Retirement dreams on Chiang Mai "Hi-So Hill" shattered as foreigner pensioners conned into buying forestry land

[theguyfromanotherforum]

3 hours ago, trogers said:

When I buy shares in a company, I would first be concerned about its line of business in that state of economy and the returns it is generating from the capital it has obtained.

 

If I am only concerned about how many days I would get to use the Lamborghini of the Chairman of the Board, my motive for putting money in that company who be suspected.

 

That's it. People spent more time doing a research when buying a TV..... but you wanna buy a house in Thailand... well, I'll just have some website take care.

 

Stupid.

 

The two studs in the picture got taken to the cleaners. They are probably smart guys too, but when it comes to greed and women even the smartest, richest people will get fleeced.

 

4 hours ago, off road pat said:

What is it with people? wanting to possess, having more and more...if they juts talked to a few farangs/expats around with there plans of buying land and build houses ?  they would already have reasonable good advice !!! DON'T BUY !!!

 

Right. As if they would listen.

 

People like this who get scammed already have their mind made up.

[Wake Up]

If you are not careful or you are unlucky then you can say RIP to your ?. 

 

Humilating and sad to think some of these fine men went to sleep with retirement dreams and woke up broke. Seen it happen many times. Devastating and hope they recover and the crooks go to jail. 

[Samuel Smith]

27 minutes ago, Tofer said:

Couldn't you read a map, and didn't you know which way North was?

 

If the answer is yes, why were you asking the locals?

What map would that be in 2001 showing all the dirt roads in Samoeng area?  Lots of dead ends back then.    No good knowing where north is, if it's a dead end valley.  Familiar with the area?

[bazza73]

2 hours ago, giddyup said:

After putting in all the figures it shows that I should be getting a full pension, yet I only get $754 PF, I wonder why?

Centrelink deducts the energy and telephone supplements after six weeks outside Australia.

You said you are only getting 50% pension due to superannuation payments. It depends on whether you are assessed on income or assets and who you are married to ( or not ). Please don't ask me to explain Centrelink rules, the logic baffles me.

[StevieAus]

While I feel very sorry for these people who have been duped I really have to ask the question as to what advice they sought and what due diligence was carried out?

I wouldn't buy a house or land in my own country without obtaining the services of a lawyer

Now before the usual posters start about crooked lawyers in Thailand that is not the case with all lawyers even here .

My wife and I have dealt with a female lawyer in Chiang Mai for well over ten years who is well known to such an extent that as recent as last week she told that she now only has the time to deal with non Thais

She has handled numerous land/ property and business purchases for us and many friends and  aquaintances and as recent as last year advised us against making a land purchase because of potential problems.

She doesn't overcharge and her advice in my opinion is second to none

Unfortunately there are crooks in every country and that is why you need to seek good advice.

 

 

 

[Jeremy50]

5 hours ago, off road pat said:

Mick Jager is no prophet, he bought a "château"  (Castle) in France and many more property's around the world !!!

What, there are two people in the world who can't even spell his name correctly?  As for the con, why are people even considering paying 11 mil for a house in a 3rd world country??? One Rai of land here shouldn't cost more than 200.000 Baht. A nice 2/3 bedroom house can be built for 2 million.

[alfalfa19]

9 hours ago, LannaGuy said:

I don't think it's very nice for anyone to gloat over retirees losing their life savings. They were not careful enough but I'm sorry they lost so much.

well said. 

[saakura]

3 hours ago, bazza73 said:

It doesn't seem to be a skill they teach in the schools. Possibly that's why when I ask for directions, I usually get three or four different answers.

If you can actually read a map, why would you need to then ask for directions and get 4 different answers?

[SteveB2]

9 hours ago, tomwct said:

Renting and leasing is the only way to Go in Amazing Thailand. Also I would never consider buying a Condo!.I've been

here 15 years and very happy!

 

Perfect. Renting and leasing is the least stressful method that reduces the amount of cash being risked brought into the 'Land of Scams'.

 

The way I see it, is that if you don't own it, then you can't have it taken away. 

 

The same goes for our dear mattress actress companions - better to lease than to buy. Just like cars, boats & planes - though fun to own initially, as they get older, so much stuff starts going wrong, plus the performance drops off, and the maintenance costs start to kill ya, that they're no longer fun and just don't represent value for money anymore... time to trade in and lease a new model!   

[Happy Grumpy]

Police will be living in them within a month. 

[ThaidaGwaii]

10 hours ago, hgma said:

names, companies, developers and agents?

Really.  The most important information...  Way to go TV.

[RichardColeman]

sorry, but.....idiots.

[Tofer]

18 minutes ago, Samuel Smith said:

What map would that be in 2001 showing all the dirt roads in Samoeng area?  Lots of dead ends back then.    No good knowing where north is, if it's a dead end valley.  Familiar with the area?

I think it was 1990 when I went exploring the North in a jeep and took many a dirt road with a Bartholemew road map and a decent sense of direction and always reached my destination eventually. Some roads shown didn't exist and I took mountain tracks scaling boulders and passing remote mountain residences, but never considered asking for directions, in fact my wife was too scared to get out of the jeep.

 

Always carry spare fuel just in case.

[NCC1701A]

11 million for a place that looks like a shop house stuck on a side of a mountain with toothpick foundations and a common swimming pool?

 

you can buy a palace in Hua Hin for 11 million.

[peterb17]

10 hours ago, giddyup said:

Renting and leasing might be the only way for you, others like a big roomy house, a nice garden, having pets, private parking, etc, etc.

Why buy-  you can rent a large house - mine is 500sqm , pool , garden etc etc - a beautiful smart house- yes it’s quite expensive- but I would never buy- you never know what is around the corner- then trying to sell a large house is a nightmare

[ujayujay]

Blue Eyes.~~~~~~

[heybuz]

5 hours ago, bazza73 said:

Is your pension a full OAP, or part pension? I've researched this very carefully, including discussion with a Centrelink Financial Services Officer, and I stand by what I said.

The effect of marital status and home ownership on an Australian OAP very much depends on what part of the income/asset spectrum you occupy. Possibly your pension was not affected for the reason you were still below the thresholds where tapering kicks in.

marital status does,home is exempt if only home.if married you lose 200dollars a fortnight,but your principle residence is exempt.

[Jimdandy]

Oh the arrogance of money. How many of them ventured to get off their lazy butts and travel to Thailand before they invested any money and actually research and see the area with their own eyeballs? 

 

They trusted the internet and got what they deserved. Just like guys who trust dating sites only to later find out sometimes that the photos of the woman they were talking to are sometimes from 10 years ago.

 

 

 

 

[CNXBKKMAN]

3 hours ago, Tofer said:

How has that blinkered opinion got anything to do with people being illegally sold a developer property or the land to build on.....

 

This smug attitude towards foreigners who buy property is absolutely uncalled for. There are many foreigners married to decent Thai ladies, not everyone marries gutter trash.

 

It's got absolutely nothing to do with who actually bought it or by what means, quite simply that they were defrauded. You cannot buy a piece of land without a land office registered title deed and transfer agreement, unless it hasn't got one, then it's not a purchase as anything without a title deed is not owned and as such cannot be sold, only passed on to someone else with possibly a financial consideration. I can't believe all these investors were stupid enough to buy without at least a Nor Sor 3 Cor title deed.

 

Sue the land office officials / developer / sales agent etc. as all must have been complicit in this scam. End of!

 

 

 

Yes they were defrauded but the there were a few steps they had to take before they could be defrauded. First warning flag, foreigners are not permitted to own land or houses and pretty much everyone knows this. If you still want to go ahead with a property purchase fine but proceed with caution! You are using money that you may never see again and happy with that risk? Yes. Still proceed with caution. Thailand is well known for scams and corruption which again shouts proceed with caution! Its well known and common that rural land on hills and mountains doesnt have full ownership papers, you might be buying nothing in the eyes of the law! There is a big risk proceed with caution. Before you hand over the cash it might be worth getting the opinion of lawyer who is independent of the people selling you the property. Your thai partner may not be trustworthy? Its happened before. Proceed with caution. Etc etc.

        

[Naam]

13 minutes ago, CNXBKKMAN said:

Yes they were defrauded but the there were a few steps they had to take before they could be defrauded. First warning flag, foreigners are not permitted to own land or houses and pretty much everyone knows this.

yada yada yakety-yak drivel drivel! everybody who lives in Stratford-on-Avon, London, Stockholm, Amsterdam, Berlin, Geneva and Paris knows this? 

[CNXBKKMAN]

10 minutes ago, Naam said:

yada yada yakety-yak drivel drivel! everybody who lives in Stratford-on-Avon, London, Stockholm, Amsterdam, Berlin, Geneva and Paris knows this? 

Most people who would consider buying a property in Thailand would visit the country probably more than once and become aware that that foreigners are not permitted to buy. They might stop and reflect on this before continuing.  How many people wouldnt give it a google before buying, even 5 or 10 years ago. 

    How many people in Amsterdam or Berlin will buy a property in Thailand without actually visiting? Can't be many. 

[whaleboneman]

3 hours ago, SteveB2 said:

 

Perfect. Renting and leasing is the least stressful method that reduces the amount of cash being risked brought into the 'Land of Scams'.

 

The way I see it, is that if you don't own it, then you can't have it taken away. 

 

The same goes for our dear mattress actress companions - better to lease than to buy. Just like cars, boats & planes - though fun to own initially, as they get older, so much stuff starts going wrong, plus the performance drops off, and the maintenance costs start to kill ya, that they're no longer fun and just don't represent value for money anymore... time to trade in and lease a new model!   

Mattress actress. Haven't heard that one before. Thanks for my morning chuckle.

[Destiny1990]

2 hours ago, CNXBKKMAN said:

Most people who would consider buying a property in Thailand would visit the country probably more than once and become aware that that foreigners are not permitted to buy. They might stop and reflect on this before continuing.  How many people wouldnt give it a google before buying, even 5 or 10 years ago. 

    How many people in Amsterdam or Berlin will buy a property in Thailand without actually visiting? Can't be many. 

Mate what u know about is zero!

maybe they entered a lease 30 years or  maybe a purchase in their wife her thai name, maybe a usefruct al is completely legal. The only thing illegal is the scam where u not get delivered what was agreed on!

Edited September 25, 2017 by Destiny1990

[off road pat]

6 hours ago, theguyfromanotherforum said:

 

That's it. People spent more time doing a research when buying a TV..... but you wanna buy a house in Thailand... well, I'll just have some website take care.

 

Stupid.

 

The two studs in the picture got taken to the cleaners. They are probably smart guys too, but when it comes to greed and women even the smartest, richest people will get fleeced.

 

 

Right. As if they would listen.

 

People like this who get scammed already have their mind made up.

Got to give this one to you, you are so right !!!

[Fairynuff]

17 hours ago, tomwct said:

Renting and leasing is the only way to Go in Amazing Thailand. Also I would never consider buying a Condo!.I've been

here 15 years and very happy!

Been here a long time too. Bought and sold  a number of condos and made a healthy profit in doing so. Two things I wouldn't do, "buy" a house or rent anything 

[Naam]

5 hours ago, CNXBKKMAN said:

Most people who would consider buying a property in Thailand would visit the country probably more than once and become aware that that foreigners are not permitted to buy. They might stop and reflect on this before continuing.  How many people wouldnt give it a google before buying, even 5 or 10 years ago. 

    How many people in Amsterdam or Berlin will buy a property in Thailand without actually visiting? Can't be many. 

that's besides the point. the fact that these "investors" did not use due diligence does not justify the comment

Quote

foreigners are not permitted to own land or houses and pretty much everyone knows this.

period!

[futsukayoi]

20 hours ago, Totster said:

A fool and his money are soon parted.

 

It is the buyers responsibility to carry out due diligence.

 

totster :)

Actually it is the lawyers responsibility to due diligence.  Of course this being Thailand they are usually the worst crooks of all and don't.  There was a similar situation in Koh Samui and there was no way to hold the lawyers accountable.

[bazza73]

8 hours ago, heybuz said:

marital status does,home is exempt if only home.if married you lose 200dollars a fortnight,but your principle residence is exempt.

So just plug in the numbers on this link :

 

http://www.yourpension.com.au/APCalc/#CalcForm

 

I'll make it simple. Compare a single person owning a home with $450,000 in assets, with a non-homeowner with the same $450,000 in assets.

Your statement is correct only when we are talking about a FULL pension. The devil is in the detail when it's a PART pension.

Edited September 26, 2017 by bazza73
Full vs Part

[MaeJoMTB]

11 hours ago, SteveB2 said:

 

Perfect. Renting and leasing is the least stressful method that reduces the amount of cash being risked brought into the 'Land of Scams'.

 

The way I see it, is that if you don't own it, then you can't have it taken away. 

 

The same goes for our dear mattress actress companions - better to lease than to buy. Just like cars, boats & planes - though fun to own initially, as they get older, so much stuff starts going wrong, plus the performance drops off, and the maintenance costs start to kill ya, that they're no longer fun and just don't represent value for money anymore... time to trade in and lease a new model!   

Classic!

 

[CNXBKKMAN]

7 hours ago, Destiny1990 said:

Mate what u know about is zero!

maybe they entered a lease 30 years or  maybe a purchase in their wife her thai name, maybe a usefruct al is completely legal. The only thing illegal is the scam where u not get delivered what was agreed on!

We all know the work arounds, sorry i will rephrase that most of us know the work arounds and ways to protect your investment. The law that foreigners cant own land/properties should be the first red flag that prompts you to proceed with caution. If the victims had used more caution (due diligence) would they they be in this position today? Maybe the individual stories will come out , the article does mention the guys want other foreigners to know about this scam.