National Park in Krabi refuses to stop fleecing tourists - authorities preparing for "double pricing" showdown today

[MartinL]

1 minute ago, thetruth revealer said:

And if the Wife is Thai, who is gonna pay the entry Fee ???? RICH FARANG once again.

Its a bout time to leave !!!

If I go anywhere with my wife, WE pay, not me, not her but US together, as a couple.

 

One reason I refuse to pay more than my wife to enter e.g. a NP - somewhere we haven't been for quite a while -  is that she says "Paeng!" and a few more words to the ticket seller to express her disgust in response to the requested higher charge for me. If it's too expensive for her, it's also too expensive for me since we work to exactly the same budget. 

 

I have the Pink ID card but haven't tested it yet.

 

Years of not going to NPs have reduced my interest in going now, to be honest.

[Hardback]

The speedboat guys just want a bigger slice of the pie - If they cut the price of park admission, the 'all in' boat and entrance  fee will still be the same but the boaties will get a bigger cut. 

Edited February 22, 2017 by Hardback

[barryofthailand]

National Parks in thailand use to give expats the Thai price if you produce a work permit or Thai drivers liscence but once the Army took over that stoppe by order of the Junta

 

[ThaiWai]

4 hours ago, samjaidee said:

I'm not saying double pricing is right but really if you think about it, approximately 10 pounds, euros or dollars will not be considered an outrageous amount by a tourist to visit a marine park. Why should they spoil their holiday by missing out on the trip just to make a political point in a country where their voice will not be heard?

 

You sound like the guys that are willing to pay 120 baht for a cup of coffee here then tell me "What, it costs that much back home".  One of the main reasons I came here is to stop being ripped off by paying nearly $4 for a cup of f'ing coffee "back home".  

[Andrew Dwyer]

 
You sound like the guys that are willing to pay 120 baht for a cup of coffee here then tell me "What, it costs that much back home".  One of the main reasons I came here is to stop being ripped off by paying nearly $4 for a cup of f'ing coffee "back home".  

Yeah but don't say " I could buy a case of that in 7-11 " !!
Apparently that doesn't get good results [emoji51]


Sent from my iPhone with the usual amount of sincerity and sarcasm [emoji4]

[ThaiWai]

3 hours ago, denby45 said:

Has everyone lost sight of the fact that Thai's earn, in general, approximately only a tenth of what westerners earn. So tourists in my opinion should stop being Cheap Charlies and visit those wonderful parks. Imagine travelling all the way to Thailand and getting the hump over dual pricing. Cutting nose off to spite face comes to mind. Long term resident foreign pensioners here of course should be treated different and their pricing should be set at a level commensurate with their average income. I know that would be a difficult thing to work out very accurately but you could get at least somewhere near.    

 

Den

Ok, so then why don't you start paying 10x for gas or 10x for food or 10x for medical treatment since it makes so much sense to you? 

[Jiggo]

For every 10 tourists 9 do not visit, no problem they still make their money on the one that did....think that may be the 'Thai Logic:

[Bob12345]

3 hours ago, denby45 said:

Has everyone lost sight of the fact that Thai's earn, in general, approximately only a tenth of what westerners earn. So tourists in my opinion should stop being Cheap Charlies and visit those wonderful parks.

Why don't you stop being a cheap charlie and pay 10x over for your groceries, your gasoline, and the food court?

 

Pad thai at the street stall? Only 400 baht for you.

Drinking a beer in a bar, that will be 800 baht sir.

Flying from Bangkok to Phuket? 20,000 baht please.

Interested in a new Toyota Camry? Please hand over 14 million baht.

Tiny condo in BKK? Just 100 million baht for you sir.

 

Just stop being such a cheap charlie and pay 10 times what the locals pay for everything.

 

[kensisaket]

Pretty much zero chance of getting anything changed where the extra money is going straight into someone(s) pocket.  You can paint this picture any color you want; but, at the end of the day corruption by any other color or name is still corruption.  

 

[David in the north]

I've managed for over ten years without National Parks & have no intention of starting to visit them now.

[kovaltech]

5 hours ago, Inepto Cracy said:

Well Krabi put in your coal powered power station and will never have to worry about tourists again. No tourists, local or farang would want to go to a holiday destination, to get lung cancer and other blood and cancer related momentos.

Holidays are for happy memories, not being fleesed, getting ill or dying, on land or in the sea.

Too late to turn back the clock now.

But the " authorities" know better than the very tourists they seek to attract. Enjoy your memories of your lost past. 555.

I wonder... doesn't there exist a new president somewhere who's doing the same ? claiming that coal should be benefitted above renewables ? i wonder how many are going to suffer... or is that just collateral damage ?

[catinthehat]

4 hours ago, rudidep said:

Two tiered pricing by private enterprise (especially when using Thai script to hide the Thai prices) is despicable. This is different. Two-tiered pricing is set at all national parks in Thailand, and clearly posted in both English and Thai. I was told that the underlying rationale is that a flat fee to cover the cost of upkeep of the parks would raise the price of a ticket to a level where it would no longer be affordable for the average-income Thai family. Hence low prices for Thai, high prices for Tourists. There some logic to this...whether acceptable or not is a different matter and leave it to the forum to decide. Cheers.

Do you really think for one minute that any of the "excess" fees are spent on upkeep and repair of any park? NO That money (and I am sure some of the local fees) go right into the pockets of the park managers. Look at what happened in Koh Chang. Millions of TB per month. There is no justifying two tired pricing. I just hope that the news of it gets to ALL tourists before deciding on their itinerary while in Thailand. As others have said, it is not about the cost to foreigners rather the principal. Just keep giving them more rounds to put into both feet.

[Destiny1990]

Probably tier pricing will cost more than it produces.

[The Deerhunter]

7 hours ago, AlexRich said:

Never had this issue - I simply don't go. All foreigners should do likewise if they want to see 'farang price' stopped.

I have to point out that this whole situation will not bother some Thais in the least.  The ones who see them selves as not directly involved in, or directly reliant on the tourist industry, who see tourism as the root of all evil, as Thailand is really just for Thais only.

 

I have heard about these people but until recently thought I had never met any of them until I was recently refused service in a motorbike repair shop "Mai Me!!!"   I went over the road to an engineering shop where i am well know and courteously treated and she was stunned.  She penned a note for me explaining exactly what I wanted (which is among his basic stock-in-trade and sent me back there again.  He turned the note over and over, put it down, served another customer, and then showed it to his wife.  She glanced at me and said, "Tell him  not have!"   Which he did!  I stood and laughed very loudly and pointedly for a minute or two, shrugged and said "Mai Pen Rai" and left.  

[jesimps]

4 hours ago, rudidep said:

Two tiered pricing by private enterprise (especially when using Thai script to hide the Thai prices) is despicable. This is different. Two-tiered pricing is set at all national parks in Thailand, and clearly posted in both English and Thai. I was told that the underlying rationale is that a flat fee to cover the cost of upkeep of the parks would raise the price of a ticket to a level where it would no longer be affordable for the average-income Thai family. Hence low prices for Thai, high prices for Tourists. There some logic to this...whether acceptable or not is a different matter and leave it to the forum to decide. Cheers.

The assumption always is that tourists are much richer than Thais. Not true. We earn more but the cost of living in falangland is usually much higher than here.

Shouldn't matter though, a loaf of bread is the same price for all, as is a Ferrari. So too should local attractions be.

 

[4MyEgo]

This is the whole point when it comes to Thai's in the so called higher office, we know better, just do as your told as Thai's struggling to make a living watch the tourists go elsewhere, NEVER to return to the land of smiles, well its their cake, so they can choke on it if they want, makes sense to me 555

[kensisaket]

3 minutes ago, jesimps said:

The assumption always is that tourists are much richer than Thais. Not true. We earn more but the cost of living in falangland is usually much higher than here.

Shouldn't matter though, a loaf of bread is the same price for all, as is a Ferrari. So too should local attractions be.

 

And, there are a hell of a lot more Thais driving around in Ferrari's (or equivalent) than there are falangs.  

[thetruth revealer]

24 minutes ago, Destiny1990 said:

Probably tier pricing will cost more than it produces.

Good point !!!

But who cares ???

[cocorico2558]

For foreigners coming on tourist visas, therefore earning their living  overseas, 400 Baht is appropriate. But foreigners living in Thailand and on non-immigrant visas, very rarely having 10times the income of a Thai should have a different rate, let's say 200 Baht. You earn more, so you pay more, very fair!

[Bangkok Barry]

9 hours ago, jerojero said:

Great media attention for Thailand tourism. Thought by now the PM would have intervened!

 

The PM won't interfere because 10x pricing is the policy of his government and those who came before. These are national parks, run by government agencies. What it does is then set an example to every Thai that it is okay to overcharge foreigners, because it is official government policy.

As for the argument that Thais pay taxes and aliens don't, that is absolute nonsense. Every person who visits the country as well as aliens who live here pay taxes whenever they spend, including in hotels, restaurants etc. Two-tier pricing is based purely on race, nothing else, and is something that many Thais themselves are ashamed of.

Edited February 22, 2017 by Bangkok Barry

[janpharma]

It will boost tourism in Vietnam and Cambodja.  What about the Tourism Authority Minister?  Does she still thinks to get more tourist?

[ross163103]

I vote with my wallet and don't visit places that two tier price so the issue doesn't bother me. I do think its wrong but am glad to see there are some Thais that see the problem with it, normally this is strictly a farang issue.

[Eligius]

1 hour ago, ThaiWai said:

Ok, so then why don't you start paying 10x for gas or 10x for food or 10x for medical treatment since it makes so much sense to you? 

Good point, ThaiWai. This policy of price-hiking for foreigners is xenophobic discrimination, pure and simple. It is outrageous. And the fact that many barbers and other shops DELIBERATELY write the cheaper Thai price in Thai numerals (which most foreigners cannot read) and the higher foreigner price in English shows the deceitfulness of the whole thing. 

 

Yes, let those who try to defend this indefensible policy happily fork out double or triple or more for their groceries, taxi rides, bus rides, and all other purchases because - the foreigners are so much, much richer than the Thais. There are a good many rich Thais around these days - and many of them are those in power who are condoning and enforcing this kind of xenophobic, nationalistic nonsense (which is what it is) of much higher prices for foreigners.

 

Do people really believe, after all we have seen in recent years, that the extra money ripped off from foreigners in national parks, etc., really goes towards beautifying and protecting those places - and not into the pockets of the already VERY RICH AND POWERFUL? Are people really that naive?!!!

Edited February 22, 2017 by Eligius

[metisdead]

Off topic posts have been removed. 

[ocddave]

I am all for 10x pricing, just so long as it is reciprocated, meaning the WTO/UN sends out a notarized letter stating all Thai's visiting other WTO/UN countries should be charged 10x pricing, we can make this part of their entrance/visa stamp upon arriving in other countries. We can start by charging all Thai Embassy employee's around the world with this new cost structure, so they understand the rules. Make sure to apply this to the PM when he goes on his trips abroad, that way he understands the consequences as well.

[FitnessHealthTravel]

It's always about the money. Yet they leave shit everywhere and trash in the sea.  They see it as a money maker nothing more.  It's a real shame as it happens everywhere but it will end, they abuse their 'cash cow' and he'll run off to another paddock!

[Pilotman]

Of course there should be differential pricing so that Thais with lower  incomes can access facilities. Tourists should pay more and let's face it, the amounts hardly break the bank. Try a tourist attraction in the UK, where you pay hideous amounts of money the third rate attractions, and have anybof you gone to rip off  attractions in the US lately . 

[Havrum]

5 hours ago, denby45 said:

Has everyone lost sight of the fact that Thai's earn, in general, approximately only a tenth of what westerners earn. So tourists in my opinion should stop being Cheap Charlies and visit those wonderful parks. Imagine travelling all the way to Thailand and getting the hump over dual pricing. Cutting nose off to spite face comes to mind. Long term resident foreign pensioners here of course should be treated different and their pricing should be set at a level commensurate with their average income. I know that would be a difficult thing to work out very accurately but you could get at least somewhere near.    

 

Den

 

This westerner makes about $500 a month so I earn the same as most working class Thais and I have to save for most of the year to be able to come to Thailand.  Some Thais make $100,000 per month. Some farangs come from places like Russia, Ukraine, Serbia, Romania, Poland, etc where they don't earn much more than the average wage of Thailand. Just because you make 10 times more than the average Thai and don't mind being fleeced, don't generalize for everyone else.

[cornishcarlos]

I don't see a problem with giving locals a discount to an attraction in their area. This happens world over, but only local residents in that specific area.

Plus, if they actually put some of the proceeds back into upkeep of the attractions, I wouldn't feel bad about paying a reasonable amount, however they rarely bother with most National parks....

[Docno]

3 hours ago, Alan Deer said:

Almost every point you have listed is inaccurate - putting numbers by them doesn't make them any more accurate either. 

Defraying costs is not effective with the current system - government funding has remained static even thought the number of parks has increased disproportionately.

Research has also shown that Thai citizens are wTP more for most sites - to the tune of 100 to 200%.

Getting money form tourist at any attraction is done more effectively by secondary purchases and services rather than by entrance fees. As you identify, they have "money to burn" - but high entrance fees create a reluctance not a willingness to spend.

you mention cost of living - people actually spend about the same on their yearly holiday, regardless of destination - flight plus spending tends to be the formula - you mention a factor or 3 or 4 in spending power - so being asked 10 TIMES the local price doesn't really impress, does it?

worth the price - there is a complicated WTP formula that has been applied to various NPs around thailand and it found that entrance fees are a hindrance here. Also the Thai authorities have continued to ignore scientifically formulated advice and continue with their own prejudiced perspectives - and now ALL NPs have what amounts to a BLANKET entrance fee regardless of the attractions they offer.

 

 

"Research has also shown that Thai citizens are wTP more for most sites - to the tune of 100 to 200%" 

I never said that fees for locals should not be higher... only that I don't have a problem in principle with us paying more because we are able to (compared to the typical Thai)

 

"Getting money form tourist at any attraction is done more effectively by secondary purchases and services rather than by entrance fees." That would depend on the attraction. National parks typically have less in the way of purchasable services. I just returned from a volcano from Indonesia (where I paid entrance and my Indonesian friend did not). I bought a coffee. Because I am a foreigner, I also had to hire a tour guide (who actually was pretty good). They're not going to make much money selling me a coffee.

 

"high entrance fees create a reluctance not a willingness to spend"

Agreed - that's why I said that the entrance fee has to be in proportion to the attraction of the site

 

"you mention a factor or 3 or 4 in spending power - so being asked 10 TIMES the local price doesn't really impress, does it?"

Misapplication of math. The point is most things will be cheaper which makes up for the very occasional thing being more expensive. Now, 'more expensive' here means relative to what locals pay. Entrance fees at American national parks can be as high as US$25.

 

"there is a complicated WTP formula that has been applied to various NPs around thailand and it found that entrance fees are a hindrance here"

Again, I'm not arguing for particular fees and I was careful to state (and italicise) that the fees must be set in relation to what the site offers. I'm merely saying, on principle, I don't think there's anything wrong with two-tier pricing systems in developing countries for the reasons I stated.