Analysis: Trump 'rigged' vote claim may leave lasting damage

[ilostmypassword]

6 hours ago, Skywalker69 said:

Pimay1 asked for a link to the photo that I posted and that is what I posted. I understand that you must be a Fox News guy, right?

Probably not. Fox has fallen out of favor with Republicans. It's gone from being one of the top 10 most trusted brands by Republicans to dropping out of the top 50 altogether. It just wasn't enough in the tank for Trump.

[AYJAYDEE]

1 hour ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

 

It is pretty darn close.

 

no it's not

[Ahab]

5 minutes ago, AYJAYDEE said:

no it's not

This has devolved into the lines from a PeeWee Herman movie....

 

If it is not, then please inform us what exactly you think is not correct. You "feel" it is not, but it is likely you cannot express with words exactly what is wrong without sounding as if you have no idea what you are talking about.  The Russians (allegedly) are supporting Trump by releasing true emails from the Clinton campaign expressing how they actually feel about various subjects.   The Russians are bad for hacking into the Clinton campaign servers (another very important reason to have absolutely top notch computer security), got it. The Clinton campaign is bad for being corrupt (pay to play while Secretary of State), and deceitful (for having one policy for the public and a totally different policy for action). In most circles corruption and lying is viewed negatively, but if you are a Democrat these are badges of honor and are good enough for about 45% of all Americans for them to vote for Hillary.

[Dtrump]

30 minutes ago, AYJAYDEE said:

no it's not

The national vice president of the AFL-CIO wrote an article for Salon in which she explained how the Democratic Party primary was “rigged from the start.”

 NYU Professor Mark Crispin Miller

This New York University professor has taught several courses and authored several books claiming that George W. Bush’s presidential victories in 2000 and again in 2004 were the result of large-scale fraud.

“[Kerry] told me he now thinks the election was stolen,” Miller said. “He says he doesn’t believe he is the person that can be out in front because of the sour grapes question. But he said he believes it was sto

“Fooled Again: How the Right Stole the 2004 Election & Why They’ll Steal the Next One Too

 

A new Rasmussen poll finds that 68 percent of Americans think elections are rigged in favor of incumbents

poll taxes, “literacy tests,” and other methods were often employed to disenfranchise black people,

 

http://thefederalist.com/2016/10/19/8-times-liberals-claimed-election-stolen-r

[CaptHaddock]

On 10/18/2016 at 9:34 PM, Chicog said:

 

 

 

Apart from:

 

It using the same malware used by Russians against German Intelligence.

 

The VPN they used to launch from France traced back to a Russian ISP.

Metadata found in documents converted to Word format was in Cyrillic.

They stopped working outside the Russian work week and on Russian state holidays.

The "Romanian" that suddenly appeared taking credit after the Russians got blamed couldn't actually speak very good Romanian.

 

What have the Romans ever done for us?

 

 

 

For those of us not in the intelligence community the source of the hacking is fundamentally unknowable.  There will never be any "evidence" that is not intermediated by intelligence agencies who cannot, on principle, be trusted.  (See "WMD.")

[Boon Mee]

Fox News Is Reporting Widespread Voter Fraud, Obama Says It’s Dangerous to Report It

 

Fox News Is Reporting Widespread Voter Fraud, Obama Says It’s Dangerous to Report It

by S. Noble • October 21, 2016

Fox News reported on the widespread voter fraud this morning. This follows a debate in which voter fraud was dismissed as one of Donald Trump’s conspiracy theories.

 

http://www.independentsentinel.com/fox-news-is-reporting-widespread-voter-fraud-obama-says-its-dangerous-to-report-it/

 

 

 

Barack Obama took his views to an extreme level, saying it’s dangerous to talk about voter fraud because it will undermine our democracy. Substitute ‘democracy’ with ‘big government’.

 

Many believe that when Obama makes comments like this, he is sending dog whistles to the media to not report it

 

[AYJAYDEE]

2 hours ago, Ahab said:

This has devolved into the lines from a PeeWee Herman movie....

 

If it is not, then please inform us what exactly you think is not correct. You "feel" it is not, but it is likely you cannot express with words exactly what is wrong without sounding as if you have no idea what you are talking about.  The Russians (allegedly) are supporting Trump by releasing true emails from the Clinton campaign expressing how they actually feel about various subjects.   The Russians are bad for hacking into the Clinton campaign servers (another very important reason to have absolutely top notch computer security), got it. The Clinton campaign is bad for being corrupt (pay to play while Secretary of State), and deceitful (for having one policy for the public and a totally different policy for action). In most circles corruption and lying is viewed negatively, but if you are a Democrat these are badges of honor and are good enough for about 45% of all Americans for them to vote for Hillary.

 

nonsense, there has never been a political party that didn't lie to the public and participate in corruption. viewed negatively?? lo9l, your country was built on lies and deceit.

[Srikcir]

1 hour ago, Boon Mee said:

Fox News Is Reporting Widespread Voter Fraud, Obama Says It’s Dangerous to Report It

 

Fox News Is Reporting Widespread Voter Fraud, Obama Says It’s Dangerous to Report It

by S. Noble • October 21, 2016

Fox News reported on the widespread voter fraud this morning. This follows a debate in which voter fraud was dismissed as one of Donald Trump’s conspiracy theories.

 

http://www.independentsentinel.com/fox-news-is-reporting-widespread-voter-fraud-obama-says-its-dangerous-to-report-it/

 

 

 

Barack Obama took his views to an extreme level, saying it’s dangerous to talk about voter fraud because it will undermine our democracy. Substitute ‘democracy’ with ‘big government’.

 

Many believe that when Obama makes comments like this, he is sending dog whistles to the media to not report it

 

"Nobody likes him."

American citizen Rafael Rodriguez on how sixth-graders view Donald Trump.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/trump-clinton-debate-immigration_us_580840b2e4b0b994d4c43970

It's getting harder for Donald to find a supporting constituency.

[Pinot]

2 hours ago, Boon Mee said:

Fox News Is Reporting Widespread Voter Fraud, Obama Says It’s Dangerous to Report It

 

Fox News Is Reporting Widespread Voter Fraud, Obama Says It’s Dangerous to Report It

by S. Noble • October 21, 2016

Fox News reported on the widespread voter fraud this morning. This follows a debate in which voter fraud was dismissed as one of Donald Trump’s conspiracy theories.

 

http://www.independentsentinel.com/fox-news-is-reporting-widespread-voter-fraud-obama-says-its-dangerous-to-report-it/

 

 

Barack Obama took his views to an extreme level, saying it’s dangerous to talk about voter fraud because it will undermine our democracy. Substitute ‘democracy’ with ‘big government’.

 

Many believe that when Obama makes comments like this, he is sending dog whistles to the media to not report it

 

 

Jeesh. There is no voter fraud. Obama is informing people not to believe the bullshit. Pretty simple, really.

 

Donald Trump didn't even accept the legitimate election of Barack Obama. He's certainly not going to accept the legitimate election of Hillary Clinton.

 

Screw em. He's back to being an unemployed reality TV actor in a few weeks. When the votes are counted there will be a Republican circular firing squad and that will be the end of it. Trump will be laughing stock as the answer to the trivia question, "Who was the worst candidate for President in history?"

[Morch]

12 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Any outlet only giving one side is biased, as is any channel that spends more time bashing Trump than reporting the news.

 

Well you seem to be in favor of various websites and organizations which constantly publish one-sided information. Sounds like a matter of choice, more than a logical conclusion. As for "bashing Trump", quite a lot of the media coverage being bashing may have something to do with the outrageous statements by Trump himself. Seeing as the US presidential campaigns ARE the news, and that Trump is part of it - not too clear what your point was.

[Morch]

12 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

That's right, and he is laughing like a drain about it. Every time it quietens down he just throws something controversial out there, like he might not accept the vote and the lemmings give him a few more million worth of free air time, and bash him a lot which only makes him more popular with his base.

 

 

The difference in interpretation is that you seem to believe this is some evidence of strategy by Trump. Others see it as representative of his impulsiveness, attention span, irritability and lack of planning ahead. IMO its more to do with him unable to bear not being the center of attention, with these campaigns bringing it to new levels.

 

Trump's electoral issues are not so much with his "base", but with those tittering or undecided. Not sure that off the cuff outrageous statements and subsequent backtracking/denials are a great tools of conversion.

[Morch]

4 hours ago, Ahab said:

This has devolved into the lines from a PeeWee Herman movie....

 

If it is not, then please inform us what exactly you think is not correct. You "feel" it is not, but it is likely you cannot express with words exactly what is wrong without sounding as if you have no idea what you are talking about.  The Russians (allegedly) are supporting Trump by releasing true emails from the Clinton campaign expressing how they actually feel about various subjects.   The Russians are bad for hacking into the Clinton campaign servers (another very important reason to have absolutely top notch computer security), got it. The Clinton campaign is bad for being corrupt (pay to play while Secretary of State), and deceitful (for having one policy for the public and a totally different policy for action). In most circles corruption and lying is viewed negatively, but if you are a Democrat these are badges of honor and are good enough for about 45% of all Americans for them to vote for Hillary.

 

I don't know that the Russians actually support Trump. Seems like they are more interested (and it would make more sense) in the overall weakening of the US. Trump's campaign (or indeed, HRC's as well) is just an opportunity to further such a goal. This could be achieved by sowing divisions, raising doubts and discouraging unity. Nothing new there.

 

It is noticeable that there are no such leaks involving Trump's activities. No personal emails, no shady business information, no insider campaign correspondence.

 

As for the leaked HRC emails - I don't recall their authenticity being admitted. Not saying they aren't, just that people seem to take it as a given. Agreed that a lot of the content does not make for a flattering portrayal of HRC or her campaign. Doubt many are really all that surprised or shocked, though. Further doubt the alleged going-ons described were not present in many a political campaign by either party.

 

Trump does not assert that the whole US political system got issues, his gripe is simply that he might lose. Had Trump been in an obvious leading position in the poles, there would be no issue. HRC does not assert that the elections ARE rigged, but that Russia intervenes in US domestic politics. While I doubt the reaction from her campaign would have been as vehement if Trump was the object of those leaks, can't quite see her calling on Russia to go further.

[Morch]

3 hours ago, CaptHaddock said:

 

For those of us not in the intelligence community the source of the hacking is fundamentally unknowable.  There will never be any "evidence" that is not intermediated by intelligence agencies who cannot, on principle, be trusted.  (See "WMD.")

 

Quite a nihilistic approach there.

Could make it troublesome to run a country, not to mention a global superpower.

[Srikcir]

1 hour ago, Pinot said:

. There is no voter fraud.

For the sake of argument that there was "massive voter fraud" even though there has only been early election voters and absentee voters - hardly the main source of cast votes than what will be seen on November 8th election day.

 

Such an argument (or excsue) in effect condemns the Republican Party for allowing or devising such a fraud!

 

Election voting in the USA is the responsibility of each state and not the federal government (unlike in Thailand). Out of 50 states, 33 states' electoral process is operated largely under the auspices of the Republican Party through control of the Governors, Secretary of State or Election Directors, with a minority by nonpartisian committees - representing over 300 electoral votes. If Trump wants to blame his loss on voter fraud, blame must lie with HIS PARTY.

 

In fact however, it has been the Republican Party that has been consistently (especially in the Southern States) aggressive in cutting short or eliminating early voting, gerrymandering and imposition of unconstitutional registration requirements. All of which coincidentally adversely affect largely minorities.

[shadmo63]

1 hour ago, Morch said:

Others see it as representative of his impulsiveness, attention span, irritability and lack of planning ahead

 

Narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) is a long-term pattern of abnormal behavior characterized by exaggerated feelings of self-importance, an excessive need for admiration, and a lack of understanding of others' feelings. People affected by it often spend a lot of time thinking about achieving power or success, or about their appearance. They often take advantage of the people around them. The behavior typically begins by early adulthood, and occurs across a variety of situations.

According to the DSM-5, individuals with NPD have most or all of the following symptoms, typically without commensurate qualities or accomplishments:

1. Grandiosity with expectations of superior treatment from others
2. Fixated on fantasies of power, success, intelligence, attractiveness, etc.
3. Self-perception of being unique, superior and associated with high-status people and institutions
4. Needing constant admiration from others
5. Sense of entitlement to special treatment and to obedience from others
6. Exploitative of others to achieve personal gain
7. Unwilling to empathize with others' feelings, wishes, or needs
8. Intensely envious of others and the belief that others are equally envious of them
9. Pompous and arrogant demeanor

All info here taken from Wikipedia

 

Draw your own conclusions.

 

[Srikcir]

5 hours ago, shadmo63 said:

Draw your own conclusions

I thought this discussion was about Trump and not about Prayut.

[Publicus]

11 hours ago, Ahab said:

So let me get this straight.

 

When Trump says that the election could be rigged by Democrats (as described in emails, and actual undercover videos of Democratic operatives) it is bad for the country, and could negatively affect future elections.

 

When Hillary says that the election is being rigged by the Russians (because they hacked and released emails that the general US public was not supposed to see showing the Democrats are trying to rig an election) it is bad for the country because the Russians are undermining the US election  by showing just how corrupt the Democrats actually are.  This is bad for the country because the Russians apparently support Trump, not because the emails are providing damaging insight into just how corrupt Hillary Clinton actually is.

 

You cannot make this stuff up, no one would believe you.

 

 

 

Must be tuff to read the Wikileaks-Putin emails in their original Russian. Or do you read the versions of 'em that are translated into English.

 

Trying here to find out if the legally busted Trump University taught Russian too. Pictures of Putin and Lenin on the wall maybe. With the Trump photo in between 'em. 

[GinBoy2]

I couldn't say it better than Samantha Bee...

 

 

[Thakkar]

19 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

None. I do prefer the channels which don't have ads every 5 minutes though, so that's not leaving much except Al Jazira. However, U Tube is here to save us all from the bias.

I try to go by what they actually say, which avoids being fooled by statements such as Trump calls ( all ) Mexicans rapists and murderers.

 

YouTube is owned by Google. Well over 90% of Google's profit is derived from advertising. It may not be "MSM" but it's part of the same system.

 

YouTube does not editorialize in the traditional sense. The kinds of clips presented to me on YouTube are decided on by algorithms based on what other things I have watched/read/liked/disliked/commented on, on the internet and things I've shared/received/liked/disliked/commented on, on gmail/forums, among other parameters. Google's AI is quite powerful and pervasive.

 

Thus, the more I surf/watch/like/dislike/comment/share, the narrower my window gets as to what is presented to me and what I see. I, in effect, become my own editor. My existing prejudices get reinforced and I go deeper down a rabbit hole of self-reinforcing viewpoints.

 

This partly explains the crazy partisanship of today. This isn't good for civil society, democracy, or personal growth. The cure is to expose oneself to a broad range of views and to maintain an open mind.

 

T

[Laughing Gravy]

I mentioned it as soon as Donald Trump was announced as the Republican candidate that Hilary would win. I also said that he would, as the campaign went on, would be exposed more and more for what he is like. That isn't saying I like HC. In fact the opposite but the 'powers to be' want her in power and she has more skeletons in her closet, than him. The timing of all these allegations are not coincidental at all. I think the 'powers to be' were surprised just how much support Trump received.

 

I am not the oracle but just do a little research and you can see the whole Hilary skeletons and the fact that she will continue to carry on with the agenda following the bushes and Obama.

 

I do hope people don't think they have been given a choice. 

 

[Publicus]

14 hours ago, AYJAYDEE said:

 

Never mind the above.

 

 

 

My reply is to this poster only, Ahab

15 hours ago, Ahab said:

So let me get this straight.

 

When Trump says that the election could be rigged by Democrats (as described in emails, and actual undercover videos of Democratic operatives) it is bad for the country, and could negatively affect future elections.

 

When Hillary says that the election is being rigged by the Russians (because they hacked and released emails that the general US public was not supposed to see showing the Democrats are trying to rig an election) it is bad for the country because the Russians are undermining the US election  by showing just how corrupt the Democrats actually are.  This is bad for the country because the Russians apparently support Trump, not because the emails are providing damaging insight into just how corrupt Hillary Clinton actually is.

 

You cannot make this stuff up, no one would believe you.

 

 

 

So let me get this straight.

 

    Fail.

 

 

 

You cannot make this stuff up, no one would believe you.

 

You just did, and yes, correct, no one believes you.  

[Srikcir]

The upcoming New Yorker Cover showing Turmp being sworn in POTUS:

http://www.newyorker.com/culture/culture-desk/cover-story-2016-10-31

[ilostmypassword]

9 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

I mentioned it as soon as Donald Trump was announced as the Republican candidate that Hilary would win. I also said that he would, as the campaign went on, would be exposed more and more for what he is like. That isn't saying I like HC. In fact the opposite but the 'powers to be' want her in power and she has more skeletons in her closet, than him. The timing of all these allegations are not coincidental at all. I think the 'powers to be' were surprised just how much support Trump received.

 

I am not the oracle but just do a little research and you can see the whole Hilary skeletons and the fact that she will continue to carry on with the agenda following the bushes and Obama.

 

I do hope people don't think they have been given a choice. 

 

I've seen this line that Hillary will be the same as all the others time and time again.  And it comes from a kind of facile cynicism. And there's lots of reasons that it's nonsense. For one thing, Obama in his first 2 years got a lot done that the Bushes et al. never would have done. Such as Dodd Frank. Wall Street and the banks hate that.  And in the last portion of his term he got to raise taxes on the wealthy. What Republican would have done that? Where he fell down was in going way too easy on wall street and thinking he could come back for another stimulus instead of asking for an adequate one in the first place. So the line now is that because Clinton got ridiculously overpaid by wall streeters she won't do anything to hurt their interests. What this kind of comment shows obliviousness to is that not only does Hillary want to get elected. She also wants to get re-elected.  And although she was clueless about the changes that had taken place in the American electorate's attitude towards the economy, she's not anymore.  And that means pushing programs that Wall Street won't like. If she doesn't do that, she's toast. Not by a threat from the Republicans. After all, every Republican candidate including Trump offered disproportionately large tax reductions to the wealthy. But from a Democrat like Elizabeth Warren.

[Laughing Gravy]

So would you like to bet that Hillary won't win?

 

I won't bother replying to the rest of your comments especially as it would seem you are stalking me.

[Publicus]

43 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

So would you like to bet that Hillary won't win?

 

I won't bother replying to the rest of your comments especially as it would seem you are stalking me.

 

The poster did not challenge the point HRC is superlikely to win, if I may interject to say so. He pointed out some facts the right ignores or dismisses concerning HRC and her approaches, awareness, policies going forward.

 

Btw this is the first time I'd noticed you posting so why don't you pick up with me where you and the other poster left off.

 

It's just a simple and friendly introductory invitation so it's entirely up to you and I'll still respect you in the morning either way.

[Publicus]

21 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

That's right, and he is laughing like a drain about it. Every time it quietens down he just throws something controversial out there, like he might not accept the vote and the lemmings give him a few more million worth of free air time, and bash him a lot which only makes him more popular with his base.

 

 

Equally as generous to this side, if not more so, Trump has bitten on every baited hook, line and sinker thrown down in front of him. 

 

My own favorite was the Miss Universe eating thingy, but Khizr Khan whipping out his pocket Constitution and pushing it toward the camera baiting Trump was perfect.

 

Trump's got 101 buttons to push and it ain't over yet. We keep Trump talking to that base and to the base only cause it further deludes him to make him think he's coming out ahead.

 

Same as when he lights himself on fire as you remind us so well in the post. 

[ilostmypassword]

22 minutes ago, Publicus said:

 

Equally as generous to this side, if not more so, Trump has bitten on every baited hook, line and sinker thrown down in front of him. 

 

My own favorite was the Miss Universe eating thingy, but Khizr Khan whipping out his pocket Constitution and pushing it toward the camera baiting Trump was perfect.

 

Trump's got 101 buttons to push and it ain't over yet. We keep Trump talking to that base and to the base only cause it further deludes him to make him think he's coming out ahead.

 

Same as when he lights himself on fire as you remind us so well in the post. 

Those buttons are why Trump is such a great negotiator.

[Boon Mee]

Obama Warned of Rigged Elections Back in 2008

 

 

[Srikcir]

3 hours ago, Boon Mee said:

Obama Warned of Rigged Elections Back in 2008

TVers please view the video and decide for yourself whether Obama made such a warning.

Hint: Neither Boon Mee nor anyone I could find in the internet that presents this video quotes Obama making such warning. Compare toTrump who can be quoted frequently to claiming "rigged elections."

 

What Obama did suggest in the video was that there be  a federal nonpartisan Voter Rights Division that would monitor states for violations of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Historically there has been concerted efforts by the Republican Party (especially in the South) to deny or suppress voter registration and voting by minorities and people who might vote Demeocrat candidates for public office. It is the duty of the US Attorney General to enforce the Act but with 33 states now controlled by Republican Governors and/or legislatures, the AG Office resources alone are strained to assure adequate investigations and uniform enforcement. A dedicated VR division could provide a broader reach by it has yet to be considered been by Congress.

[Thakkar]

18 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

I mentioned it as soon as Donald Trump was announced as the Republican candidate that Hilary would win. I also said that he would, as the campaign went on, would be exposed more and more for what he is like. That isn't saying I like HC. In fact the opposite but the 'powers to be' want her in power and she has more skeletons in her closet, than him. The timing of all these allegations are not coincidental at all. I think the 'powers to be' were surprised just how much support Trump received.

 

I am not the oracle but just do a little research and you can see the whole Hilary skeletons and the fact that she will continue to carry on with the agenda following the bushes and Obama.

 

I do hope people don't think they have been given a choice. 

 

 

18 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

So would you like to bet that Hillary won't win?

 

 

It seems to me that what you're saying is that if Hillary wins, then that is proof that the "fix is in"

 

Where was this "fix" when she was younger and running against an unknown, inexperienced, half black, son of a Muslim with a name that sounds like "Osama" in 2007? Where was the "fix" in her favour when she tried unsuccessfully to introduce universal healthcare in the '90s?

 

There was no fix when Trump legitimately won the Republican primary against a slew of weak candidates with the overwhelming and enthusiastic support of GOP primary voters who, after years of wallowing in a right wing marinade of hate, fear, suspicion and false memes had finally found their hero.

 

Is it really a fix when Trump's hateful, misogyny-laden, racist, idiotic, false, bombastic, assholery rhetoric is rejected by a plurality of decent Americans?

 

if I were a 100-year-old overweight, diabetic with a penchant for unfiltered cigarettes who died soon after eating a cookie, would you bother to test the cookie for poison?

 

T