Sanders defends Trump's praise of Australian healthcare system

[rooster59]

Sanders defends Trump's praise of Australian healthcare system

 

U.S. Senator Bernie Sanders (I-VT) walks onto the stage as he is introduced by U.S. Senator Elizabeth Warren (D-MA) (not pictured) at a Our Revolution rally in Boston, Massachusetts, U.S., March 31, 2017. REUTERS/Mary Schwalm

 

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. Senator Bernie Sanders said on Saturday that President Donald Trump was right to call Australia's universal healthcare system better than the U.S. system.

 

Sanders, a self-described democratic socialist who ran for the Democratic presidential nomination last year, also said the Senate should use the Australian system as a model while crafting an alternative to Republican healthcare legislation that Trump endorses.

 

"President Trump is right. The Australian healthcare system provides healthcare to all of its people at a fraction of the cost than we do," Sanders commented on Twitter.

 

The tweet was accompanied by a short video that set out the virtues of Australia's universal healthcare system, saying it guarantees better service to all Australians at about half the cost of U.S. healthcare. The video also noted that Australians can expect to live longer than Americans, on average.

 

Sanders' tweet came two days after Trump told Australian Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull in New York: "You have better healthcare than we do."

 

The president's comment raised eyebrows, coming just after the U.S. House of Representatives had approved a Trump-backed bill that would overturn much of former President Barack Obama's signature healthcare law and move the U.S. system further away from universal coverage.

 

The White House later said Trump was simply being nice to an ally and does not think the United States should adopt Australia's healthcare approach.

 

The healthcare legislation that Trump endorses would pare back insurance protections for the sick, and, according to nonpartisan congressional researchers, would lead to 24 million more Americans being without health coverage by 2026.

 

But the bill's approval in the House on Thursday sent the legislation to the Senate, where it has little support.

 

"We will take this pathetic healthcare bill, throw it in the garbage can and do something that will work for ordinary Americans instead," Sanders said in a second Saturday tweet.

 

A Vermont independent, Sanders has become more influential in the Senate since 2016, when he took his long-shot presidential bid and turned it into a political movement against inequality.

 

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-05-07

[boomerangutang]

Sanders has more intelligence in the tip of his pinkie, than Trump has in his entire braincase.  

 

Trump says one (out of a thousand) things correctly, and Sanders agrees.  Whoopdeedoo.

[darksidedog]

I so wish Bernie had been elected. There is a man who understands what people need and could have been trusted to make America a much better place for its people.

Trump admits Australia's healthcare is better but won't do anything to adopt that which would be a massive improvement on the rubbish he is trying to foist upon the American public.

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, darksidedog said:

I so wish Bernie had been elected. There is a man who understands what people need and could have been trusted to make America a much better place for its people.

Trump admits Australia's healthcare is better but won't do anything to adopt that which would be a massive improvement on the rubbish he is trying to foist upon the American public.

 

IMHO Bernie is also a determined fighter and espouses a lot of realistic and balanced logic.

 

Personally I suspect Bernie is just a bit before his time for the US, overall I strongly believe the world is heading for social democracy and I hope that's true.  

 

I agree, I wish he was elected.

 

Edited May 7, 2017 by scorecard

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, scorecard said:

 

Bernie is also a determined fighter and he espouses a lot of realistic and balanced logic.

 

Personally I suspect Bernie is just a bit before his time, I strongly believe the world is heading for social democracy and I hope that's true.  

 

I agree, wish he was elected.

Bernie is a bit European. Most well-off western countries have general health care. I guess most of the western countries are indeed socialist countries, which is a good thing.

[Thakkar]

I watched the Trump clip of this several times, trying to remember how my child, when she was 4 years old, talked in discombobulated string of consciousness ramblings, and I think I've figured out what he was trying to say:

 

The Australian system is superior to Obamacare (true), and now that he has repealed Obamacare (partly true, but there's still a long, convoluted process to go through) and replaced it with Something Better (not true, even when and if the new bill is passed), America will have something akin to the Australian system (so far from true that it's laughable)

 

He either really believes that, in which case he's an imbecile, or he's trying to con his supporters, in which case he's treating them as imbeciles.

[lannarebirth]

2 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

Sanders has more intelligence in the tip of his pinkie, than Trump has in his entire braincase.  

 

Trump says one (out of a thousand) things correctly, and Sanders agrees.  Whoopdeedoo.

The Clinton supporters, who delivered the election victory to Trump, ought to be feeling pretty guilty about now. 

[Jingthing]

26 minutes ago, Emster23 said:

 You''re a newbie here, so let me give you a tip: this isn't some alt right site where you are encouraged to spout discombobulated nonsense. If you have a point to make, I suggest you do that with a bit of evidence. All this blather is a waste of our time, and perhaps even yours

Sure thing, he's a "newbie" and I'm the Queene of England. 

[metisdead]

An offensive post containing profane language has been removed, the replies were removed as well. 

[sanukjim]

3 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

Sanders has more intelligence in the tip of his pinkie, than Trump has in his entire braincase.  

 

Trump says one (out of a thousand) things correctly, and Sanders agrees.  Whoopdeedoo.

So boomeraangutang,you are a scientist able to evaluate the intelligence of others,WOW.What university are you a professor in ? Cambridge?,Columbia? Ramkhamhaeng in Bangkok?

[heybruce]

"The White House later said Trump was simply being nice to an ally and does not think the United States should adopt Australia's healthcare approach."

 

Right, we've seen how Trump goes out of his way to complement allies.  Oh wait, it's the tyrants he complements, the allies he offends!  Is there something about PM Turnball we don't know?

[heybruce]

Clever move, to the conservatives there is no insult worse than having Bernie Sanders agree with you.  Well done Bernie.

 

Also, if you look at facts instead of rhetoric, he's correct:  Australia and many other countries have far better health care than the US, and pay much less for it.  In terms of value for money, people in the US are being played for fools by the healthcare system.

[sirineou]

Unless the costs are not brought down , who pays for it is irrelevant. It will always be too expensive in the scheme of things.

It will be either too expensive for the insurance companies and they will require that Others (gov, or consumer) pay more, It will be too expensive for the Gov. and require that Insurance except less or consumer pay more, and it would be too expensive for consumer and require that either Insurance ask for less, Gov subsidizes more,, or do with out.

In every part of the equation there is conflict, and it will not work

All these machinations   will only prolong the pain for all involved , in the end there is only one solution.

Medicare for all, the single payer solution.

It is inevitable, the only question how many should suffer and for how long.

 

Edited May 7, 2017 by sirineou
add punctuation

[Srikcir]

2 hours ago, sam101glt said:

Seriously There's a Reason You Liberal Snowflakes are Living in Thailand!Hillary Lost Bernie Never Stood a Chance and Your Hero Barack F--ked Up the Country So Bad It'll take 8 years to get it working again! You guys just go back to your pints or whatever you guys call it and go back to sleep REALLY We Don't Need Your Help At All!!  Now That Hillary,Barack and Bernie are Gone We Know you need a New Titty to Suck but I'm afraid the Thai Girls aren't that well endowed unless you guys are more incline to the Katoys of which I'm pretty sure you may be?

Your total reputation speaks for itself - ZERO

[tomwct]

I understand Sanders is going to Venezuela to try and talk his fellow Socialist to resign because it's hurting fellow Socialists

images across the Globe. He will also ask that Venezuela give a free education to everyone that wants one, but the

first priority is to give everyone something to eat. Some haven't eaten in weeks. 

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, tomwct said:

I understand Sanders is going to Venezuela to try and talk his fellow Socialist to resign because it's hurting fellow Socialists

images across the Globe. He will also ask that Venezuela give a free education to everyone that wants one, but the

first priority is to give everyone something to eat. Some haven't eaten in weeks. 

Sounds like fake news, dude.

[55Jay]

I like old Bernie's approach to Trump from the outset.  He's a calm, reasoned voice, but avoids rolling around in the gutter with the bottom rung in "The Resistance". 

 

Which is why he retains credibility.  I don't think Trump is ready to pull his head out and ask him for advice yet.  Probably never, but it sure would be nice to have an adult in the room.

Edited May 7, 2017 by 55Jay

[Traveler19491]

5 hours ago, tomwct said:

I understand Sanders is going to Venezuela to try and talk his fellow Socialist to resign because it's hurting fellow Socialists

images across the Globe. He will also ask that Venezuela give a free education to everyone that wants one, but the

first priority is to give everyone something to eat. Some haven't eaten in weeks. 

 

 

You simple minds who keep calling Sanders a "socialist" tend to get boring after a while. Sanders is not a socialist. It would be such a breath of fresh air if once, just once, you blatherers on the right could get your terms straight and understand the definition of each. Sanders, as he himself has said endlessly, is a democratic socialist. There's a difference. Look it up. And look at the many countries that embrace democratic socialism. Most of which are considerably better off than the US. And just for the record...your assertion that Sanders is going to Venezuela is, indeed, fake news.

Edited May 7, 2017 by Traveler19491

[boomerangutang]

8 hours ago, sanukjim said:

So boomerangutang,you are a scientist able to evaluate the intelligence of others,WOW.What university are you a professor in ? Cambridge?,Columbia? Ramkhamhaeng in Bangkok?

                         Instead of continuing to sit in a hard chair at a university, facing the front of a room, pretending I was interested in what the teacher was teaching, I left HS and went traveling and working and getting knocked around in the school of hard knocks.   I've met a lot of University-educated folks, and to assume they're smarter than others who are at the bottom of the privilege heap, is a stretch.  Indeed, I was good buddies with a guy who was top of his law class at Yale, and he turned into a messed-up, hot-headed problem.  Universities are to smarts what an umbrella is is to mixing concrete.   It's a way for slick-willies to make money (rather like Trump and his University), and for youngsters to extend (by 4 to 10 years) the time they stay sheltered from the real world.

[thaibeachlovers]

12 hours ago, darksidedog said:

I so wish Bernie had been elected. There is a man who understands what people need and could have been trusted to make America a much better place for its people.

Trump admits Australia's healthcare is better but won't do anything to adopt that which would be a massive improvement on the rubbish he is trying to foist upon the American public.

Seriously? You think Trump can do anything on his own? You think he could get politicians paid off by lobbyists to agree to throw out the insurance companies?

He barely got the present law passed- zero chance he could get single payer in.

 

[thaibeachlovers]

6 hours ago, tomwct said:

I understand Sanders is going to Venezuela to try and talk his fellow Socialist to resign because it's hurting fellow Socialists

images across the Globe. He will also ask that Venezuela give a free education to everyone that wants one, but the

first priority is to give everyone something to eat. Some haven't eaten in weeks. 

 

Some haven't eaten in weeks. 

 

Try not eating for weeks and see if you are still alive.

 

It must have pained him to agree with Trump, but good on him for doing so.

 

 

Edited May 7, 2017 by thaibeachlovers

[sirineou]

9 minutes ago, boomerangutang said:

                         Instead of continuing to sit in a hard chair at a university, facing the front of a room, pretending I was interested in what the teacher was teaching, I left HS and went traveling and working and getting knocked around in the school of hard knocks.   I've met a lot of University-educated folks, and to assume they're smarter than others who are at the bottom of the privilege heap, is a stretch.  Indeed, I was good buddies with a guy who was top of his law class at Yale, and he turned into a messed-up, hot-headed problem.  Universities are to smarts what an umbrella is is to mixing concrete.   It's a way for slick-willies to make money (rather like Trump and his University), and for youngsters to extend (by 4 to 10 years) the time they stay sheltered from the real world.

Intelligence and education are two different things .

Education provides you the information, intelligence enables you to utilize such information  for useful purposes.

The more information you have the closer you can come to the truth, so intelligent with limited information can give an incomplete picture but a sincere  belief in the resulting opinion.

It does not help to question  the intelligence, only the information. 

A conventional formal education  will provide you with the necessary information but is not the only source,Intelligent people such as you will seek information in many different venues.   But there are known unknowns and unknown unknowns , a sincere conversation with out value judgments can help expose unknown unknowns for all involved.  

My two cents worth in the subject

 

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

30 minutes ago, sirineou said:

Intelligence and education are two different things .

Education provides you the information, intelligence enables you to utilize such information  for useful purposes.

The more information you have the closer you can come to the truth, so intelligent with limited information can give an incomplete picture but a sincere  belief in the resulting opinion.

It does not help to question  the intelligence, only the information. 

A conventional formal education  will provide you with the necessary information but is not the only source,Intelligent people such as you will seek information in many different venues.   But there are known unknowns and unknown unknowns , a sincere conversation with out value judgments can help expose unknown unknowns for all involved.  

My two cents worth in the subject

 

 

 

My two cents is a little off topic,  but does involve healthcare, to be specific, nurses and university education.

During my long time in hospitals they changed nurse training from in hospital to university. While the end product of the university education were by no means stupid, they were inferior to the hospital trained nurses. Many needed an extra year of on the job training to be able to do their job.

[klikster]

8 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

                         Instead of continuing to sit in a hard chair at a university, facing the front of a room, pretending I was interested in what the teacher was teaching, I left HS and went traveling and working and getting knocked around in the school of hard knocks.

So, you left HS (High School?) before you dropped out of "a university"  so you could get knocked around?

 

Helluva career path!

[timber]

Kinda no win situation.  The  pharmaceutical and medical treatment lobbyists support the people getting elected into office, and if  pharmaceutical and medical treatment is costing 2 or 3 times as much as anywhere else how do they expect to get comparative costs.

[ilostmypassword]

12 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Seriously? You think Trump can do anything on his own? You think he could get politicians paid off by lobbyists to agree to throw out the insurance companies?

He barely got the present law passed- zero chance he could get single payer in.

 

Yes, supporting a bill that would slash taxes on the wealthy was definitely a courageous move on Trump's part.

[heybruce]

16 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Seriously? You think Trump can do anything on his own? You think he could get politicians paid off by lobbyists to agree to throw out the insurance companies?

He barely got the present law passed- zero chance he could get single payer in.

 

What law has Trump got passed?  The replacement for Affordable Health Care made it through the House of Representatives, but it is a long way from becoming law.

 

Getting universal health care through congress would be a long fight, and currently no one in Washington seems interested in taking it on.  Most Americans are unaware of simple, easy to understand facts about single payer systems--they cost significantly less and deliver better health care.  http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2015/oct/us-health-care-from-a-global-perspective 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/danmunro/2014/06/16/u-s-healthcare-ranked-dead-last-compared-to-10-other-countries/#6df1a9dc576f

[thaibeachlovers]

2 hours ago, heybruce said:

What law has Trump got passed?  The replacement for Affordable Health Care made it through the House of Representatives, but it is a long way from becoming law.

 

Getting universal health care through congress would be a long fight, and currently no one in Washington seems interested in taking it on.  Most Americans are unaware of simple, easy to understand facts about single payer systems--they cost significantly less and deliver better health care.  http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2015/oct/us-health-care-from-a-global-perspective 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/danmunro/2014/06/16/u-s-healthcare-ranked-dead-last-compared-to-10-other-countries/#6df1a9dc576f

You ignored most of what I said and made a distortion of the rest.

So long as members of congress are owned by the lobbyists, no single payer system is going to get in. They'll be lucky to even get cross border insurance passed.

The voters did their best to get someone to stand up to the lobbyists, but one man isn't enough in the American system.

I still think Trump should have waited till Obamacare collapsed under it's sheer unworkability, then he would have had less trouble bringing in something better. Some states already have no insurance companies. More will follow to be sure.

[ilostmypassword]

12 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You ignored most of what I said and made a distortion of the rest.

So long as members of congress are owned by the lobbyists, no single payer system is going to get in. They'll be lucky to even get cross border insurance passed.

The voters did their best to get someone to stand up to the lobbyists, but one man isn't enough in the American system.

I still think Trump should have waited till Obamacare collapsed under it's sheer unworkability, then he would have had less trouble bringing in something better. Some states already have no insurance companies. More will follow to be sure.

What evidence do you have that Trump is even interested in standing up to the lobbyists. The large number of Wall Street people he's hired? Maybe it's this?

Top Ethics Officer Challenges Trump Over Secret Waivers for Ex-Lobbyists

 The federal government’s top ethics officer is challenging the Trump administration’s issuance of secret waivers that allow former lobbyists to handle matters they recently worked on, setting up a confrontation between the ethics office and President Trump.

The move by Walter M. Shaub Jr., the director of the Office of Government Ethics, is the latest sign of rising tension between Mr. Shaub and the Trump White House. Mr. Shaub has tried several times to use his limited powers to force Mr. Trump to broadly honor federal ethics rules as well as the ethics order that Mr. Trump himself signed in late January.

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/05/01/us/politics/top-ethics-officer-challenges-trump-over-secret-waivers-for-ex-lobbyists.html

 

 

[heybruce]

7 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

What evidence do you have that Trump is even interested in standing up to the lobbyists. The large number of Wall Street people he's hired? Maybe it's this?

Top Ethics Officer Challenges Trump Over Secret Waivers for Ex-Lobbyists

 The federal government’s top ethics officer is challenging the Trump administration’s issuance of secret waivers that allow former lobbyists to handle matters they recently worked on, setting up a confrontation between the ethics office and President Trump.

The move by Walter M. Shaub Jr., the director of the Office of Government Ethics, is the latest sign of rising tension between Mr. Shaub and the Trump White House. Mr. Shaub has tried several times to use his limited powers to force Mr. Trump to broadly honor federal ethics rules as well as the ethics order that Mr. Trump himself signed in late January.

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/05/01/us/politics/top-ethics-officer-challenges-trump-over-secret-waivers-for-ex-lobbyists.html

 

 

Interesting reading.  Either Trump has no concept of ethics or he is a colossal hypocrite.  Or both.

 

Regardless we can be certain there will be no draining of the swamp.  Trump will make the swamp bigger, deeper and murkier.

Edited May 8, 2017 by heybruce