Ruled out Thailand

[chrisinth]

@ timtscott

IMO you have made many valid points in the OP, which should be a must read for people in your position, making long term plans on retiring in a specific place.

If I had adopted a similar strategy, I would have to admit that I may have second thoughts on the move to Thailand if I was doing it in the near future, but my reasons would be different. (Having lived here for almost 20 years already that is actually a moot point).

Your comment:

"To me the land of smiles is really the land of fake smiles. Maybe it always had been but I refused to see it."

I like very much, the fake smiles have been here for decades but a lot of people refuse to accept this as reality until they have commited to the move and then it is too late for them to accept they didn't follow their basic instinct's in the first place. As a result, a lot become bitter and twisted and are intent on spreading their new-found knowledge to all that will listen.

Everyone is different, and as we get older (as you have seen for yourself) the goalposts shift as the goals in life change. What we craved for yesterday is a distant memory and what we now seek would never have been considered yesterday.

With Thailand, I have been through (and am still happily in) the whole spectrum, originally came to party, became a business owner for 12 years, got married, house owner and am still employed here. Still enjoying it here. After the 'party' stage, nothing was planned, it just happened. This is one of the reasons I am still endeared to Thailand.

The above said, this could have happened in any country in the world. Enjoy your hunt for happiness Tim, and glad you caught it in time. Thailand will still be here if it doesn't workout.................

"I will miss Thailand or the Thailand I had put on a pedestal"

Love it!!

[English 1]

Very true it's a very fake place and you cannot trust the locals or their 'Smiles'.

Try Panama or Equador much safer than the LoS and nicer people.

[gandalf12]

Been in Thailand over 30 years and only once, when I was speeding in my car, was I stopped by the police. Even then they were friendly and we had a laugh before going on my way. No money changed hands either.

[little mary sunshine]

Good luck finding a nice warm place to retire that is

Affordable and has good and affordable medical.

I lived in Costa Rica for a year, great climate, closer

To The States than here however here you are a

Farang, there a Gringo. Much more crime, gangs

Of young thugs every night in San Jose, never felt

Safe after dark.

Thailand has many problems, I find the filth, mold,

And lack of respect for the environment, along with

The stupid drivers, Thai and Westerners, the most

Offensive, however, that being said, Thailand is still

The best affordable place I have found to retire.

[thailen]

Glad you're leaving. If you're from the U.S. or Canada, please tell your friends(I assume they're over 50) NOT to come here, that meeting a young thai or filipina(or other Southeast Asia country) and having a long-term relationship is impossible, that the food is terrible and expensive and you can only get spicy Thai food here(and not Russian, Indian, Chinese,German,French,American, Korean, Middle Eastern, Danish, Swedish, Norwegian), that rent is over the top expensive, that places like Pattaya(where I live) charge too much for public transportation, that people here are murdered by the dozens or beaten or raped every day, where expats are harassed the moment you leave your condo, where you can get food poisoning every time you buy food from a street vendor, where you pay ridiculous prices for beer at pubs.

Yes, please tell them, so we old fogies will have less competition and good luck. Don't forget to close the door on your way out.

[thailen]

Thais and expats frequently complain about the traffic(me, too) but compared to where? Los Angeles? Atlanta? New York? Chicago?

Give me a break!

[Goanna]

In the country areas, farang used to sponsor the rtp with cash donations on a regular basis. Generally like, you pay here 200 baht, or go station and pay 1000 baht. Wrong lane, speeding, no thai license, anything. However, things changed after the coup, and the army got involved in the checkpoints. I haven't had to pay tea money for more than a year.

If the police don't pull you over, then you live in a city. That's all.

[CoreanoOzzie]

Should we all shed a tear for you?

[Seducedbytheseas]

I agree; Thailand is not the same place it was years ago, and there will be plenty more changes. For me, I never looked at Thailand as a permanent location, but one that I would like to keep a link to, and coincidentally, have made an investment in. I own a home here, but don't expect to stay here permanently. I have lived in The Philippines, Indonesia, Vietnam, for example, and have found each location to have a good side and bad. One thing in common is that there will alays be small issues that irritate the hell out of you- no matter where you are. You can either be a permanent resident or a drifter. I prefer to drift around Asia, and now have my sights on Sri Lanka and for a change of pace, a stint in Singapore, where my wife can get some quality work experience. If I didn't have a business here in Asia, I would most certainly spend some time drifting around Central and S. America. I miss the food and the surfing there.

[lungnorm]

I too was planning to retire to Thailand. But it has changed, the govt now reeks of nazism it will be quite some time before Thailand gets a normal democratic Govt. Thailand has changed since I first visited in 1997. I have a lot of Thai friends in Australia but they seem to be a lot different to the Thai's in Thailand. And of course there is the traffic which has got a heck of a lot worse since 1997. The road toll would put anyone off driving there, just last holiday 5 day period 398 road fatalities not to mention the thousands injured. I ended up retiring to the Philippines just over 15 months ago and so far so good. I am in the Cebu area would not entertain Manila. They have terrific Malls here much bigger and better than the Mall's in Thailand. Its a little bit cheaper to rent accommodation here. Sure the traffic is bad but not as bad as Bkk or Chiangmai.I did visit the Philippines 2 years prior to deciding to retire here and I am sure its a lot safer than anywhere in South America. Depending on your financial situation I would pick the Bahama's if I could afford it. I am sure I made the right choice every day I read some crap on Thailand it definitely has gone downhill. I am already a temp permanent resident in Oct this year I will get to be a Permanent Resident and only need to report annually to the immigration office. Most unlike all the stuff I read about the Thai immigration offices. I went to do my annual report just this week, I was in and out in under 1 hour and it cost only $10. Good Luck in making your decision.

[Lowriesuzanne]

Be careful. Don't fantasize that other places are "better". Like Panama or Ecuador. Those are very violent places. I have looked for alternatives... carefully. Belize? Every property is eventually flattened by hurricanes. I'm happy with my double gate-guarded moo baan in Chiang Mai with its 43 security cameras that work. The long haul flights? Horrible. The Chinese have a solution. You get a free 3 day visa for one city. LAX-Shanghai-Chiang Mai, for example. You stop over in Shanghai and take city tours, then arrive in Chiang Mai. You break up that long haul flight. Korea Air? Book a hotel in Incheon Airport and sleep for 8 hours. Taiwan? Take the tours between flights. The Chinese are smart. They are pulling some of their money out of Asia...where do they buy? In cheap midwestern cities in the U.S. like Detroit. Detroit??? Yes. Plus Canada, New Zealand, Australia. And #6 is Thailand. The Chinese are not buying in Latin America. Malaysia and Singapore, yes.

[Paul Phuket]

I've been wanting to retire to Thailand for over ten years I finally did 18months ago.. As much as yes there's issues.. But compared with UK living in London and awful traffic!! And rude people... And expensive...

I've loved everything about now being retired here if you can get over some of the minor annoyances driving idiots on the road get plenty of those in UK too!!

I went back to UK recently for a brief visit I couldn't wait to get back to what I now call my home... I retired early at 53 so have plenty of time to enjoy the paradise I hope!!!

Would also add I sometimes get stopped at check points as soon as they see your a farang your waved on.. I've been keen to show my Thai driving licence now I've got it no ones interested l!

Edited February 26, 2016 by Paul Phuket

[torpedo1970]

Agree with the OP on this.

No need to even go back to 1977 as some mention.

I came first time 10 years ago to Jomtien, and i have seen it go downhill every year from then. I am in the same position, looking to retire in a few years time drawing very similar conclusions as the OP. And yes, i have been travelling around the country too

Over the years i have seen seasoned expats packing up and leave, many to other SE Asian countries as Vietnam and Cambodia. (many Americans claim Cambodia is like Thailand was 20 years ago) But quite a few of my fellow Europeans are actually going back to the old retirement plan of Spain or Portugal. Cost is also a large factor in their decision. Since flying within Europe is almost free, there is no visa hassle, food (Western products) are cheaper than here, restaurants are about the same.... Health and hospital service is more extensive and for the most of times Free.

Wishing the OP good luck in finding a perfect place for him.

[Guest]

I have now spend few days at Penang, Malaysia. I must say I'm positively surprised how nice this island is and how nice the people are.

The population (700.000 people) consist of mixture of Chinese, Malayan and Indian. English is spoken widely and people are happy to encage to spontaneous conversations. Public transportation works well.

This place is in a middle way in mentality between the effective Singapore and relaxed Thailand. Very nice indeed.

For me. My next location is Costa del Sol in Spain. Warm enough, benefits of the EU membership, which hopefully will continue in the future as it gives a lots of freedoms for it's members.

[derator01]

Please stick to the topic. Constant anti-American bashing will not be tolerated.

[gilbreth99]

sorry, but I totally understand where the OP is coming from, of course Thailand has some wonderful areas, but Pattaya, jomtien, Phuket are not part of those wonderful areas , they are whore house cities. Ten years ago, whilst working legit in Bangkok my favoutite area was Cha Am or Hua Hin. Was there last week and the entire 20km stretch between the two was a dusty, dirty building site. Thailand is rapidly killing itself .... For those experts here, look at Pattaya in 1977 and today ! ( I do realise possibly only 1% would be qualified to answer ) Thailand has committed suicide on itself,

Pattaya is a great family friendly town. I am raising 2 kids here. The working girls are rarely seen outside of Walking street and the bars. We go to the beaches often, see movies, play soccer, visit the parks, etc., just like anywhere else in the world, with much less traffic and at good prices.

[BaldPlumber]

I know that there is no perfect place. I don't expect perfection but from what I have learned from my research and in country experience is that Thailand is less and less welcoming. I realize this a general statement and I have met some very nice Thai people over the years. But even the ones I have come really close to I find there is always an invisible barrier. I will never be Thai to them and thus never an equal. I know this exist in other cultures and it certainly exist in my own. Also I have traveled all over Thailand not just the sex tourist locations. There are parts of the country I truly love. But you should never confuse the words " I love you" with "I want to marry you". Thailand is a lot of fun. For me personally, it is best as a vacation destination and not a permanent home.

Oh by the way cost of living does play a role in my decision as well but it is not the deciding factor.

"I will never be thai to them", I dont really get why that matters?

Neither do I. Of course you'll never be Thai in the same way as a Frenchman living in the UK will never be British.

It's totally beyond me why some people seem to desire total assimilation into Thai culture and are disappointed when this eludes them.

Far better to keep the best bits of you own culture and heritage and borrow the bits of the Thai one that you like.

It's all a bit odd to me, you can't change who you are just by dint of living in a foreign country.

[puukao]

Took you 30 years to figure out "land of fakes". Admittedly, it took me about one week. I felt dumb.

This thread will get interest because it's the truth....'Thailand WAS a great place, but now it's just a cheap alternative." If you can do it, visit 1-3 months a year, and I bet even that gets old.

It's still the best place in SE Asia, however.

Life is too short......no sense retiring somewhere that is stressful.

[luke000]

The OP has made the right choice .

A miserable lonely existence awaits him in Thailand.

A life of depression, alcohol dependency, cynicism , complaining about everything , feeling sorry for himself awaits him in
Thailand

[thailen]

Oh, yes, South(and Latin0 America are far superior to Thailand. Say hello to El Chapo on his way to a U.S. prison. Mexico, the land of drugs and the place you can wave to immigrants from Venezuela, Chile, Columbia and other paradises on their way to the U.S.

Gilbreath99 is absolutely right. Pattaya is not the same place it was 10 years ago. Walking Street is still here, but so are thousands of new people - single, gay, families. Did the "whoretown" reputation stop 50,000 Russians from buying and renting condos and houses here(just ask th Russian consulate in Bangkok)? Is it stopping thousands of Chinese from coming here?The number of tourists coming to Pattaya and many moving here are testimony to the new "family" mindset and living style of expats coming here. I've lived in a number of countries and in many U.S. cities and the climate here in Pattaya is as good as it gets.

[slerickson]

I can understand your sentiments. I will leave myself in 12 months or so and go to Philippines as my gf is Filipino.

Have you looked at Vietnam? Hearing good reports but no retirement visa at this stage.

What part? I just got back from Northern Vietnam and very glad to be in Thailand. Nothing terrible but just didn't like the vibe. Had planned on a month but 12 days was enough.

[Pinot]

I lived in Phuket for six years. I have been stopped by the police and frisked ONCE in all that time. The #1 target for the BIB is Thais.

South Africa is cheap to live, but South Africans want out of there. They can't get their money out because of the financial restrictions.

I was in Panama last year to check it out. It's supposed to be the #1 rated retirement destination. It was a terrible place. Razor wire everywhere, fat women and bad food.

I was also in Colombia. Had a great time but I'll never learn Spanish which you'll absolutely have to have. Ecuador is still a possibility.

Vietnam is a possibility. If Thailand is a 3rd world country, Vietnam is 2.75, Cambodia is 2.5.

You're blowing off Thailand for the wrong reason. Don't buy anything. Go live in the place you want to stay for awhile and good luck.

I'll take LOS, with its faults.

[Nowisee]

It took me a few weeks to decide to move here, incidentally I had never been here before.

The decision factors I used before moving seemed very logical at the time and are still relevant, the reality is what makes it challenging and interesting.
The more I force the issue of integrating with the locals and the culture, excepting the differences, the more I can see it opening up my mind.

There's still the overhang of no one approaching me and talking, although I am not certain it's true xenophobia, but I am starting to see a little bit of change in the people being more friendly, open and interested in saying hi.

There's more I like about here than I dislike.

Traffic stops are not because I am farang, everyone is being stopped and I am quickly on my way. The stops in the US are much more of a hassle.

The fake smiles comment is more a misunderstanding of the way smiles are used here. The real fake smiles are in the US when someone is smiling at you and plotting how to screw you...

The flight back to the US sucks... so my solution is to stop going to the US. I'll instead go the other direction to Spain and Portugal with maybe a stop along the way.

Still not sure I want to live here full time and I would probably never say it's a "beautiful" country. But as I have read, been told and observed with my limited traveling, it's at least in the top 3 of SEA.

All that being said (not sure why I bothered) it's your decision and hope it all works out for you.

Edited February 26, 2016 by Nowisee

[Altalake]

Goldbear is right. South - and indeed Central America - has lots of problems. I could list them for you, but I have not got the time.

We have looked all over, and Thaliand still suits us best. Food, people, weather et al. Been coming here for 40 years now.

Nowhere is perfect, but here is pretty good.

[Old Croc]

People, the world and even Thailand are constantly evolving. Nothing stays the same.

Plans to move to a new country and culture, particularly for retirement, is not something to be taken lightly nor locked in years in advance. The OP has discovered Thailand no longer fits his aspirations for the rest of his life and is looking elsewhere. No big story here. Everybody's needs and thoughts are different and they need to be constantly updated looking forward not backwards.

For example, for many years my plans for retirement involved extensive travel and short term residence in exotic places with my lady. When I finally had the time, and the money to realize these dreams, my health deserted me, followed soon after by my third wife. Not being even vaguely interested in hooking up with a member of the blue rinse set who suddenly seemed to be my only option available in Australia, my thoughts turned to SEA.

Fast forward a number of years, I now live happily in a nice house, in a good area in Phuket, with my fourth, and best, lady who greatly assists with my medical difficulties.

I don't try to be Thai, I don't get involved in, nor upset by, local politics nor the entrenched corruption that is part of the culture here, and stay away from any toxic locals and expats.

Everybody is different, live where is best for you.

[Just1Voice]

With all it's "faults", I still can't think of any place I would rather live, for many number of reasons.

[bazza40]

While I don't agree with the OP on a couple of points, his post does make sense from the point of view of a 27 hour flight. I would love to give places such as Mexico, Chile or Spain a try, but it's just too far to go. When you are in your seventies, an 8 hour flight is the limit for most people. Especially if you have to go back to your country of origin periodically.

I don't put Thailand on a pedestal; however, for me the good significantly outweighs the bad.

Good luck with the senoritas.

[mcfish]

OP is also looking for validation and probably needs to fully convince himself that going to South America is absolutely the right choice

I feel that he will be quite surprised by the genuine replys be people having lived there and the overwhelming opinion that thailand is the best and safest retirement destination, even with all its faults.

Sent from my SC-01D using Tapatalk

[chicowoodduck]

Clear thinking will help you avoid the shi*t storm called LOS.

Years from now you will thank your brain for steering you well clear......kudos for you...???

[Timebandit]

Utila,Honduras is pretty nice,and please consider Bonaire.

Honduras has the highest murder rate in the World. I believe he wrote "South America".