Report: All foreign tourists will soon need insurance in order to enter Thailand

[mommysboy]

3 minutes ago, jethro69 said:

Let's assume it's gonna happen, and they might hide it in the plane ticket, or make it mandatory that only the gov insurance (purchased @ point of entry) is the right one. So I guess I would just cancel my existing policy. A lot of Insurance (Thai) companies would be happy.

 

It would likely only be for emergency, and repatriation.  It would not in any way match your existing policy or any health insurance you hold.  I doubt it would cover elective surgery for instance.

[jpinx]

This topic is such an old chestnut, it's been kicking around the agendas of the Tourist Authority meetings for many years, but it's not easy to apply it in real life because of the multitude of methods of getting a permission-to-stay stamp.  Most of the stories which appear in the news about someone who's had an accident and can't pay the bill seem to be from tourists -- not extended stayers.  It'd be really useful to have some basic data of accident versus visa type before they start enforcing some complicated and unfair system which will only line the pockets of the private hospitals.

[jethro69]

2 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

 

It would likely only be for emergency, and repatriation.  It would not in any way match your existing policy or any health insurance you hold.  I doubt it would cover elective surgery for instance.

My current policy includes repatriation, but it works a bit the other way round. It's meant to get me back into Thailand should I have a major accident somewhere in Loas, Cambodia or the like. Should maybe read the 25 pages fine print one day.

[mommysboy]

5 minutes ago, jethro69 said:

My current policy includes repatriation, but it works a bit the other way round. It's meant to get me back into Thailand should I have a major accident somewhere in Loas, Cambodia or the like. Should maybe read the 25 pages fine print one day.

Sorry don't get your point.  I thought we were talking about basic insurance in Thailand to be levied on all visitors to cover basic hospital costs in case of emergency.

[mommysboy]

12 minutes ago, jpinx said:

This topic is such an old chestnut, it's been kicking around the agendas of the Tourist Authority meetings for many years, but it's not easy to apply it in real life because of the multitude of methods of getting a permission-to-stay stamp.  Most of the stories which appear in the news about someone who's had an accident and can't pay the bill seem to be from tourists -- not extended stayers.  It'd be really useful to have some basic data of accident versus visa type before they start enforcing some complicated and unfair system which will only line the pockets of the private hospitals.

The accidents are about toursits.  But I think the problem group is the expat stayers who run out of options. Help for these people is much needed and long overdue.

Edited June 5, 2017 by mommysboy

[jethro69]

3 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

Sorry don't get your point.  I thought we were talking about basic insurance in Thailand to be levied on all visitors to cover basic hospital costs in case of emergency.

Makes no sense to further discuss it as long nobody knows what the "basic insurance" will cover, but I'm pretty sure with whatever they'll come up, my policy covers it already.

[MaxYakov]

11 hours ago, CLW said:

And show me that hospital that treats foreigners without paying or credit card deposit.
Anyway most travel insurance you have to pay first by yourself and claim afterwards

I can show you two: Bumrungrad Intl and St. Louis (both Bangkok) both treated me without pre-payment or CC deposit. Bumrundgrad's hernia operation was more than 100,000 THB and they trusted me for it until I checked out. It could be because I had a good credit history with them. I don't know why.

[mommysboy]

3 minutes ago, jethro69 said:

Makes no sense to further discuss it as long nobody knows what the "basic insurance" will cover, but I'm pretty sure with whatever they'll come up, my policy covers it already.

 

Oh sure, but this is isn't about you, is it?

 

It's good that you are adequately covered.

 

In the main, it would likely suit everyone that there is universal coverage- no arguments.

 

 

 

 

[mommysboy]

3 minutes ago, MaxYakov said:

I can show you two: Bumrungrad Intl and St. Louis (both Bangkok) both treated me without pre-payment or CC deposit. Bumrundgrad's hernia operation was more than 100,000 THB and they trusted me for it until I checked out. It could be because I had a good credit history with them. I don't know why.

They are legally obliged to treat emergency.  It may not be a case of trusting.  Had you not paid, there may have been some options oipen to them to enforce payment.  A poor person would likely have come to a monthly arrangment.

Edited June 5, 2017 by mommysboy

[George FmplesdaCosteedback]

20 minutes ago, jethro69 said:

Let's assume it's gonna happen, and they might hide it in the plane ticket, or make it mandatory that only the gov insurance (purchased @ point of entry) is the right one. So I guess I would just cancel my existing policy. A lot of Insurance (Thai) companies would be happy.

It's the usual Thai B/S. They can't "hide it in the plane ticket" unless it goes on the landing fee or a new "Entry Fee" at other boarders.

They never think anything through before making another stupid proposal.

It will no doubt just be another harebrained idea that will get swept under the carpet in a week or so.

Yes, a lot of Thai insurance companies and their shareholders would be rubbing their grubby hands if they could get this scam to work. And I expect TAT would be happy enough to report; " New insurance policy rule will increase tourist numbers" too.

 

[MaxYakov]

7 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

They are legally obliged to treat emergency.  It may not be a case of trusting.  Had you not paid, there may have been some options oipen to them to enforce payment.  A poor person would likely have come to a monthly arrangment.

All my treatments were non-emergencies. I don't know what recourse they have to enforce payment and I don't want to find out.

 

Anyway, isn't this required insurance only a "proposal" at this point according to the OP? Much ado about a "proposal" that was made to look like a "done deal"?

Edited June 5, 2017 by MaxYakov

[mommysboy]

1 minute ago, MaxYakov said:

All my treatments were non-emergencies. I don't know what recourse they have to enforce payment and I don't want to find out.

 

 

As you say, perhaps it was your track record.  Normally, they will ask questions, eg, ask about your health policy and perhaps liaise with the claims department, or take a credit card and make an initial charge.

 

If you were brought in unconscious, then every hospital is obliged to treat any life threatening condition, regardless of financial situation.

[Ruffian Dick]

I thought this was travel insurance, not health insurance.

[gk10002000]

10 hours ago, greeneking said:

Just suppose a policy was taken by an average visitor.  Would it cover for renting a motorbike?  For a rider with no license as is usual?

It might not even cover riding in a tuk tuk.

What about elephant riding, cuddling tigers, trekking, rock climbing, ziplines and bunjy jumping, white water rafting, jet skis and scuba diving?

At the airport point of issue should the tourist be informed they should not do any of these?

Probably it would cover for the most dangerous of them all - crossing the road!

yeah, all those things typically require special riders on routine policies from at home or just for travel. It is not clear if they mean accident insurance or comprehensive medical insurance for say chronic conditions, heart attacks, or some illness not necessarily associated with travel or an accident.

[mommysboy]

13 minutes ago, Ruffian Dick said:

I thought this was travel insurance, not health insurance.

 

11 minutes ago, gk10002000 said:

yeah, all those things typically require special riders on routine policies from at home or just for travel. It is not clear if they mean accident insurance or comprehensive medical insurance for say chronic conditions, heart attacks, or some illness not necessarily associated with travel or an accident.

I took it to mean hospital treatment- emergency in patient for the purpose of treating a life threatening situation, and repatriation.  A good example might be burst appendix.

 

Obviously, it would not be for elective surgery, an example of which might be standard hip replacement or nose job.

 

Countries like UK already have such emergency arrangments for all visitors, regardless of status. It basically means that nobody's life is at undue risk.

 

 

Read the last paragraph of the opening post: " The requirement is seen as helping to reduce the burden on Thai hospitals who are being forced to treat an increasing number of uninsured foreigners."  From this I think we can assume this is not about stolen cameras, and delayed flights.

Edited June 5, 2017 by mommysboy

[MaxYakov]

38 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

 

 

As you say, perhaps it was your track record.  Normally, they will ask questions, eg, ask about your health policy and perhaps liaise with the claims department, or take a credit card and make an initial charge.

 

If you were brought in unconscious, then every hospital is obliged to treat any life threatening condition, regardless of financial situation.

That's good to hear (if it's is enforced -  ). I've heard stories to the contrary years ago. It was recommended that a credit card and passport be carried at all times because an accident victim without a credit card had been refused treatment at a particular hospital.

 

FWIW: 

72-hour emergency treatment for free at any hospital Thai Visa forum - April 1, 2017 [link]

 

From the Thai Visa forum The Nation  OP article:

 

"She [Thai Medical Error Network director Preeyanan Lorsermvattana] added that Thailand still did not have enough emergency physicians and it was important that everyone should take good care of their health so they will not become an emergency patient."

 

So...take good care of your health while perched on that motorbike or ensconced in that Tuk Tuk at 60+ km/h or visa run van at 120+ km/h, ya'all hear?

 

PS: What is a "Thai Medical Error Network", anyway? Based on the April 1 publish date and the fact that the OP is from The Nation, I'm starting to wonder. Anyway, a confusing discussion on the above, linked thread.

Edited June 5, 2017 by MaxYakov

[George FmplesdaCosteedback]

What we are forgetting is how much medical care costs differ from the hospital to hospital in Thailand.

If you are unfortunate enough to have an accident it depends where you are taken to, or go to and how badly injured you are. And if you live out in the sticks.

I had seven stitches in my leg after falling into an uncovered drain in the floodwater some years ago.

The charge was about ฿200 including some antibiotic shots and pills to take home from the pharmacy.

I had to wait about 45 minutes (I have waited 4+ hours in an A&E in England).

I've also been charged ฿4,000 for "dyspepsia" at another hospital when my girlfriend had serious stomach pain... A couple of Antocil, a burp and good fart now cost me nothing.

 

Also in the UK where NHS care is "free" it would have cost me ฿1,000 in a taxi to get to a hospital, as I didn't need an ambulance (you can wait hours for an ambulance in the UK for non emergencies).

Drugs administered at UK hospitals are free, but every item from an outside chemist is about ฿500 these days unless you are exempt.

If you are really very sick the care here is as good as many NHS hospitals I have been to (most have better and newer equipment), and considering all the tax money you pay it is favorably comparable over the years. Some UK companies offer BUPA etc private care as part of employment deal, but it is taxed as a perk the same as company cars.

Once you retire or if you bought cover yourself the premiums increase I believe.

It is a balancing act, or a question of odds. With any existing problems you will pay extra for cover, and once over 60 the costs just increase even if you are fit and healthy in the compulsory annual medical.

Getting nursing care at home here is relatively cheap, where as in the UK it could cost you all your savings and then your house.

Do you expect to drop dead of a heart attack, or die slowly of cancer? A serious accident of course will be different, depending on injuries.

Nobody can tell.

Take care!

 

 

 

[George FmplesdaCosteedback]

1 hour ago, Ruffian Dick said:

I thought this was travel insurance, not health insurance.

From the OP : "a proposal that would require foreigners applying for an extension of stay to have valid medical insurance" is being considered as part of the plan.

A retirement "visa" is an extension of stay...

[Laab Muu]

1 hour ago, mommysboy said:

Countries like UK already have such emergency arrangments for all visitors, regardless of status. It basically means that nobody's life is at undue risk.

 

Correct, they charge an NHS surcharge of about £600 in a spouse visa application.

[Ruffian Dick]

1 hour ago, mommysboy said:

 

I took it to mean hospital treatment- emergency in patient for the purpose of treating a life threatening situation, and repatriation.  A good example might be burst appendix.

 

Obviously, it would not be for elective surgery, an example of which might be standard hip replacement or nose job.

 

Countries like UK already have such emergency arrangments for all visitors, regardless of status. It basically means that nobody's life is at undue risk.

 

 

Read the last paragraph of the opening post: " The requirement is seen as helping to reduce the burden on Thai hospitals who are being forced to treat an increasing number of uninsured foreigners."  From this I think we can assume this is not about stolen cameras, and delayed flights.

I think we will have to wait for some sort of official announcement instead of teasing out meaning from a reporter's interpretation of the government's discussion. Third or fourth hand knowledge etc.

It's not clear to me how one can get any kind of useful health insurance from a coin-operated machine.

[dopenhagen]

Wouldn't be difficult, since most arrive via Air, and anyone rejected at immigration by regulations become the responsibility of the Airlines, the Airlines would be enticed to enforce the check for valid insurance at the same time they verify that the traveler has an exit ticket from Thailand.

Secondly, the description goes on implementing the compulsory insurance at the time of extension, which makes all the comments about chaos upon arrival to Thailand even more stupid.

However the key argument is that the airlines will be enforcing it, and the few entering Thailand which are tourists can easily be rejected at the border without hassle since they presumably would have legitimate helm to stay in the departing country...

 

[Laab Muu]

Well it's getting coverage in the international news media now, Sky news is running the story featuring Jaturon Phakdeewanit, director of the Tourism Safety and Security Standards as saying visitors without travel insurance have cost Thailand at least 3 billion baht ($A117 million) a year for their medical treatments at state hospitals. "We need to push this through as soon as possible because the problem is becoming more serious," 

 

 

[George FmplesdaCosteedback]

11 minutes ago, Laab Muu said:

Correct, they charge an NHS surcharge of about £600 in a spouse visa application.

I heard this was to be implemented, but I didn't hear it had been.

So, for a Thai going to stay with , live with her UK husband the visa fee now includes an NHS charge of ฿26,000+. How about students going to study in England?

It is a very good point.

 

[Laab Muu]

4 minutes ago, George FmplesdaCosteedback said:

I heard this was to be implemented, but I didn't hear it had been.

So, for a Thai going to stay with , live with her UK husband the visa fee now includes an NHS charge of ฿26,000+. How about students going to study in England?

It is a very good point.

 

£150 per year for students, so if they apply for a 2 year student visa they have to pay £300 NHS surcharge on application. All others is £200 per year, any visa under 6 months does not require it.

 

https://www.gov.uk/healthcare-immigration-application/how-much-pay

Edited June 5, 2017 by Laab Muu
Added Link

[ThaidaGwaii]

If car rental can run a pre-tab on someone's credit card, why the hospitals can't do the same?

[George FmplesdaCosteedback]

37 minutes ago, Laab Muu said:

£150 per year for students, so if they apply for a 2 year student visa they have to pay £300 NHS surcharge on application. All others is £200 per year, any visa under 6 months does not require it.

 

https://www.gov.uk/healthcare-immigration-application/how-much-pay

Thanks for that. Well is isn't such a bad deal for anyone who can afford to study in the UK. Full medical care for ฿6500 a year. What would the insurance policy cost? If they have comprehensive international medical care insurance from a recognized company already do they have to pay or just prove it is valid?

I know everyone needs proof of financial status, but do they have to put a substantial (฿800,000 for 1 year retirement) sum in an UK bank too?

It's a bit swings and roundabouts now.

Edited June 5, 2017 by George FmplesdaCosteedback

[cyborgx]

I was treated in a Bangkok Government Hospital including inpatient as well as many outpatient visits. I don't recall seeing even 1 other foreigner during any of the visits!

Edited June 5, 2017 by cyborgx

[IMA_FARANG]

I will support a corresponding  rule that all  Thai  tourists entering the U.S. be required to show a one week minimum insurance requirement before entering the U.S.

Since U.S. health costs run a minimum of 400 to 500 dollars for a one night stay in an average U.S. hospital in case of an accident that means a Thai tourist arriving in the U.S. must show at lest 400 U.S. dollars per day of insurance coverage from a U.S. insurance provider on entrance to the U.S.

At roughly 35 Baht to one dollar, that means a Thai entering the U.S. must show evidence of 

140,000 Baht per family member to enter the U.S. for a one week entry to the U.S.

What is "good foe the Goose is good for the Gander", as the saying goes.

 

 

[Laab Muu]

I don't get why people are so upset or opposed to the idea. Its a reasonable proposal, the public health system is not flush with cash, and if this helps then its a reasonable request.

[timendres]

This only question here being: which major Thai health insurance company is pushing for this, and who at the government level is tapping into the massive avalanche of money about to come down the mountain.