate for the gun and then the next the gun is not registered at all.

Now he claims he bough it in Japan. Did he forget?

Must have been a very stressful flight.

Either that or being in a shared damp cell wearing only his Y fronts has made him say anything at all to try and get out!

I wonder if he will ever come back?

Who cares?

Well said.

Despite having five bullets in the chamber at least the good news is they did not find a box of ammo in his luggage.

It must have been quite humiliating for him to have the mugshot taken along with fingerprints and DNA swab then placed in the cell where he has now spent a week locked up.

All taking place in a foreign country with everyone speaking a language you do not understand.

The boredom must be mind numbing.

may be he gets an idea what he did to many others. May be some of them were not as guilty as he is - or not guilty at all? (Even if it was not personal - just business)

[Nigeone]

BP says BIB are checking the old hand-written gun registration records(pre 2009) to see if there was a mistake in transferring to the digital database. Finding that the gun was registered but lost in transfer would be miraculous, if not actually a surprise.

Yes that's a good angle though isn't it...Thailand..the hub for excuses...!!

[sweatalot]

No mention of the purpose of his trip.

Yes there was. he was in a group of 80 going to see an industrial waste plant.

Hmmm...unlicenced .22 pistol (an assassin's favourite) industrial waste plant. where waste is burnt as fuel to produce energy.

Maybe a bit of stretch but...........wouldn't it be a great place to get rid of a body?

Might have to start writing a novel...or documentary

I'm not aware there was a bullet missing.

Btw When assassinate somebody in a waste plant I usually throw the gun into the fire as well

Edited June 29, 2015 by sweatalot

[sweatalot]

The fact that this guy was in a position of high Authority within the RTP, is really beyond comprehension.

How could anybody of such " high standing " be so reckless / arrogant.

His buddies will be quick to turn away from him now, as they surely would not wish to associated with him.

The fact that this guy was in a position of high Authority within the RTP, is really beyond comprehension.

May be it's not so uncommon in RTp?

[skildpadden]

This story just keeps on giving, and he seems to spinning himself in a web of lies. This is better than Thai soap operas.

That it does appear to be unregistered in Thailand should be interesting for the Japanese. I am sure that will lead to the Japanese to do ballistics tests and other tests to determine if the weapon could have been used in crimes elsewhere in the world or is wanted elsewhere.

The information found could be interesting for the INTERPOL Ballistic Information Network (IBIN) and the INTERPOL Illicit Arms Records and Tracing Management System (iARMS).

From Interpol site:
For the purposes of iARMS, a firearm is deemed to be “illicit” if:

• It is considered illicit under the law of the country in whose territorial jurisdiction it is found; or
• It is transferred in violation of an arms embargo decided by the United Nations Security Council in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations; or
• It is not marked in accordance with the International Instrument to Enable States to Identify and Trace, in a Timely and Reliable Manner, Illicit Small Arms and Light Weapons (International Tracing Instrument); or
• It is manufactured or assembled without a license or authorization from the competent authority of the country where the manufacture or assembly takes place; or
• It is transferred without a license or authorization as required by a competent national authority.

As former chief of police he of all should know to register a gun - and it would likely be very easy or him - unless of course he had a reason not to register it. He should also lead by example by living up to international standards (but alas we are talking about he RTP).

[Nigeone]

Yes this all quite interesting...I've just thought too despite swampy saying it didn't go through the airport which nobody believes I'm sure...if they are again!! Looking for the registration in 'old' pre 2009 paperwork before digital recording would that not realistically put to rest the fact that it must have come through swampy...there shooting themselves in the foot by each passing day...he must be really squirming now too...as someone else said the more lies you tell the bigger hole you dig ..

[Thai at Heart]

I still don't see what difference the registration has to do with carrying the gun onboard a plane leaving Japan. Don't get the big issue.

He's a gangster, he has gangstery things. He's a fool. Safest place for us to put him is in jail.

[Nigeone]

I still don't see what difference the registration has to do with carrying the gun onboard a plane leaving Japan. Don't get the big issue.

He's a gangster, he has gangstery things. He's a fool. Safest place for us to put him is in jail.

Remember he stated aparently that he held the registration of the gun and the paperwork was on its way with his son...it now turns out it's not registered at all..allegedly .that makes him more in the poo..so that throws into question everything else he's been saying..been not registered means it's not traceable therefore more in the poo...what's he doing with a unregistered gun and where did he get it from...remember Swampy are saying it didn't go through there..in my view it did by the way...so it does have big relevance..but I do agree with you the safest place is in jail and I would imagine there only to decide how long !! Edited June 29, 2015 by Nigeone

[Thai at Heart]

I still don't see what difference the registration has to do with carrying the gun onboard a plane leaving Japan. Don't get the big issue.

He's a gangster, he has gangstery things. He's a fool. Safest place for us to put him is in jail.

Remember he stated aparently that he held the registration of the gun and the paperwork was on its way with his son...it now turns out it's not registered at all..allegedly .that makes him more in the poo..so that throws into question everything else he's been saying..been not registered means it's not traceable therefore more in the poo...what's he doing with a unregistered gun and where did he get it from...remember Swampy are saying it didn't go through there..in view it did by the way...so it does have big relevance..but I do agree with you the safest place is in jail and I would imagine there only to decide how long !!

It is just as illegal to take a registered or unregistered gun on an aeroplane. So if he provides the documents he has a better chance of getting away with it? Don't think so.

The Japanese care that it was in their airport. All the rest of it is pretty irrelevant.

[Arkady]

BP says BIB are checking the old hand-written gun registration records(pre 2009) to see if there was a mistake in transferring to the digital database. Finding that the gun was registered but lost in transfer would be miraculous, if not actually a surprise.

If they come to the conclusion that the permit was somehow overlooked when they were transferred to the digital database, they then have to make the argument that someone forgot to engrave or stamp the Thai serial number on the gun. Whereas a Thai prosecutor might have no difficulty in believing this, the Japanese are unlikely to believe that two 1 in 10,000++ errors could have happened with the same gun. The system of Thai serial numbers goes back much further than 2009.

Another problem is going to be that the current model of the NNA .22 magnum Sidewinder only started production in 2012. The previous model was not called a Sidewinder, as the cylinder didn't swing out and had to be removed completely to load it. Therefore it looks quite different. In addition the year of production can be determined from the US serial number.

There also seems to be some suggestion that the Thai authorities might attempt to extradite him to face charges in Thailand in the hope that the Japanese would drop their charges and let the Thais deal with him in their own way for his series of honest mistakes. This also seems futile as the Japanese would surely say they are welcome to extradite him once his has finished his sentence over there for what could be construed as an attempt at air piracy. In fact they would compulsorily deport him back to Thailand. That would assume that he is still alive by then and the Thai statute of limitations has not expired.

[Nigeone]

BP says BIB are checking the old hand-written gun registration records(pre 2009) to see if there was a mistake in transferring to the digital database. Finding that the gun was registered but lost in transfer would be miraculous, if not actually a surprise.

If they come to the conclusion that the permit was somehow overlooked when they were transferred to the digital database, they then have to make the argument that someone forgot to engrave or stamp the Thai serial number on the gun. Whereas a Thai prosecutor might have no difficulty in believing this, the Japanese are unlikely to believe that two 1 in 10,000++ errors could have happened with the same gun. The system of Thai serial numbers goes back much further than 2009.

Another problem is going to be that the current model of the NNA .22 magnum Sidewinder only started production in 2012. The previous model was not called a Sidewinder, as the cylinder didn't swing out and had to be removed completely to load it. Therefore it looks quite different. In addition the year of production can be determined from the US serial number.

There also seems to be some suggestion that the Thai authorities might attempt to extradite him to face charges in Thailand in the hope that the Japanese would drop their charges and let the Thais deal with him in their own way for his series of honest mistakes. This also seems futile as the Japanese would surely say they are welcome to extradite him once his has finished his sentence over there for what could be construed as an attempt at air piracy. In fact they would compulsorily deport him back to Thailand. That would assume that he is still alive by then and the Thai statute of limitations has not expired.

So if what your saying is correct and I have no reason whatsoever to doubt you that would put the latest story about the paper records and not being recorded properly as another lie..apparently digital records started from 2009 and you reckon the gun is from 2012 at the earliest so they seem to be going to great lengths to try and get him off the hook...all interesting stuff though.