Approval system for condo upgrade

[Delight]

There is a move to  (in the condo where I live ) to change the electricity charging system . Currently the building  charges for all power. The proposed change will mean direct billing to each room by PEA

 My Q relates to the approval type.

 

How must this change be approved?

 

Also I seek info on the  likely cost to each co -owner by PEA  to facilitate this upgrade (i.e cost per new meter per room)?

 

Has any subscriber to this blog had experience of a similar change?

 

Thanks in advance

 

[KittenKong]

It sounds to me as though any such change would need to be approved by a suitable majority at an AGM/EGM as it affects all co-owners.

 

I suppose that your building is currently paying and charging the commercial rate and if individual meters are installed then each co-owner will only pay the domestic rate. So any costs would be rapidly covered by that saving. But dont you already have individual meters for the internal billing? If so maybe they are suitable for PEA use.

 

I think that meters cost under 500B in HomePro but I dont know if the are the same as the PEA ones or if they are acceptable to them.  As far as I know each meter requires a guarantee deposit also, though in my building this is held on a group basis in the building's bank account.

 

If you already have individual meters then wiring in new ones (if needed) should be a quick job and so presumably inexpensive.

[Delight]

 Thanks for your reply

 

If the building were to use PEA meters then they would have to be purchased. Suspect that the existing meters would be unacceptable to PEA

 

Now we have one  supply in via the main meter.

 

Clearly we would need 2 incoming supplies. One for the existing meter (to cover common area) and  a separate feed to the new meters. That sounds like a big job.

 

Hopefully you are correct that a simple majority at general meeting would be acceptable

 

If ,however a 50 % vote is required -then that will never happen

 

Thanks for your interest.

 

 

 

 

[zappalot]

2 hours ago, Delight said:

 

If ,however a 50 % vote is required -then that will never happen

 

 

I wouldn't hold my breath. The managements of condominium buildings often don't know anything about what they are allowed to do and what not. They often do whatever they want and don't care about the condominium act, the law underlying all actions and decisions made by the management and what should in general going on in the building.

Maybe it's often not even that they don't care, it's often that they don't know. And they don't want to know.

You can show them the law and all in return you would get is a smile saying "And what you want to do now?"

 

Search yourself the condominium act of Thailand. Very helpful.

[KittenKong]

5 hours ago, Delight said:

 If the building were to use PEA meters then they would have to be purchased. Suspect that the existing meters would be unacceptable to PEA

Now we have one  supply in via the main meter.

Clearly we would need 2 incoming supplies. One for the existing meter (to cover common area) and  a separate feed to the new meters. That sounds like a big job.

 

If you look in the Electrical sub-forum just below this one you will see some current discussion about official meter costs. I suspect that the topic will have been covered many times before in there also.

 

I haven't seen your installation but normally dividing your supply should not be a very hard job. They would split the supply before your existing meter and route it directly from there to the existing co-owner meters which they would replace with ones that suit the PEA. If your building is anything like mine then all the meters for each floor would be in a technical room for that floor, which makes it very easy to supply them independently from the common area circuits. But maybe in your building each meter is situated near each room?

 

Assuming that all electricity is currently being billed at the commercial rate (is it?) then I would have thought that co-owner support for installing individual PEA meters would be unanimous, regardless of cost. The savings made from paying the lower domestic rate should pay for the work in very little time. In my building even absentee Thai owners would get off their a*ses for that. And of course at worst they only actually need to send a proxy vote, so some careful advance explanations should get them motivated. But I do think that it would pass with a simple majority of those present at a second AGM meeting.

[blackcab]

There is one consideration. The chances are that at the minute there is profit being made from the resale of electricity.

 

If the building is not generating profit from this enterprise then there is a chance common fees (ie Special Assessments) will have to increase to cover the shortfall.

[Delight]

 Thanks for making the point

 

In our case the mark up contributes 1.5 Baht /meter/month to common power needs.

 

The current fees total can easily absorb this potential loss of income.

[jippytum]

The proposal needs to be approved at the condo AGM .It is beneficial to have a government  meter . The cost to change is 3000 baht and 2000 baht is a refundable deposit . The condo manager will arrange the transfer to owners name included in the 3000 baht

[KittenKong]

9 hours ago, blackcab said:

There is one consideration. The chances are that at the minute there is profit being made from the resale of electricity.

 

If the building is not generating profit from this enterprise then there is a chance common fees (ie Special Assessments) will have to increase to cover the shortfall.

 

That is certainly a possibility. Though any profit currently being made by the building is unlikely to be as large as the potential saving made from switching from the commercial tariff to the domestic one.

[AsianExport]

Please report when it is approved.

 

 

[Delight]

9 hours ago, jippytum said:

The proposal needs to be approved at the condo AGM .It is beneficial to have a government  meter . The cost to change is 3000 baht and 2000 baht is a refundable deposit . The condo manager will arrange the transfer to owners name included in the 3000 baht

 

Does the 3000  Baht include the modifications to the building wiring?

[jippytum]

There should be no modifications to the building wiring required to change a meter. However the electricity board will not fit new meters if the wiring is substandard .If so that is the responsibility of the condo to correct.

[Delight]

On 9/22/2016 at 10:34 AM, jippytum said:

There should be no modifications to the building wiring required to change a meter. However the electricity board will not fit new meters if the wiring is substandard .If so that is the responsibility of the condo to correct.

 

Perhaps you could expand on your statement"There should be no modifications to the building wiring required to change a meter

 

Currently the condo buys electricity from PEA. It then re-sells electricity to each apartment.

 

My view is that the final  arrangement will mean 2 Electricity  inputs to the building-such that the apartments and the common area will each require its own separate  feed. Hence some modification to wiring.

 

Do you disagree with this ? . If so please explain.

 

I accept what you state about the wiring quality. PEA are currently carrying out a technical survey of the building.

 

[wpcoe]

Why not keep a single feed and just put a meter on the common area as just another meter on that line?

Edited September 24, 2016 by wpcoe

[jippytum]

On 9/23/2016 at 4:10 PM, Delight said:

 

Perhaps you could expand on your statement"There should be no modifications to the building wiring required to change a meter

 

Currently the condo buys electricity from PEA. It then re-sells electricity to each apartment.

 

My view is that the final  arrangement will mean 2 Electricity  inputs to the building-such that the apartments and the common area will each require its own separate  feed. Hence some modification to wiring.

 

Do you disagree with this ? . If so please explain.

 

I accept what you state about the wiring quality. PEA are currently carrying out a technical survey of the building.

 

At the moment each unit has a separate privately owned meter  .When the meter is read by the condo staff the appropriate charge plus any surcharge is then paid by the owner to the condo office .

The electricity used by the common area is already on a separate feed and not included in individual unit usage per month.

The electricity for  the common area is calculated on a sq meter basis for each unit and paid from the maintenance fund not from individual usage for each unit.

We  recently changed all meters to the government scheme by request and the cost was 3000 baht per unit . Now each unit is charged at cost given an individual bill that can if required be paid at the 7/11 or by direct debit.

[Delight]

10 hours ago, jippytum said:

At the moment each unit has a separate privately owned meter  .When the meter is read by the condo staff the appropriate charge plus any surcharge is then paid by the owner to the condo office .

The electricity used by the common area is already on a separate feed and not included in individual unit usage per month.

The electricity for  the common area is calculated on a sq meter basis for each unit and paid from the maintenance fund not from individual usage for each unit.

We  recently changed all meters to the government scheme by request and the cost was 3000 baht per unit . Now each unit is charged at cost given an individual bill that can if required be paid at the 7/11 or by direct debit.

 

jippytum

  Consider a condo with 1 floor and just 3 rooms (see Sketch)

I do not see how you can get from A  to B without some modification to the wiring

 

Then think about  24 floors.

 

Please tell me that  I am wrong and your earlier statement-i.e. no wiring modification- required- is valid. Feel free to modify my sketch.

[KittenKong]

If all your individual meters are connected directly to common area supply cables then there will indeed be some work to be done, as your second diagram indicates. Exactly how much will depend on your building layout, but if the individual meters are positioned at each unit then it will be quite extensive (at least one cable would have to run along each floor to supply all those meters). If the individual meters for each floor are already situated in some technical area on that floor then the work required will be less.

 

[jippytum]

At our condo   each unit and the common area had  separate private meters   from the main PEA feed .This allowed for the calculation of units used by each unit and the common area. The electricity board changed each unit meter upon request for a charge of 3000 baht .Over a two year period  100% of the owners have changed .There was no change in the wiring and no charge from the PEA  other than to supply and connect the meters which are all in one location .Our building is eight years old

Edited September 30, 2016 by jippytum
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