ICO's are selling snake oil?

[12DrinkMore]

"Initial Coin Offerings" 

 

When a company wants to raise cash it has a few methods, normally it

 

- takes out a loan

- sells bonds

- sells shares

 

In all of these three, the provider of the cash has a defined return (loans and bonds) or a defined stake in the future of the company (shares).

 

There are thousands of wannabees with good, bad or mediocre ideas for blockchain applications. They like to raise capital through ICO's and subsequently dribbling more "coins" into the market. So what are you getting when you buy into this?

 

- is it a loan? No, there is no obligation on the company to give you interest or return the money.

- is it a bond? No, there is no obligation on the company to give you interest or return the money.

- is it a share. No, you have no stake in the company.

 

Effectively you have simply donated your money to the company for no return whatsoever.

 

The hope is presumably that the coins will do a parabolic "bitcoin" and they will all become rich.

 

Well, they won't.

 

 

 

[Calach]

Sure they are, the vast majority of them at least.

 

But we're all going in to surf the wave hoping to cash out before everyone else stops keeping appearances. 

[Pungdo]

I have bought into 3 ICO's, the ones that interest me are the ones looking to try and solve "Real World Problems" as I feel they have the best chance of succeeding and doing ok for me, 2 of them have already hit the market and if I wanted to sell my coins would double my investment or better.

[Guitar God]

I bought $100 worth of ETN  snake oil during its ICO in October and today it's worth $4032. 

[dlodratsab]

5 hours ago, 12DrinkMore said:

 

 

I Wont Sum!.......Is it for available @ 7-11?

[12DrinkMore]

18 minutes ago, Guitar God said:

I bought $100 worth of ETN  snake oil during its ICO in October and today it's worth $4032. 

 

How did you manage that?

 

ICO was priced at USD 0.01 and the crapto  today is USD 0.13.

 

USD 100 would be USD 1,300 before all the leakages trying to get it out of the system.

 

https://icobench.com/ico/electroneum

 

Edited January 22, 2018 by 12DrinkMore

[punchjudy]

anyone want to buy this TVCoin

 

748tgh882fjrj678466rtirttnlg69bhgbtgth6

[cmrichsw]

"A fool and his money are soon parted"

[Guitar God]

19 minutes ago, 12DrinkMore said:

 

How did you manage that?

 

ICO was priced at USD 0.01 and the crapto  today is USD 0.13.

 

USD 100 would be USD 1,300 before all the leakages trying to get it out of the system.

 

https://icobench.com/ico/electroneum

 

I bought 15,000 shares for $100, posted one referral link on Quora and FB three days before the ICO finished and I'm holding a little over 30,000 ETN today. 

 

ETN sales  fee is minimal, I've been paying $24 to send BTC to my banks or debit cards so I'd the current $4078 I'd clear $4k if I cashed out today. 

[12DrinkMore]

16 minutes ago, Guitar God said:

I bought 15,000 shares for $100, posted one referral link on Quora and FB three days before the ICO finished and I'm holding a little over 30,000 ETN today. 

 

ETN sales  fee is minimal, I've been paying $24 to send BTC to my banks or debit cards so I'd the current $4078 I'd clear $4k if I cashed out today. 

 

You'll have to run that by me again.

 

How did you manage a 35% discount to ICO price?

 

Why are you calling these craptos shares? Shares in what?

 

How does this referral thing function? They give away free 100% more than those you applied for?

 

[Brunolem]

Today's ICOs are a replica of what happened in the late 90s with the dotcom IPOs.

 

Then it was the dotcom bubble, and we know how it ended, now it the "dotcoin" bubble, and we can imagine how it will end...

[Blackheart1916]

Here we go again, "I missed out because I am smarter than you, now I will have a whinge, posed as a question or observation." Suck it up, Princess.

[jspill]

Well my friend put $10k into Icon (ICX) in December, it was worth about 10 cents after ICO, now it's worth about $10, so he's up 100x, or a million dollars in a month... 

[12DrinkMore]

21 minutes ago, jspill said:

Well my friend put $10k into Icon (ICX) in December, it was worth about 10 cents after ICO, now it's worth about $10, so he's up 100x, or a million dollars in a month... 

 

Awesome.

 

How much has he cashed out?

 

However the lowest price in December was about USD 1.24 and now we're at USD 9.00

 

https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/icon/

 

 

 

Edited January 22, 2018 by 12DrinkMore

[12DrinkMore]

1 hour ago, Blackheart1916 said:

Here we go again, "I missed out because I am smarter than you, now I will have a whinge, posed as a question or observation." Suck it up, Princess.

 

Here we go again, another personal attack by a bitter.

 

So come on then, give us a list of all your trades so we can be astounded at how much we have missed. Don't be selective and just pick the winners.

 

 

[12DrinkMore]

1 hour ago, Brunolem said:

Today's ICOs are a replica of what happened in the late 90s with the dotcom IPOs.

 

Then it was the dotcom bubble, and we know how it ended, now it the "dotcoin" bubble, and we can imagine how it will end...

 

I have just been whacked on the head by a guy totally convinced bitcoin is going to  USD 1,000,000 in the next couple of years. 

 

Clearly this party has a while to run.

 

I am thinking about dumping all my shares and going all in.

 

What could possibly go wrong? I will be a multi-trillionaire. 100% guarantee.

[Brunolem]

3 minutes ago, 12DrinkMore said:

 

I have just been whacked on the head by a guy totally convinced bitcoin is going to  USD 1,000,000 in the next couple of years. 

 

Clearly this party has a while to run.

 

I am thinking about dumping all my shares and going all in.

 

What could possibly go wrong? I will be a multi-trillionaire. 100% guarantee.

Bitcoin has been stuck for a while, well below its highs, and I think it is unlikely to go much higher for at least 2 reasons:

 

- it has gone mainstream, there are bitcoin futures, bitcoin shorts...so bitcoin is more or less coerced into following the major markets which are far from being so volatile

 

- new cryptos have appeared supported by a better, more efficient technological background

 

More generally, there may be still a lot of money to make with cryptos, for those able to cash out exactly at the right time, but in the end there will be much more losers than winners...exactly as with the dotcom mania.

 

This is all very fragile...just because of a rumor coming from South Korea, cryptos can lose 20% overnight!

 

Imagine what the reaction will be when the rumors will come from the US or the EU...

[zib]

Most ICOs are scams. But you can still profit on them because dumb money will flow into them. But don't expect anything long term. 

[jspill]

1 hour ago, 12DrinkMore said:

 

Awesome.

 

How much has he cashed out?

 

However the lowest price in December was about USD 1.24 and now we're at USD 9.00

 

https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/icon/

 

 

 

11 cents coming out of the ICO, as per the website you linked yourself earlier - https://icobench.com/ico/icon

 

Yeah $9 now, I said about $10. Ok so 90x returns. Pretty nice. 

 

He hasn't cashed out anything, Icon will easily hit $20 and beyond. 

[Brunolem]

35 minutes ago, zib said:

Most ICOs are scams. But you can still profit on them because dumb money will flow into them. But don't expect anything long term. 

Rawai...brings back memories...

 

I stayed there for 2 weeks, at a place called Salaloy...in 1978!

We were less than 10 farangs on the island at that time...wonderful holidays...

[zib]

3 hours ago, Brunolem said:

Rawai...brings back memories...

 

I stayed there for 2 weeks, at a place called Salaloy...in 1978!

We were less than 10 farangs on the island at that time...wonderful holidays...

Sounds awesome compared to now :D

[janclaes47]

6 hours ago, 12DrinkMore said:

6 hours ago, jspill said:

Well my friend put $10k into Icon (ICX) in December, it was worth about 10 cents after ICO, now it's worth about $10, so he's up 100x, or a million dollars in a month... 

 

Awesome.

 

How much has he cashed out?

 

However the lowest price in December was about USD 1.24 and now we're at USD 9.00

 

https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/icon/

 

Woosh, another troll pushed back in his corner.

 

I wonder why Guitar god hasn't answered your last request for some clarification, of his mysterious gains,  however he has been online since and must have seen your post.

 

[janclaes47]

5 hours ago, jspill said:

11 cents coming out of the ICO, as per the website you linked yourself earlier - https://icobench.com/ico/icon

 

Yeah $9 now, I said about $10. Ok so 90x returns. Pretty nice. 

 

He hasn't cashed out anything, Icon will easily hit $20 and beyond. 

You said he bought in December, which day was it 11 cents in December or even in the 30 days prior to it?

 

And by the way, it isn't $9 now , it's $8.05

Edited January 22, 2018 by janclaes47

[Blackheart1916]

8 hours ago, 12DrinkMore said:

 

Here we go again, another personal attack by a bitter.

 

So come on then, give us a list of all your trades so we can be astounded at how much we have missed. Don't be selective and just pick the winners.

 

 

Ok so I list my gains and how far I am ahead, then you reply calling me a liar. You have done all this before. Why would i be bitter when I am the one making money? Nothing to prove to you, sunshine.

[12DrinkMore]

6 hours ago, Blackheart1916 said:

Ok so I list my gains and how far I am ahead, then you reply calling me a liar. You have done all this before. Why would i be bitter when I am the one making money? Nothing to prove to you, sunshine.

 

Who have I called a liar?

 

I have, in a couple of posts, pointed out that the "facts" as presented could not have been correct. But I assume that he poster was simply mistaken, and could post again to align reality with the heresay.

 

No idea why you should be bitter, it is just the general tone of your posts giving me that impression. 

 

But I do not understand why you continue to post personal attacks. 

 

I am critical of the craptos and argued for that position. You are welcome to take the other side and argue for the craptos. Or maybe start another thread?

[Brunolem]

10 hours ago, zib said:

Sounds awesome compared to now :D

It was...

I returned to Phuket in 2004...what a terrible change.

Think that I had the James Bond island for myself, for as long as I wanted, back then...and now it was a circus with vendors!

All these beaches on the West coast were deserted, not one building.

Basically, there was Rawai with the Salaloi and its maybe 10 bungalows, a beach restaurant, and a gypsie fishing village a one end of the beach.

To buy anything, we had to go to Phuket city, where was also the bus station.

To find something remotely similar today, you have to go to some islands out from Satun...and this is rapidly changing...not for the best...

[Brunolem]

46 minutes ago, 12DrinkMore said:

 

I am critical of the craptos and argued for that position. You are welcome to take the other side and argue for the craptos. Or maybe start another thread?

Here is a positive post from Nassim Taleb (supersmart guy) and a negative headline showing once again how fragile cryptos are...both are from today...

 

https://medium.com/opacity/bitcoin-1537e616a074

[12DrinkMore]

2 hours ago, Brunolem said:

Here is a positive post from Nassim Taleb (supersmart guy)

 

He has gone off on a philosophical tangent.

 

There is some validity in the argument that having a viable alternative to the sovereign currencies would remove one lever of power from the governments. However, we are a long, long way from having a crapto that approaches the requirements.

 

All the current craptos are too volatile, have too little liquidity, difficult to use for daily transactions, and subject to fraud and abuse with virtually no recourse.

 

 

 

 

[Brunolem]

2 hours ago, 12DrinkMore said:

 

He has gone off on a philosophical tangent.

 

There is some validity in the argument that having a viable alternative to the sovereign currencies would remove one lever of power from the governments. However, we are a long, long way from having a crapto that approaches the requirements.

 

All the current craptos are too volatile, have too little liquidity, difficult to use for daily transactions, and subject to fraud and abuse with virtually no recourse.

 

 

 

 

Sure...I think his point is that cryptos are good...in essence...because of the freedom potential that goes with them.

 

Yet, I remain convinced that while governments may not be able to get rid of them, they can very well create their own, then with their friends of big business, decide that only their cryptos are acceptable for most payments.

 

In the end, private cryptos will have a very limited use, as is the case now...for example, for payments between private parties on websites such as ebay...

 

Further on, why would people want to bother dealing with many different currencies?

 

If you are, say, in the US, where there is a crypto dollar accepted everywhere, why would you want to also have bitcoins, ethereums and other cryptos, that would only be accepted for a limited number of transactions?

 

I am confident that cryptos have a future...as a replacement of actual paper currencies, controlled by the same entities...

[Acemaker]

On 1/22/2018 at 6:44 PM, 12DrinkMore said:

 

Here we go again, another personal attack by a bitter.

 

So come on then, give us a list of all your trades so we can be astounded at how much we have missed. Don't be selective and just pick the winners.

 

 

Hmm, seems to me youre the one with a Bee in his maybe her Bonnet about Cryptos, some people just hate to see others making money usually the broke ones or those with money worries, and your just another one, Bye.