This is why you have to avoid travelling by bus in Thailand!

[brewsterbudgen]

OH GREAT!! NOW you tell me. Some months ago, about two hundred klicks south of Chiang Mai coming up from Bkk, the bus driver left the highway and decided to finish the trip up through the bush. Of course, he was sleeping at the time, so his judgement wasn't all that great.

from what you wrote I feel quite sure you were not on a Nakhon Chai Air bus ( and if I had to use a bus it would be the only bus company I would ever trust in Thailand). There is no excuse for their drivers to fall asleep because on long distances they have two on board. They also have very well maintained buses.

http://www.nca.co.th/main.html

They are by far the best, most reliable and safest bus company.

[tropo]

This is the first bus crash I've seen in this area and it was non-lethal as far as I can see. One could hardly even call it a crash. He most likely took the turn too fast at the wrong angle as that's a very narrow corner and takes a bit of skill to maneuver a bus around. There are thousands of buses using this road every week without incident.

Let's find some photos of car crashes, airplane crashes, bike crashes, train crashes and boat sinkings and all decide to stay at home then. Now how do I get from home to my place in Thailand? Astral projection?

In the meanwhile I'll keep using buses in Thailand and hope for the best. More chance of a taxi crashing in my opinion.

[Asiantravel]

If we stopped using buses, minivans, motorcycles, bicycles we could never leave the house. Except planes.. But oh noo, those fall out of sky sometimes too.

And it would be wiser not to walk because sidewalks are bad, we shouldn't cross streets cos there are no regulated crossings. And street food is iffy freshness, water unsafe to swim, beaches dirty, air polluted, locals angry..

Im not afraid to take a bus here at all.

minivans are in a league of their own and the statistics prove it ( PS since the last entry on December 8 2015 there have been three other incidents that haven't been added to these lists yet )

http://driving-in-thailand.com/accidents-involving-minivans/

[arrowsdawdle]

The bus drivers are a menace at the moment in Pattaya. Speeding combined with poor driving. God bless all on the roads with them!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

it's not only the drivers it's the condition of the buses themselves. I was walking past seven or eight of them parked along Beach Road and I was looking at the condition of the tyres which were shocking in some cases.

In fairness, Thai drivers in all manner of cars, trucks, and motorbikes are so erratic and their unpredictable "me-first" lane changes are responsible for so many accidents.

[jesimps]

If we stopped using buses, minivans, motorcycles, bicycles we could never leave the house. Except planes.. But oh noo, those fall out of sky sometimes too.

And it would be wiser not to walk because sidewalks are bad, we shouldn't cross streets cos there are no regulated crossings. And street food is iffy freshness, water unsafe to swim, beaches dirty, air polluted, locals angry..

Im not afraid to take a bus here at all.

"I'm not afraid to take a bus here at all"

What a great epitaph for a tombstone.

[arrowsdawdle]

This is the first bus crash I've seen in this area and it was non-lethal as far as I can see. One could hardly even call it a crash. He most likely took the turn too fast at the wrong angle as that's a very narrow corner and takes a bit of skill to maneuver a bus around. There are thousands of buses using this road every week without incident.

Let's find some photos of car crashes, airplane crashes, bike crashes, train crashes and boat sinkings and all decide to stay at home then. Now how do I get from home to my place in Thailand? Astral projection?

In the meanwhile I'll keep using buses in Thailand and hope for the best. More chance of a taxi crashing in my opinion.

The bus system in Bangkok is quite efficient and inexpensive. Sure, you find drivers that drive too fast on occasion but that happens everywhere. Where else can you travel from Chaeng Wattana to Green Valley Country Club, a taxi ride that costs 400+ baht, for only 65 baht (and that includes the BTS fare from Victory Monument to Udom Suk)?

[mpyre]

So what??? A bus listing at 15 degrees??? Thousands of buses a day...

[arrowsdawdle]

The mini-buses and vans seem out of control and are best avoided, but the overnight tour buses that connect cities like Khon Kaen and Bangkok cost about 400 baht for the six-hour trip and feature Wi-Fi, electric outlets for your laptop, deep-reclining seats, and a decent food service. These are far superior to the overcrowded no leg-room Greyhounds of America.

Edited January 30, 2016 by arrowsdawdle

[UPDEHSOI]

OH GREAT!! NOW you tell me. Some months ago, about two hundred klicks south of Chiang Mai coming up from Bkk, the bus driver left the highway and decided to finish the trip up through the bush. Of course, he was sleeping at the time, so his judgement wasn't all that great.

from what you wrote I feel quite sure you were not on a Nakhon Chai Air bus ( and if I had to use a bus it would be the only bus company I would ever trust in Thailand). There is no excuse for their drivers to fall asleep because on long distances they have two on board. They also have very well maintained buses.

http://www.nca.co.th/main.html

You're absolutely correct. I have been travelling via Nakhon Chai Air many years. My plane usually arrives in Bkk later in the evening, and many times I don't want to spend the night in the big city, so I hustle over to their bus station and grab a bus up north. This time it was a little bit later, I was at Mo Chit with a friend, I would have had to take a taxi to the other bus station ( yeah, I know it's just down the road, so to speak ) ya da ya da ya da. So I jumped on an Indra Tour bus that was just about ready to leave. Really STOOPID actually, considering the Nakhon Chai Air buses ARE well maintained, have super comfortable seats, ( with massagers ) they give you nice blankets, even though the air con will not freeze your bum off. They also give you some sort of food and those little neck thinggys which are really comfortable actually. I deserved what I got. As a side note, Indra Tour wanted me to pay the hospital bills,and they would reimburse me later. I said okay, but first I was going to call my lawyer, and then have my lawyer call them. Thirteen minutes later a lady wearing an Indra Tour uniform showed up and squared things away. I also talked to two young ladies from Malaysia at the hospital, who were on the same bus, and were beaten up somewhat. Indra Tours were moving them to a cheaper hospital. There's a lot more, but this is enough.

[richard_smith237]

If we stopped using buses, minivans, motorcycles, bicycles we could never leave the house. Except planes.. But oh noo, those fall out of sky sometimes too.

And it would be wiser not to walk because sidewalks are bad, we shouldn't cross streets cos there are no regulated crossings. And street food is iffy freshness, water unsafe to swim, beaches dirty, air polluted, locals angry..

Im not afraid to take a bus here at all.

You are right... I don't use the Busses or Minivans, I have only used the motorcycles when extremely desperate and I never have or never will cycle on Thailand's roads... Crossing the road often involves taking a chance...

I'm glad I don't have to do any of the above because I have a car, or when I have a drink I use UBER (In Bangkok)...

Placing your safety in a strangers hands is fair enough in many nations, especially those nations who understand that the public's interested is best protected by a safety net of standards and inspections, by responsibility and consequence... Thailand doesn't really have that...

...so I drive... and continue to feel sorry for the unnecessary and readily avoidable tragic loss of life and injury so frequently reported in Thailand.

Fortunately the example offered by the Op was not so serious. Serious accidents do happen in other nations, in many of our home nations, however, it does seem that in Thailand these; what can only be described as incidents borne of simple and completely careless lack of regard for human safety, occur so frequently they have become the norm, thus desensitising many of us, as exampled by many of the comments we see in many of these threads....

Unfortunately this desensitivity manifests itself as careless, free-from-personal-responsibility, it'll-never-happen-to-me attitude exampled in the quoted post above... well, while you're at it, you don't need to wear your seatbelt as you are not afraid...

Edited January 30, 2016 by richard_smith237

[samsensam]

while we're at it i encountered this the other sunday morning

[aussiandrew]

I call it precision driving as he kept it up right.

[TheCruncher]

Looking at the pictures I suspect that the driver just took that corner too sharply and didnt go wide enough to clear the concrete bollards on his right. Easy to do if you are distracted by something else or cant see the bollards too clearly.

It's unlikely to be brake failure.

The bus is not allowed to enter from the direction he came. Only cars coming from the opposite direction can take that entrance.

[Basil B]

One thing for sure, there are too many accidents involving Buses and Minivans in Thailand.

Just this past week...

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/890311-bus-crash-injures-13-in-phrae/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/889985-thai-boy-injured-when-bus-drives-into-post/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/889308-two-passengers-killed-ten-injured-in-bus-accident-in-nakhon-phanom/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/888634-bus-crash-kills-2-injures-23-in-chaiyaphum/

Two were fatal accidents, 4 fatalities

I am sure I could find a lot more links if I were to dig deeper.

Edited January 30, 2016 by Basil B

[whitemouse]

If we stopped using buses, minivans, motorcycles, bicycles we could never leave the house. Except planes.. But oh noo, those fall out of sky sometimes too.

And it would be wiser not to walk because sidewalks are bad, we shouldn't cross streets cos there are no regulated crossings. And street food is iffy freshness, water unsafe to swim, beaches dirty, air polluted, locals angry..

Im not afraid to take a bus here at all.

"I'm not afraid to take a bus here at all"

What a great epitaph for a tombstone.

Not really. Besides, I've chosen cremation, much tidier! Rotting seems unhygienic.

[tropo]

If we stopped using buses, minivans, motorcycles, bicycles we could never leave the house. Except planes.. But oh noo, those fall out of sky sometimes too.

And it would be wiser not to walk because sidewalks are bad, we shouldn't cross streets cos there are no regulated crossings. And street food is iffy freshness, water unsafe to swim, beaches dirty, air polluted, locals angry..

Im not afraid to take a bus here at all.

You are right... I don't use the Busses or Minivans, I have only used the motorcycles when extremely desperate and I never have or never will cycle on Thailand's roads... Crossing the road often involves taking a chance...

I'm glad I don't have to do any of the above because I have a car, or when I have a drink I use UBER (In Bangkok)...

Placing your safety in a strangers hands is fair enough in many nations, especially those nations who understand that the public's interested is best protected by a safety net of standards and inspections, by responsibility and consequence... Thailand doesn't really have that...

...so I drive... and continue to feel sorry for the unnecessary and readily avoidable tragic loss of life and injury so frequently reported in Thailand.

Fortunately the example offered by the Op was not so serious. Serious accidents do happen in other nations, in many of our home nations, however, it does seem that in Thailand these; what can only be described as incidents borne of simple and completely careless lack of regard for human safety, occur so frequently they have become the norm, thus desensitising many of us, as exampled by many of the comments we see in many of these threads....

Unfortunately this desensitivity manifests itself as careless, free-from-personal-responsibility, it'll-never-happen-to-me attitude exampled in the quoted post above... well, while you're at it, you don't need to wear your seatbelt as you are not afraid...

We're probably never going to see stats to prove it one way or another, but I wouldn't be surprised if the chances of you being injured or killed in a car crash here in Thailand are higher than the chances of you being injured or killed in a tour bus crash. You may think you're in control, but ultimately your safety is still influenced by all the other traffic on the road. Other traffic is more likely to see a bus than a car and a collision usually ends up in the bus' favour.

Edited January 30, 2016 by tropo

[tropo]

Looking at the pictures I suspect that the driver just took that corner too sharply and didnt go wide enough to clear the concrete bollards on his right. Easy to do if you are distracted by something else or cant see the bollards too clearly.

It's unlikely to be brake failure.

The bus is not allowed to enter from the direction he came. Only cars coming from the opposite direction can take that entrance.

That's the way the turn was originally designated, but these days every car and bus turns right there. Even when there was a no right turn sign, many years ago, all vehicles still turned right there.

[richard_smith237]

If we stopped using buses, minivans, motorcycles, bicycles we could never leave the house. Except planes.. But oh noo, those fall out of sky sometimes too.

And it would be wiser not to walk because sidewalks are bad, we shouldn't cross streets cos there are no regulated crossings. And street food is iffy freshness, water unsafe to swim, beaches dirty, air polluted, locals angry..

Im not afraid to take a bus here at all.

You are right... I don't use the Busses or Minivans, I have only used the motorcycles when extremely desperate and I never have or never will cycle on Thailand's roads... Crossing the road often involves taking a chance...

I'm glad I don't have to do any of the above because I have a car, or when I have a drink I use UBER (In Bangkok)...

Placing your safety in a strangers hands is fair enough in many nations, especially those nations who understand that the public's interested is best protected by a safety net of standards and inspections, by responsibility and consequence... Thailand doesn't really have that...

...so I drive... and continue to feel sorry for the unnecessary and readily avoidable tragic loss of life and injury so frequently reported in Thailand.

Fortunately the example offered by the Op was not so serious. Serious accidents do happen in other nations, in many of our home nations, however, it does seem that in Thailand these; what can only be described as incidents borne of simple and completely careless lack of regard for human safety, occur so frequently they have become the norm, thus desensitising many of us, as exampled by many of the comments we see in many of these threads....

Unfortunately this desensitivity manifests itself as careless, free-from-personal-responsibility, it'll-never-happen-to-me attitude exampled in the quoted post above... well, while you're at it, you don't need to wear your seatbelt as you are not afraid...

We're probably never going to see stats to prove it one way or another, but I wouldn't be surprised if the chances of you being injured or killed in a car crash here in Thailand are higher than the chances of you being injured or killed in a tour bus crash. You may think you're in control, but ultimately your safety is still influenced by all the other traffic on the road. Other traffic is more likely to see a bus than a car and a collision usually ends up in the bus' favour.

Firstly I agree that my safety on the road is heavily influenced by other traffic on the road, but I'm not so sure that being in a car places me at greater risk for a number of reasons ...

Firstly, I'm driving - I'm sure my driving standards are far higher than many bus drivers who speed in the rain, ride (and overheat) the breaks down hills, enter curves too fast etc... busses don't have seatbelt or airbags... How well maintained are the busses ? how well built are they ?

My car (BMW X5) has Seatbelts ABS, ESP, Airbags, crumple zones etc... Busses in Thailand are cosmetic, the structure is flawed (and sometimes made of wood on-top of chassis)

If I were to take 100,000 car journeys and 100,000 bus journey I'd prefer to take my chances with myself driving (I've been driving about 18 years or so in Thailand, most of my adult life)...

.... that said, it would be very interesting to see 'comparable stats'...

I agree with the visibility part of your argument, however, that also leads bus drivers to drive aggressively and over assertively when making the assumption that they've been seen and speeding through junctions etc where the rules of the asphalt jungle in Thailand suggest the bigger the vehicle the greater the assumption is it has right of way often leading to accidents.

[gk10002000]

Having taken taxis, minivans and buses from BKK to Pattaya at all hours of the day and night, I still think the Bus is the safest method of travel. Take one of the inner seats not the window seats and hope for the best.

[tropo]

If we stopped using buses, minivans, motorcycles, bicycles we could never leave the house. Except planes.. But oh noo, those fall out of sky sometimes too.

And it would be wiser not to walk because sidewalks are bad, we shouldn't cross streets cos there are no regulated crossings. And street food is iffy freshness, water unsafe to swim, beaches dirty, air polluted, locals angry..

Im not afraid to take a bus here at all.

You are right... I don't use the Busses or Minivans, I have only used the motorcycles when extremely desperate and I never have or never will cycle on Thailand's roads... Crossing the road often involves taking a chance...

I'm glad I don't have to do any of the above because I have a car, or when I have a drink I use UBER (In Bangkok)...

Placing your safety in a strangers hands is fair enough in many nations, especially those nations who understand that the public's interested is best protected by a safety net of standards and inspections, by responsibility and consequence... Thailand doesn't really have that...

...so I drive... and continue to feel sorry for the unnecessary and readily avoidable tragic loss of life and injury so frequently reported in Thailand.

Fortunately the example offered by the Op was not so serious. Serious accidents do happen in other nations, in many of our home nations, however, it does seem that in Thailand these; what can only be described as incidents borne of simple and completely careless lack of regard for human safety, occur so frequently they have become the norm, thus desensitising many of us, as exampled by many of the comments we see in many of these threads....

Unfortunately this desensitivity manifests itself as careless, free-from-personal-responsibility, it'll-never-happen-to-me attitude exampled in the quoted post above... well, while you're at it, you don't need to wear your seatbelt as you are not afraid...

We're probably never going to see stats to prove it one way or another, but I wouldn't be surprised if the chances of you being injured or killed in a car crash here in Thailand are higher than the chances of you being injured or killed in a tour bus crash. You may think you're in control, but ultimately your safety is still influenced by all the other traffic on the road. Other traffic is more likely to see a bus than a car and a collision usually ends up in the bus' favour.

Firstly I agree that my safety on the road is heavily influenced by other traffic on the road, but I'm not so sure that being in a car places me at greater risk for a number of reasons ...

Firstly, I'm driving - I'm sure my driving standards are far higher than many bus drivers who speed in the rain, ride (and overheat) the breaks down hills, enter curves too fast etc... busses don't have seatbelt or airbags... How well maintained are the busses ? how well built are they ?

My car (BMW X5) has Seatbelts ABS, ESP, Airbags, crumple zones etc... Busses in Thailand are cosmetic, the structure is flawed (and sometimes made of wood on-top of chassis)

If I were to take 100,000 car journeys and 100,000 bus journey I'd prefer to take my chances with myself driving (I've been driving about 18 years or so in Thailand, most of my adult life)...

.... that said, it would be very interesting to see 'comparable stats'...

I agree with the visibility part of your argument, however, that also leads bus drivers to drive aggressively and over assertively when making the assumption that they've been seen and speeding through junctions etc where the rules of the asphalt jungle in Thailand suggest the bigger the vehicle the greater the assumption is it has right of way often leading to accidents.

You've got a nice safe car, I'll give you that. From the sounds of it over confidence is probably your biggest flaw. (your car's safety features and your driving ability). If you've been driving in Thailand for 18 years, I'll guess you're probably no spring chicken. Age slows reflexes and dims eyesight.

I've been riding motorcycles for 10 years in Pattaya, but I wouldn't feel comfortable bragging about my safety record and just say I've been very lucky and leave it at that.

Having said that, I haven't been upset with any bus drivers on the Pattaya - Airport/Bangkok routes yet, but I could also have been lucky as I don't travel frequently. I never get the feeling they're in a hurry.

Edited January 30, 2016 by tropo

[CarolJadzia]

The statistics are available if you hunt them down:-

Mode of transport involved in road accidents in Thailand

Modes of Transport - Years 2000 2001 2002

Pedestrian 4,469 4,135 4,592

Motorcycle 37,498 41,215 53,732

Motor tricycle 1,838 1,852 1,825

Passenger Car 37,440 38,437 44,019

Pick Up 21,372 22,785 26,116

Van 2,477 2,975 3,291

Heavy Bus 3,533 3,618 3,823

Medium Truck 2,624 2,696 3,220

Heavy Truck and Semi Trailer 3,780 3,668 4,523

Other 3,926 4,051 1,912

Total 118,957 125,432 147,053

This paper presents an overview of traffic accident situations in Thailand. It highlights the transformation of road accident problems in Thailand, from the past to present, with the focus on the situation of the most accident prone mode of transport in the country, motorcycle accidents. Relating problems and contributing causes of motorcycle accidents are also detailed in this paper. Subsequently, this paper recommends several measures to curb the alarming increases in motorcycle accidents.

http://www.iatss.or.jp/common/pdf/en/publication/iatss-research/29-1-11.pdf

When looking at the vehicles involved in traffic accidents in Thailand, the figure below indicates that the majority of accidents involve motorcycles, personal cars, pickups, and taxis, in that order. However a substantial number of trucks and buses are also involved, while pedestrians and bicyclists are likely more amongst the victims of accidents, rather than the perpetrators of damage of death.

http://www.thaiwebsites.com/caraccidents.asp

[berybert]

Looking at the pictures I suspect that the driver just took that corner too sharply and didnt go wide enough to clear the concrete bollards on his right. Easy to do if you are distracted by something else or cant see the bollards too clearly.

It's unlikely to be brake failure.

The bus is not allowed to enter from the direction he came. Only cars coming from the opposite direction can take that entrance.

Are you sure ? I have never seen a no right turn at that junction, and that's assuming he was turning right and not coming straight across from Bali Hai.

And there are loads of cars that do turn right there coming down the hill.

[berybert]

The statistics are available if you hunt them down:-

Mode of transport involved in road accidents in Thailand

Modes of Transport - Years 2000 2001 2002

Pedestrian 4,469 4,135 4,592

As a pedestrian I love the fact I can be considered a mode of Transport. I wonder if I can claim a tax rebate for it ?

[KittenKong]

The bus is not allowed to enter from the direction he came. Only cars coming from the opposite direction can take that entrance.

All sorts of people turn right there all the time (including me) and I've never noticed a "no right turn" sign.

[TheCruncher]

The bus is not allowed to enter from the direction he came. Only cars coming from the opposite direction can take that entrance.

All sorts of people turn right there all the time (including me) and I've never noticed a "no right turn" sign.

Because all sorts of people turn there doesn't make it legal, I also see all sorts of people ( not including me ) riding bikes without helmets.

I don't know now as I don't go in that area much these days, but previously there was a no turn signal, which seems to have been confirmed by Tropo already.

So either they removed the sign, or it was forcibly removed by an accident in the past, but it was definitely there some years ago when I traveled often in that area.

[Fairynuff]

If what you say about taking the corner too close,or for what other ridicilous excuse,top and bottom of it HE IS NOT FIT TO HAVE A LICENCE<SIMPLE AS.>

What makes you think he has a license?

[CarolJadzia]

If what you say about taking the corner too close,or for what other ridicilous excuse,top and bottom of it HE IS NOT FIT TO HAVE A LICENCE<SIMPLE AS.>

What makes you think he has a license?

Even if he does have a licence where in the Thai driving test is the bit about driving coaches?

[impulse]

The statistics are available if you hunt them down:-

Mode of transport involved in road accidents in Thailand

Modes of Transport - Years 2000 2001 2002

Pedestrian 4,469 4,135 4,592

As a pedestrian I love the fact I can be considered a mode of Transport. I wonder if I can claim a tax rebate for it ?

Just a healthy dose of reality for those who think they're safer walking than in a vehicle.

The good news: Over 99.95% of us in Thailand aren't killed in road accidents in any given year.

Meaning if you live in Thailand for 50 years, your chances of dying in a road crash are about 2-3%.

[monkey4u]

If what you say about taking the corner too close,or for what other ridicilous excuse,top and bottom of it HE IS NOT FIT TO HAVE A LICENCE<SIMPLE AS.>

Who said he had a license

[sawadee1947]

nooo, that's not any accident. This is the new 30 degree test, which has come now for buses. And as you can see those buses on the photos are pretty much ok.