Beach bans on the burkini in France sparks widespread debate

[NativeSon360]

On 8/19/2016 at 7:09 PM, farcanell said:

 

Hello... Look at the picture... The burkini IS a form of open face attire... And a change from Muslim tradition, in its own right.

 

and I'm sure your not suggesting modesty is absurd, or are you?

 

Ah.... I see you see by editing ?

Actually, I was trying to clean-up my post. I was in such a hurry reading, that I assumed the Muslims again were trying to impose their Burka traditions in the Christian world. I did not read "Burkini", thus my reply was way-off topic. My own prejudice is the blame for that! Oops!

[farcanell]

4 hours ago, JemJem said:

No, Farcanell, I didn't advocate for a reduction of Western style liberties of course. If you read my post again, I actually criticised countries like Saudi A and Iran, for making all women cover themselves outdoors in all places. And, also you distorted my post, by switching to writing about sharia stuff.

I am actually not a fan of any religion, especially Islam; and I wish no women wore burqinis to beaches, but sadly, life is not like that. I had just meant that it is no harm if some would wear that to beaches if they wanted to.

I also for example wouldn't mind people going barefoot to places like shopping malls and cafes; to give you another example.

Now, understood ?

 Fair enough...  I understand this explaination moreso than the origional post, which I read several times... I'm glad you have clarified your position

 

Perhaps the confusion ( on my part?) was in your questioning where the western outcry was about what happens in Muslim countries, like Saudi, which is worse than in France... (And IMO indeed it is)

 

But..... By doing so, you compare the laws of the different countries.... So I did not deflect (or distort) but rather,  gave other examples of how/ why this is inappropriate ( comparing Muslim countries laws to democratic countries laws), but nevertheless, a comparisons multiple posters have already made

 

my apologies for that.... And again... Your second post is better written and your intend far easier to see, and gets a big like from me ?

[farcanell]

4 hours ago, Zendo said:

 

Not at all , in France Döner kebabs are what Greeks call shawarmas.. and it's sold and make by muslims in France, mostly coming from Turckey they sell it in sandwiches with french fries inside or outside !

Big Big buisness, everybody like it even it's fat and not much healthy, much better than the ones available in Thaïland, it 14% of ALL sandwiches sold in France !

 

Did you guys heard about the morroco King discourse recently ? if not just have a look :

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-37148105

 

 

Do you think that he's calling for women to wear burkinis on French beaches, who knows ? sometimes opinons differs, understanding too ^^ !!!!

 

 

PS : about the hindus.. I remember being in Karnataka beaches 20 years ago.. Local women went fully dressed into the water, that was funny to see but ho my god : SO SEXY, have you hever seen a women in a wet Sari ?? here you go :

 

 

Here is more for thoses who like it :

http://wonderwoman.intoday.in/photo/15-hotties-in-sexy-wet-sari/1/758.html

 

 

Yer... You got me... I might have to move to India!

[Linzz]

Forgive me if this has already been covered, but just having a rethink on this. Naturally I don't really give a sh_t what people want to wear, but is the ban because bikini clad women are unlikely to be suicide bombers?

[farcanell]

5 minutes ago, Linzz said:

Forgive me if this has already been covered, but just having a rethink on this. Naturally I don't really give a sh_t what people want to wear, but is the ban because bikini clad women are unlikely to be suicide bombers?

 Lol.... No... That's a new take.

 

the size of the bomb, inside the packaging, vs the size of the packaging around bomb

[thaibeachlovers]

On 21 สิงหาคม 2559 at 6:05 PM, 7by7 said:

 

When everyone involved, including the victim, say that it had noting to do with religion, I believe them.

 

The burkini started out as beachwear for Muslim women who don't want to expose their bodies on the beach; yes. It has been adopted by non Muslims, some because their religious beliefs have similar modesty rules to those of some Muslims, others as an alternative to slathering sunscreen all over themselves.

 

As the terrorists have been condemned worldwide on countless occasions by Muslims of all sects from leaders to ordinary people online and in the streets, then yes; the bombs do have nothing to do with them.

 

It is not just some Muslim women who cover their hair; Orthodox Jewish women cover their hair with a headscarf, Haredi Jewish women once married wear a wig over their real hair; there are other examples of religions which have dress codes as well as well; Sikh men and their turbans for example. Do you consider these to be 'separatist (sic) tools' as well?

Do you consider these to be 'separatist (sic) tools' as well?

I do.

Up to me they'd all be banned in public. We have had enough religious wars and it's about time the human race grew up and just stopped doing it.

[farcanell]

3 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Do you consider these to be 'separatist (sic) tools' as well?

I do.

Up to me they'd all be banned in public. We have had enough religious wars and it's about time the human race grew up and just stopped doing it.

 

Lol... It will never happen

 

im waiting for a rise in popularity with that fruit loop religion that plays with rattlesnakes in the Appalachians or smoky mountain area (?)

 

see how they bring terror to the world... Snakes in letterboxes etc

 

sorry... A little OT.

[Galactus]

 

authorities need to be fair. they need to ban nuns from beaches too. what is the difference?

personally i dont want to see any of them on beaches.

Edited August 22, 2016 by Galactus

[farcanell]

6 minutes ago, Galactus said:

 

authorities need to be fair. they need to ban nuns from beaches too. what is the difference?

personally i dont want to see any of them on beaches.

 

YOU are the man, Galactus!

 

and... 100% right.... 

 

persecute equally, or don't persecute at all!

 

But.... Is it a French beach.... Obviously it looks like one.

[Zendo]

It's may be in Italie, because it comes from an the Imam of Florence, Izzedin Elzir, who post it on Facebook and got his account suspended for a while for this :

 

https://francais.rt.com/international/25299-italie-imam-compte-facebook-bloqué

 

Anyway... In France the Catholics are so rare that it would never happen.. but I am agee it should be ban, this is 21st century now, FREE ALL WOMEN and specially this one (by the way no catholics killed this cartoonist for this famous albums in France)

 

"HA ! All pretexts are good to avoid apply on me some sun cream in the back ..."

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 22, 2016 by Zendo

[farcanell]

Thanks Zendo

 

love the pictures... But too many French words for me to bother translating (Italian iman story)

 

i find your claim about the lack of Catholics ( parading in public) really curious, given the amount of famous church's and abbeys etc, founded throughout the Middle Ages.

 

assumedly these historical landmarks are still there, perhaps minus overt advertising, or rather, I hope so, as I've always wanted to visit Fontevraud abbey, where kings Henry and Richard are interred ... 

 

 

[Zendo]

15 minutes ago, farcanell said:

Thanks Zendo

 

love the pictures... But too many French words for me to bother translating (Italian iman story)

 

i find your claim about the lack of Catholics ( parading in public) really curious, given the amount of famous church's and abbeys etc, founded throughout the Middle Ages.

 

assumedly these historical landmarks are still there, perhaps minus overt advertising, or rather, I hope so, as I've always wanted to visit Fontevraud abbey, where kings Henry and Richard are interred ... 

 

 

 

Most of the churches in France are empty or almost empty and cost millions in Euros to take care of this "patrimoine" I have my idea about reconversion : turn them into discos and night pub, the sound is really great and most have balconies and VIP places !

 

"Cependant dans l'ensemble le taux de pratique religieuse y est relativement faible. Alors que 70 % de la population française est baptisée, le pays compte parmi les moins « religieux » au monde (plusieurs sondages estiment que 40 % des Français se considèrent comme athées, et que la part de Français ne s'identifiant à aucune religion s'établit entre 60 et 70 %)"

 

which means with Google translate :

 

However overall the rate of religious practice is relatively low . While 70 % of the French population is baptized , the country is among the less "religious" in the world ( several surveys estimate that 40 % of the French consider themselves atheists, and the share of French not identifying with any religion s ' lays between 60 and 70 %) .

 

 

Edited August 22, 2016 by Zendo

[farcanell]

I kind of like that stat.... As long as nobody goes all taliban and blows up these historical links to our heritage... I may one day soon, get to see some of these things.

 

australia, being only a couple of hundred years old ( European settlement wise) has very little historical links to the Middle Ages, or earlier.

 

as bad as herr hitler was... Most of these landmarks were left intact during WW2, weren't they?

 

burkini burkini burkini ( just to stay on topic!)

[cumgranosalum]

sums it it up perfectly for me.....

 

" When, as happened in France, an attempt is made to coerce women out of the burqa rather than creating a situation in which a woman can choose what she wishes to do, it’s not about liberating her but about unclothing her.

 It becomes an act of humiliation and cultural imperialism.

 It’s not about the burqa. It’s about coercion. Coercing a woman out of a burqa is a bad as coercing her into one."

  - Arundhati Roy

[Chicog]

And apparently now Nice will sue anyone who posts photos of police harrassing muslim women on beaches:

Here you go my froggy chums, fill your boots.

 

[Galactus]

10 minutes ago, Chicog said:

And apparently now Nice will sue anyone who posts photos of police harrassing muslim women on beaches:

Here you go my froggy chums, fill your boots.

 

 

which is worse?  police or the idiots behind just looking but not saying any word or giving any reaction?

best protest for this nonsense should be is coming to beach with closed christian Nun clothing by hundreds and force to police to react.

 

[Zendo]

so much noise for almost nothing

Dd you see the scene by yourself.. who knows the real story ? and what's the problem with this women taking out this clothe ? She seems to be annoyed ? tell me more about her and the situation, because you where there Galactus and Chicog, right ?
 How Maybe you just read comments on the newspapers and look at these 2 pictures only ?? maybe you don't have the whole picture then, contact her and talk to her.. she might explain what happened clearly instead of thinking too quickly.

 

And about Christians nuns clothing... it's forbidden to wear it in France for people who are not nuns, I mean Professionnal student or teacher of Official Church, it's a costume for only few ones.. not for  normal citizens (christans or not).. so calm dawn and eat a nice couscous with good friends.. it will make you calm down, don't forget to avoid Harrisa !

[ilostmypassword]

On 8/22/2016 at 10:55 PM, farcanell said:

I kind of like that stat.... As long as nobody goes all taliban and blows up these historical links to our heritage... I may one day soon, get to see some of these things.

 

australia, being only a couple of hundred years old ( European settlement wise) has very little historical links to the Middle Ages, or earlier.

 

as bad as herr hitler was... Most of these landmarks were left intact during WW2, weren't they?

 

burkini burkini burkini ( just to stay on topic!)

Actually, Hitler wanted to destroy Paris but was circumvented by his own generals.

[Linzz]

Undressing nuns on the beach would face an outrage. Undressing anyone against their wishes by the heavy hand of the law is equivalent to a police state no different to some Muslim countries enforcing by their police the covering up of foreigners by the same means. This is attitude adjustment by the fashion police. 

 

The only caveat should be if clothing could harbor munitions. The  bulk of that under a burkini is not possible yet. Not sure of future technology allowing better concealment though so it can only get worse.  Our phones are now flat  and thin so who knows where it's going? Unless there is a threat to personal safety  there should be no call for this heavy handedness because it's just a statement that some disagree with how others look with police backup, specifically looking Muslim. But alarm bells don't go off in my head when I see a woman in a hijab or headscarf, as someone else said they can look really attractive as the women in Iran mostly wear. My mother used to wear a headscarf to the beach and she's a European Christian. 

Burkas and face coverings are a different proposition and are  not in the least bit attractive because they are not meant to be , but again unless for identification purposes there can be no danger in it. Up to them but I would offer them a vitamin D pill.

Perhaps separate beaches for burkinis and bikinis is the answer. I wonder which beach Muslim men will choose to sit though...

[Galactus]

35 minutes ago, Zendo said:

so much noise for almost nothing

Dd you see the scene by yourself.. who knows the real story ? and what's the problem with this women taking out this clothe ? She seems to be annoyed ? tell me more about her and the situation, because you where there Galactus and Chicog, right ?
 How Maybe you just read comments on the newspapers and look at these 2 pictures only ?? maybe you don't have the whole picture then, contact her and talk to her.. she might explain what happened clearly instead of thinking too quickly.

 

And about Christians nuns clothing... it's forbidden to wear it in France for people who are not nuns, I mean Professionnal student or teacher of Official Church, it's a costume for only few ones.. not for  normal citizens (christans or not).. so calm dawn and eat a nice couscous with good friends.. it will make you calm down, don't forget to avoid Harrisa !

 

real story? it is the burka ban and it is effective now and photo looks like a part of it and now, you cannot even take photos of police fining people for such offences.

it looks like it is you needing a lot of couscous:) i dont know what is Harrisa but again, it sounds like a muslim food. so do you accuse me as a muslim? you know i feel offended and disrespected if you do so but what ever it is, it sounds so poor and discriminating, like the burqa ban.

 

and which one has a higher fine? wearing burka on the beach or wearing Nun clothes although you are not a Nun?

what are you supporting? ladies with burqa cannot use beaches bc they are muslim but Christian nuns are OK to come with closed clothes?

Edited August 25, 2016 by Galactus

[Linzz]

54 minutes ago, Zendo said:

so much noise for almost nothing

Dd you see the scene by yourself.. who knows the real story ? and what's the problem with this women taking out this clothe ? She seems to be annoyed ? tell me more about her and the situation, because you where there Galactus and Chicog, right ?
 How Maybe you just read comments on the newspapers and look at these 2 pictures only ?? maybe you don't have the whole picture then, contact her and talk to her.. she might explain what happened clearly instead of thinking too quickly.

 

And about Christians nuns clothing... it's forbidden to wear it in France for people who are not nuns, I mean Professionnal student or teacher of Official Church, it's a costume for only few ones.. not for  normal citizens (christans or not).. so calm dawn and eat a nice couscous with good friends.. it will make you calm down, don't forget to avoid Harrisa !

 

"Dd you see the scene by yourself.. who knows the real story ? and what's the problem with this women taking out this clothe ? She seems to be annoyed ? tell me more about her and the situation, because you where there Galactus and Chicog, right ?"

 

Yeah thats right, it could be the fashion police are telling her to put her clothes back on. How dare a Muslim undress and try to look liberal. Inappropriate though, the police should be in speedos
 

[Zendo]

43 minutes ago, Galactus said:

 

real story? it is the burka ban and it is effective now and photo looks like a part of it and now, you cannot even take photos of police fining people for such offences.

it looks like it is you needing a lot of couscous:) i dont know what is Harrisa but again, it sounds like a muslim food. so do you accuse me as a muslim? you know i feel offended and disrespected if you do so but what ever it is, it sounds so poor and discriminating, like the burqa ban.

 

and which one has a higher fine? wearing burka on the beach or wearing Nun clothes although you are not a Nun?

what are you supporting? ladies with burqa cannot use beaches bc they are muslim but Christian nuns are OK to come with closed clothes?

 

 

First of all, you didn't answer to the question: do you know what happens for real ? where you there ?

 

Secondly, you feel offended ?! ho poor thing... let's get over it like a man , and let me explain you one thing :

the moment you loose you humour, you're brain dead, Personnaly I love couscous like all French people, it's on the top 3 favorites dishes in France, and it has nothing to do with religion, it's a north african dish.. and Harrisa, well google it : it's nam prick for north african : Delicious and really spicy !

 

I grow up with many africans people.. there has never be any problem and I have good friends for life (who never show any religious feeling in public).

Just recently young generation wants to go back to dark ages.. why like this ?? Muslims brothers at work?? but you know that already because you have real wisdom of what is happening in France and all the money involved in the process and building mosquees, let imams teaching without even knowing French language.. manipulating poor spirited people. French politics got much wealth with this practices so yes it's French people fault to what is happening, but things are changing because too much is too much and blood as been too much poored in the "land of freedom". There is a anti-islamophobic association in France who is really famous those days, there are many proofs that they are friends of salafists and banned people from France for Terrorism. Sometimes things are more complicated than what you see.. like an iceberg.. well you know the image !

 

Also, you can compare only Imams (muslims priest) going fully costumed on the beach with theses nuns (it doest not happen in France anyway, nuns stays in their church, that's their dutty, this picture is from Italy).. and by the way there is no female preachers in Islam... such a shame, maybe female are less than nothing in their eyes..

 

And once for all, if you know that a beach as STRICT rules, why bother going there.. like I told you 99.98% of beaches are COSTUMES FREE in France, only 20 mayors ban the religious costumes on the beach, if a nun is coming she will have trouble too but that is not happening, we have been fighting against obscurantism for years and catholics are not showing off in France otherwise they would have big problems with citizens !

 

Last thing : I am in Favor of intelligence, and Islam is not a thing I can like.. but hey who bother to read the religious books, just read newspapers is more than enough today !

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Zendo]

45 minutes ago, Linzz said:

 

"Dd you see the scene by yourself.. who knows the real story ? and what's the problem with this women taking out this clothe ? She seems to be annoyed ? tell me more about her and the situation, because you where there Galactus and Chicog, right ?"

 

Yeah thats right, it could be the fashion police are telling her to put her clothes back on. How dare a Muslim undress and try to look liberal. Inappropriate though, the police should be in speedos
 

 

Of course.. who knows..?! lol

Truth as always two sides, let the TAO makes its way through and wait to have more informations about this.. but like I told you : you see a sign : NO DOG, you come with your DOG.. police is coming, what will you do ? take pictures to send it to animal protection association ?

Next time you'll  go to a wild beach and you'll have much fun with your dogs running around and smelling eachother buttocks !

 

Let me laugh again while smoking a shisha  on one of these wild beaches !

[Jingthing]

I think anything goes on the beach, including wearing nothing.

 

However, clearly, not all agree:

 

Quote

In Wake of Burkini Ban, Muslim Women Demand Criminalization of Fat White Men in Speedos
CANNES – A French-Muslim group has called for a ban on what it terms “woefully-endowed white walruses terrorizing our kids in public,” alongside the repeal of a string of municipal measures outlawing the burkini in southern France.

http://www.themideastbeast.com/wake-burkini-ban-muslim-women-demand-criminalization-fat-white-guys-speedos/

[Opl]

 do you like burkinis? , you'll love face-kinis !

http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/facekini-china-terrifying-swimwear-trend-hit-beach-gallery-1.1910561

Edited August 25, 2016 by Opl

[Opl]

Just now, Opl said:

 

 

Edited August 25, 2016 by Opl

[Opl]

double post sorry

[ChidlomDweller]

On August 17, 2016 at 9:35 AM, Zendo said:

Burkini has nothing to do with islam, it's all about provocation now, pushed by extemists groups !

 

It will end up badly, soon we'll see people wearing these old fashioned costumes on the supermaket, street and beaches in France.. like old time !

 

 

 

Would love to see the reaction if someone walked around Molenbeek in this garb.  "But it's only a piece textile!!!"  People who say it's only about clothing, devoid of any political meaning, are totally missing the point.

Edited August 25, 2016 by ChidlomDweller

[cumgranosalum]

Spot the "illegal" one!

 

 

[Opl]

 man AND woman

 

 

 

Edited August 26, 2016 by Opl