Govt approves 10 year visas for foreigners over 50

[chiang mai]

The 10K health insurance is far from fool proof and most likely an unnecessary expense for many. People aged  over 65 can still buy such a policy but it will be very costly and the likelihood it will pay out when needed is far from guaranteed, given pre existing conditions of most people at that age. So for me for example, that policy will be an impractical and expensive piece of window dressing and I guess I am in the majority on this.

[anotheruser]

1 minute ago, chiang mai said:

The 10K health insurance is far from fool proof and most likely an unnecessary expense for many. People aged  over 65 can still buy such a policy but it will be very costly and the likelihood it will pay out when needed is far from guaranteed, given pre existing conditions of most people at that age. So for me for example, that policy will be an impractical and expensive piece of window dressing and I guess I am in the majority on this.

 

So what is your plan? Pay as you go? If that's the case than 3 mil in the bank makes sense.

[rogeroc]

It is 100% understandable that some Expats will be worried about the proposed changes and i really hope that they will be accomodated.

 

However in effect this is a new product and presumably primarily designed for people, in the future, wanting to reside in Thailand for a long period of time. I am from the UK i don't think it is unreasonable to expect to have either Baht 100000 per month income or Baht 3000000 savings (particulary so if the income and savings can be combined) to stay for 10 years even if those figures must be reconfirmed after 5 years.

 

I knew from many years back that i wanted to retire abroad and i set myself a combined income and savings target to be able to comfortable do so before i took retirement. The figure i set myself was way in excess of the proposals on the table here!

Edited November 22, 2016 by rogeroc

[HampiK]

1 minute ago, rogeroc said:

It is 100% understandable that some Expats will be worried about the proposed changes and i really hope that they will be accomodated.

 

However in effect this is a new product and presumably primarily designed for people, in the future, wanting to reside in Thailand for a long period of time. I am from the UK i don't think it is unreasonable to expect to have either Baht 100000 per year income or Baht 3000000 savings (particulary so if the income and savings can be combined) to stay for 10 years even if those figures must be reconfirmed after 5 years.

 

I knew from many years back that i wanted to retire abroad and i set myself a combined income and savings target to be able to comfortable do so before i took retirement. The figure i set myself was way in excess of the proposals on the table here!

 

I think is 100'000 Baht per month not year

[rogeroc]

Apologies per month was what i meant

Edited November 22, 2016 by rogeroc

[Jingthing]

50 minutes ago, HampiK said:

 

When i read, that this visa is made for some region (not for all) it sounds for me as additional visa.. but I think soon we have the exact wordings and how it will behave.

 

it could be a replacement, but i don't think so. But till we know it everything is only speculation....

There is NO WAY that this visa if it comes to pass will be limited to certain provinces. Don't even go there. That's just puff writing. 

[rogeroc]

38 minutes ago, freethinker said:

Do you have any idea how obnoxious you are? 

 

Id vaguer most pensioners won't be able to meet these requirements. I suppose some US citizens can meet the lump sun with the 401k system they use but it will be tough for most who also don't wish to liquidate their assets at home. 

 

 

 

I suspect you may be right about that but to some extent retiring abroad and not wishing to liquidate your assets at home is wanting it both ways.

Edited November 22, 2016 by rogeroc

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 hours ago, scavenger said:

Indeed, the Thai article seems to suggest an additional option rather than a "replacement." It also says there are 14 countries for whose citizens it will be available to (Denmark, Norway, Netherlands, Sweden, France, Finland, Italy, Germany, Switzerland, USA, UK, Japan, Canada -- the fourteenth country isn't specified...) Also, the wording seems to imply that it will be available for a maximum of ten years (twice five years.) 

 

 

I've been slowly plowing my way thru the dozens of pages in this thread, trying to come to some understanding of just what the original OP's use of the term "replacement" for 1 year visas really meant. Especially since the Post and others routinely mix up and use interchangeably the terms visa and extension of stay. So you're never quite sure just which actual thing they're talking about.

 

But now with the above added translation, I'm beginning to think this proposed policy isn't likely to directly affect extensions of stay. If this plan WAS going to totally replace retirement extensions of stay, then the new visas clearly wouldn't be ONLY offered to citizens of 14 specified (higher wealth) countries.

[tj916]

9 minutes ago, rogeroc said:

It is 100% understandable that some Expats will be worried about the proposed changes and i really hope that they will be accomodated.

 

However in effect this is a new product and presumably primarily designed for people, in the future, wanting to reside in Thailand for a long period of time. I am from the UK i don't think it is unreasonable to expect to have either Baht 100000 per year income or Baht 3000000 savings (particulary so if the income and savings can be combined) to stay for 10 years even if those figures must be reconfirmed after 5 years.

 

I knew from many years back that i wanted to retire abroad and i set myself a combined income and savings target to be able to comfortable do so before i took retirement. The figure i set myself was way in excess of the proposals on the table here!

Hi Roger.

            If you have access to 100000 baht a month get your self over here.

leave your money in your homeland,  And bring it over as and when needed.

Chose your company carefully and you will have a great time.

[Bangkokazy]

The good suggestions from Thai Govt 100,000 baht months is not so much to live for.
There are only 3,300 Baht per day.

[Jingthing]

I agree that IF that is what the THAI article says, that the 10 year visa is only available to limited nationals, that would strongly indicate it is separate option and NOT a replacement for the current retirement status system. Lots of IFs there. 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

.

 

Much appreciated, but I hope the general point is clear - too many base their views on who should and should not be allowed easy 'visas' on their own personal circumstances.....

 

Reading this thread has been pretty depressing -- not only because of having to totally guess just what kind of new visa rules the government is dreaming up -- but also to see various posters here slagging off other TV members just because they don't fit that person's idea of who is "right" for Thailand or who has enough money to be deemed acceptable.

 

Lots of people here could use a strong dose of empathy for others around them. We don't make the visa and extension rules here. But it's pretty sick and sad to see some here expressing delight that others' lives MIGHT be or have been turned upside down by some rule changes.

 

Rather than making a new rule to require health insurance, perhaps the Thai government ought to at least have a new rule that any foreigner desiring to live here should at least have a heart!

 

 

 

[Jingthing]

 

Just now, Bangkokazy said:

The good suggestions from Thai Govt 100,000 baht months is not so much to live for.
There are only 3,300 Baht per day.

For a TOURIST, no.

For a RESIDENT that might own their home, 3300 per day may be massive overspending. 

 

[HampiK]

3 minutes ago, Bangkokazy said:

The good suggestions from Thai Govt 100,000 baht months is not so much to live for.
There are only 3,300 Baht per day.

 

For a tourist this is true, but for most expats that is a big amount.

If you aren't a tourist you want go out every evening for drink and girls. And there are also quit a few people living in Thailand who have a family and don't need to pay for thai girls... I even know at least 2 foreigners who have a gig... so free sex.

 

Many times when it depends on money... I think some posters don't make a difference between a 3 week tourist and a person who live in Thailand

[rogeroc]

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

 

For a TOURIST, no.

For a RESIDENT that might own their home, 3300 per day may be massive overspending. 

 

 

I can easily see that a 50 / 55 year old coming to live here could spend Baht 3300 per day whilst still in tourist mode which could last for a few years. But when they are 65, 70, 75 that would be a lot of money !

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, rogeroc said:

 

I can easily see that a 50 / 55 year old coming to live here could spend Baht 3300 per day whilst still in tourist mode which could last for a few years. But when they are 65, 70, 75 that would be a lot of money !

The tourist mode generally passes. 

[HampiK]

1 minute ago, rogeroc said:

 

I can easily see that a 50 / 55 year old coming to live here could spend Baht 3300 per day whilst still in tourist mode which could last for a few years. But when they are 65, 70, 75 that would be a lot of money !

 

This depends... maybe the 65,70,75 need more money for viagra

[Andrew65]

1 minute ago, rogeroc said:

 

I can easily see that a 50 / 55 year old coming to live here could spend Baht 3300 per day whilst still in tourist mode which could last for a few years. But when they are 65, 70, 75 that would be a lot of money !

You've put that well. I am 51 and long out of tourist-mode, (single & not screwing -around). I can get by on about 1500 a day in lower-Sukhumvit quite easily

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 hour ago, Andrew65 said:

Is it actually clear if the $10k per-annum is the policy cost or the potential payout/benefits.,

 

When it comes to Thai health insurance, that exact wording about per annum doesn't make much sense.

 

All the Thai health policies i'm familiar with have two common things typically:

--a per disability $ limit, not necessarily limited to a calendar year, and

--a lifetime payout $ limit

 

The only thing that's typically done per year is the policy premium. And I don't think that's the amount they're talking about.

 

[Bangkokazy]

I live 50/50 in Thailand rest I live in Europe

[rogeroc]

3 minutes ago, Bangkokazy said:

I live 50/50 in Thailand rest I live in Europe

 

And presumably the proposed 10 year Visa could still be a better option than tourist visa / visa exempts etc.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 hours ago, HampiK said:

The 10'000$ Insurance should be no problem, because even the cheapest insurance plan I am looking at is more than that.

 

 

No, not quite NO problem.

 

Prices aside, most Thai health insurers simply will NOT write new health insurance policies once people get older than a certain age, often 60 or 65. And many also will simply cancel existing current policy holders once they reach certain ages, regardless of their ability/desire to pay the premiums.

 

There COULD be a government sponsored health insurance program or pool for expats living in country that wouldn't have those age restrictions. But right now, there isn't any such thing. And the prospects for one become a reality don't look very good at present.

 

Also, as others have noted, Thai insurers are particularly keen on only writing health insurance policies that exclude coverage for all known pre-existing conditions. So, someone here could easily have a health insurance policy, but end up being totally un-insured for a particular medical problem that might befall them (because it's been listed as an excluded, pre-existing condition).

 

 

[Thaiwrath]

32 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Lots of people here could use a strong dose of empathy for others around them. We don't make the visa and extension rules here. But it's pretty sick and sad to see some here expressing delight that others' lives MIGHT be or have been turned upside down by some rule changes.

 

Rather than making a new rule to require health insurance, perhaps the Thai government ought to at least have a new rule that any foreigner desiring to live here should at least have a heart!

 

 

 

 

The majority of people I have met here are not of the higher income bracket, and most of them are real, down to earth people, not like some of the pretentious <deleted> you see on here. 

[sjaak327]

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

I agree that IF that is what the THAI article says, that the 10 year visa is only available to limited nationals, that would strongly indicate it is separate option and NOT a replacement for the current retirement status system. Lots of IFs there. 

I initially was under the impression that this visa was an adittional visa for people that meet the requirements and want an easier option. You pointed out the one line I missed in the article.

 

Having said that, I personally would believe abandoning the 65/800 K requirement for annual extension of stay and the initial non imm oa at 3900 to be a mistake on Thailand's part.

 

I think the current requirements suit the general costs of living in the country better than 100K/3M even though I personally would be able to comply with those requirements (except for the age part, that will have to wait five more years).

 

 

Edited November 22, 2016 by sjaak327

[JLCrab]

9 hours ago, chiang mai said:

 

Not really, it just seems that we merely (MAY) have to invest our reserves, before our individual expiry dates, it;s still a huge financial win over time..

It's only a huge financial win if you don't get real sick and 'coverage' may refer to an insurance policy, not a bank account.

 

Personally I would meet that insurance policy requirement as specified right now. But I just received an extension last week through December 2017 so I'll see back and see what happens.

Edited November 22, 2016 by JLCrab

[scubascuba3]

Maybe the solution is to start travelling more, Thailand on a SETV 3 months, then Cambodia/other for a while then back to Thailand etc, probably be cheaper and might make it more interesting. Forget the Retirement visa hassle.

[digibum]

7 minutes ago, sjaak327 said:

I initially was under the impression that this visa was an adittional visa for people that meet the requirements and want an easier option. You pointed out the one line I missed in the article.

 

Having said that, I personally would believe abandoning the 65/800 K requirement for annual extension of stay and the initial non imm oa at 3900 to be a mistake on Thailand's part.

 

I think the current requirements suit the general costs of living in the country better than 100K/3M even though I personally would be able to comply with those requirements (except for the age part, that will have to wait five more years).

 

 

 

While I take no joy in what might happen to others, I don't think it's a bad move for Thailand.  65K is less than $1,900 USD a month and 800K in the bank is less than $23,000 USD.  Realistically, these people are not making a major contribution to the Thai economy.  They don't have enough disposable income to do more than rent a condo, feed themselves, and buy a few beers now and then.  

 

Bumping it up to about $3,000 USD a month leaves a little change left over to be able to spend it in the Thai economy.  Likewise having $85K USD liquid means a person probably isn't scraping every last penny to meet the minimum requirements.  

 

So, yeah, for Thailand this makes total sense.  

 

I know a lot of people might be saying, "But, I can't live on my pension/savings back home."  And Thailand is saying, "That's a problem between you and your home country.  We're not a dumping ground for the world's underfunded pensioners."  

 

It doesn't mean that they're bad people.  It's just that Thailand is under no obligation to offer someone a visa if they don't feel that they're obtaining some sort of benefit from it and apparently they have looked at what the current policies have resulted in and decided they don't want that anymore.

 

And not to rub it in but anybody who feels this is unfair or that they're owed something from Thailand, come on man, it's Thailand.  If you were under any illusion that Thailand saw you as anything more than a walking ATM, you probably believe 20 year old girls have a fetish for 60 year old men.  The Thai government has no loyalties.  They don't care about what's fair.  You were useful to them until you weren't and if you ever thought anything other than that, well, you sorta deluded yourself.  

 

That's just the reality of it.  

 

 

[gigman]

Those who made this idea ..it must be to much sun into their heads...

Show me who can have such high retirement money in the 1 month.

Sorry guys  but Vietnam is more friendly and more beautiful ..at least for next 5 years it will be only better for expats.

[MaiChai]

The problem i have with leaving large amounts of money in Thai banks is that you are not covered if the money disappears. I mean if the money walks through fraud or errors at the bank. Also that money would be tied up and you cant really invest it. They must think we are stupid or something.

[gigman]

Just now, MaiChai said:

The problem i have with leaving large amounts of money in Thai banks is that you are not covered if the money disappears. I mean if the money walks through fraud or errors at the bank. Also that money would be tied up and you cant really invest it. They must think we are stupid or something.

Yeah, they take us a little bit as silly old and spoiled who get money very easy....