Koh Tao murder trial reconvenes in Koh Samui

[berybert]

i have commented on this case before and I still maintain that the verdict is already in these 2 boys will be found guilty to appease the families of the victims .

A guilty verdict will not appease the victims families.

As with everyone on here they have seen through this disgrace.

And yes I do mean everyone on here. Those who claim the Burmese are guilty do so for reasons no sane person could understand.

Edited September 2, 2015 by berybert

[silverado]

pic of the day...

[smedly]

Telegraph report says that after Win was stripped, blindfolded, beaten, told that his body would be dumped at sea,

he was told if he confessed that he would just go to prison for four or five years. And he had plastic bags on his head for the duration.

I am inclined to believe his statement. I sincerely hope that everyone who pays their fiver via direct debit to Amnesty

International every month will demand answers as to why they were not able to intervene when the B2 first retracted their confessions and spoke of

their torture. Disgusted.

I am of the opinion that either he has been coached well... or it actually happened as he said.

My view is he has a good defence team who know that to put him up to it would be disastrous as they both will be cross examined in detail, my bet is they have been advised well, to tell the truth as they will be vigorously cross-examined.

all the police/prosecution have to do to discredit their testimony is to show cctv evidence of something that shows them up as telling lies, an example would be footage of them leaving the beach area after 4am when they claim they were at home in bed at 3am, I somehow doubt that will happen as I don't believe the police/prosecution have anything that could debunk their claims my opinion is they likely have evidence that would conform their testimony but are hiding it, another reason as I said weeks ago that all cctv evidence that the police used should have been made available to defense but is seems it wasn't and therefore was withheld, and there is the problem, in the west you simply cannot do that as a prosecutor, all very basic stuff

[fish fingers]

This Trial has really screwed up Thailand's image .. and will continue to do so, whatever the outcome.

[Nigeone]

This Trial has really screwed up Thailand's image .. and will continue to do so, whatever the outcome.

I don't entirely agree with you. Anyone who has lived in Thailand for any length of time know what goes on and how justice is seen to be done but not necessarily with the right guilty parties. Solving a crime is more important than getting the real perps for the crime.! Hence the problems. All this trial has done is confirm and bring out into the open what really goes on behind the land of smiles. Money talks I'm afraid but I do agree that many who were not aware of how it works will have there eyes opened. I feel incredibly sad for the parents and family of Hannah and David as if it's not enough to lose your loved ones you then have to witness and read about the disgrace of the RTP prosecutions case and the fragrant lies and covering up of so much information. Justice is not going to be done in this trial but maybe at least the B2 might be found not guilty and freed. That's as much as can be hoped for I feel because they are not going to revisit the crime scene and evidence not submitted etc as it will incriminate the protected! and expose the powers that be that hold the purse strings. Sad but true. However the world and human rights are watching and have so much more information because of this trial so who knows , maybe it will lead to a more professional and honest investigation in the future ! I'm not holding my breath sadly ! Edited September 2, 2015 by Nigeone

[Nigeone]

Telegraph report says that after Win was stripped, blindfolded, beaten, told that his body would be dumped at sea,

he was told if he confessed that he would just go to prison for four or five years. And he had plastic bags on his head for the duration.

I am inclined to believe his statement. I sincerely hope that everyone who pays their fiver via direct debit to Amnesty

International every month will demand answers as to why they were not able to intervene when the B2 first retracted their confessions and spoke of

their torture. Disgusted.

I am of the opinion that either he has been coached well... or it actually happened as he said.

My view is he has a good defence team who know that to put him up to it would be disastrous as they both will be cross examined in detail, my bet is they have been advised well, to tell the truth as they will be vigorously cross-examined.

all the police/prosecution have to do to discredit their testimony is to show cctv evidence of something that shows them up as telling lies, an example would be footage of them leaving the beach area after 4am when they claim they were at home in bed at 3am, I somehow doubt that will happen as I don't believe the police/prosecution have anything that could debunk their claims my opinion is they likely have evidence that would conform their testimony but are hiding it, another reason as I said weeks ago that all cctv evidence that the police used should have been made available to defense but is seems it wasn't and therefore was withheld, and there is the problem, in the west you simply cannot do that as a prosecutor, all very basic stuff

There not going to show anything to undermine the defense case as I'm sure they haven't got it. If they had it would have come to light before now. I am sure they have evidence to incriminate other people but your right your never going to see that.. They would have to hand back the millions of Bht if they did.

[dundee48]

If I was thay guy on the picture posing ,I would be quite upset actually having to deal with social media gossip .

Yes he could be a bad guy , but maybe just a normal guy, looking tough and posing on pictures.

It will only lead to endless speculations until someone actually can dig up som "dirt" on this guy.

Correct Balo. the B2 conspiracy theorists here have named and shamed so many people is actually quite embarrassing. To be truthfully, at the end of the day, what they say actually makes to difference, no one really cares what they write, there is a bigger picture and they are 0.00001% of this, i.e irrelevant. They think they are making a contribution but in reality nothing, zero, ziltch.

I suppose it is difficult for you to understand that until the B2 are found guilty then the prosecution case is what is considered a conspiracy.

But that may ne too much for you.

Don`t feed the troll.

[catsanddogs]

http://news.sky.com/story/1545513/backpacker-accused-i-was-tortured-naked

During the interrogation in early October last year, two weeks after the bodies were found on a beach, Zaw Lin said they put him on the telephone to his co-accused, Wei Phyo, also 22, who told him: "They almost killed me. I am almost dying."

Kingsley Abbott of the International Commission of Jurists, along with other human rights lawyers, sat through the 10 hours of testimony on Wednesday.

Mr Abbot said afterwards: "Based on what we heard today, that he was stripped naked, had plastic bags placed over his head, blindfolded and made to fear for his life in order to extract a confession, it is very likely to meet the definition of torture as defined by the Convention Against Torture, to which Thailand is a party."

[catsanddogs]

The third man was not arrested with Zaw Lin and Wei Phyo, and police investigators told the court they have since "lost contact with him".

http://news.sky.com/story/1545513/backpacker-accused-i-was-tortured-naked

I really do hope someone somewhere has contact with Maung Maung and hope the defence will look into his whereabouts.

[Aj Mick]

Other are now picking it up, surprised it is not in the news section as I think a lot of people are interested in this

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/thailand/11838501/Suspect-in-British-backpacker-murder-trial-describes-police-torture.html

sky news

http://news.sky.com/story/1545513/backpacker-murder-suspect-tells-of-torture

The Daily Mail though I don't know if you can open this

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3219592/Bar-worker-claims-admitted-murdering-two-British-backpackers-tortured-police-tied-plastic-bags-head-collapsed.html

In the news for all the wrong reasons again

This case, is now getting little or no coverage from English language news sources within Thailand, and zilch from Thai language sources as far as I can tell. I cannot believe that it is because folks here in Thailand have lost interest in it.

Correct, the Daily Mail is blocked in Thailand.

Edited September 2, 2015 by Aj Mick

[webfact]

Man accused of murdering British backpackers in Thailand says his 'confession' was obtained through torture
DOUG BOLTON

LONDON: -- One of the men accused of murdering two British backpackers in Thailand last year has claimed that his 'confession' was obtained through torture.

Hannah Witheridge, 23, from Norfolk, and David Miller, 24, from Jersey, were murdered on a beach on the island of Koh Tao in September 2014. It is understood that the two travellers had met on the island while staying at the same hotel.

Post mortem examinations showed that both had suffered severe head wounds, and that Ms Witheridge had been raped.

Two 22-year-old bar workers on the island, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, were accused of the murders. But as reported by Sky News, Lin has claimed that his initial confession to the murders was false, and obtained through torture.

He told a court on the neighbouring island of Koh Samui that he was woken up at night in October 2014 by ten men in the dormitory that he shared with other workers.

He said that he and other workers were handcuffed and taken outside. He was separated from the rest, and taken to somewhere that was not a police station.

Full story http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/man-accused-of-murdering-british-backpackers-in-thailand-says-his-confession-was-obtained-through-torture-10483284.html

-- The Independent 2015-09-03

[boomerangutang]

Will the Defence call Nomsod to the stand just for a few questions and put him under oath to say where he was on the night of the murders.

Why would they, his whereabouts has been validated, unless you can confirm otherwise

Running Man videos. They show Nomsod. Mon tried to stifle every bit of evidence showing his nephew on the island, but those were a very busy two days and he must have missed the CCTV showing NS, or else he didn't have control of that camera, as he has control (and/or influence with owners) over nearly every other camera in that vicinity. There are likely other proofs of NS being on the island and possibly being involved with the crime, but there are concerted sustained efforts by certain parties to snuff out any proofs. Have you been paying attention?

I would be interested to know if the clothes that were stolen from Win on the beach were described in court today. The top that Maung was wearing in the CCTV stills appeared to be the one that Win was wearing on the motorbike. So I'm wondering if the black top was the one that was supposedly stolen from the beach that Maung seemed to be wearing later on. unfortunately I cannot find a pic of Maung wearing it with a timestamp on but I believe other posters may have one. As often happens, I am not being given an option on here to attach files so will post separately.

You're concerned about details which a farang investigation/court would delve into. As we know, this drama is playing out in Thailand, and there are a plethora of details (which could be crucial) which won't be addressed. It would be like if you bring your car in to a Thai mechanic and start mentioning all sorts of problems (bald tires, brakes not working, clutch slipping, etc.). The mechanic reaches in, turns the key, starts the car and says, "see, no problem. Car can go. You ok now." Actually, to more accurately make the analogy with the trial proceedings, the mechanic (prosecution) would find a cig butt on the floor of the car and claim that's the cause of your problem.

[shaurene]

Hannah was clutching a hair, it came out by the roots, in other words she pulled it out of the attackers head! The hair does not belong to David, it does not belong to the B2. There's a killer on the loose and the whole case against the B2 is a sham. The scenario the RTP have said happened is false. For Gods sake get out there again and re investigate this case the victims deserve more than this charade as do the parents of the victims.

agreed, but I'd like to add this, the most common place to find DNA evidence on both victims and perps of this sort of violent close encounter crime is under finger nails, for the perp it is hard to remove and often overlooked and can remain there for a very long time, have you ever done some motor servicing and got that dirty black oil in behind your nails, not easy to remove

Theres the UK autopsy results coming so lets see what it discloses.

Would this be admissible in court?

Maybe or maybe not but it is admissible in the press and would make it harder for the court to convict knowing that DNA from a unbiased source contradicts the RTP version.

I did not know about the hair, the hair would be one of the most important pieces of ever dense. She would have been fighting and going for the head. They should have checked the DNA with every male on the island.

I bet that hair evidence has strangely gone missing. What made me angry in the beginning, none of the police had any idea/sense of what to do when they found the bodies, like trained police forces would have had the island locked down, no one on and no one off.

These 2 guys have been framed, 100%.

I hope the grudges are not under pressure to convict.

[Charlie Croker]

We all knew they were being tortured into making confessions, when they released statements like the investigation is 75% complete.

[shaurene]

Telegraph report says that after Win was stripped, blindfolded, beaten, told that his body would be dumped at sea,b

he was told if he confessed that he would just go to prison for four or five years. And he had plastic bags on his head for the duration.

I am inclined to believe his statement. I sincerely hope that everyone who pays their fiver via direct debit to Amnesty

International every month will demand answers as to why they were not able to intervene when the B2 first retracted their confessions and spoke of

their torture. Disgusted.

I am of the opinion that either he has been coached well... or it actually happened as he said.

My view is he has a good defence team who know that to put him up to it would be disastrous as they both will be cross examined in detail, my bet is they have been advised well, to tell the truth as they will be vigorously cross-examined.

all the police/prosecution have to do to discredit their testimony is to show cctv evidence of something that shows them up as telling lies, an example would be footage of them leaving the beach area after 4am when they claim they were at home in bed at 3am, I somehow doubt that will happen as I don't believe the police/prosecution have anything that could debunk their claims my opinion is they likely have evidence that would conform their testimony but are hiding it, another reason as I said weeks ago that all cctv evidence that the police used should have been made available to defense but is seems it wasn't and therefore was withheld, and there is the problem, in the west you simply cannot do that as a prosecutor, all very basic stuff

There not going to show anything to undermine the defense case as I'm sure they haven't got it. If they had it would have come to light before now. I am sure they have evidence to incriminate other people but your right your never going to see that.. They would have to hand back the millions of Bht if they did.

I quite believe they were tortured. I read a book last year about a Australian guy with oil underwater diving company he got scammed and found the main guy, they had meetings for him to get all the deposits back he pain to a so called USA company to place the tender in. They were driving back to Bangkok and had a fight when they stopped the car, the Aussie guy got the better of it by taking the knife off the other guy, he left him down the bank where they fell police came and the body had gone, they took him to Bangkok and the Aussie guy gave the full story of his torturous, including the plastic bags over his head, he stated it was the Tourist police department. He confessed under the torturous conditions and spent 14 yrs in Bangkok prisons. You can find the book in most of the book shops at the BBK airport, great reading.

[StealthEnergiser]

Hannah was clutching a hair, it came out by the roots, in other words she pulled it out of the attackers head! The hair does not belong to David, it does not belong to the B2. There's a killer on the loose and the whole case against the B2 is a sham. The scenario the RTP have said happened is false. For Gods sake get out there again and re investigate this case the victims deserve more than this charade as do the parents of the victims.

agreed, but I'd like to add this, the most common place to find DNA evidence on both victims and perps of this sort of violent close encounter crime is under finger nails, for the perp it is hard to remove and often overlooked and can remain there for a very long time, have you ever done some motor servicing and got that dirty black oil in behind your nails, not easy to remove

Theres the UK autopsy results coming so lets see what it discloses.

Would this be admissible in court?

Maybe or maybe not but it is admissible in the press and would make it harder for the court to convict knowing that DNA from a unbiased source contradicts the RTP version.

I did not know about the hair, the hair would be one of the most important pieces of ever dense. She would have been fighting and going for the head. They should have checked the DNA with every male on the island.

I bet that hair evidence has strangely gone missing. What made me angry in the beginning, none of the police had any idea/sense of what to do when they found the bodies, like trained police forces would have had the island locked down, no one on and no one off.

These 2 guys have been framed, 100%.

I hope the grudges are not under pressure to convict.

What i don't understand is that The police pathologist who carried out the autopsy said in July that the investigation had set the evidence aside because of the inconclusive test result.

If she has tested that wouldn't the results be in the system now and they just need a match.

I don't understand why she is saying inconclusive if she knows the DNA does not match Hannah / David or the B2.

http://www.eveningnews24.co.uk/news/senior_police_officers_give_contradictory_evidence_at_hannah_witheridge_murder_trial_1_4215995?utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitterfeed

[smedly]

Will the Defence call Nomsod to the stand just for a few questions and put him under oath to say where he was on the night of the murders.

Why would they, his whereabouts has been validated, unless you can confirm otherwise

Running Man videos. They show Nomsod. Mon tried to stifle every bit of evidence showing his nephew on the island, but those were a very busy two days and he must have missed the CCTV showing NS, or else he didn't have control of that camera, as he has control (and/or influence with owners) over nearly every other camera in that vicinity. There are likely other proofs of NS being on the island and possibly being involved with the crime, but there are concerted sustained efforts by certain parties to snuff out any proofs. Have you been paying attention?

I would be interested to know if the clothes that were stolen from Win on the beach were described in court today. The top that Maung was wearing in the CCTV stills appeared to be the one that Win was wearing on the motorbike. So I'm wondering if the black top was the one that was supposedly stolen from the beach that Maung seemed to be wearing later on. unfortunately I cannot find a pic of Maung wearing it with a timestamp on but I believe other posters may have one. As often happens, I am not being given an option on here to attach files so will post separately.

You're concerned about details which a farang investigation/court would delve into. As we know, this drama is playing out in Thailand, and there are a plethora of details (which could be crucial) which won't be addressed. It would be like if you bring your car in to a Thai mechanic and start mentioning all sorts of problems (bald tires, brakes not working, clutch slipping, etc.). The mechanic reaches in, turns the key, starts the car and says, "see, no problem. Car can go. You ok now." Actually, to more accurately make the analogy with the trial proceedings, the mechanic (prosecution) would find a cig butt on the floor of the car and claim that's the cause of your problem.

ok so lets be clear about this

Nomsod in not on trial, the defense team are not police or prosecutors so Nomsod, Mon, Shark tooth guy or anyone else for that matter will be in this court room unless they have direct witness input.

If however someone uncovers undeniable ground breaking provable evidence that implicates them or anyone else then it would be reported to the police and it would be their duty to follow it up and investigate

[Briggsy]

Stealth Energiser

Re the hair, very concisely put.

The hair issue highlights the fact that the investigation is not objective, unbiased or led by the evidence.

Rather the investigation is led by a predetermined outcome that it shall not go in a particular direction or incriminate certain important people. Therefore the police set aside and do not introduce to court any evidence that does not fit this scenario. That includes the hair. They also appear to hide this evidence from the defence.

[thailandchilli]

I did not know about the hair, the hair would be one of the most important pieces of ever dense. She would have been fighting and going for the head. They should have checked the DNA with every male on the island.

I bet that hair evidence has strangely gone missing. What made me angry in the beginning, none of the police had any idea/sense of what to do when they found the bodies, like trained police forces would have had the island locked down, no one on and no one off.

These 2 guys have been framed, 100%.

I hope the grudges are not under pressure to convict.

What i don't understand is that The police pathologist who carried out the autopsy said in July that the investigation had set the evidence aside because of the inconclusive test result.

If she has tested that wouldn't the results be in the system now and they just need a match.

I don't understand why she is saying inconclusive if she knows the DNA does not match Hannah / David or the B2.

http://www.eveningnews24.co.uk/news/senior_police_officers_give_contradictory_evidence_at_hannah_witheridge_murder_trial_1_4215995?utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitterfeed

I'm saddened and quite disgusted at the lies and false testimonies being given by a number of the RTP witnesses. Yes there are so many examples now that there is enough to say STOP this complete and utter stitch up job, you weren't clever enough to pull it off and your further dragging down Thailand's credibility and reputation for justice for the whole world to see.

Putting aside the utter lack of respect their showing for the victims and their families by this amateur display of an investigation and putting aside the scapegoats they have in court now and the alleged torture and false evidence. The world is listening and observing, they may have clipped the wings of the Thai press but unfortunately for them its not the Thai press that people in the world take notice of anyway. Do the right thing Thailand/judges in this case. You managed to correct the injustice being perpetrated on the Phuketwan journalists, please show the world that the judgement you give reflects all that has been represented in a fair and transparent manner. If you don't then there are observers in the court room, highly respected international organizations that will be reporting the truth for you.

Its little wonder the UK police released their brief report when they returned to the UK and highlighted the confusion and inconsistencies. I bet even they are now in a state of utter astonishment at the further contradictions being openly reported in court.

[Fat Haggis]

If I was thay guy on the picture posing ,I would be quite upset actually having to deal with social media gossip .

Yes he could be a bad guy , but maybe just a normal guy, looking tough and posing on pictures.

It will only lead to endless speculations until someone actually can dig up som "dirt" on this guy.

Oh really, the fact that he posed for these pictures and put them on a social media site means he is open to criticism and gossip, you don't want harangued, it's simply, don't post or write stuff that people can use against you on a public social network site!!!

[StealthEnergiser]

Koh Tao defendant tells court of torture

• 

By Michael Sainsbury | Thursday, 03 September 2015

As the first of two Rakhine State migrants took the stand in the Koh Tao murder trial yesterday, the court heard how the police allegedly tortured the slightly built 22-year-old into confessing

Ko Zaw Lin and Ko Wai Phyo stand accused of murdering a pair of British backpackers on the Thai tourist island of Koh Tao last year. Both suspects initially confessed to killing David Miller, and killing and raping Hannah Witheridge, but later withdrew the confessions under allegations of torture.

The Myanmar suspects were arrested two weeks after the victims’ bodies were found amid an investigation riddled with irregularities and inconsistencies. Early on, police had already limited their focus to migrant workers, prompting accusations the pair are scapegoats.

http://www.mmtimes.com/index.php/national-news/16286-koh-tao-defendant-tells-court-of-torture.html

[boomerangutang]

Other are now picking it up, surprised it is not in the news section as I think a lot of people are interested in this

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/thailand/11838501/Suspect-in-British-backpacker-murder-trial-describes-police-torture.html

sky news

http://news.sky.com/story/1545513/backpacker-murder-suspect-tells-of-torture

The Daily Mail though I don't know if you can open this

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3219592/Bar-worker-claims-admitted-murdering-two-British-backpackers-tortured-police-tied-plastic-bags-head-collapsed.html

In the news for all the wrong reasons again

News stories carried by International press corps, but nothing in Thai newspapers. Go figure.

What i don't understand is that The police pathologist who carried out the autopsy said in July that the investigation had set the evidence aside because of the inconclusive test result. If she (forensic 'expert') has tested that (the hair) wouldn't the results be in the system now and they just need a match. I don't understand why she is saying inconclusive if she knows the DNA does not match Hannah / David or the B2.

You're assuming the Thai forensics person knows what she's doing, has the right tools, and isn't influenced by her agenda-driven bosses. that's a BIG assumption. Additionally, if the hair doesn't match the scapegoats and/or DID MATCH one of the people the RTP are sworn to shield, then it makes perfect sense that RTP would lose it.

ok so lets be clear about this

Nomsod in not on trial, the defense team are not police or prosecutors so Nomsod, Mon, Shark tooth guy or anyone else for that matter will (not?) be in this court room unless they have direct witness input.

If however someone uncovers undeniable ground breaking provable evidence that implicates them or anyone else then it would be reported to the police and it would be their duty to follow it up and investigate

"....It would be their (RTP's) duty....." Yea, like entrusting your aunt Mildred to lead a climbing trek up K2 in bedroom slippers.

Edited September 3, 2015 by boomerangutang

[Rykbanlor]

If I was thay guy on the picture posing ,I would be quite upset actually having to deal with social media gossip .

Yes he could be a bad guy , but maybe just a normal guy, looking tough and posing on pictures.

It will only lead to endless speculations until someone actually can dig up som "dirt" on this guy.

Oh really, the fact that he posed for these pictures and put them on a social media site means he is open to criticism and gossip, you don't want harangued, it's simply, don't post or write stuff that people can use against you on a public social network site!!!

Please don't tell me He is defending the guy who posed with a frickin hoe. Yes, if he posts that kind of insensitive bs he deserves to be scrutinised.

[Fat Haggis]

People who seem intent on "baiting" would do well to remember that the B2 are innocent until proven guilty, not the other way around

[stephenterry]

If she has tested that wouldn't the results be in the system now and they just need a match.

I don't understand why she is saying inconclusive if she knows the DNA does not match Hannah / David or the B2.

Maybe the defence missed a trick there. What does 'inconclusive' mean? No doubt when it was returned, the RTP said it matches. I think 11 September will be very enlightening after Win completes his testimony and Ms Pornthip takes the stand. I think this will be the day when key DNA evidence is submitted that contests that of the prosecution's assertions.

If, and when, that happens it will be all downhill for the defence, bolstered by the professional crime scene witness, and possibly statements from other UK witnesses. They could probably attain 'reasonable doubt' that the prosecution case has not been proven, in which case a not guilty verdict should be the outcome at this court. Then there will be an appeal...

[stephenterry]

snip

ok so lets be clear about this

Nomsod in not on trial, the defense team are not police or prosecutors so Nomsod, Mon, Shark tooth guy or anyone else for that matter will be in this court room unless they have direct witness input.

If however someone uncovers undeniable ground breaking provable evidence that implicates them or anyone else then it would be reported to the police and it would be their duty to follow it up and investigate

I agree that Nomsod is not on trial at this court. But your second sentence, whilst being true, won't happen here because it should have already happened.

[seahorse]

This Trial has really screwed up Thailand's image .. and will continue to do so, whatever the outcome.

I don't entirely agree with you. Anyone who has lived in Thailand for any length of time know what goes on and how justice is seen to be done but not necessarily with the right guilty parties. Solving a crime is more important than getting the real perps for the crime.! Hence the problems. All this trial has done is confirm and bring out into the open what really goes on behind the land of smiles. Money talks I'm afraid but I do agree that many who were not aware of how it works will have there eyes opened. I feel incredibly sad for the parents and family of Hannah and David as if it's not enough to lose your loved ones you then have to witness and read about the disgrace of the RTP prosecutions case and the fragrant lies and covering up of so much information. Justice is not going to be done in this trial but maybe at least the B2 might be found not guilty and freed. That's as much as can be hoped for I feel because they are not going to revisit the crime scene and evidence not submitted etc as it will incriminate the protected! and expose the powers that be that hold the purse strings. Sad but true. However the world and human rights are watching and have so much more information because of this trial so who knows , maybe it will lead to a more professional and honest investigation in the future ! I'm not holding my breath sadly !

Yes, indeed. Many who were not aware of how the judicial system works in Thailand have had their eyes opened. Justice seems to be the least of their considerations.

[boomerangutang]

If she has tested that wouldn't the results be in the system now and they just need a match.

I don't understand why she is saying inconclusive if she knows the DNA does not match Hannah / David or the B2.

Maybe the defence missed a trick there. What does 'inconclusive' mean? No doubt when it was returned, the RTP said it matches. I think 11 September will be very enlightening after Win completes his testimony and Ms Pornthip takes the stand. I think this will be the day when key DNA evidence is submitted that contests that of the prosecution's assertions.

If, and when, that happens it will be all downhill for the defence, bolstered by the professional crime scene witness, and possibly statements from other UK witnesses. They could probably attain 'reasonable doubt' that the prosecution case has not been proven, in which case a not guilty verdict should be the outcome at this court. Then there will be an appeal...

I agree somewhat. But I even Ms Pontip will likely have limitations on what she can or cannot say. For starters, she probably won't be allowed to mention DNA as it relates to the Headman's family or mafia-like buddies. Also, if she's apprised of whatever was found out about the hair (even if it was 'inconclusive'), she will probably have to keep quiet on that also, as it's now officially been lost.

British forensics, whether official or privately garnered, isn't under such restrictions. Brit officials will probably skirt the issue of H's peoples' DNA but the expert working independently may be able to speak his true thoughts.

That's a basic dynamic running like a thread through this entire case, from 5 am Monday morning Sept 15, 2014 to today, and beyond. The truth is getting trampled, and there are concerted & sustained efforts from several powerful entities to keep truth. from being aired. The near-gag order from the court, and the gag order on Thai news outlets are just two of many proofs. Other proofs: 200 of 300 CCTV cameras purportedly not working in the vicinity of the crime. Mon only asked about whether he was told of the crime early on Monday morning, ...nothing more. The list is long and sad.

Do Thai parents and teachers teach their kids that it's fine to tell lies? If so, that might partly explain why lying is endemic to Thais.

[Richard Hall]

We all knew they were being tortured into making confessions, when they released statements like the investigation is 75% complete.

Wow, am I the only exception that doesn't.

[thailandchilli]

We all knew they were being tortured into making confessions, when they released statements like the investigation is 75% complete.

Wow, am I the only exception that doesn't.

No, I'm sure there's another 5 or 6 that don't also, but no problem they'll be along soon to give your post a like