Maj-Gen Sansern says government has no money to subsidize rubber price

[webfact]

Maj-Gen Sansern says government has no money to subsidize rubber price



BANGKOK: -- The government does not have enough money to subsidize the price of rubber sheets at 50-60 baht/kg and wants southern rubber farmers to refrain from protesting to put pressure on the government, said government spokesman Maj-Gen Sansern Kaewkamnerd on Sunday.

He explained that subsidizing rubber price as demanded by rubber farmers would require about 140 billion baht which the government could not afford because there are many other farmers as well as non-farmers that the government would have to take care of.

Moreover, he pointed out that price subsidy would not solve the price problem at its root cause and the problem would keep returning.

The spokesman claimed that Prime Minister Prayut Chan-ocha has always been concerned with the plight of rubber farmers and has tried to solve their problem based on facts on short, medium and long terms.

He urged rubber farmers to understand that rubber price slump was due to several factors. Among them are global oil price cuts, oversupply of rubber and competition from synthetic rubber.

However, he pointed out that there are several rubber farmers who have switched to other crops and supplementary work such as livestock raising and managed to survive.

The prime minister, said Maj-Gen Sansern, has pleaded with rubber farmers not to protest to put pressure on the government.

Source: http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/maj-gen-sansern-says-government-has-no-money-to-subsidize-rubber-price


-- Thai PBS 2016-01-11

[phycokiller]

lucky a few survived, wouldnt be too good if they all died

[candide]

Hmmmmm... I wonder how long this government will be able to hold this position in front of one of their main supporter base...

[rubl]

Hmmmmm... I wonder how long this government will be able to hold this position in front of one of their main supporter base...

There's an assumption there, that the rubber tree farmers are one of the current governments main supporter bases. Would that include the rubber tree farmers in the NorthEast?

Anyway it's good that someone says

"He urged rubber farmers to understand that rubber price slump was due to several factors. Among them are global oil price cuts, oversupply of rubber and competition from synthetic rubber."

[ezzra]

It's about high time that a Thai government will say enough is enough, these handouts never end

as more and more people from all walks of life in Thailand become to depend and demand that the

government will act and be a nanny to their silly and irresponsible life style and wrong decision

when it comes to farming and surviving in this country, no other country in the world offer such support

of free money, why Thailand?

[LannaGuy]

It's about high time that a Thai government will say enough is enough, these handouts never end

as more and more people from all walks of life in Thailand become to depend and demand that the

government will act and be a nanny to their silly and irresponsible life style and wrong decision

when it comes to farming and surviving in this country, no other country in the world offer such support

of free money, why Thailand?

rubbish subsidies are common throughout the world and it's part of any government's job to look after it's people not just make huge 'donations' to Parks

[oneday]

Ah, but they have tons of money for military toys.

[chainarong]

It is not only a question of money , emerging markets under new guidelines for world free trade have until 2018 to cut out all subsidies, so indirectly this administration is doing something right for a change , even though they possibly don't realize it, it is not much use giving rubber farmers something this year and taking it off them next year, this will only compound the problem.............................................. .

[robblok]

Farmers, always moaning about handouts but when it goes well ( a few years ago) they spend all their earning and then when the world market goes bad they expect the taxpayer to pay up.

Same like the rice farmers, when will they learn the world market dictates the prices and if they want to cut out the middle men they have to form cooperatives like they do in other countries.

Its always the same with farmers.. give us money or else. You don't see many other groups of people in a given profession being that militant and willing to disrupt the lives of others for their own gain. Farmers the world over are some of the most militant people there are (just look at French farmers, even Dutch ones).

Help them to switch but that is a good thing but don't poor money into something that wont change. This is one good thing about this government they don't have to fear the farmers and spend all the tax money on them.

One note.. as i do have problems with the increased military spending.. they should have frozen the military budget too.

(I grew up among farmers in the Netherlands so I know how they think)

Edited January 11, 2016 by robblok

[robblok]

Ah, but they have tons of money for military toys.

And that is wrong too.. should have frozen the military budget its high enough. But to put it in perspective what the farmers are asking.. the military budget is 206 billion.. the farmers are asking for a yearly donation as big as the military budget.. also similar to the health budget.. so its not just a little bit they as.. they want too much.

Edited January 11, 2016 by robblok

[LannaGuy]

Ah, but they have tons of money for military toys.

And that is wrong too.. should have frozen the military budget its high enough. But to put it in perspective what the farmers are asking.. the military budget is 206 billion.. the farmers are asking for a yearly donation as big as the military budget.. also similar to the health budget.. so its not just a little bit they as.. they want too much.

I have no knowledge about how much they should or should not get but subsidies are a common tool of all governments from quantitative easing, to EU farming and all the US protective subsidies. If they all stopped and let the world economies truly run freely the world would spiral down in misery and debt and there would be even more insurrection. It needs to be thought through carefully by qualified economists but the 'head in sand' we won't intervene approach is not going to work.

[worgeordie]

I thought Thailand had a very healthy bank balance,at least thats

what the Government was saying a few days ago,and they are

saying they are going to give cash aid to Lebanon and Jordan,

but none for the rubber tappers,I suspect in the end they will give

in and find the money,maybe some of the money they are putting

aside for the Submarines !.

regards Worgeordie

[robblok]

Ah, but they have tons of money for military toys.

And that is wrong too.. should have frozen the military budget its high enough. But to put it in perspective what the farmers are asking.. the military budget is 206 billion.. the farmers are asking for a yearly donation as big as the military budget.. also similar to the health budget.. so its not just a little bit they as.. they want too much.

I have no knowledge about how much they should or should not get but subsidies are a common tool of all governments from quantitative easing, to EU farming and all the US protective subsidies. If they all stopped and let the world economies truly run freely the world would spiral down in misery and debt and there would be even more insurrection. It needs to be thought through carefully by qualified economists but the 'head in sand' we won't intervene approach is not going to work.

That is what you say.. for the record I am against the EU and US farming subsidies too.. Costing the taxpayer too much money. The market will sort it out themselves.

Why do other jobs don't need subsidizing.. ? I don't see people working for factories coming out and demanding money. Farmers are no different and need to either change or loose it. (I am all for helping them change) There is an over supply and that will only be solved by less production or more demand.. and more demand is not happening.

So its not a head in the sand approach at all its a realistic one.

[LannaGuy]

Ah, but they have tons of money for military toys.

And that is wrong too.. should have frozen the military budget its high enough. But to put it in perspective what the farmers are asking.. the military budget is 206 billion.. the farmers are asking for a yearly donation as big as the military budget.. also similar to the health budget.. so its not just a little bit they as.. they want too much.

I have no knowledge about how much they should or should not get but subsidies are a common tool of all governments from quantitative easing, to EU farming and all the US protective subsidies. If they all stopped and let the world economies truly run freely the world would spiral down in misery and debt and there would be even more insurrection. It needs to be thought through carefully by qualified economists but the 'head in sand' we won't intervene approach is not going to work.

That is what you say.. for the record I am against the EU and US farming subsidies too.. Costing the taxpayer too much money. The market will sort it out themselves.

Why do other jobs don't need subsidizing.. ? I don't see people working for factories coming out and demanding money. Farmers are no different and need to either change or loose it. (I am all for helping them change) There is an over supply and that will only be solved by less production or more demand.. and more demand is not happening.

So its not a head in the sand approach at all its a realistic one.

Morning robblok, if it happened as you outline there would be chaos in the markets and they would collapse. Don't forget the Thai government have a long history of 'protectionism' from the financial markets to foreigners buying land to no citizenship even though marriage, in fact, they are far more protective and xenophobic than the majority of countries. Back to the farmers, if they are left to react to the market and 'cast aside' there will be chaos. I am not for 'hand outs' but I am for limited market protection if required as is the 'norm' in all developed countries.

Edited January 11, 2016 by LannaGuy

[shirtless]

These Farmers need to diversify or go broke , world demand on rubber is at a low like many other commodities .

[phutoie2]

Come on, ol Robbo grew up among farmers, he knows how they think. Well thats just given me the first laugh of the day. Comparing Cloggie farmers to Thai ones.

[Pib]

However, he pointed out that there are several rubber farmers who have switched to other crops and supplementary work such as livestock raising and managed to survive.

Boy, that's not a very motivating statement....that is, switch what you are raising and you should manage to survive.

Somehow the word "survive" just don't bring-up visions of a better life...more like crawling along in a desert with an almost empty canteen of water.

[robblok]

Come on, ol Robbo grew up among farmers, he knows how they think. Well thats just given me the first laugh of the day. Comparing Cloggie farmers to Thai ones.

Never said I knew how Thai farmers thought.. learn to read. But if you look all over the world you will see that farmers in general are quite militant. That is something they all have in common.

[robblok]

And that is wrong too.. should have frozen the military budget its high enough. But to put it in perspective what the farmers are asking.. the military budget is 206 billion.. the farmers are asking for a yearly donation as big as the military budget.. also similar to the health budget.. so its not just a little bit they as.. they want too much.

I have no knowledge about how much they should or should not get but subsidies are a common tool of all governments from quantitative easing, to EU farming and all the US protective subsidies. If they all stopped and let the world economies truly run freely the world would spiral down in misery and debt and there would be even more insurrection. It needs to be thought through carefully by qualified economists but the 'head in sand' we won't intervene approach is not going to work.

That is what you say.. for the record I am against the EU and US farming subsidies too.. Costing the taxpayer too much money. The market will sort it out themselves.

Why do other jobs don't need subsidizing.. ? I don't see people working for factories coming out and demanding money. Farmers are no different and need to either change or loose it. (I am all for helping them change) There is an over supply and that will only be solved by less production or more demand.. and more demand is not happening.

So its not a head in the sand approach at all its a realistic one.

Morning robblok, if it happened as you outline there would be chaos in the markets and they would collapse. Don't forget the Thai government have a long history of 'protectionism' from the financial markets to foreigners buying land to no citizenship even though marriage, in fact, they are far more protective and xenophobic than the majority of countries. Back to the farmers, if they are left to react to the market and 'cast aside' there will be chaos. I am not for 'hand outs' but I am for limited market protection if required as is the 'norm' in all developed countries.

In no developed country do they give a sum equal to the health budget away to farmers.. so what they are asking is unrealistic.

You are right about how protective / xenofobic they are here.. and I don't see that as a good thing. Maybe we differ but breaking protectionism is a good thing. In general the consumers benefit from it by getting better services.

Back to the farmers, why did they not save their money when there was a boom (few years ago) and now expect handouts. There simply is no money for this and even if there was its not sustainable.. just look at the rice scam.. now these farmers want the same.

So if you give the rice and rubber farmers both what they want then farmers get double of the health budget (for all Thais)... I wonder where the money has to come from. Just not realistic. You can't beat the world market its impossible.

[bark]

It's about high time that a Thai government will say enough is enough, these handouts never end

as more and more people from all walks of life in Thailand become to depend and demand that the

government will act and be a nanny to their silly and irresponsible life style and wrong decision

when it comes to farming and surviving in this country, no other country in the world offer such support

of free money, why Thailand?

Not sure what country you are from, but, most country in the world help their farmers. USA and Canada, Wheat, corn, Dairy, Eggs, Pork, all get money from the government. In Canada when the cod fish were over fished by over nations. The Canadian Government told their fishermen not to fish anymore. They were given money to sit at home for 8-10 years. The problem for Thailand is that the government has no control over each section of the farming industry. Thai farmers, like to jump on the bandwagon. When the price of rubber started to go up, they planted more trees. Trees take 5 years to grow enough to harvest. By this time the price could go down. Supply and demand. Thailand economy is based on Rice, shrimp ( seafood). I agree with you, that the government gives too much, sometimes. But Thailand"s economy is Farm based.

[Evilbaz]

Last I read farm income was about 10% of GDP - roughly the same as tourism.?

[robblok]

It's about high time that a Thai government will say enough is enough, these handouts never end

as more and more people from all walks of life in Thailand become to depend and demand that the

government will act and be a nanny to their silly and irresponsible life style and wrong decision

when it comes to farming and surviving in this country, no other country in the world offer such support

of free money, why Thailand?

Not sure what country you are from, but, most country in the world help their farmers. USA and Canada, Wheat, corn, Dairy, Eggs, Pork, all get money from the government. In Canada when the cod fish were over fished by over nations. The Canadian Government told their fishermen not to fish anymore. They were given money to sit at home for 8-10 years. The problem for Thailand is that the government has no control over each section of the farming industry. Thai farmers, like to jump on the bandwagon. When the price of rubber started to go up, they planted more trees. Trees take 5 years to grow enough to harvest. By this time the price could go down. Supply and demand. Thailand economy is based on Rice, shrimp ( seafood). I agree with you, that the government gives too much, sometimes. But Thailand"s economy is Farm based.

Sure other countries do it too.. but not as much as the Thais (like you said)

If they give in to the demands of the rubber farmers and do the same for the rice farmers (both want around 200 billion) you got 400 billion that is double the amount of the health budget (about). Now do you know any country int he world who in relation to the health budget gives farmers double of that.

Also I would say the health budget benefits all Thais.. while this would only benefit a limited amount of people. The demands are totally unrealistic. Also in other countries at least the farmers are taxed and pay partly for their own subsidies.. now here in Thailand.. i doubt many farmers pay tax. In reality its the normal salary workers who will have to pay AGAIN for the farmers. Seems quite unfair given that Thailand has such a small taxpayer base.

[Pib]

The govt will give in and partially meet the rubber farmers demands via a bunch of little give aways in order to keep the farmers muzzled.

[rubl]

It's about high time that a Thai government will say enough is enough, these handouts never end

as more and more people from all walks of life in Thailand become to depend and demand that the

government will act and be a nanny to their silly and irresponsible life style and wrong decision

when it comes to farming and surviving in this country, no other country in the world offer such support

of free money, why Thailand?

rubbish subsidies are common throughout the world and it's part of any government's job to look after it's people not just make huge 'donations' to Parks

... or lose 500++ billion on 'self-financing' schemes to make rice farmers rich.

[Eric Loh]

Last I read farm income was about 10% of GDP - roughly the same as tourism.?

The more important statistic is the 64% population is in some form of agricultural produces from rubber, rice to fisheries. All these sectors are being hit hard and lots of unemployed and poverty stricken farmers. When the pain hits bottom and nothing to lose, this can manifest into something that can lead to dire consequences and violence. IMHO, the Junta will blink first and will bow to farmer demands albeit some compromises which will trigger other farming sectors to also press their demands. He crave for the job, now he deal with it. Karma is a bitch.

[rubl]

That is what you say.. for the record I am against the EU and US farming subsidies too.. Costing the taxpayer too much money. The market will sort it out themselves.

Why do other jobs don't need subsidizing.. ? I don't see people working for factories coming out and demanding money. Farmers are no different and need to either change or loose it. (I am all for helping them change) There is an over supply and that will only be solved by less production or more demand.. and more demand is not happening.

So its not a head in the sand approach at all its a realistic one.

Morning robblok, if it happened as you outline there would be chaos in the markets and they would collapse. Don't forget the Thai government have a long history of 'protectionism' from the financial markets to foreigners buying land to no citizenship even though marriage, in fact, they are far more protective and xenophobic than the majority of countries. Back to the farmers, if they are left to react to the market and 'cast aside' there will be chaos. I am not for 'hand outs' but I am for limited market protection if required as is the 'norm' in all developed countries.

Thailand is not in a position to 'protect' it's export market for rubber. They could 'subsidise' the rubber tree farmers by giving them twice the marker price, but we know what that leads to. The previous government did just that and lost 500++ billion Baht on their 'self-financing' scheme.

BTW Thailand produces about one third of the World's natural rubber and exports 90%.

So, good the government stops this type of nonsense. They already subsidised a little bit last year, paying out 13 billion Baht (1500 Baht per rai, maximum for 15 rai, directly to farmers). Better they spend the money on quality improvements, diversification, etc., etc.

[car720]

It's about high time that a Thai government will say enough is enough, these handouts never end

as more and more people from all walks of life in Thailand become to depend and demand that the

government will act and be a nanny to their silly and irresponsible life style and wrong decision

when it comes to farming and surviving in this country, no other country in the world offer such support

of free money, why Thailand?

Is it not true though that any government is supposed to be having the interests of its people at heart before all other considerations.

They say that they have "no money" and yet in the next article they say that they are sending refugee cash aid to both Jordan and Lebanon.

Correct me if I am wrong but are they not saying that they have money for foreigners but not for their own people?

[rubl]

How can the Prayut government say it has no money to subsidize rubber prices? He didn't hesitate to payout over 600 billion baht in 2014 for rice price support in respect to Yingluck's rice pledge program. Prayut just borrowed the funds by issuing treasury bonds and in exchange he expected regime support from the rice farmers.

Prayut has already paid out over 265 billion baht to shore up rubber prices (2014-12-31). But obviously, he has given Southern rubber farmers far less in price subsidies than he did with the Northern rice farmers. The Southern rubber farmers were chagrined that Yingluck favored the Northern rice farmers with large subsidies under her rice pledge program to gain their poilitical support and expected the same favored treatment from the junta by Southern rubber farmers' support for a coup.

But it appears after being in power over 19 months that Prayut needs to do more to buy Southern rubber farmers' loyalty. Mr Pairat Jaichum, vice president of a network of rubber planters in 14 southern provinces warned, "rubber planters are in deep trouble and they no longer are afraid of the military junta." 2015-10-25

Unlike Yingluck though, Prayut should have little fear of being ousted by a coup.

I think you need to come with some details on that 265 billion Baht on rubber subsidy, my dear chap. Also the 'obviously' South getting less than North needs an explanation.

Oh, by the way, the RPPS was a 'self-financing' scheme, not a subsidy. It self-financed itself to the amount of minus 500++ billion Baht.

[tbthailand]

wow, the empathy-vacuum this man creates must have sucked all the air out of the room...

[rubl]

wow, the empathy-vacuum this man creates must have sucked all the air out of the room...

Wow, honesty is no longer appreciated it would seem. Would you rather be (democratically) lied to ?

Would you rather have the current government copy the 'self-financing' aspects of the RPPS to lose the country another 500++ billion Baht?