Phuket's gun-slinging cops: No action to stop off-duty police from carrying guns in pubs, on streets

[rooster59]

Phuket's gun-slinging cops: No action to stop off-duty police from carrying guns in pubs, on streets 

The Phuket News

 

A personal handgun, as allowed, sits on the hip of a police officer in Phuket. Photo: Tanyaluk Sakoot

 

PHUKET: Despite the recent deadly shoot-out at a pub in Samui or the bodies piling up of people in Phuket killed by guns carried into public places by off-duty officers, the Royal Thai Police is not considering reviewing its stance on officers carrying loaded firearms into pubs, clubs, restaurants or other venues while not on duty.

 

To Maj Gen Chayodom Jintawairoth, Commander of the General Staff Sub-Division at Region 8 Police, the current policy is safe enough.
 

Citing the Firearms, Ammunition, Explosives, Fireworks, and the Equivalent of Firearms Act, which dates back to 1947, Maj Gen Chayodom said, “By law, only officers on duty may carry weapons in public, which is a suitable policy. Officers on duty need weapons for protection and to stop crime when needed. There is no need to change this policy.”

 

After explaining at length that police officers of the rank of captain or above must also carry police identification with them while carrying a firearm in public while on duty, Gen Chayodom admitted that the Royal Thai Police “does not have a policy for off-duty police officers to carry weapons into public places”.

 

“If off duty officers are involved in a firearm incident and found guilty, they will be punished with both criminal and disciplinary proceedings, accordingly,” he said in an official statement* issued to The Phuket News.

 

“If after investigation an officer is found guilty of ‘such an accusation’ (sic) then the punishment would be either to ask the officer to leave the police force voluntary or he or she will be fired from the current position, this depends on the severity of the offence,” he said.

 

That is if the officer is charged, and even then that is if the police investigation is concluded, or even launched.

 

Gen Chayodom did not respond to questions about the current status of investigations or criminal proceedings against any Region 8 police officers involved in specific cases identified by The Phuket News where citizens – mostly innocents – were killed by guns carried by Royal Thai Police officers into a public venue while off duty.

 

Region 8 Police jurisdiction includes Samui, where two people were shot dead and five others wounded in a violent pub brawl involving several policemen in the early hours of Sept 23.

 

Lt Corp Jaerasak Sroisangvarn and Kraisorn Mingsakul, a guard at the Camp Beer pub in Bo Phut, died in the shoot-out.

 

Full story: http://www.thephuketnews.com/phuket-gun-slinging-cops-no-action-to-stop-off-duty-police-from-carrying-guns-in-pubs-on-streets-59914.php#4oWAH7dbE3eHXCWm.97

 

 

 

-- © Copyright Phuket News 2016-11-20

 

 

[dotpoom]

" After explaining at length that police officers of the rank of captain or above must also carry police identification with them while carrying a firearm in public while on duty,"......

 

Does that mean the lower ranks don't need identification?

[LivinginKata]

I have been told by members of the RTP that they are always on duty and that's why they carry their gun. And it not a police force issue ... the policeman buys his own gun .... and bullets, and uniform, and radio, and all the accessories expected of a Thai policeman..

[Mickmouse1]

I agree with the police commissioner asking people not to criticise the police as there is no ground for such CRITICISM ?

[12DrinkMore]

What's the issue?

 

Quote

Citing the Firearms, Ammunition, Explosives, Fireworks, and the Equivalent of Firearms Act, which dates back to 1947, Maj Gen Chayodom said, “By law, only officers on duty may carry weapons in public, which is a suitable policy. Officers on duty need weapons for protection and to stop crime when needed. There is no need to change this policy.”

 

 

Case clear.

 

The BIB's should be obeying the law, not making it up.

 

Off duty >>> no weapons

[monkey4u]

34 minutes ago, dotpoom said:

" After explaining at length that police officers of the rank of captain or above must also carry police identification with them while carrying a firearm in public while on duty,"......

 

Does that mean the lower ranks don't need identification?

They have their guns as proof of who or what they are

The rest of this statement you can add your own thoughts

[Gandtee]

Why carry them exposed. I know a police officer who has an ankle holster and as he said, "he is always on duty". Despite much criticism there are good cops and they remain the poor ones.

[connda]

Don't see a problem.  They're cops.

[Thaiwrath]

They carry them because they seem to be an absolute necessity in the event of losing face.

Edited November 20, 2016 by Thaiwrath

[JoePai]

14 minutes ago, connda said:

Don't see a problem.  They're cops.

 

[gk10002000]

well, who is in charge of the Royal Thai Police?  Is there a civilian boss responsible to the people and that is elected?  Nope.  Everything is under the military control and oversight

[Bangkok Barry]

The fact that they are cops is irrelevant. They bought their own guns and ammunition so they are free when off duty to carry them wherever and whenever they like within the law. And that is where, like most laws in Thailand, it becomes fuzzy. I believe that if they have a license they can carry a gun in public. Or can they? So many do, as we see in frequent reports of motorists including taxi drivers reacting after their feelings are hurt when someone cuts in front of them etc...

Edited November 20, 2016 by Bangkok Barry

[daveAustin]

Quote

Gen Chayodom admitted that the Royal Thai Police “does not have a policy for off-duty police officers to carry weapons into public places”.

 

Of course you don't.

 

I wish they would remove the 'royal' part from their title. Just a state-sponsored Mafia is all they are.  

[yellowboat]

In other countries, police carry firearms when they are going to college or out drinking.  The attitudes of Thai police offers need to change, and that will not happen until their (real) wages go up and they are better trained and educated. 

[elgordo38]

3 hours ago, rooster59 said:

“If off duty officers are involved in a firearm incident and found guilty, they will be punished with both criminal and disciplinary proceedings, accordingly,” he said in an official statement* issued to The Phuket News.

I am sure that will satisfy the person that is possibly shot or wounded. The part of a officer carrying a loaded gun while carousing in a bar truly scares me. If he takes a girl upstairs and is not satisfied and he has numerous drinks under his belt its hard to say what the outcome might be. 

[evadgib]

2 hours ago, LivinginKata said:

I have been told by members of the RTP that they are always on duty and that's why they carry their gun. And it not a police force issue ... the policeman buys his own gun .... and bullets, and uniform, and radio, and all the accessories expected of a Thai policeman..

 

This came as a shock to me the first time I saw someone riding a motorcy in full 'Police'  livery one night while clearly rat-arrsed and with a gun on his hip.

 

I have also seen a marked police pickup (Burgundy w Cream doors) being driven that appeared to have rolled over multiple times-all windows smashed-all  pannels damaged, and illuminated at night by a single bulb no better than a candle!

Edited November 20, 2016 by evadgib

[KenKadz]

2 hours ago, LivinginKata said:

I have been told by members of the RTP that they are always on duty and that's why they carry their gun. And it not a police force issue ... the policeman buys his own gun .... and bullets, and uniform, and radio, and all the accessories expected of a Thai policeman..

Really? Nothing is supplied by the department?

If true this certainly explains a lot about police behavior.

And it exposes a lot about the government of Thailand!

[Grubster]

1 hour ago, Gandtee said:

Why carry them exposed. I know a police officer who has an ankle holster and as he said, "he is always on duty". Despite much criticism there are good cops and they remain the poor ones.

Is he drinking with that gun, if so its surely not good.

[Grubster]

1 hour ago, gk10002000 said:

well, who is in charge of the Royal Thai Police?  Is there a civilian boss responsible to the people and that is elected?  Nope.  Everything is under the military control and oversight

Very true, when you are the supreme commander of everything then you own all good and bad, I haven't noticed much action taken on the corrupt police system other than transferring a bunch of them. Most notably the lead investigator investigating the Hi-So family in the Brit murders. I bet he wished he had seen the obvious evidence pointing at the two boys.

[elgordo38]

Whats wrong with a dollop and a trollop after working hours. Just take the gun off before you embrace here otherwise you will leave an indentation on her. If the gun has a hair trigger you might some explaining to do. 

[chrisinth]

3 hours ago, LivinginKata said:

I have been told by members of the RTP that they are always on duty and that's why they carry their gun. And it not a police force issue ... the policeman buys his own gun .... and bullets, and uniform, and radio, and all the accessories expected of a Thai policeman..

 

I would say that if that were the case, if the officer was in uniform, they may have a valid point.

 

Your second point however, for the simple reason that it is a privately owned weapon, and not issued, unless the person found with the weapon has a permit to carry (yes, very relevant to Thai law) then they will already be in breach of said laws.

 

IMO, they are not allowed to carry in a public place when not on assigned duty unless they are in possession of a permit to carry. But, they make their own rules and keep incidents in-house. This is the part that needs addressing.

[chrisinth]

1 hour ago, Bangkok Barry said:

The fact that they are cops is irrelevant. They bought their own guns and ammunition so they are free when off duty to carry them wherever and whenever they like within the law. And that is where, like most laws in Thailand, it becomes fuzzy. I believe that if they have a license they can carry a gun in public. Or can they? So many do, as we see in frequent reports of motorists including taxi drivers reacting after their feelings are hurt when someone cuts in front of them etc...

 

It should all come down to the permit to carry. And these are not easily got here in Thailand.

[lemonjelly]

This country is the Spaghetti Western of ASEAN


Sent from my twisted mind using Thaivisa Connect

[chrisinth]

4 hours ago, rooster59 said:

Citing the Firearms, Ammunition, Explosives, Fireworks, and the Equivalent of Firearms Act, which dates back to 1947, Maj Gen Chayodom said, “By law, only officers on duty may carry weapons in public, which is a suitable policy. Officers on duty need weapons for protection and to stop crime when needed. There is no need to change this policy.”

 

There should be nothing more to say on the subject after citing the law, even if it is that dated.

 

Anything outside this should be stopped and the offenders prosecuted.

 

From the same OP however:

 

“If after investigation an officer is found guilty of ‘such an accusation’ (sic) then the punishment would be either to ask the officer to leave the police force voluntary or he or she will be fired from the current position, this depends on the severity of the offence,” he said.

 

This should be up to the courts and not kept in-house as the event would be against the Firearms, Ammunition, Explosives, Fireworks, and the Equivalent of Firearms Act and not just against police regulations.

 

IMHO of course...........................

[LivinginKata]

1 hour ago, KenKadz said:

Really? Nothing is supplied by the department?

If true this certainly explains a lot about police behavior.

And it exposes a lot about the government of Thailand!

 

My wife's nephew joined the BiB (I've known him for years before he joined the BiB) had little money and I gave him the money to buy his gun as he felt 'bad' without a gun.  Another member of my extended family bought the radio. He bought his 2 uniforms. 

[Reigntax]

5 hours ago, Bangkok Barry said:

The fact that they are cops is irrelevant. They bought their own guns and ammunition so they are free when off duty to carry them wherever and whenever they like within the law. And that is where, like most laws in Thailand, it becomes fuzzy. I believe that if they have a license they can carry a gun in public. Or can they? So many do, as we see in frequent reports of motorists including taxi drivers reacting after their feelings are hurt when someone cuts in front of them etc...

 

But do you want one to be carrying a gun while out drinking. They are a danger to themselves and the public when sober and we are well aware how a gun seems needed to compensate for other minor deficiencies .

[chrisinth]

1 hour ago, Docno said:

 

Dated? Half the American population wants to make assault rifles available to Joe Average on the basis of a constitutional amendment introduced in 1791 ...

 

Yep, I was thinking that same example even when i was typing........................

[Khon Kaen Dave]

I am of the opinion that off duty cop's will be terrified if they cant carry their weapon,on or off duty.And their stance it that

They just may be on a night out with the mia noi,when a disgruntled victim of the police,who has had a beating at his hands or has been otherwise made to part with a large sum of money,or what ever,sees him and decides upon a bit of self induced retribution.The cop wouldn't stand a chance. That's why i think they want to carry their weapon.Self protection.The only problem would be,that a lot of innocent by standers would probably get wounded or killed in the melee.

We all know how well trained the RTB are in weapons usage.

[LivinginKata]

5 minutes ago, Khon Kaen Dave said:

I am of the opinion that off duty cop's will be terrified if they cant carry their weapon,on or off duty.And their stance it that

They just may be on a night out with the mia noi,when a disgruntled victim of the police,who has had a beating at his hands or has been otherwise made to part with a large sum of money,or what ever,sees him and decides upon a bit of self induced retribution.The cop wouldn't stand a chance. That's why i think they want to carry their weapon.Self protection.The only problem would be,that a lot of innocent by standers would probably get wounded or killed in the melee.

We all know how well trained the RTB are in weapons usage.

 

Lot of truth in your post. Thai cops want the cudos of having a gun, can act the big man,  even threaten when talk goes pear shaped. I would think self protection is low on the thinking as BiB think themselves invincible and untouchable.  

[George FmplesdaCosteedback]

Does anyone know what the law says?

If a cop is off duty then he should be classed as an ordinary citizen. Do they have to apply for a licence to carry a gun as a policeman, or are they covered as police, and if they are, are they allowed to carry a gun outside of work?

Since the guns are their own property can they easily get a licence to carry it at anytime, being police?

It should be straight forward, but I suspect if they are not covered to carry a gun outside work hours the police just ignore the law, since they are the ones who are supposed to enforce it.