Fines and traffic stops cause Chinese to avoid CM

[Nick ZepTepi]

Can an IDP be used for a motorcycle? I don't have a motorcycle license at home.

It's just a international version of what you're qualified for back home.
So of you've only got a car and no bike licence the IDP will reflect that.


Sent from my mobile, please forgive the autocorrect.

[fredge45]

Was stopped at one of these blocks one time... donut muncher walked up, looked things over, stepped back and thanked me for following the Thai laws!  Never, ever had a positive approach and send off by a muncher any where else in the world!

 

"merican muchers would rather shoot you than treat you like a person...

[Si Thea01]

On ‎25‎/‎08‎/‎2016 at 8:53 AM, dcnx said:

Just as a heads up, recently I've been refused and ticketed when I showed a paper copy AND a photo in my phone of my IDP. This is new, they aways accepted it in the past.

 

The original is at home, barely held together after falling into a puddle of water. The last traffic policeman to touch it tore the already fragile page with my photo on it, now I don't take it out.

 

Now, I just avoid the known stop areas, not worth the hassle. They can chase bikers all afternoon and it doesn't do anything to help matters or road safety.

 

 

 

Given what you have said, is it wrong to assume you live here permanently.  If so, why haven't you obtained a Thai drivers' license.  It's not that hard to obtain and would save all the trouble you seem to be experiencing.

[landslide]

40 minutes ago, fredge45 said:

Was stopped at one of these blocks one time... donut muncher walked up, looked things over, stepped back and thanked me for following the Thai laws!  Never, ever had a positive approach and send off by a muncher any where else in the world!

 

"merican muchers would rather shoot you than treat you like a person...

I'm American, and at 62 years old, have been stopped numerous times in my life.  I've never had an impolite officer.  More times than not been let go with a warning and no ticket.  Never have they ever pulled a gun on me.  Maybe if you would be polite and respond to their requests, you would not have that problem.

[NoshowJones]

On 8/24/2016 at 11:37 PM, FolkGuitar said:

I go past the traffic road block on the north-west side of the moat almost every day. I get stopped almost every day, then waved on when I show my license. I see as many Thais getting pulled over as foreign visitors. I see bikes being confiscated from Thais who don't have the proper papers. But I also see foreign tourists who are in violation of Thai law by not having a either a valid driver's license and/or a valid IDP. They are stupid. It's very easy NOT to get a traffic fine. I manage to avoid it just about every day. 

 

When I plan to visit a foreign country, and know that I'm going to be driving there, I spend a good 5 minutes on the Internet learning about the requirements for driving in that country for a foreigner. If it says that I need to have an IDP, I make sure I have a valid IDP. I do NOT cancel my trip. If it says I need to have some sort of very special 'something,' and I don't have it, I simply don't drive in that country. I do NOT cancel my trip because of it.  I hire a taxi.  A little common sense goes a long way.

 

I offer as a counter-suggestion that the reason the Chinese tourists may be canceling their trips just might have something to do with all the bombs going off in Thailand. They don't know that they are 800k away from them here in Chiang Mai. And I'm not going to tell them...

 

Edited August 26, 2016 by possum1931
I was writing a reply and the whole thing just disappeared, just forget it.

[NoshowJones]

2 hours ago, Throatwobbler said:

Good to get those stupid foreigners of the roads as we know that it is their fault that Thailand has the second worst death rate in the world. Give the roads back to the safe Thai drivers.

.

[csabo]

I wouldn't want this guy in my neighborhood either

 

[elgordo38]

On 8/25/2016 at 0:37 AM, heybruce said:

I've been stopped three times this year, always on a road parallel to the moat.  Not many stops, but much more than years past.  Each time they checked for helmet, drivers license and the sticker on my bike, then waved me on.  They were stopping everybody on motorbikes and a lot of people were being fined for one or more violations. 

 

If you're biking sober with a helmet and current license and registration then the stops are just brief inconveniences.  If the Chinese, or anyone else, think it is unreasonable they be required to drive legally, they are free to move on to less restrictive places.  They won't be missed.

Bite your tongue the TAT lady is listening. Sees all hears all knows well you know starts with an N_____g

Edited August 26, 2016 by elgordo38

[JaseTheBass]

I guess China hasn't got around to signing the UN Convention on Road Traffic which is why they are breaking the law using a Chinese driving licence (unless there is an agreement directly with China in place).

 

Tourists from the UK, US, Aus & NZ under Thai law don't need an IDP, but that doesn't stop the local mafia extorting money whenever possible.

[masuk]

2 hours ago, elgenon said:

Can an IDP be used for a motorcycle? I don't have a motorcycle license at home.

so if you don't have a motor cycle licence, then you're not insured by your home travel insurance company.

 

that's the way it works for most countries.

[louse1953]

On 8/25/2016 at 8:53 AM, dcnx said:

Just as a heads up, recently I've been refused and ticketed when I showed a paper copy AND a photo in my phone of my IDP. This is new, they aways accepted it in the past.

 

The original is at home, barely held together after falling into a puddle of water. The last traffic policeman to touch it tore the already fragile page with my photo on it, now I don't take it out.

 

Now, I just avoid the known stop areas, not worth the hassle. They can chase bikers all afternoon and it doesn't do anything to help matters or road safety.

 

 

You can't use a IDP for ever you know,they have a use by date.

[louse1953]

3 hours ago, elgenon said:

Can an IDP be used for a motorcycle? I don't have a motorcycle license at home.

No.

[thaibeachlovers]

6 hours ago, cmsally said:

Some friends of mine were stopped on a motorbike going to Mae Rim 3 times on one stretch of road. It wasn't the fact of being stopped that pissed them off it was the fact it was only tourists. I must admit I thought they were exagerrating but hey presto the next day saw a police check point about 100 m south of Tapae Gate and stood and watched about 10 mins. They were only stopping Chinese and foreigners! Helmetless and 3 on a bike Thais were sailing past. It made them feel targetted and the fact it was about 3 days after the referendum made them feel paranoid. These are people that have  visited Thailand many times before.

They don't care if someone wants to check paperwork etc. but they don't want to feel like as tourists they are being singled out.

Same in Pattaya on Beach Rd.

[FolkGuitar]

2 hours ago, JaseTheBass said:

Tourists from the UK, US, Aus & NZ under Thai law don't need an IDP, but that doesn't stop the local mafia extorting money whenever possible.

 

With all due respect, this that is incorrect.

 

United Kingdom

http://www.theaa.com/getaway/idp/

Recognised internationally, an International Driving Permit (IDP) normally allows the holder to drive a private motor vehicle when accompanied by a valid UK driving license.

 

U.S.A.

http://www.dmv.org/international-driver-permits.php

The following requirements and restrictions apply:

• You must carry both your IDP and your driver’s license when driving abroad.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Driving_Permit

An International Driving Permit (IDP) is an identity document that allows the holder to drive a private motor vehicle in any country that recognizes IDPs. To be valid, the IDP must be accompanied by a valid driving license.

 

Australia

http://www.aaa.asn.au/international-services/international-driving-permit/

An IDP is proof that you hold a valid drivers licence in your home country at the date of issue of the IDP and should be carried with your domestic drivers license; 

 

 

[manarak]

9 minutes ago, FolkGuitar said:

 

With all due respect, this that is incorrect.

 

United Kingdom

http://www.theaa.com/getaway/idp/

Recognised internationally, an International Driving Permit (IDP) normally allows the holder to drive a private motor vehicle when accompanied by a valid UK driving license.

 

U.S.A.

http://www.dmv.org/international-driver-permits.php

The following requirements and restrictions apply:

• You must carry both your IDP and your driver’s license when driving abroad.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Driving_Permit

An International Driving Permit (IDP) is an identity document that allows the holder to drive a private motor vehicle in any country that recognizes IDPs. To be valid, the IDP must be accompanied by a valid driving license.

 

Australia

http://www.aaa.asn.au/international-services/international-driving-permit/

An IDP is proof that you hold a valid drivers licence in your home country at the date of issue of the IDP and should be carried with your domestic drivers license; 

 

 

yes...

but there definitely have been police orders given to traffic cops to also also accept foreign driver licenses from tourists if said licences were written in English and complying with international standards regarding the vehicle classes (B, A, etc.).

But I don't know if that police order is still valid.

[bazza40]

East of the Ping River e.g. Nong Hoi I very rarely see any police.It's even more rarely I see police stopping motorists or motorbike riders after 12 noon.

Have been stopped a couple of times on Thapae Road. As I have both Thai scooter and car licences, no problem.

The Chinese are a conundrum to me. As individuals, I've found them to be  polite and considerate. In a group, their psychology seems to change dramatically.

[FolkGuitar]

7 minutes ago, manarak said:

 

yes...

but there definitely have been police orders given to traffic cops to also also accept foreign driver licenses from tourists if said licences were written in English and complying with international standards regarding the vehicle classes (B, A, etc.).

But I don't know if that police order is still valid.

 

Hmmm... Thanks! Can you please post a citation for this order? I've 'heard' it said often by farang who've been stopped and ticketed for not having it, but I've never seen it on any 'official' pages, either consular, police information for foreigners, or at the Motor Vehicle office. It would be good to have some valid info for a change.

[manarak]

1 minute ago, FolkGuitar said:

 

Hmmm... Thanks! Can you please post a citation for this order? I've 'heard' it said often by farang who've been stopped and ticketed for not having it, but I've never seen it on any 'official' pages, either consular, police information for foreigners, or at the Motor Vehicle office. It would be good to have some valid info for a change.

 

info here:

https://www.angloinfo.com/thailand/how-to/thailand-transport-driving-licences

 

[FolkGuitar]

56 minutes ago, manarak said:

 

info here:

https://www.angloinfo.com/thailand/how-to/thailand-transport-driving-licences

 

 

Thanks for that. Very interesting site. It looks to be a good resource for someone coming to Thailand. But as it's the only one I've seen that deals with this particular issue, I wonder (not necessarily 'doubt,' but wonder) about it's authenticity. I don't see any citations that it is quoting.  If every country's IDP website states that the two documents must be used together, and only this one says otherwise, it might be wise not to push the fates... It's easy enough to get the IDP, and that solves all issues about licensing. Thanks again for the link.

[Rod Gold]

Awww, don't the Chinese understand this is Thai culture?  What's the problem here?

[landslide]

7 hours ago, manarak said:

 

yes...

but there definitely have been police orders given to traffic cops to also also accept foreign driver licenses from tourists if said licences were written in English and complying with international standards regarding the vehicle classes (B, A, etc.).

But I don't know if that police order is still valid.

I've never been asked for my IDP when renting cars in Thailand, nor have I been asked for the IDP when stopped at a road block.  I am pretty sure, however, that if I was to have an accident in Thailand, and did not have a valid IDP, I would end up having trouble with my insurance.  An IDP is $15 in the USA.  To me, it is cheap insurance for some peace of mind.

[FolkGuitar]

18 minutes ago, landslide said:

I've never been asked for my IDP when renting cars in Thailand, nor have I been asked for the IDP when stopped at a road block.  I am pretty sure, however, that if I was to have an accident in Thailand, and did not have a valid IDP, I would end up having trouble with my insurance.  An IDP is $15 in the USA.  To me, it is cheap insurance for some peace of mind.

 

Small correction; as of June 1st, the cost of the IDP increased to $20 in the US.  If nothing else, it's worth it to have another legal picture ID when traveling that is recognized by so many countries.

[chickenrunCM]

It is not about to pay a fine for not having a Driver license, it is about that shop rent out bikes and cars without checking the license, in Europe you can´t rent anything without showing your driver license.

It´the same like a pot dealer sells you a joint and after you smoke it, he calls the police to check you with a test.

The police checks it not about safety, because everybody can drive further on, it´s only about making money. 

confiscate all bikes and demolish them, if the driver not have a license, and the problem will be solved within few days, and finally most of the rental shops in the town will be closed.

first it was helmet, now driver licenses, after this the police will find another ways for fines, not carry passports or similar things, this fines are calculated in the budget of the police.

BTW if you live in Thailand longer than 3 month anyway you must have a Thai driver license, an IDL is not valid then anymore

Edited August 26, 2016 by chickenrunCM

[streetsweeper]

Unfortunately, Thailand is only able to attract a certain class of mainland Chinese tourists and with that class comes certain behaviours and idiosyncracies.

The vast majority of them are certainly not established middle or upper class.

Thankfully the better ones come to North America and behave as if the fear of God has been put in them.

Thailand reaps what it sows.

[Dante99]

32 minutes ago, streetsweeper said:

Unfortunately, Thailand is only able to attract a certain class of mainland Chinese tourists and with that class comes certain behaviours and idiosyncracies.

The vast majority of them are certainly not established middle or upper class.

Thankfully the better ones come to North America and behave as if the fear of God has been put in them.

Thailand reaps what it sows.

Four Seasons is 70+% Chinese guests and the other 5 stars probably are close to that.   Are these the ones you refer to?

[daveAustin]

On 8/25/2016 at 8:53 AM, dcnx said:

Just as a heads up, recently I've been refused and ticketed when I showed a paper copy AND a photo in my phone of my IDP. This is new, they aways accepted it in the past.

 

The original is at home, barely held together after falling into a puddle of water. The last traffic policeman to touch it tore the already fragile page with my photo on it, now I don't take it out.

 

Now, I just avoid the known stop areas, not worth the hassle. They can chase bikers all afternoon and it doesn't do anything to help matters or road safety.

 

I don't understand. Just get a license.

[Paul Catton]

20 hours ago, FolkGuitar said:

 

With all due respect, this that is incorrect.

 

United Kingdom

http://www.theaa.com/getaway/idp/

Recognised internationally, an International Driving Permit (IDP) normally allows the holder to drive a private motor vehicle when accompanied by a valid UK driving license.

 

U.S.A.

http://www.dmv.org/international-driver-permits.php

The following requirements and restrictions apply:

• You must carry both your IDP and your driver’s license when driving abroad.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Driving_Permit

An International Driving Permit (IDP) is an identity document that allows the holder to drive a private motor vehicle in any country that recognizes IDPs. To be valid, the IDP must be accompanied by a valid driving license.

 

Australia

http://www.aaa.asn.au/international-services/international-driving-permit/

An IDP is proof that you hold a valid drivers licence in your home country at the date of issue of the IDP and should be carried with your domestic drivers license; 

 

 

Your links were based on information sections of IDP which would correctly note that both IDP and a home country driving licences are to be held in accompaniment.

 

An IDP needs to be backed up with a driving licence as it is not a licence in its own right.

However the reverse is not mandatory for all home country driving licences.

 

Thailand being a signatory of the 1949 Geneva & 1968 Vienna Road Traffic Conventions committed to a mutual acceptance of driving licences between all signatories.

In reality the majority of developed nations signed these accords so I have never found a need to obtain an IDP for independent self travel overseas.

IDP originating from NZ is issued by a private company, the AA (Automobile Association).

It would be disconcerting if the RTP from own misinformation were trying to extort financial penalty from tourists legally travelling.

Thailand, no couldn't happen?

[FolkGuitar]

5 hours ago, Paul Catton said:

Your links were based on information sections of IDP which would correctly note that both IDP and a home country driving licences are to be held in accompaniment.

 

An IDP needs to be backed up with a driving licence as it is not a licence in its own right.

However the reverse is not mandatory for all home country driving licences.

 

 

Thanks! That's great to hear. But can you provide a link from a valid governmental source for this?

Otherwise, it's yet again just 'hear-say.'

[CMKiwi]

I was chatting with a friend about these checkpoints yesterday. And although this subject has been beaten to death on TV over the years nothing really has come of it.

 

One train of thought is that those who break the law cannot complain when they are caught, and in essence I agree with that.  Some also believe that its only a small annoyance when they as law abiding citizens/long term visitors get stopped as same checkpoints.  To some that is true but to others its still an embuggerance.

 

As visitors to this country we are not going to change the way the RTP do or go about their business.

 

But in my discussion yesterday a good point was raised. What if any do these checkpoints produce in regards to improving road safety?  In relation to the tourists that get stopped and then instantly fined for not having correct licence.... I dont believe it improves road safety one iota.

 

After the perpetrator has paid the fine (In most cases, one the spot or in situ) The RTP simply wave them on.  So all that really occurs is that the RTP coffers grow, and unlicenced riders remain riding on the roads (Albeit with slightly less funds in their back pocket).  

 

I could understand stopping riders without helmets and ensuring they dont continue till they have a properly approved helmet...although I understand some countries or states within countries,  helmet laws are voluntary.  However enforcing helmet laws here would go a little way to saving some lives. (Part of road safety)

 

The standard of road test here is a bit of a farce compared to what is required in other countries. IMHO I dont really think it makes a great deal of difference to they way a lot of Thais drive if they do or dont have a licence.  Some may argue that a driver / rider without a licence may do so with a bit more care as they dont want to get in trouble with the law should they be involved in an accident.  But maybe thats just a perception.

 

If the roads are to become safer to other/all road users then I believe the RTP needs a huge overhaul. Starting with driver education and a revamped licence system and moving right through to enforcing road rules..... it appears that alot of motor vehicle users break the rules/laws cause the believe no-one is their to either stop them or subsequent fines are a joke.

 

Ok....Im starting to rant so Ill stop here.  I cant change they way the current system operates and dont see it moving forward anytime soon.  Luckily I havent had an accident in CM in the 4 years Ive been here, although I have seen a few and avoided many.  

 

I noticed today they the area where the BiB setup near Lanna Golf course is having some earthworks done.  Perhaps they are erecting a permanent checkpoint there?  Its surely a nice little earner for them!

 

 

[stacks]

On 8/26/2016 at 9:21 AM, masuk said:

I wish the police would do a late shift and catch the hoons who scream up and down Huay Kaew Rd around midnight.

 

The bikes have modified mufflers, and are extremely noisy.

 

That is my absolute favorite stretch of road in the city to drive like an a-hole on.

Edited August 29, 2016 by stacks