Koh Tao Murders: Defense Asks Court to Drop Charges

[sambum]

I want to come back to the hoe

David and Hannah's DNA were matched on the handle

we have other DNA

if this could be extracted and identified then we have some more suspects

Agree 100%! It's been mentioned a few times, but why not start with the owner of the hoe (The "blind gardener") and while they are at it why not ask him a few questions as well about why it was moved back and forward?

[sambum]

Which really says it all about the Rtp. Any reasonable person would agree that if the b2 were real suspects the clothes would have been subject to forensic examination. A bright teenager could work that one out. And to think a few posters still believe that the b2 are guilty beggars belief.

The teenager would not even have to be that bright! I would have thought - sorry I'll rephrase that - the whole world and his dog must surely know that the first pieces of evidence to be DNA tested should be the murder weapon, and then the clothes that the victim was wearing! It's obvious that if Hannah's clothes were not DNA tested, and have now gone "missing" then .............................? Draw your own conclusions, especially as there is none of the B2's DNA on the murder weapon!

[stephenterry]

The whole premise of the innocence of the Burmese men and their supposed use as scapegoats is based on things that are known not to be true, things that are not known to be true and willfully ignoring and downplaying facts that don't fit with the narrative.

Replace with the whole premise of guilt is based on things etc etc

[stephenterry]

Sometimes I wonder.

[stephenterry]

The only fact is that the rtp assert that the DNA found in the female matches the b2. This has not been substantiated. Fact. <removed>

[stephenterry]

It's likely that a guilty verdict will be announced as it has been ordered by the authorities, IMO. That should make the pro hang them high gang happy.

[AleG]

A zillion folks DNA is on the weapon but NOT any of the B2's........Now come on.......WHY is that...?

Went to 7/11 and bought rubber gloves...?

Why is that you turned a partial DNA match from one person into "a zillion folks"?

No, really, I'd like to hear an explanation for that.

There were three results from the test, two from the victims and a partial one (that matched a quarter of the markers on one of the suspects).

I asked this question again (and I expect no answer again), if the argument is that there must be DNA from the two Burmese if they ever touched the hoe, where's the DNA from the owner of the hoe?

Because we know for a fact that man carried the hoe on that day, and who knows for how many months he (and possible others) used it. Yet, no profile.

The answer is, of course, that there's no guarantee that holding an object will leave enough DNA to be identified.

[CharlieH]

hair-splitting nitpicking/bating removed and response to it.

[StealthEnergiser]

I want to come back to the hoe

David and Hannah's DNA were matched on the handle

we have other DNA

if this could be extracted and identified then we have some more suspects

The extra DNA on the hoe should be investigated immediately .

Has anyone seen confirmation that the DNA tests done on Nomsod were confirmed by a reliable source. ???

One would think that all suspects should be checked again by a trustworthy organisation and not the previous police.

It has also been reported that police lied under oath "see post 301" so they should be kept away from the new investigation.

Edited November 1, 2015 by StealthEnergiser

[StealthEnergiser]

A zillion folks DNA is on the weapon but NOT any of the B2's........Now come on.......WHY is that...?

Went to 7/11 and bought rubber gloves...?

Why is that you turned a partial DNA match from one person into "a zillion folks"?

No, really, I'd like to hear an explanation for that.

There were three results from the test, two from the victims and a partial one (that matched a quarter of the markers on one of the suspects).

I asked this question again (and I expect no answer again), if the argument is that there must be DNA from the two Burmese if they ever touched the hoe, where's the DNA from the owner of the hoe?

Because we know for a fact that man carried the hoe on that day, and who knows for how many months he (and possible others) used it. Yet, no profile.

The answer is, of course, that there's no guarantee that holding an object will leave enough DNA to be identified.

out of interest what hoe are you talking about ?

[StealthEnergiser]

Why did the police show this ? what is the reason for the plastic bag over the handle ?

[sweatalot]

There's an update re; the untimely death of Christene Annesley. You may recall, she's the young British gal who was found dead in Mon's guest house, months after the Sept crime. Her parents went and found the last person who had spoken with Christene on KT. The parents asked British authorities to assist, but they didn't. Now it appears the parents are arranging for a private investigation, to find out whether she was murdered. We also hear she was the same age and went to the same UK college as David. An ordinarily healthy 23 yr old gal doesn't just expire and die all of a sudden. Is it possible she was inquiring about the murders of David and Hannah? If so, it's quite possible the same person who participated in the murder of (or the cover-up of the crime against) D & H would not hesitate to kill someone who was asking annoying questions. She had just graduated with a major in journalism. Journalists ask questions. Killers-on-the-run don't like probing questions - particularly by journalists.

speculation

but may very well be true

interesting anyway

[AleG]

A zillion folks DNA is on the weapon but NOT any of the B2's........Now come on.......WHY is that...?

Went to 7/11 and bought rubber gloves...?

Why is that you turned a partial DNA match from one person into "a zillion folks"?

No, really, I'd like to hear an explanation for that.

There were three results from the test, two from the victims and a partial one (that matched a quarter of the markers on one of the suspects).

I asked this question again (and I expect no answer again), if the argument is that there must be DNA from the two Burmese if they ever touched the hoe, where's the DNA from the owner of the hoe?

Because we know for a fact that man carried the hoe on that day, and who knows for how many months he (and possible others) used it. Yet, no profile.

The answer is, of course, that there's no guarantee that holding an object will leave enough DNA to be identified.

Is that your explanation for posting misinformation?

Edited November 1, 2015 by AleG

[HUH]

A zillion folks DNA is on the weapon but NOT any of the B2's........Now come on.......WHY is that...?

Went to 7/11 and bought rubber gloves...?

Why is that you turned a partial DNA match from one person into "a zillion folks"?

No, really, I'd like to hear an explanation for that.

There were three results from the test, two from the victims and a partial one (that matched a quarter of the markers on one of the suspects).

I asked this question again (and I expect no answer again), if the argument is that there must be DNA from the two Burmese if they ever touched the hoe, where's the DNA from the owner of the hoe?

Because we know for a fact that man carried the hoe on that day, and who knows for how many months he (and possible others) used it. Yet, no profile.

The answer is, of course, that there's no guarantee that holding an object will leave enough DNA to be identified.

When the owner "O" moved the hoe it is reported police told him to put gloves on, there is also a photo of O with a glove on his hand next to the hoe. In addition there are a number of reasons why there may not be further DNA on the hoe, partial washing being one. I wonder why the police tried to get him to say the hoe had been washed?

“Also, police cajoled him to say he washed off the blood from the hoe. However, that is not what he told the judge. He said that he had not paid any attention to the hoe and was not aware of whether there was any blood on it or not.”

[StealthEnergiser]

more from the above article

The police say that DNA found on the female victim's body will show the truth. But the defence has not been allowed to analyse that DNA, the police lab is not ISO-certified to analyse DNA samples, and having their own lab test the DNA is clearly a conflict of interest. [/size]

The cops haven't shown that they've followed S134/4, they haven't let the defence analyse the victim's DNA, the police lab wasn't internationally certified to analyse DNA, and they should have used a neutral, fully qualified lab.[/size]

The accused might well be guilty of the rape and murder, but the evidence presented doesn't prove it. To show that justice has been done, and thus preserve Thailand's image, both defendants must be freed.[/size]

Burin Kantabutra[/size]

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/opinion/Guilt-not-shown-in-Koh-Tao-trial-30270711.html

If you are going to start a cut and paste Appeal to Authority campaign at least do it with someone who can maintain his credibility past a couple paragraphs, this is false :"the defence has not been allowed to analyse that DNA" and it's repeated three times.

The court issued an order so that the defense could have the evidence analyzed, they (the defense) declined to do so. That is a documented fact and it doesn't matter how many times it is denied, facts are those pesky things that don't go away if you stop believing in them.

The Samui Provincial Court has ordered remaining forensic evidence in the Koh Tao tourist murders case to be sent for re-examination at the Thai Justice Ministry's Central Institute of Forensic Science in line with a defence request, according to local Thai media reports on July 10.

The court, in Surat Thani, yesterday ordered public prosecutors to work with investigators to send all remaining forensic evidence found at the crime scene, including a shovel, for forensic retesting.

And then what happened?

The defence team in the Koh Tao murder trial has dramatically reversed its demands to retest the DNA found on the body of Norfolk student Hannah Witheridge, and said they “don’t need it any more.”

how many times do you have to be told - the only DNA samples the defense would be interested in retesting in an approved lab are the original samples, the police were not offering the original samples because they claim they no longer have them - go figure

What they were offering was some processed extract that could not be verified as to its source - it could in fact have been saliva samples from the accused, no way to tell, why would the defense want to test samples they could not even verify if they came from the victims body - seriously ?

That is why they declined

Further - I can think of no good reason why the claimed original samples are no longer available considering the plentiful source, I can only conclude that either they never existed or police have destroyed them

I wish you would stop posting this inaccurate nonsense

Very good post Smedly well explained thank you.

[sweatalot]

HUH, on 31 Oct 2015 - 09:06, said:

AGareth2, on 31 Oct 2015 - 08:40, said:

I want to come back to the hoe

David and Hannah's DNA were matched on the handle

we have other DNA

if this could be extracted and identified then we have some more suspects

Yes and I also think the hair is never going to go away as much as the prosecution would want it to.

They were using this mysterious blonde hair to match to suspects early on in the case but since then?? Where is it? who does it belong to? The real killer? (for sure)

A British man has become the prime suspect for the murder of two British tourists and his arrest is imminent, a senior Thai police officer told The Telegraph on Wednesday.

Prachum Ruangthong, the head of police on the Thai island of Koh Tao where the murder took place, said he believed a British man was the likely killer of Hannah Witheridge and David Miller.

Police would have closed the case by the end of the day once DNA testing on samples of hair found in Ms Witheridge's hand were concluded, he added.

"After this evening everything will become clear." http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/thailand/11100980/British-man-prime-suspect-in-Thailand-murder.html

Yes and I also think the hair is never going to go away as much as the prosecution would want it to.

Neither is the loss of Hannah's clothing, which must have had the killer(s) DNA all over it.

Neither is the failure to survey AC bar, the location where the victims were last seen alive - many things could have happened many motives imaginable -

isn't it routine to check everybody who had contact with a murder victim shortly before the crime?

[CharlieH]

A post commenting on Moderation has been removed.

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[seedy]

Post showing Disrespect to the Royal Thai Police have been removed.

11) You will not post slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards Thailand, specific
locations, Thai institutions such as the judicial or law enforcement system, Thai culture, Thai people or
any other group on the basis of race, nationality, religion, gender or sexual orientation.

Posters who continue will enjoy a posting holiday

[KunMatt]

Can anyone give a plausible explanation as to why Col. Chiewpreecha (a senior investigating police officer) didn't follow up the rumour about the altercation at the AC bar, which i believe was the last place Hannah and David were seen alive? It does seem strange that the 'lead' wasn't persued, because this should be standard practice in the RTP's investigation manual, since PM Chan Ocha says it's the same one the UK Met Police use.

"Under cross-examination yesterday, Colonel Cherdpong Chiewpreecha, a senior investigating police officer, told judges that he had not looked into the rumour that Ms Witheridge had been involved in an argument with a Thai youth just hours before she was killed, according to a source present at yesterday’s hearing.

While Col Cherdpong admitted that he had heard about Ms Witheridge’s altercation with “Dodo” Toovichien, the son of Koh Tao’s wealthiest man and effectively the island chief, he said that neither he nor his officers actively followed up that line of enquiry." (Source Myanmar Times)

Probably because the person the rumor referred to wasn't even on the island at the time.

'Errm, so you would have us believe!

Notwithstanding the whereabouts of the 'absent' person, why is it that when this investigation was described as 'perfect' by the Thai PM, there was never an in-depth examination of the happenings at the A C Bar, the last place the murder victims were seen alive. From what I recall of events, the owner/manager Mon withheld the CCTV recordings from the police, on the basis they were his 'private' property. This is hardly what could be considered the actions of a man 'helping the police with their enquiries'. What do you think?

You do realise that Mon was arrested as the first prime suspect in the case because the original police chief said there was CCTV footage that definitely implicated him as being involved in thr crime, right?

The police chief was quickly changed out after this and the CCTV footage was never mentioned again.

A young female British student then died in Mon's resort just a couple of months later. Her family have just launched a private investigation into her suspicious and unexplained death.

[balo]

AC bar is still open for business, how has the tourist numbers to KT been for the last couple of months ?

[AleG]

Can anyone give a plausible explanation as to why Col. Chiewpreecha (a senior investigating police officer) didn't follow up the rumour about the altercation at the AC bar, which i believe was the last place Hannah and David were seen alive? It does seem strange that the 'lead' wasn't persued, because this should be standard practice in the RTP's investigation manual, since PM Chan Ocha says it's the same one the UK Met Police use.

"Under cross-examination yesterday, Colonel Cherdpong Chiewpreecha, a senior investigating police officer, told judges that he had not looked into the rumour that Ms Witheridge had been involved in an argument with a Thai youth just hours before she was killed, according to a source present at yesterday’s hearing.

While Col Cherdpong admitted that he had heard about Ms Witheridge’s altercation with “Dodo” Toovichien, the son of Koh Tao’s wealthiest man and effectively the island chief, he said that neither he nor his officers actively followed up that line of enquiry." (Source Myanmar Times)

Probably because the person the rumor referred to wasn't even on the island at the time.

'Errm, so you would have us believe!

Notwithstanding the whereabouts of the 'absent' person, why is it that when this investigation was described as 'perfect' by the Thai PM, there was never an in-depth examination of the happenings at the A C Bar, the last place the murder victims were seen alive. From what I recall of events, the owner/manager Mon withheld the CCTV recordings from the police, on the basis they were his 'private' property. This is hardly what could be considered the actions of a man 'helping the police with their enquiries'. What do you think?

You do realise that Mon was arrested as the first prime suspect in the case because the original police chief said there was CCTV footage that definitely implicated him as being involved in thr crime, right?

The police chief was quickly changed out after this and the CCTV footage was never mentioned again.

A young female British student then died in Mon's resort just a couple of months later. Her family have just launched a private investigation into her suspicious and unexplained death.

You are wrong in every single thing you said.

"You do realise that Mon was arrested as the first prime suspect in the case because the original police chief said there was CCTV footage that definitely implicated him as being involved in thr crime, right?"

The first "prime" suspect was Chris Ware, on Sept 17th, six days before Mon was questioned:

"British man 'prime suspect' in Thailand murder

A senior police officer tells The Telegraph a British man is now the prime suspect for the murders of two British backpackers"

Before him three Burmese workers were interrogated as suspects on the 16th:

“Three male Myanmar migrant workers are under police detention for investigation,” southern regional police commander Lt Gen Panya Maman said, without providing any further details."

Mon became a suspect after the drama with Sean McAnna on Sept 23rd, and the social media stampede that followed.

You have no idea of what footage they were referring to, but the prosecution spent 12 hours during one day of the hearings going over CCTV footage alone.

"The police chief was quickly changed out after this and the CCTV footage was never mentioned again."

Panya was promoted, as scheduled, more than a week after that, when the Zaw Lin and Wei Phyo were already being followed as suspects; this meme doesn't get any more true the more it is repeated.

Police promotions are done on the first of October, Somyot retired and his replacement installed on the same date this year, and also in the middle of an even bigger investigation (the Erawan bombers).

"A young female British student then died in Mon's resort just a couple of months later. Her family have just launched a private investigation into her suspicious and unexplained death."

Her mother has repeatedly stated that there was no foul play involved in her death:

"Christina died on the same island British tourists Hannah Witheridge, 23, and David Miller, 24, were murdered last year.

But Mrs Annesley ruled out foul play, and confirmed her daughter had now been repatriated."

They are now in the middle of establishing the circumstances in which that happened, nothing whatsoever has been reported that even implies that her death is unexplained, let alone that she may have been murdered.

Not that the facts would get on the way of using her as nothing but a character that can be made to think and said whatever is convenient.

[IslandLover]

smedly, on 31 Oct 2015 - 22:56, said:

IslandLover, on 31 Oct 2015 - 19:11, said:

HUH, on 31 Oct 2015 - 09:06, said:HUH, on 31 Oct 2015 - 09:06, said:

AGareth2, on 31 Oct 2015 - 08:40, said:AGareth2, on 31 Oct 2015 - 08:40, said:

I want to come back to the hoe

David and Hannah's DNA were matched on the handle

we have other DNA

if this could be extracted and identified then we have some more suspects

Yes and I also think the hair is never going to go away as much as the prosecution would want it to.

They were using this mysterious blonde hair to match to suspects early on in the case but since then?? Where is it? who does it belong to? The real killer? (for sure)

A British man has become the prime suspect for the murder of two British tourists and his arrest is imminent, a senior Thai police officer told The Telegraph on Wednesday.

Prachum Ruangthong, the head of police on the Thai island of Koh Tao where the murder took place, said he believed a British man was the likely killer of Hannah Witheridge and David Miller.

Police would have closed the case by the end of the day once DNA testing on samples of hair found in Ms Witheridge's hand were concluded, he added.

"After this evening everything will become clear." http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/thailand/11100980/British-man-prime-suspect-in-Thailand-murder.html

Yes and I also think the hair is never going to go away as much as the prosecution would want it to.

Neither is the loss of Hannah's clothing, which must have had the killer(s) DNA all over it.

This might seem an odd question coming from me but what clothes were lost, her clothes were clearly seen at the crime scene and as you rightly say would have been a source for DNA testing

Are you saying that the clothes were lost and not tested ?

Pink top and white skirt that Hannah was wearing when her body was found. Yes, they were never tested and are now reportedly "lost".

[IslandLover]

stephenterry, on 01 Nov 2015 - 05:04, said:

Well done SE for posting these statements from Burin Kantabutra, clearly an educated Thai of high community standing. Wish he would post these in BP and Thai newspapers. But I guess he'd be censored, PDQ.

He posts in the "Opinion" section of The Nation.

[IslandLover]

KamalaRider, on 01 Nov 2015 - 06:26, said:

DiscoDan, on 01 Nov 2015 - 06:21, said:

http://esctoday.com/977/sarah_yuen_executive_project_manager_live_events/

It's Sarah Yuen who is responsible now for the organisation of the Eurovision Song Contest.

So you mean because of she got the job everyone in Europe in television wants, she not qualified to report on Koh Tao trial?

Well, thanks to DiscoDan for supplying the 2002 bio of Sarah Yuen. At least we all now know what her credentials are. BTW she now works for Sky News, and other media companies.

[BritTim]

You do realise that Mon was arrested as the first prime suspect in the case because the original police chief said there was CCTV footage that definitely implicated him as being involved in thr crime, right?

The police chief was quickly changed out after this and the CCTV footage was never mentioned again.

A young female British student then died in Mon's resort just a couple of months later. Her family have just launched a private investigation into her suspicious and unexplained death.

You are wrong in every single thing you said.

"You do realise that Mon was arrested as the first prime suspect in the case because the original police chief said there was CCTV footage that definitely implicated him as being involved in thr crime, right?"

The first "prime" suspect was Chris Ware, on Sept 17th, six days before Mon was questioned:

"British man 'prime suspect' in Thailand murder

A senior police officer tells The Telegraph a British man is now the prime suspect for the murders of two British backpackers"

Before him three Burmese workers were interrogated as suspects on the 16th:

“Three male Myanmar migrant workers are under police detention for investigation,” southern regional police commander Lt Gen Panya Maman said, without providing any further details."

Mon became a suspect after the drama with Sean McAnna on Sept 23rd, and the social media stampede that followed.

You have no idea of what footage they were referring to, but the prosecution spent 12 hours during one day of the hearings going over CCTV footage alone.

"The police chief was quickly changed out after this and the CCTV footage was never mentioned again."

Panya was promoted, as scheduled, more than a week after that, when the Zaw Lin and Wei Phyo were already being followed as suspects; this meme doesn't get any more true the more it is repeated.

Police promotions are done on the first of October, Somyot retired and his replacement installed on the same date this year, and also in the middle of an even bigger investigation (the Erawan bombers).

"A young female British student then died in Mon's resort just a couple of months later. Her family have just launched a private investigation into her suspicious and unexplained death."

Her mother has repeatedly stated that there was no foul play involved in her death:

"Christina died on the same island British tourists Hannah Witheridge, 23, and David Miller, 24, were murdered last year.

But Mrs Annesley ruled out foul play, and confirmed her daughter had now been repatriated."

They are now in the middle of establishing the circumstances in which that happened, nothing whatsoever has been reported that even implies that her death is unexplained, let alone that she may have been murdered.

Not that the facts would get on the way of using her as nothing but a character that can be made to think and said whatever is convenient.

This is mostly correct, with two important caveats:

• If Mon, as claimed, had no involvement in the murders, his actions were strange to put it mildly. Why involve himself in the positioning of the alleged murder weapon at the crime scene? Why was he, together with his police sidekick, chasing Sean? (Sean claimed they wanted to kill him and frame him for the murders.)
• Like the families of David and Hannah, Christina's mother was originally persuaded to accept the Thai authorities' version of events. It is now clear that she believes the investigation was not done properly and is doubtful of the claims of death by natural causes. She has not alleged murder, but initiating a private investigation surely suggests she believes just that to be a possibility.

[KunMatt]

You do realise that Mon was arrested as the first prime suspect in the case because the original police chief said there was CCTV footage that definitely implicated him as being involved in thr crime, right?

The police chief was quickly changed out after this and the CCTV footage was never mentioned again.

A young female British student then died in Mon's resort just a couple of months later. Her family have just launched a private investigation into her suspicious and unexplained death.

You are wrong in every single thing you said.

"You do realise that Mon was arrested as the first prime suspect in the case because the original police chief said there was CCTV footage that definitely implicated him as being involved in thr crime, right?"

The first "prime" suspect was Chris Ware, on Sept 17th, six days before Mon was questioned:

"British man 'prime suspect' in Thailand murder

A senior police officer tells The Telegraph a British man is now the prime suspect for the murders of two British backpackers"

Before him three Burmese workers were interrogated as suspects on the 16th:

“Three male Myanmar migrant workers are under police detention for investigation,” southern regional police commander Lt Gen Panya Maman said, without providing any further details."

Mon became a suspect after the drama with Sean McAnna on Sept 23rd, and the social media stampede that followed.

You have no idea of what footage they were referring to, but the prosecution spent 12 hours during one day of the hearings going over CCTV footage alone.

"The police chief was quickly changed out after this and the CCTV footage was never mentioned again."

Panya was promoted, as scheduled, more than a week after that, when the Zaw Lin and Wei Phyo were already being followed as suspects; this meme doesn't get any more true the more it is repeated.

Police promotions are done on the first of October, Somyot retired and his replacement installed on the same date this year, and also in the middle of an even bigger investigation (the Erawan bombers).

"A young female British student then died in Mon's resort just a couple of months later. Her family have just launched a private investigation into her suspicious and unexplained death."

Her mother has repeatedly stated that there was no foul play involved in her death:

"Christina died on the same island British tourists Hannah Witheridge, 23, and David Miller, 24, were murdered last year.

But Mrs Annesley ruled out foul play, and confirmed her daughter had now been repatriated."

They are now in the middle of establishing the circumstances in which that happened, nothing whatsoever has been reported that even implies that her death is unexplained, let alone that she may have been murdered.

Not that the facts would get on the way of using her as nothing but a character that can be made to think and said whatever is convenient.

This is mostly correct, with two important caveats:

• If Mon, as claimed, had no involvement in the murders, his actions were strange to put it mildly. Why involve himself in the positioning of the alleged murder weapon at the crime scene? Why was he, together with his police sidekick, chasing Sean? (Sean claimed they wanted to kill him and frame him for the murders.)
• Like the families of David and Hannah, Christina's mother was originally persuaded to accept the Thai authorities' version of events. It is now clear that she believes the investigation was not done properly and is doubtful of the claims of death by natural causes. She has not alleged murder, but initiating a private investigation surely suggests she believes just that to be a possibility.

He was also all over the crime scene before and after the police arrived, he was standing behind both of the suspects during the re-enactment and at every public appearance of them and he withheld any CCTV that he owned which could have helped the investigation. I'm not saying that he is involved in the crime but if this was a movie then he would be my first guess.

[StealthEnergiser]

You do realise that Mon was arrested as the first prime suspect in the case because the original police chief said there was CCTV footage that definitely implicated him as being involved in thr crime, right?

The police chief was quickly changed out after this and the CCTV footage was never mentioned again.

A young female British student then died in Mon's resort just a couple of months later. Her family have just launched a private investigation into her suspicious and unexplained death.

You are wrong in every single thing you said.

"You do realise that Mon was arrested as the first prime suspect in the case because the original police chief said there was CCTV footage that definitely implicated him as being involved in thr crime, right?"

The first "prime" suspect was Chris Ware, on Sept 17th, six days before Mon was questioned:

"British man 'prime suspect' in Thailand murder

A senior police officer tells The Telegraph a British man is now the prime suspect for the murders of two British backpackers"

Before him three Burmese workers were interrogated as suspects on the 16th:

“Three male Myanmar migrant workers are under police detention for investigation,” southern regional police commander Lt Gen Panya Maman said, without providing any further details."

Mon became a suspect after the drama with Sean McAnna on Sept 23rd, and the social media stampede that followed.

You have no idea of what footage they were referring to, but the prosecution spent 12 hours during one day of the hearings going over CCTV footage alone.

"The police chief was quickly changed out after this and the CCTV footage was never mentioned again."

Panya was promoted, as scheduled, more than a week after that, when the Zaw Lin and Wei Phyo were already being followed as suspects; this meme doesn't get any more true the more it is repeated.

Police promotions are done on the first of October, Somyot retired and his replacement installed on the same date this year, and also in the middle of an even bigger investigation (the Erawan bombers).

"A young female British student then died in Mon's resort just a couple of months later. Her family have just launched a private investigation into her suspicious and unexplained death."

Her mother has repeatedly stated that there was no foul play involved in her death:

"Christina died on the same island British tourists Hannah Witheridge, 23, and David Miller, 24, were murdered last year.

But Mrs Annesley ruled out foul play, and confirmed her daughter had now been repatriated."

They are now in the middle of establishing the circumstances in which that happened, nothing whatsoever has been reported that even implies that her death is unexplained, let alone that she may have been murdered.

Not that the facts would get on the way of using her as nothing but a character that can be made to think and said whatever is convenient.

This is mostly correct, with two important caveats:

• If Mon, as claimed, had no involvement in the murders, his actions were strange to put it mildly. Why involve himself in the positioning of the alleged murder weapon at the crime scene? Why was he, together with his police sidekick, chasing Sean? (Sean claimed they wanted to kill him and frame him for the murders.)
• Like the families of David and Hannah, Christina's mother was originally persuaded to accept the Thai authorities' version of events. It is now clear that she believes the investigation was not done properly and is doubtful of the claims of death by natural causes. She has not alleged murder, but initiating a private investigation surely suggests she believes just that to be a possibility.

He was also all over the crime scene before and after the police arrived, he was standing behind both of the suspects during the re-enactment and at every public appearance of them and he withheld any CCTV that he owned which could have helped the investigation. I'm not saying that he is involved in the crime but if this was a movie then he would be my first guess.

5.40am "O found bodies must have called Mon

Mon was at scene well before police not sure how long .

6.30am police came "why 1 hour later to a double murder scene ? he was called at 6.25 AM.

8,00 am The doctor comes to the scene.

Police believe a garden hoe which came from the resort and was found leaning against a tree near the crime scene, was used to bludgeon both victims.

After arriving at the crime scene around 5.40am O admitted removing the hoe from next to the tree and taking it back to a vegetable garden inside the resort where he worked.

Around half an hour later he said he was approached by the resort’s boss and a policeman who told him to put on a pair of gloves and return it to the scene, which he did.

- See more at: http://www.mizzima.c...L.z6wn9MP5.dpuf

Jakkapan's testimony was followed by Dr Chasit Yoohat, who said he arrived at the beach at 8am and observed the scene for an hour before leaving and then returning at 10am when he examined the bodies.

He said Witheridge had suffered severe head injuries and there were signs that she had been sexually assaulted while Miller had been beaten.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/british-backpackers-murder-trial-new-evidence-could-prove-innocence-burmese-duo-1510025

A Thai police officer who was called to the scene of the killing of two British tourists on Koh Tao island in September 2014 testified on Wednesday, the first of dozens of witnesses who will appear in court during a three-month trial of two Burmese men.

Police Lieutenant Jakkapan Kaewkao, the second police officer at the scene, said he found David Miller face down in the surf and Hannah Witheridge 12 metres away on the beach.

Questioned by the prosecution, he said he received a call at 6:30am on September 15, 2014 by a fellow officer. He arrived at the beach five minutes later and swiftly cordoned off the area.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jul/08/thai-police-officer-describes-scene-at-site-of-british-backpacker-killings

Edited November 1, 2015 by StealthEnergiser

[KunMatt]

You do realise that Mon was arrested as the first prime suspect in the case because the original police chief said there was CCTV footage that definitely implicated him as being involved in thr crime, right?

The police chief was quickly changed out after this and the CCTV footage was never mentioned again.

A young female British student then died in Mon's resort just a couple of months later. Her family have just launched a private investigation into her suspicious and unexplained death.

You are wrong in every single thing you said.

"You do realise that Mon was arrested as the first prime suspect in the case because the original police chief said there was CCTV footage that definitely implicated him as being involved in thr crime, right?"

The first "prime" suspect was Chris Ware, on Sept 17th, six days before Mon was questioned:
"British man 'prime suspect' in Thailand murder
A senior police officer tells The Telegraph a British man is now the prime suspect for the murders of two British backpackers"

Before him three Burmese workers were interrogated as suspects on the 16th:
“Three male Myanmar migrant workers are under police detention for investigation,” southern regional police commander Lt Gen Panya Maman said, without providing any further details."

Mon became a suspect after the drama with Sean McAnna on Sept 23rd, and the social media stampede that followed.
You have no idea of what footage they were referring to, but the prosecution spent 12 hours during one day of the hearings going over CCTV footage alone.

"The police chief was quickly changed out after this and the CCTV footage was never mentioned again."
Panya was promoted, as scheduled, more than a week after that, when the Zaw Lin and Wei Phyo were already being followed as suspects; this meme doesn't get any more true the more it is repeated.
Police promotions are done on the first of October, Somyot retired and his replacement installed on the same date this year, and also in the middle of an even bigger investigation (the Erawan bombers).

"A young female British student then died in Mon's resort just a couple of months later. Her family have just launched a private investigation into her suspicious and unexplained death."
Her mother has repeatedly stated that there was no foul play involved in her death:
"Christina died on the same island British tourists Hannah Witheridge, 23, and David Miller, 24, were murdered last year.
But Mrs Annesley ruled out foul play, and confirmed her daughter had now been repatriated."

They are now in the middle of establishing the circumstances in which that happened, nothing whatsoever has been reported that even implies that her death is unexplained, let alone that she may have been murdered.
Not that the facts would get on the way of using her as nothing but a character that can be made to think and said whatever is convenient.

This is mostly correct, with two important caveats:

• If Mon, as claimed, had no involvement in the murders, his actions were strange to put it mildly. Why involve himself in the positioning of the alleged murder weapon at the crime scene? Why was he, together with his police sidekick, chasing Sean? (Sean claimed they wanted to kill him and frame him for the murders.)
• Like the families of David and Hannah, Christina's mother was originally persuaded to accept the Thai authorities' version of events. It is now clear that she believes the investigation was not done properly and is doubtful of the claims of death by natural causes. She has not alleged murder, but initiating a private investigation surely suggests she believes just that to be a possibility.

He was also all over the crime scene before and after the police arrived, he was standing behind both of the suspects during the re-enactment and at every public appearance of them and he withheld any CCTV that he owned which could have helped the investigation. I'm not saying that he is involved in the crime but if this was a movie then he would be my first guess.

5.40am "O found bodies must have called Mon

Mon was at scene well before police not sure how long .

6.30am police came "why 1 hour later to a double murder scene ?

8,00 am The doctor comes to the scene.


Police believe a garden hoe which came from the resort and was found leaning against a tree near the crime scene, was used to bludgeon both victims.

After arriving at the crime scene around 5.40am O admitted removing the hoe from next to the tree and taking it back to a vegetable garden inside the resort where he worked.
Around half an hour later he said he was approached by the resort’s boss and a policeman who told him to put on a pair of gloves and return it to the scene, which he did.

- See more at: http://www.mizzima.c...L.z6wn9MP5.dpuf

Jakkapan's testimony was followed by Dr Chasit Yoohat, who said he arrived at the beach at 8am and observed the scene for an hour before leaving and then returning at 10am when he examined the bodies.

He said Witheridge had suffered severe head injuries and there were signs that she had been sexually assaulted while Miller had been beaten.
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/british-backpackers-murder-trial-new-evidence-could-prove-innocence-burmese-duo-1510025

What time did Mon and his policeman friend chase Sean into a 9/11 and threaten to hang him for the crime? How did that fit into the time line?

[StealthEnergiser]

Timeline

5.40am "O found bodies must have called Mon

Mon was at scene well before police not sure how long .

6.35am police came "why 1 hour later to a double murder scene ? he was called at 6.30 AM.

These reports are saying that Police Lieutenant Jakkapan Kaewkao, was the second police officer at the scene , he was the first going by other reports below.

8.00 am The doctor comes to the scene.

Police believe a garden hoe which came from the resort and was found leaning against a tree near the crime scene, was used to bludgeon both victims.

After arriving at the crime scene around 5.40am O admitted removing the hoe from next to the tree and taking it back to a vegetable garden inside the resort where he worked.

Around half an hour later he said he was approached by the resort’s boss and a policeman who told him to put on a pair of gloves and return it to the scene, which he did.

- See more at: http://www.mizzima.c...L.z6wn9MP5.dpuf

Jakkapan's testimony was followed by Dr Chasit Yoohat, who said he arrived at the beach at 8am and observed the scene for an hour before leaving and then returning at 10am when he examined the bodies.

He said Witheridge had suffered severe head injuries and there were signs that she had been sexually assaulted while Miller had been beaten.

http://www.ibtimes.c...ese-duo-1510025

A Thai police officer who was called to the scene of the killing of two British tourists on Koh Tao island in September 2014 testified on Wednesday, the first of dozens of witnesses who will appear in court during a three-month trial of two Burmese men.

Police Lieutenant Jakkapan Kaewkao, the second police officer at the scene, said he found David Miller face down in the surf and Hannah Witheridge 12 metres away on the beach.

Questioned by the prosecution, he said he received a call at 6:30am on September 15, 2014 by a fellow officer. He arrived at the beach five minutes later and swiftly cordoned off the area.

http://www.theguardi...packer-killings

The court heard evidence from Police Lieutenant Jakkapan Kaewkhao, the first policeman to arrive at the scene at 6.35am.

He described finding the body of Ms Witheridge lying face up and semi-clothed behind some rocks splattered with blood. He said Mr Miller was lying face down about 12 yards away with seawater lapping around him

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/thailand/11725454/Thai-police-officer-describes-finding-bodies-of-British-backpackers-during-murder-trial.html

Edited November 1, 2015 by StealthEnergiser

[joebrown]

Can anyone give a plausible explanation as to why Col. Chiewpreecha (a senior investigating police officer) didn't follow up the rumour about the altercation at the AC bar, which i believe was the last place Hannah and David were seen alive? It does seem strange that the 'lead' wasn't persued, because this should be standard practice in the RTP's investigation manual, since PM Chan Ocha says it's the same one the UK Met Police use.

"Under cross-examination yesterday, Colonel Cherdpong Chiewpreecha, a senior investigating police officer, told judges that he had not looked into the rumour that Ms Witheridge had been involved in an argument with a Thai youth just hours before she was killed, according to a source present at yesterday’s hearing.

While Col Cherdpong admitted that he had heard about Ms Witheridge’s altercation with “Dodo” Toovichien, the son of Koh Tao’s wealthiest man and effectively the island chief, he said that neither he nor his officers actively followed up that line of enquiry." (Source Myanmar Times)

Probably because the person the rumor referred to wasn't even on the island at the time.

'Errm, so you would have us believe!

Notwithstanding the whereabouts of the 'absent' person, why is it that when this investigation was described as 'perfect' by the Thai PM, there was never an in-depth examination of the happenings at the A C Bar, the last place the murder victims were seen alive. From what I recall of events, the owner/manager Mon withheld the CCTV recordings from the police, on the basis they were his 'private' property. This is hardly what could be considered the actions of a man 'helping the police with their enquiries'. What do you think?

To : - AleG

I'm still waiting for your reply to my post.