Start a mixed farm in Isaan

[Mr Kie]

Hi all, just wanna share after we turned the rice field to a mixed farm, it seems everything getting better than before. we have 5 rai in Yasothon, in the past we did grow only rice and could do only once a year and the turnover is varied and relatively low compare to other crops. so we decided to divide more than 80% of this small piece of land to a mixed farm, growing more than 50 variety of crops and some of livestock.

The problem is, Isaan used to be the sea and the underground water is therefore salty, couldn't use that water for cultivating anymore unlike the other part of Thailand provided with good irrigation. another problem is poor soil quality, during the dry season you even can see the white layer on top of it. with such type of soil only few can be grown. one of the crop that is best suited for this type of soil is Jasmine rice. on the economic side, rice price is up and down a lot and depending on the government policy, not reliable, it's better to stand on your own feet and moving forward with something else that has a good payoff.

In the attached is our farm. i have started this project with my parent and right now already been for 3 months.

Any advice or suggestion would be most welcome

[Mr Kie]

Here are things that we are growing right now. some survived and some died, but we do keep planted again, at the same time improving soil quality using compost.

[whatproblem]

Good luck ,hope it succeeds,

[WishWashMan]

pick 1 and concentrate on that. your way is sure loss of money!

[Bantex]

Good luck but I think your trying to grow too many varieties of crops. Best sticking to the crops that are successful with a small area to try other crops to see how they fare.

[soalbundy]

Here are things that we are growing right now. some survived and some died, but we do keep planted again, at the same time improving soil quality using compost.

Well done, i would be interested in who you sell your produce to. That about salted water was interesting, we live in Isaan and use water from a deep well (28 meters) for showering and for the washing machine,it's not the least bit salty.

[bazza40]

Are you experienced in commercial farming? If not, just send me 2000 baht a week- your money will last longer that way.

[maprao]

Good Luck with your venture.

If nothing else you will eat nice food with no preserving or inbalming chemicals added

[Dan747]

Wife and I have 8 Rai 10 kilometers north of Ubon grow three kinds of Rice (Wild/Jasmine/Sweet) with a sort of fruit trees, one fish pond with Tilapia and eight hens that provide fresh eggs for not only us but for our family. Next project this year is a couple of Bee Hives for honey and to help the pollination of agricultural crops in the local area. Thanks for your post since I am always looking for the next project-”Good Luck!”

[Nokawou]

The "salty" water has nothing to do with ancient sea beds and it contains excess Calcium (Ca) not sodium (Na) and the Ca will leave the white calcium carbonate deposits on the surface this will results in excessive alkaline soils. You could try to add gypsum (calcium sulfate) to the soil as a conditioner this will mobilize the Ca and leach it from the soil. The best thing to do is to send some soil samples to a lab for analysis to see what you soil status is this will also indicate how much gypsum to use. There is also a good possibility that the groundwater is stratified and you could get better quality water deeper down, this is all dependent on the geology of you area, you could find out from the neighbors that have wells who has the best water and how deep the well is. With the soil analysis you could find the right crops that will do well on your type of soil and you do not have to experiment that much. Best of luck, you have the right approach and with some effort you will find the right crop for your area that will give you good returns on your investment.

[WishWashMan]

pick 1 and concentrate on that. your way is sure loss of money!

Im not a FARMER but i have good business instincts. Oh the money that would be saved if my humble advice would be taken...................lol.

[nuananddon]

I've been a farmer nearly all my life so here is a little advice. One day you pray for rain, the next day you pray for it to stop, on another day you pray for sunshine and finally you pray it don't get too hot. There is a lot of risk in farming for a living vs being a hobby farmer. Same with any investment, only send what you can afford to lose. Best of luck.

[Mr Kie]

Thank you for all commend and valuable advice....i have to be optimistic about it, what i have seen in the past we could make only less than 40k Baht/year from rice alone, which mean we could make only less than 10k per rai...and have to work on something else for additional income. we found up to 50% of the income is spent on food.

Due to we have only 5 rai of land for farming which's too small to do like the commercial one so we have to make use of every square foot and turn it to a better payoff per rai. on the other hand i think instead of making money out of one thing and buy all the things isn't that better to grow all the thing you like have and buy few things that is necessary for life.

There are many of Thai farmers have been successfully with doing a mixed farm, able to generate up to 100k per rai. the key success is good soil and water.

in the attached is one type of bamboo for shoots, i just planted for about 5 weeks and already got the new shoot...pretty fast. this type of bamboo you can harvest it all year round and in summer time price is quite good 30-40 Baht/kg retail price at local market, and a lot of demand for that.

[Mr Kie]

I've been a farmer nearly all my life so here is a little advice. One day you pray for rain, the next day you pray for it to stop, on another day you pray for sunshine and finally you pray it don't get too hot. There is a lot of risk in farming for a living vs being a hobby farmer. Same with any investment, only send what you can afford to lose. Best of luck.

Right!...I totally agree, farming is risky and every businesses is risky too.... that's why we have to manage the risk and find the new way to make it better....

[Lou Provencaou]

From the "hobby farmer" point of view may I modestly suggest strawberry, orange, pomegranate, ginger, tea, coffee, Aloe Vera, date palm trees and last but not least turmeric wich is so famous in Farangland for health; unfortunately you cannot grow olive trees wich are so common where I come from and producing sych a fantastic and tastefull oil . Your list is impressive, I like it very much; you seem very interested and passionate about growing good things to eat. The idea to make honey is great also

: - )))

From the commercial point of view (I am not sure that this is really your point) the problem is to sell so many different products in small quantities. But the happiness to eat your own good quality products and the advantages for your health is ubquantifiable with money. It's worth kilos of gold in wellbeing and pleasure because anybody who knows fruits and vegetable freshly coming from gardens knows that they are so much more tastefull.Moreover it may allow to work in the fresh air together and zat good things together. Maybe somebody wealthy may be clever enough to buy those from you as they are more tastefull/delicious and helpfull to live a healthy food lifestyle. That is like the bio trend.

I wish you all the best. You gave me a few ideas for the future when I will make my own garden too. Now I just have a few fruits treas at my girlfriend's home but soon I'll do your kind of garden of eden thing.

: - )

When I planted them and took informations about what could be growed, I had been informed (as I would cover the world of fruit trees if I had the power to do so, so much I like them )that some of the trees that you plant are difficult to grow. Tea and coffee that I suggest are said to only grow in north West.

I am sure that there can still be some great and original suggestions. Maybe some spices ...

Chokdeekrap sincerely

[Mr Kie]

Good luck but I think your trying to grow too many varieties of crops. Best sticking to the crops that are successful with a small area to try other crops to see how they fare.

Thanks Bantex, right!... i growing too many but only few each....definitely will go for the one that doing better....and what i looking at is lime at this moment.

[ozyjon]

Good luck, i know farming is extremely hard work, i never want to do it,

i think you are doing to much but go for it,, whatever fails, stop it and

continue with whats successful.

[bazza40]

The "salty" water has nothing to do with ancient sea beds and it contains excess Calcium (Ca) not sodium (Na) and the Ca will leave the white calcium carbonate deposits on the surface this will results in excessive alkaline soils. You could try to add gypsum (calcium sulfate) to the soil as a conditioner this will mobilize the Ca and leach it from the soil. The best thing to do is to send some soil samples to a lab for analysis to see what you soil status is this will also indicate how much gypsum to use. There is also a good possibility that the groundwater is stratified and you could get better quality water deeper down, this is all dependent on the geology of you area, you could find out from the neighbors that have wells who has the best water and how deep the well is. With the soil analysis you could find the right crops that will do well on your type of soil and you do not have to experiment that much. Best of luck, you have the right approach and with some effort you will find the right crop for your area that will give you good returns on your investment.

I agree the OP should be getting a soil analysis done. However,adding gypsum will do nothing to bring the soil pH down. It's a soil conditioner for heavy clays. To bring soil pH down, elemental sulphur addition is required.

[RedQualia]

We also have five rai. It's a bit far from where we live, so we haven't done that much with it thus far. Currently, it's mostly growing longan. Many people grow longan in that area, and the market for longan goes up and down at different times of the year. This probably has to do with how many other farmers have crops maturing at the same time. If your crop matures at an "off time," then the price for longan tends to be higher. Sometimes quite high. The price for longan hit rock bottom a couple of years ago... I think they were offering 5 Baht per KG. We've never made any money from the longan trees. I think we've decided that we're done with longan and need to replace all the trees with something else. I'm currently experimenting with coffee and cocoa plants (someone at Maejo University has come up with a variety of cocoa that will do well in the Chiang Mai area; it's still a fairly sensitive plant for up here, though. I would not think it would do well in your area at all). Lychee will not grow where we are. I would like to try mixed farming as you're doing, but dealing with many smaller crops takes quite a bit more effort.

A very few thoughts for you: Trees tend to take up quite a bit of space. The ground beneath them generally can't be used for too many other things. I can't recall how many longan trees we have. Maybe 30? No room for more, really. I'm also surprised to hear that you can grow either longan or lychee in your area. Are those trees successful? Are they producing any fruit? Same for tamarind, really. Tamarind does well in the Phetchabun area, but Yasothon isn't very much like the Phetchabun area. Have you been successful with tamarind? Any fruit? What would the market prices be in the Phetchabun area for tamarind grown in Yasothon?

Actually, you list a great many different fruits and vegetables, but you also say that some types have not been successful. Can you list for us which things have been successful please?

I'm unsure of how far it might be for you to travel to markets where you could sell the things you grow, but would assume that you can do that. The key would probably be to grow things that Thai people like to buy/eat (things you can sell), but that are less common in your area (less common should mean higher selling price).

Less useful thoughts: After I get rich selling coffee and cocoa, I plan to take over the Thai tomato and zucchini markets. Most Thai tomatoes have zero flavor, and it's very rare to find decent tomatoes here. I don't know if they would grow well in your area or not. They like hot weather, but usually not as hot as in Thailand. They also consume quite a bit of water. If interested, your best bet would be to research what they need to grow well, temperatures, best times of year, and etc, via the Internet. If you can find or import heirloom tomato seeds, that would be even better. There are several collections for tropical climates available at www.tomatofest.com. Other places as well. Consider this one, perhaps: https://www.tomatofest.com/tomato-seeds-tropical-hot-humid-collection.html

Some years I've had quite good luck with tomatoes. Big tomatoes with wonderful flavor. Other years have been bad. I generally start tomato seeds in late July, and plant the seedlings in September and October. I have to protect them from the rain at that time, but usually have quite a few small tomatoes by the time rainy season ends, about the beginning of November.

Zucchini is mostly a foreign food, I guess. It's difficult to find any in Thailand and it took me a long, long time to find zucchini seed. The first place I found it was in Roi Et, in a seed shop behind the Chinese temple in town there. There turned out to be 3-4 seed shops around the Chinese temple. I'm unsure of how good the seeds actually are. I mean, Roi Et can get hot, and the shops in question were also hot. Who can say how long the seeds have been hanging in the aluminum/mylar bags there in the heat? What I can say is that only about 15-20% of the seeds I planted sprouted into plants, and none survived more than a few weeks. I have since found zucchini seed in Chiang Mai and bought some. I'm going to try again, of course. IF you could grow it, and if it produced fruit, I imagine you'd be able to sell it for a fairly good price. I see someone reported seeing some in Bangkok supermarket for 103 Baht per kilo. Zucchini grows extremely well in the USA, and there were many times when I had so much of it I was getting sick and tired of eating it. But so far it seems fairly uncommon here in Thailand.

Enough. If you find a way to actually make money from your five rai, I hope you do let us all know! Best of luck to you sir!

Edited June 3, 2016 by RedQualia

[colinneil]

Good luck to you sir, i am always happy to see someone get up and try.

Many people just sit there and say this wont work that wont work.

You are trying, the same as me, i grow a lot of veg mainly for our own use.

I have tried zucchini many times, they start well then after a few weeks wilt and die.

Only had 2 fruit in 5 years.

Keep on trying, hope you do well and prosper.

[WishWashMan]

Good luck to you sir, i am always happy to see someone get up and try.

Many people just sit there and say this wont work that wont work.

You are trying, the same as me, i grow a lot of veg mainly for our own use.

I have tried zucchini many times, they start well then after a few weeks wilt and die.

Only had 2 fruit in 5 years.

Keep on trying, hope you do well and prosper.

Trying doesnt cut it. Esp when you doing what every other somchai, noot, nit is doing. The old doing the same thing over n over again and expecting a different result.

Farm to feed family is 1 thing trying to out do THE JOLLY GREEN GIANT is another.

IF you want tom make money dont do what all the other poor farmers are doing.

IF you want to lose weight dont do what the fat man is doing.

Sometimes the only way to change a family for the good is to get out of dodge. Pick up the ma n pa and move to a city.

Edited June 3, 2016 by WishWashMan

[Mr Kie]

Good luck to you sir, i am always happy to see someone get up and try.

Many people just sit there and say this wont work that wont work.

You are trying, the same as me, i grow a lot of veg mainly for our own use.

I have tried zucchini many times, they start well then after a few weeks wilt and die.

Only had 2 fruit in 5 years.

Keep on trying, hope you do well and prosper.

Thanks...me too... growing watermelon only 40% are survived. but that was due to poor soil quality. if you keep using compost will help to improve soil quality and at the end it will take care of your plant. I'm trying to grow different crops because i can't wait for 5 years till we can start harvesting if we go for one.

already harvested some of them and in the attached we do grow Durian too which is no one else growing in the area. i know it gonna takes years till we can harvest it.

[Mr Kie]

Here are things that we are growing right now. some survived and some died, but we do keep planted again, at the same time improving soil quality using compost.

Well done, i would be interested in who you sell your produce to. That about salted water was interesting, we live in Isaan and use water from a deep well (28 meters) for showering and for the washing machine,it's not the least bit salty.

i checked with the neighbor next to us and they have no issue like we do. that might be different from area to area

well...we expected not to sell at the early stage and if we do have leftover will sell it at the local market or in Yasothon. growing many varieties is the best solution for selling because we able to harvest it all year round...some can be harvested everyday....some once a week, some once a month or year and some in 5 years. all in all it will provide everyday income.

we also have some chickens for egg and cows for their manure. we take 0.5 rai for growing Napier grass for cow all year round and in that paddock will let chicken walking around which is large enough for them to enjoy. for cattle we only feed them with grasses no any concentrate feed given but they still perform relatively okay.

[Mr Kie]

We also have five rai. It's a bit far from where we live, so we haven't done that much with it thus far. Currently, it's mostly growing longan. Many people grow longan in that area, and the market for longan goes up and down at different times of the year. This probably has to do with how many other farmers have crops maturing at the same time. If your crop matures at an "off time," then the price for longan tends to be higher. Sometimes quite high. The price for longan hit rock bottom a couple of years ago... I think they were offering 5 Baht per KG. We've never made any money from the longan trees. I think we've decided that we're done with longan and need to replace all the trees with something else. I'm currently experimenting with coffee and cocoa plants (someone at Maejo University has come up with a variety of cocoa that will do well in the Chiang Mai area; it's still a fairly sensitive plant for up here, though. I would not think it would do well in your area at all). Lychee will not grow where we are. I would like to try mixed farming as you're doing, but dealing with many smaller crops takes quite a bit more effort.

A very few thoughts for you: Trees tend to take up quite a bit of space. The ground beneath them generally can't be used for too many other things. I can't recall how many longan trees we have. Maybe 30? No room for more, really. I'm also surprised to hear that you can grow either longan or lychee in your area. Are those trees successful? Are they producing any fruit? Same for tamarind, really. Tamarind does well in the Phetchabun area, but Yasothon isn't very much like the Phetchabun area. Have you been successful with tamarind? Any fruit? What would the market prices be in the Phetchabun area for tamarind grown in Yasothon?

Actually, you list a great many different fruits and vegetables, but you also say that some types have not been successful. Can you list for us which things have been successful please?

I'm unsure of how far it might be for you to travel to markets where you could sell the things you grow, but would assume that you can do that. The key would probably be to grow things that Thai people like to buy/eat (things you can sell), but that are less common in your area (less common should mean higher selling price).

Less useful thoughts: After I get rich selling coffee and cocoa, I plan to take over the Thai tomato and zucchini markets. Most Thai tomatoes have zero flavor, and it's very rare to find decent tomatoes here. I don't know if they would grow well in your area or not. They like hot weather, but usually not as hot as in Thailand. They also consume quite a bit of water. If interested, your best bet would be to research what they need to grow well, temperatures, best times of year, and etc, via the Internet. If you can find or import heirloom tomato seeds, that would be even better. There are several collections for tropical climates available at www.tomatofest.com. Other places as well. Consider this one, perhaps: https://www.tomatofest.com/tomato-seeds-tropical-hot-humid-collection.html

Some years I've had quite good luck with tomatoes. Big tomatoes with wonderful flavor. Other years have been bad. I generally start tomato seeds in late July, and plant the seedlings in September and October. I have to protect them from the rain at that time, but usually have quite a few small tomatoes by the time rainy season ends, about the beginning of November.

Zucchini is mostly a foreign food, I guess. It's difficult to find any in Thailand and it took me a long, long time to find zucchini seed. The first place I found it was in Roi Et, in a seed shop behind the Chinese temple in town there. There turned out to be 3-4 seed shops around the Chinese temple. I'm unsure of how good the seeds actually are. I mean, Roi Et can get hot, and the shops in question were also hot. Who can say how long the seeds have been hanging in the aluminum/mylar bags there in the heat? What I can say is that only about 15-20% of the seeds I planted sprouted into plants, and none survived more than a few weeks. I have since found zucchini seed in Chiang Mai and bought some. I'm going to try again, of course. IF you could grow it, and if it produced fruit, I imagine you'd be able to sell it for a fairly good price. I see someone reported seeing some in Bangkok supermarket for 103 Baht per kilo. Zucchini grows extremely well in the USA, and there were many times when I had so much of it I was getting sick and tired of eating it. But so far it seems fairly uncommon here in Thailand.

Enough. If you find a way to actually make money from your five rai, I hope you do let us all know! Best of luck to you sir!

Thanks for the reply....very informative

from what i have seen...everyone gonna say price is up and down a lot depending on the market. that is absolutely true and because of that we have to spread all the risk not to one crop but to all the crops.

when you talking about growing tree gonna need more spaces.....this is also not a problem if we go for a mixed farm because we can think of what type of plant can be grown in the boxes or not necessary to have the root go down the soil and need some of sun light...then choose that type of plant and growing between the fruit tree....by doing this way will be more efficient in using the space....like i said we will grow only few each and for longan we do have only 3 of them and they are producing fruit too but not much... for Tamarind we have both sweet and for cooking also only few in our farm. price of tamarind would be around 80-100 Bath/kg not exactly sure right now....i been to Pakistan once and people asked me if i able to ship a container of tamarind for cooking coz they can't grow and import a lot of it.

right!...some successful but i can see only few of them because i just started out 3 months ago and the other crops are not yet ready to give fruit they are still young...for example watermelon is only 40% survived and already been harvested.

the distance from farm to market is 2 km (local market in the village) and 19 km to Yasothon city.....my next project is building a new farm shop right in the middle of village for selling our produces...

regarding tomato very interesting....right now we found tomato is also not growing well at our land and only pure breed that is survived and will try out more and first need to get the better soil before moving forward ....we do seed saving too but only few

i also like zucchini...but not sure for other Thai people...anyway that is a good one to try out here. yes.. will go on with updating all the progress here.

[timberpond]

Pay attention to costing... having so many different varieties might bring the cost to a much higher level.

[Mr Kie]

Pay attention to costing... having so many different varieties might bring the cost to a much higher level.

Investing in this will be mainly on irrigation system, connecting pipeline covering the area where we wanna grow crops. total i have invested is around 20,000 baht this including irrigation system covering around 2.5 rai, buying seed and young plants, some of cultivating tools, day old chicks and feed. right now i not gonna talk about the labor cost as it is all from our family.

In the near future i will then install the timer to automatically watering the plant and we will make compost and liquid organic fertilizer adding to the water and automatically injected to the water line. by doing this will help reduce a lot of working time on watering the plant daily. and will spend more time on harvesting and selling the produces.

[Mr Kie]

here is how my farm gonna look like in 2017, this plan was drawn before i started. look like the total revenue per year is expected too high but that are from other businesses too....like renting the room, coffee shop, 7 Eleven shop,...etc. i would like to turn this farm to be my future working office.

[Mr Kie]

From the "hobby farmer" point of view may I modestly suggest strawberry, orange, pomegranate, ginger, tea, coffee, Aloe Vera, date palm trees and last but not least turmeric wich is so famous in Farangland for health; unfortunately you cannot grow olive trees wich are so common where I come from and producing sych a fantastic and tastefull oil . Your list is impressive, I like it very much; you seem very interested and passionate about growing good things to eat. The idea to make honey is great also

: - )))

From the commercial point of view (I am not sure that this is really your point) the problem is to sell so many different products in small quantities. But the happiness to eat your own good quality products and the advantages for your health is ubquantifiable with money. It's worth kilos of gold in wellbeing and pleasure because anybody who knows fruits and vegetable freshly coming from gardens knows that they are so much more tastefull.Moreover it may allow to work in the fresh air together and zat good things together. Maybe somebody wealthy may be clever enough to buy those from you as they are more tastefull/delicious and helpfull to live a healthy food lifestyle. That is like the bio trend.

I wish you all the best. You gave me a few ideas for the future when I will make my own garden too. Now I just have a few fruits treas at my girlfriend's home but soon I'll do your kind of garden of eden thing.

: - )

When I planted them and took informations about what could be growed, I had been informed (as I would cover the world of fruit trees if I had the power to do so, so much I like them )that some of the trees that you plant are difficult to grow. Tea and coffee that I suggest are said to only grow in north West.

I am sure that there can still be some great and original suggestions. Maybe some spices ...

Chokdeekrap sincerely

Thanks...that was the idea of starting a mix farm. for me i have no need to rush and go for one crop...in the long run it will turn much better and i have to do my best to turn 5 rai to be more productive. my first aim is to feed the family and the rest will sell to the local market and do some food processing if that is needed later on.

i would say farming like what i'm doing is a hobby but once it get better can turn it to be commercial.....i'm planing to have a farm shop in the village and also in the city of Yasothon as well in the future. when you look at the retail shop they don't sell only a single produce but different varieties right? so the same idea why i'm growing many different types.

it always good to stay and work in a farm with fresh air, not gonna be too hard to work if you have set a good plan, good to eat your own food, fresh and tasty as it not stay overnight or travel long distance till you can have it. Like i said... before i spent 200-300 Baht for food a day...if three of us buying all the food every day this would cost us around 800-900 Baht a day or 24000 Baht/month or almost 300,000 Baht a year..... I have never seen anyone that can turn 5 rai to 300,000 Baht a year...

Right some of plant that i listed are difficult to grow and don't know if it will give fruit but that is not a problem. i believe if we have the better soil most of the plant will be doing okay.

here is some young dragon fruit i have prepared...and already flowering

good luck to you too...

[WishWashMan]

You need to get real. Your endeavour is nothing like what 7-11 projects. You have 600$ invested. They have $600,000,000 or whatever!

Dont think of your farming as a commerical thing, you will be disappointed. Just look at it as your passionate hobby.

[Speedo1968]

The "salty" water has nothing to do with ancient sea beds and it contains excess Calcium (Ca) not sodium (Na) and the Ca will leave the white calcium carbonate deposits on the surface this will results in excessive alkaline soils. You could try to add gypsum (calcium sulfate) to the soil as a conditioner this will mobilize the Ca and leach it from the soil. The best thing to do is to send some soil samples to a lab for analysis to see what you soil status is this will also indicate how much gypsum to use. There is also a good possibility that the groundwater is stratified and you could get better quality water deeper down, this is all dependent on the geology of you area, you could find out from the neighbors that have wells who has the best water and how deep the well is. With the soil analysis you could find the right crops that will do well on your type of soil and you do not have to experiment that much. Best of luck, you have the right approach and with some effort you will find the right crop for your area that will give you good returns on your investment.

I like your comments in general and yes they are very useful for people considering agriculture for profit or hobby.

Lots of areas of Isaan have salty soils, intensified irrigation is causing this to rise to the surface.

To the west of Banphai ( 45 km south of KK ) there are the remains of an old salt gathering site, There is a mound on top of which the collected water was put in pots and the water boiled off to leave the salt. Pieces of broken pot can still be found. I am told it dates back a 100 years or so.