Trump blames 'both Democrats and Republicans' for allegations

[Grubster]

3 minutes ago, heybruce said:

I've long maintained he's a great conman.  That doesn't make him brilliant and doesn't mean he's qualified to be president.

He is qualified to be president as is every law abiding US born citizen of age in the US.  Having a great speaker might make you feel good but having a great leader will make the country good. Lets see what happens here. I may agree he is a bum as all the last nine presidents have been, but only time will tell. Neither you nor I can be sure what he will do.

[dunroaming]

Well at least Trump never disappoints.  You can always rely on him to rant and rave and deny everything.  Very Presidential!

[craigt3365]

44 minutes ago, Grubster said:

And it will never change if nobody makes the changes in law, have you noticed a lot of effort on the part of any of the past administrations to right these wrongs? Do you think the Lawyer Hillary Clinton would have tried to change any of these laws?

Wait.  You're saying the guy who made out like a bandit due to lax bankruptcy laws, bilked many out of their investment money, and won't even show his tax returns, is going to help us?  Really?  You do understand how silly that sounds.  Not to mention, it's been proven he doesn't stand by his promises. LOL

 

But 100% agreed.  Something needs to change.  Unfortunately, Trump doesn't look to be the person who'll do the changing.  But we'll see.

[Grubster]

25 minutes ago, heybruce said:

All the Trump supporters assume he will fulfill his vague promises to drain the swamp and make America great again.  Many former Trump partners and contractors can tell you that taking him at his word is a dangerously bad idea.  His nominations for key posts and his failure to apply anything but flimsy window dressing to conflict of interest concerns should also give these people a clue, but apparently it hasn't.

Well I don't know but it sounds like he is still planning on building the wall, and doing something with healthcare, what other vague promises has he backed out of? Yes I'm sure he will back out of not letting any muslims in but I was smart enough to know that was a vote getting statement only. After all which president did all they said they would do? His nominations seem to be very strong leaders to me. Evidently you think he is in it for money with your conflict of interest statements. Really you think a billionaire would intentionally ruin his legacy like that? I don't. The swamp dwellers are shaking in their boots after fighting so hard against him. I bet the shredding machines have been running up our electric bill lately.

[Grubster]

3 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Wait.  You're saying the guy who made out like a bandit due to lax bankruptcy laws, bilked many out of their investment money, and won't even show his tax returns, is going to help us?  Really?  You do understand how silly that sounds.  Not to mention, it's been proven he doesn't stand by his promises. LOL

 

But 100% agreed.  Something needs to change.  Unfortunately, Trump doesn't look to be the person who'll do the changing.  But we'll see.

Yes we will.

[dunroaming]

I think that Trump will change things.  Question is, in which direction will it take the USA.  Down the swanee or up the creek.  Time will tell.

[craigt3365]

3 minutes ago, Grubster said:

Well I don't know but it sounds like he is still planning on building the wall, and doing something with healthcare, what other vague promises has he backed out of? Yes I'm sure he will back out of not letting any muslims in but I was smart enough to know that was a vote getting statement only. After all which president did all they said they would do? His nominations seem to be very strong leaders to me. Evidently you think he is in it for money with your conflict of interest statements. Really you think a billionaire would intentionally ruin his legacy like that? I don't. The swamp dwellers are shaking in their boots after fighting so hard against him. I bet the shredding machines have been running up our electric bill lately.

You are aware one of his potential cabinet members is from Exxon?  With massive investments in Russia? I'd say that person is in this for the money.  And a huge conflict of interest.

 

Lovely person.  Seems more of the swamp in coming to DC.

 

http://fortune.com/2017/01/11/rex-tillerson-trump-exxon-mobil-tax/

 

 

Quote

 

Why Trump Pick Rex Tillerson’s Questionable Tax Arrangement Is Bad News for Exxon

Rex Tillerson, Donald Trump's pick for Secretary of State, may be able to sidestep an $80 million tax bill in 2017. But the growing possibility that he might not could create a major headache for Tillerson as well as for his former company Exxon.

At Tillerson's confirmation hearing on Wednesday, the former Exxon Mobil (xom, +0.01%) CEO got a number of questions about his conflicts of interest. His biggest conflict by far is his huge interest in Exxon, through the direct ownership of about $54 million worth of shares, plus another $175 million in a financial contract called restricted stock units (RSUs).

 

 

Hard to support these kind of people.  Definitely the 1% everybody seems to talk about.

[Grubster]

3 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

You are aware one of his potential cabinet members is from Exxon?  With massive investments in Russia? I'd say that person is in this for the money.  And a huge conflict of interest.

 

Lovely person.  Seems more of the swamp in coming to DC.

 

http://fortune.com/2017/01/11/rex-tillerson-trump-exxon-mobil-tax/

 

 

 

Hard to support these kind of people.  Definitely the 1% everybody seems to talk about.

Well I disagree again as I think Tillerson is very wealthy and has no reason not to help fix the problems at hand even if the fix flies in the face of his former employer.

[heybruce]

7 hours ago, Grubster said:

He is qualified to be president as is every law abiding US born citizen of age in the US.  Having a great speaker might make you feel good but having a great leader will make the country good. Lets see what happens here. I may agree he is a bum as all the last nine presidents have been, but only time will tell. Neither you nor I can be sure what he will do.

What makes you think he will be a great leader?  Mis-managing a family fortune that would be much larger if he simply put it in an S&P 500 index fund and left it alone?

[heybruce]

7 hours ago, Grubster said:

Well I don't know but it sounds like he is still planning on building the wall, and doing something with healthcare, what other vague promises has he backed out of? Yes I'm sure he will back out of not letting any muslims in but I was smart enough to know that was a vote getting statement only. After all which president did all they said they would do? His nominations seem to be very strong leaders to me. Evidently you think he is in it for money with your conflict of interest statements. Really you think a billionaire would intentionally ruin his legacy like that? I don't. The swamp dwellers are shaking in their boots after fighting so hard against him. I bet the shredding machines have been running up our electric bill lately.

You mean building the fence-wall and promising that he'll someday, somehow get Mexico to pay for it?  Or putting the Republicans on the spot by saying the Affordable Care Act will be repealed and replaced on the same day, even though Congress is nowhere near to agreeing on a replacement?

 

Are you still holding out hope for his secret plan to defeat ISIS?  Oh wait, has that been superseded by a promise to order the generals to come up with a plan in 90 days?  How about getting rid of the Iran nuclear deal, do you think he'll do that?  Will you then hold him responsible when Iran starts building a nuclear weapon, followed by Saudi Arabia, then the rest of the region?  Do you think massive tariffs with Mexico, bad for both Mexico and the US, and a trade war with China will make America great again?

 

Then there are the questions about Russia--will he Putin's useful idiot or is he under Putin's thumb?

[Ulysses G.]

1 hour ago, heybruce said:

What makes you think he will be a great leader?  Mis-managing a family fortune that would be much larger if he simply put it in an S&P 500 index fund and left it alone?

 

Pure speculation based on guesses and very controversial figures. No one even knows how much Trump inherited. In other words, a typical, dishonest, left wing talking point.

Edited January 14, 2017 by Ulysses G.

[Credo]

3 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Pure speculation based on guesses and very controversial figures. No one even knows how much Trump inherited. In other words, a typical, dishonest, left wing talking point.

Yup, pure speculation on your part as well to defend the indefensible with right wing demagoguery.   You don't know either, so you attack others for not knowing.   

[Opl]

2 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Pure speculation based on guesses and very controversial figures. No one even knows how much Trump inherited. In other words, a typical, dishonest, left wing talking point.

 

It's difficult to know how really healthy his business are - indeed - as long as Trump does not release his tax returns. And he won't. And you agreed an said he doesn't have to.  His attitude is questionable.

 

"Great entrepreneurs build businesses with purpose at their heart and always treat people with respect. These are not characteristics I see in Mr Trump," 

 

http://fortune.com/2016/10/22/donald-trump-richard-branson/

 

[Ulysses G.]

2 hours ago, Credo said:

You don't know either, so you attack others for not knowing.   

 

Others that make dubious statements about things that they have no way to know.

[heybruce]

3 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Pure speculation based on guesses and very controversial figures. No one even knows how much Trump inherited. In other words, a typical, dishonest, left wing talking point.

 

And you clearly think it is acceptable to have a mystery man of unknown finances and financial connections as president.  A thin skinned autocrat that loves celebrity and loathes scrutiny.

 

I prefer someone who will open their finances to scrutiny so the public will be able to determine if he/she is honest and if there are any conflicts of interest.

Edited January 14, 2017 by heybruce

[Ulysses G.]

If tax returns showed all that, there would be no big-time criminals. They don't and the government has access to them already. No cigar.

[heybruce]

2 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

If tax returns showed all that, there would be no big-time criminals. They don't and the government has access to them already. No cigar.

 

You stubbornly maintain your naivety.  The IRS doesn't investigate criminal activity beyond illegal tax avoidance.  They don't ask why money was transferred to Trump's accounts through shell companies linked to Russia so long as the money is properly declared.  Until Trump releases his tax returns, or until the FBI (which appears to be very pro-Trump) subpoenas these tax returns, people will have their suspicions, with good reason.

[Ulysses G.]

I am not the one being naive. If there was illegal activity, the government would already know it. The records would have already been subpoenaed by the authorities long ago. The public has nothing to do with it. The Democrats obsession with demanding the tax returns is simply a political ploy.

Edited January 14, 2017 by Ulysses G.

[heybruce]

3 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

If tax returns showed all that, there would be no big-time criminals. They don't and the government has access to them already. No cigar.

 

47 minutes ago, heybruce said:

 

You stubbornly maintain your naivety.  The IRS doesn't investigate criminal activity beyond illegal tax avoidance.  They don't ask why money was transferred to Trump's accounts through shell companies linked to Russia so long as the money is properly declared.  Until Trump releases his tax returns, or until the FBI (which appears to be very pro-Trump) subpoenas these tax returns, people will have their suspicions, with good reason.

 

6 minutes ago, Ulysses G. said:

I am not the one being naive. If there was illegal activity, the government would already know it. The records would have already been subpoenaed by the authorities long ago. The public has nothing to do with it. The Democrats obsession with demanding the tax returns is simply a political ploy.

 

I see, you believe the all-seeing eye of the government allows no crime committed by the rich and well connected to go un-noticed and un-prosecuted.  Nothing naive about that.

[pitrevie]

6 minutes ago, heybruce said:

 

 

 

I see, you believe the all-seeing eye of the government allows no crime committed by the rich and well connected to go un-noticed and un-prosecuted.  Nothing naive about that.

 

And all this from Ulysses G who states that he voted for Obama first time around which is about as believable as Trump stating that he has read the Bible.

[Ulysses G.]

Only numerous long-term members know it is true. I am guessing that includes Scott and Jingthing, but go ahead and ignore all that.

Edited January 15, 2017 by Ulysses G.

[Ulysses G.]

22 hours ago, heybruce said:

 

 

 

I see, you believe the all-seeing eye of the government allows no crime committed by the rich and well connected to go un-noticed and un-prosecuted.  Nothing naive about that.

 

Possibly, sometimes, but certainly not Donald Trump. Try to be realistic.

[stevenl]

Only numerous long-term members know it is true. I am guessing that includes Scott and Jingthing, but go ahead and ignore all that.

Nobody knows that but yourself. You do claim so, looking at your attacks on Obama and defense of anything from Trump I don't believe it.

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[Ulysses G.]

That is your prerogative, but you are - once again - mistaken. 

[heybruce]

2 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Possibly, sometimes, but certainly not Donald Trump. Try to be realistic.

You first.  The IRS does not do intelligence work and is not responsible for investigating and prosecuting crimes.  It is a tax collecting agency, required by law to keep personal and financial information secret unless presented with a warrant.

 

As I said before, the IRS will take no action if money is transferred to one of Trump's accounts through a shell company with Russian ties provide the money is properly declared.  It also will not share this information with the FBI or any other agency unless required to by a warrant.  Any IRS employee who does so on their own initiative will be prosecuted under federal law. 

 

Trump's tax returns are secure from the FBI, CIA, press and all others until a court rules otherwise or Trump voluntarily releases them.  Every serious presidential candidate since Richard Nixon has released tax returns to assure the public they aren't up to anything questionable.  Trump, proving he is an incredible hypocrite, criticized Mitt Romney for his reluctance to release tax returns.  Now Trump refuses to release his tax returns under the pretext that he is under audit, even though being under audit in no way prevents him from releasing his returns.  He won't even present the IRS form letter informing him that he is being audited; we have to trust this notorious liar when he says he's being audited.

 

Is it any wonder that people think he's hiding something?

Edited January 16, 2017 by heybruce

[Ulysses G.]

And you really don't think that the FBI would issue a warrant if anything untoward was going on?  Try to be realistic.

[stevenl]

That is your prerogative, but you are - once again - mistaken. [emoji2]

Yes, the human mind is strong and can make us believe many things we did, even if we didn't do them.

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[Ulysses G.]

Just now, stevenl said:

Yes, the human mind is strong and can make us believe many things we did, even if we didn't do them.

 

 

Like claiming psychic powers that one does not really possess.

[heybruce]

55 minutes ago, Ulysses G. said:

And you really don't think that the FBI would issue a warrant if anything untoward was going on?  Try to be realistic.

How is the FBI going to find anything untoward going on?  Trump has businesses, accounts and lawyers all over the world, many outside of the jurisdiction of the FBI.  Also, there is no reason for Trump not to release his tax returns unless he is hiding something.  Try to be realistic.

Edited January 16, 2017 by heybruce

[Ulysses G.]

How would his tax returns show anything illegal overseas? Thanks for making my argument. It is silly to keep hounding him about his tax returns for any reason other than a dishonest talking point.