Dutch poll test of anti-immigrant feeling, Turkish dispute

[webfact]

Dutch poll test of anti-immigrant feeling, Turkish dispute

By Philip Blenkinsop

REUTERS

 

An election poster billboard seen near a windmill the day before a general election, in Amsterdam, Netherlands, March 14, 2017. REUTERS/Michael Kooren

 

AMSTERDAM (Reuters) - The Dutch go to the polls on Wednesday in an election seen as a test of anti-immigrant and nationalist feeling magnified by a deepening dispute with Turkey.

 

The centre-right VVD party of Prime Minister Mark Rutte, 50, will vie with the PVV (Party for Freedom) of anti-Islam and anti-EU firebrand Geert Wilders, 53, to form the biggest party in parliament.

 

Wilders, who has vowed to "de-Islamicise" the Netherlands, has virtually no chance of forming a government given that all the leading parties have ruled out working with him, but a PVV win would still send shockwave across Europe.

 

The vote is the first of three this year seen as a test of anti-establishment sentiment in the European Union and the bloc's chances of survival after the surprise victory of EU-sceptic Donald Trump in the United States and Britain's 2016 vote to exit the union.

 

France chooses its next president, with far-right Marine Le Pen set to make the second-round run-off in May, while in September right-wing eurosceptic party Alternative for Germany, which has attacked Chancellor Angela Merkel's open-door refugee policy, will probably win its first lower house seats.

 

In the Netherlands, opinion polls indicated a three percentage point lead for Rutte's party over Wilders', although these did not fully take into account a rupture of diplomatic relations with Ankara after the Dutch banned Turkish ministers from addressing rallies of overseas Turks.

 

Turkish President Tayyip Erdogan accused the Dutch of behaving like Nazis.

 

Early indications are that the dispute may have helped both.

 

NO CLEAR WINNER, WEEKS OF BARGAINING

 

Unlike the U.S. or French presidential elections, there will be no outright Dutch winner, with up to 15 parties having a realistic chance of winning a seat in parliament and none set to gain even 20 percent of the vote.

 

Rutte's last government was a two-party coalition with the Labour Party, but at least four parties may now be needed to secure a majority in parliament. It would be the first such multi-party alliance since three in the 1970s. Two of those fell apart within 12 months.

 

Political risk consultants Eurasia Group said government formation was likely to be lengthy and could result in a weak coalition that would determine European Union policy at a critical time for the bloc.

 

Rutte, who is hoping Dutch economic recovery will win him backing, has been insistent on one thing - that he will neither accept the PVV as a coalition partner nor rely on Wilders to support a minority government, as was the case in 2010-2012.

 

The prime minister accuses Wilders of treachery for withdrawing support and creating a political crisis at a time of deep economic troubles.

 

"I will not work with such a party, Mr Wilders, not in a cabinet nor with you supporting from outside. Not, never, not," Rutte told Wilders in the only TV debate between the two, which was watched on Monday by 2.28 million viewers, the most for any election event.

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-03-15

[phantomfiddler]

Fifteen political parties ! Just imagine the huge amount of money required to support these conniving parasites when a much simpler and more effective system could be obtained using Singapore,s model :)

[sandrabbit]

It's going to be chaos if all the other parties refuse to work with Geert Wilders PVV, probably another election later on in the year.

[Grouse]

17 minutes ago, phantomfiddler said:

Fifteen political parties ! Just imagine the huge amount of money required to support these conniving parasites when a much simpler and more effective system could be obtained using Singapore,s model :)

The Netherlands is a democracy

[Grouse]

2 minutes ago, sandrabbit said:

It's going to be chaos if all the other parties refuse to work with Geert Wilders PVV, probably another election later on in the year.

No; it's going to be a coalition 

[sandrabbit]

2 minutes ago, Grouse said:

No; it's going to be a coalition 

Agreed but they do fall apart and unravel frequently, same in Belgium.

[Grouse]

29 minutes ago, sandrabbit said:

Agreed but they do fall apart and unravel frequently, same in Belgium.

True, but it's also possible to have too much stability. The UK system needs change to avoid single party arrogance if not tyranny 

[SoilSpoil]

1 hour ago, phantomfiddler said:

Fifteen political parties ! Just imagine the huge amount of money required to support these conniving parasites when a much simpler and more effective system could be obtained using Singapore,s model :)

The Dutch have a political system based on compromises. The Polder model as they call it. And its been quite succesfull and effwctive for them. 

[stevenl]

4 hours ago, phantomfiddler said:

Fifteen political parties ! Just imagine the huge amount of money required to support these conniving parasites when a much simpler and more effective system could be obtained using Singapore,s model :)

Even better, 28 parties are contesting in the elections.

[Baerboxer]

6 hours ago, Grouse said:

True, but it's also possible to have too much stability. The UK system needs change to avoid single party arrogance if not tyranny 

 

Why's that then Grousey because you don't like the results in the UK?

 

Liberals do a vanishing trick, Labor go back to Stalinist Trotskyism with a leader only the loony left, silly Trade Unionists, and former CND action grannies want to vote for,  fringe nutcase parties like UKIP and the Scottish National Socialist Party, whoops, sorry SNP, easy to confuse though.

 

That means however obnoxious the Tories are, people are actually voting for them; which means they will make their policies more extreme and see how far they can go. 

 

None of which suggests the Dutch, German, French, or American systems are any better.

[Grouse]

10 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Why's that then Grousey because you don't like the results in the UK?

 

Liberals do a vanishing trick, Labor go back to Stalinist Trotskyism with a leader only the loony left, silly Trade Unionists, and former CND action grannies want to vote for,  fringe nutcase parties like UKIP and the Scottish National Socialist Party, whoops, sorry SNP, easy to confuse though.

 

That means however obnoxious the Tories are, people are actually voting for them; which means they will make their policies more extreme and see how far they can go. 

 

None of which suggests the Dutch, German, French, or American systems are any better.

No the point is that whereas coalitions may be weak overall, the constituents make their voice heard. The Con Party just scoffs at everyone else. It was better by far when they had a coalition partner

[Baerboxer]

Just now, Grouse said:

No the point is that whereas coalitions may be weak overall, the constituents make their voice heard. The Con Party just scoffs at everyone else. It was better by far when they had a coalition partner

 

The problem with all political parties is that unbridled they go to extremes far greater than anything contained in their manifestos.

 

 

[stevenl]

And there was me thinking this topic was about Dutch politics.

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[Grouse]

3 minutes ago, stevenl said:

And there was me thinking this topic was about Dutch politics.

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It is.

 

Someone brought up the issue of multiple parties and coalitions. The discussion is absolutely relevant 

[stevenl]

It is.
 
Someone brought up the issue of multiple parties and coalitions. The discussion is absolutely relevant 

Yes, but not when the discussion goes into the 3 UK parties.

And now back to Dutch politics please?

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[stevenl]

And to start that, i am predicting a disappointing result for Wilders's PVV.

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[Guest]

11 minutes ago, stevenl said:

And to start that, i am predicting a disappointing result for Wilders's PVV.
 

How many parties usually have cabinet seats in NL? Eg. How many parties are required to form strong enough majority?

 

[stevenl]

How many parties usually have cabinet seats in NL? Eg. How many parties are required to form strong enough majority?

 

I guess about 10 parties represented in Congress, ATM a few more with elected parlementarians starting a new party but retaining their seat. Quite often 2 parties in a coalition, sometimes 3, looks like minimum 4 after these elections.

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[simple1]

11 hours ago, stevenl said:

And to start that, i am predicting a disappointing result for Wilders's PVV.

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You're correct! Wilder's lost and no way near gaining any access to power in a coalition. I hope the defeat signals an end to the poisonous politics of the extreme right gaining further traction in the coming elections in France and Germany.

Edited March 15, 2017 by simple1

[Prbkk]

By any measure ( except winning the World Cup) The Netherlands is one of the most successful countries on the planet. Fortunately the Dutch had the good sense to send this Wilders character packing,  despite his sartorial and beehive coiffure splendour.

[bandito]

On ‎3‎/‎15‎/‎2017 at 6:18 PM, stevenl said:

And to start that, i am predicting a disappointing result for Wilders's PVV.

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And as you undoubtable know by now, he lost.

But still 2nd place.

Rutte is the winner, not good but better than big mouth Wilders.

[stander]

The fact that Hollande and Merkel celebrate the Dutch Election result tells you how catastrophically bad it is for The Netherlands.