Brexit has created chaos in Britain – nobody voted for this

[Kieran00001]

11 hours ago, nauseus said:

As ever, there may more to be considered than just money, at least by many. By the way, the peace between Greece and Turkey followed on from a rash of earthquakes in both countries.. but the tremors within the EU are only just beginning. 

 

But it is the money we keep hearing them complain about, isn't it?

 

The "earthquake diplomacy" came a little after the conflict ended and that period of diplomacy is over anyway, if you hadn't noticed, but i am talking about actual peace not two countries having a dialogue, as in them not shooting each other, something that had ended 20 years before that when Greece joined the EU.

 

These "tremors" in the EU were supposed to be earthquakes by now, weren't they?  Or was it a tsunami?  It ain't happening, it doesn't matter how many Leave supporters wet their panties over tabloid headlines, the EU is going to survive.

[transam]

10 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

But it is the money we keep hearing them complain about, isn't it?

 

The "earthquake diplomacy" came a little after the conflict ended and that period of diplomacy is over anyway, if you hadn't noticed, but i am talking about actual peace not two countries having a dialogue, as in them not shooting each other, something that had ended 20 years before that when Greece joined the EU.

 

These "tremors" in the EU were supposed to be earthquakes by now, weren't they?  Or was it a tsunami?  It ain't happening, it doesn't matter how many Leave supporters wet their panties over tabloid headlines, the EU is going to survive.

Of course the EU will survive in one form or another. 27 members, those with their hands out ain't going anywhere, the money countries don't want egg on their face, those controlling the EU don't want to lose their nice pay checks..

[The Renegade]

17 minutes ago, transam said:

Of course the EU will survive in one form or another. 27 members, those with their hands out ain't going anywhere, the money countries don't want egg on their face, those controlling the EU don't want to lose their nice pay checks..

In very simple terms. That sums it up nicely. ?

[The Renegade]

tebee

 

Being a nice guy,  I am going to go off topic to bring you info that might be really pertinent to you.

 

Quote

Holiday properties in Brittany have been occupied by squatters who claim they cannot afford local rents, with activists promising a summer of “spectacular actions” to force second-homeowners, many of them British, to sell up and go.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/squatters-move-in-on-expats-holiday-homes-in-brittany-2fcjkwv0q

[RuamRudy]

Another day, another revelation of crooks, dirty money and Vote Leave.

Brexit, Dark Money and the DUP

[Jip99]

2 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

Another day, another revelation of crooks, dirty money and Vote Leave.

Brexit, Dark Money and the DUP

 

 

You do understand, don't you, that it really doesn't matter one jot how long your list becomes.

[tebee]

1 hour ago, The Renegade said:

tebee

 

I am trying to be gentle here.

 

There is no equivalent to the NHS throughout any other developed western nation.

 

There is no comparison.

Just how many western nations have you visited and checked out their health systems ? None is quite identical to the NHS, but many are very similar.

 

French one ( which I know best) is almost identical to the British one for low income ( <12,000 euros per person) families. Government just pays everything . Richer people people are expected to contribute to routine treatment and Dr visits, but chronic conditions and major operations as 100% government funded too.

 

There are zero waiting times - when my mum needed a cataract operation here  she saw the specialist the same day (saturday) and he apologized he would not be able to do the operation until the Thursday because the new year holiday intervened. 

 

Creeping privatization is happening here too though. My two town center government local hospitals have just been replaced by new private PPI funded ones on greenfield sites out of town and the old sites sold off for development.    You can use the new ones just as if they were state own ones though - the government health card is accepted there too.  

[RuamRudy]

1 minute ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

You do understand, don't you, that it really doesn't matter one jot how long your list becomes.

Sure, I understand fully. What I cannot understand, for the life of me, is why you are so accepting of this. It beggars belief that Brexit voters, of all people, are accepting of this.

 

It is becoming clearer by the day that Brexit was not led by a band of brave, noble Brits fighting to free us from EU tyranny. They are, to a man, a collection of spivs, conmen and corrupt elite who have been working to feather their own nests. Only Yesterday, Daniel Hannan stated the following:

 

"To make a success of Brexit, we should be cutting taxes, not raising them; making takeovers easier, not harder; slashing regulations, not faffing about with gender quotas, pay curbs and workers on boards."

 

One day the people of the UK will wake up and realise that there has been a coup, and that not only did they miss it, they actually enabled it. You have handed our country over to criminals and you don't even realise it.

[The Renegade]

1 minute ago, RuamRudy said:

One day the people of the UK will wake up and realise that there has been a coup, and that not only did they miss it, they actually enabled it. You have handed our country over to criminals and you don't even realise it.

That actually started in 1973.

 

Guess what happened in 1973 ?

[RuamRudy]

Just now, The Renegade said:

That actually started in 1973.

 

Guess what happened in 1973 ?

I despair. Is your myopic, utterly irrational hatred of the EU so great that you are willing to facilitate, nay cheer on the theft of our country's wealth and resources? Everything is up for grabs now, and those bankrolling Brexit have had years of planning to make sure they stuff their pockets with as much of your and my money as possible. They started on referendum night and it just keeps rolling on. But worse than that, they are going to screw over your kids, your grandkids and mine too. People will, quite rightly, point the finger to you as being the one who let this happen.

[transam]

6 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

Sure, I understand fully. What I cannot understand, for the life of me, is why you are so accepting of this. It beggars belief that Brexit voters, of all people, are accepting of this.

 

It is becoming clearer by the day that Brexit was not led by a band of brave, noble Brits fighting to free us from EU tyranny. They are, to a man, a collection of spivs, conmen and corrupt elite who have been working to feather their own nests. Only Yesterday, Daniel Hannan stated the following:

 

"To make a success of Brexit, we should be cutting taxes, not raising them; making takeovers easier, not harder; slashing regulations, not faffing about with gender quotas, pay curbs and workers on boards."

 

One day the people of the UK will wake up and realise that there has been a coup, and that not only did they miss it, they actually enabled it. You have handed our country over to criminals and you don't even realise it.

Do I recall you wanted Scotland to leave the Union....?

 

Your kin voted the other way, were they all wrong too...?

[RuamRudy]

1 minute ago, transam said:

Do I recall you wanted Scotland to leave the Union....?

 

Your kin voted the other way, were they all wrong too...?

The independence campaign was financed by private individuals; Better Together was the one supported by big busines and corporate entities. Exactly as with Brexit, the elites distort democracy through shadowy means. There is ample evidence to show this, should you care to look.

[The Renegade]

9 minutes ago, tebee said:

French one ( which I know best) is almost identical to the British one for low income ( <12,000 euros per person) families. Government just pays everything . Richer people people are expected to contribute to routine treatment and Dr visits, but chronic conditions and major operations as 100% government funded too.

So people in France do not pay medical insurance ? 

 

People in France do not have to pay up front in many instances and then claim the money back ?

 

Nothing like the UK system.

 

[tebee]

58 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

tebee

 

Being a nice guy,  I am going to go off topic to bring you info that might be really pertinent to you.

 

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/squatters-move-in-on-expats-holiday-homes-in-brittany-2fcjkwv0q

No idea where that is - most villages have many empty houses due to depopulation - youngers like to move to the big cities and most french people build new houses as they are relatively cheap - in my town 9000 euro for the plot with water, sewers, electric and gas already connected   - about 70,000 to built a new 2 bed house.

 

We have two blocks of council flats sitting empty as there are not enough tenants - rent is 245 euros a month for a 70 sqm 2 bed flat. The local butchers shop - with 3 bed accommodation and garage has been on the market for 14 years at 40,000 euros with no takers.

 

We have houses we rent out long term to French tennants - all 2-bed - we get 300-350 euros a month rent of which the government pays about 80%

 

Houses are more expensive in the big cities, but there aren't exactly many British holidays homes there. 

 

As an example, this is a housing association flat in my town, refurbished last year 3 bedroom 327 euros a month including water and electric.

 

Not exactly expensive ?

 

https://www.leboncoin.fr/locations/1430892816.htm/ 

Edited June 28, 2018 by tebee

[The Renegade]

9 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

The independence campaign was financed by private individuals;

And why do you think they funded it ?

 

Might it have been because they wanted the Government of an Independent Scotland beholden to them and in their back pockets ?

 

???

 

Nah, you probably think they done it out of the goodness of their heart ??

[dick dasterdly]

1 hour ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

But it is the money we keep hearing them complain about, isn't it?

 

The "earthquake diplomacy" came a little after the conflict ended and that period of diplomacy is over anyway, if you hadn't noticed, but i am talking about actual peace not two countries having a dialogue, as in them not shooting each other, something that had ended 20 years before that when Greece joined the EU.

 

These "tremors" in the EU were supposed to be earthquakes by now, weren't they?  Or was it a tsunami?  It ain't happening, it doesn't matter how many Leave supporters wet their panties over tabloid headlines, the EU is going to survive.

"These "tremors" in the EU were supposed to be earthquakes by now, weren't they?  Or was it a tsunami?  It ain't happening, it doesn't matter how many Leave supporters wet their panties over tabloid headlines, the EU is going to survive."

 

I hope you're right re. the eu surviving, as the last thing we need is more uncertainty.  They're already changing some of their policies re. immigration in view of the backlash.

 

The first part of your comment (quoted in italics in my post)  is extremely reminiscent of 'experts' opinions in the event of a leave vote!

Edited June 28, 2018 by dick dasterdly

[tebee]

10 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

So people in France do not pay medical insurance ? 

 

People in France do not have to pay up front in many instances and then claim the money back ?

 

Nothing like the UK system.

 

People can have private top-up insurance - though it is not compulsory. It is however relatively cheap - around 40 euros a month for me as 60+ diabetic, as the government picks up most large bills and 45-70% of the smaller ones.

 

It used to be the case that you have to pay up front and reclaim, but these days almost everybody is linked to the government computer system and you give them your card, they put it in the machine and check you have cover and that is it. It's all automatically deducted. If you don't have insurance and are not on one of the two government schemes ( there is a second one for people earning less than around (18,000 euros) you might be asked for the co-pay but that is all. Even the traveling district nurses who come to take my bloods have portable machines.   

[Eloquent pilgrim]

30 minutes ago, transam said:

Do I recall you wanted Scotland to leave the Union....?

 

Your kin voted the other way, were they all wrong too...?

Ha Ha ..... Reminds me of the proud parents watching their son’s passing out parade from the military academy; as they marched past, the wife turns to her husband and says “aw, look, Jock, our wee Jimmy’s the only one in step”

[The Renegade]

20 minutes ago, tebee said:

No idea where that is - most villages have many empty houses due to depopulation -

You missed the pertinent point

 

Quote

with activists promising a summer of “spectacular actions” to force second-homeowners, many of them British, to sell up and go.

What does that sound like to you ?

[RuamRudy]

14 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

And why do you think they funded it ?

 

Might it have been because they wanted the Government of an Independent Scotland beholden to them and in their back pockets ?

 

???

 

Nah, you probably think they done it out of the goodness of their heart ??

Maybe you want to go back and read my post once again and then may think about it a little more? Private individuals as in the working class people who chipped in 5, 10, 50 pounds - how in the name of god do you think a check-out operator or a bus driver is going to be able to use their donation of a fiver to keep the SG beholden to them???

 

 

[dick dasterdly]

30 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

Sure, I understand fully. What I cannot understand, for the life of me, is why you are so accepting of this. It beggars belief that Brexit voters, of all people, are accepting of this.

 

It is becoming clearer by the day that Brexit was not led by a band of brave, noble Brits fighting to free us from EU tyranny. They are, to a man, a collection of spivs, conmen and corrupt elite who have been working to feather their own nests. Only Yesterday, Daniel Hannan stated the following:

 

"To make a success of Brexit, we should be cutting taxes, not raising them; making takeovers easier, not harder; slashing regulations, not faffing about with gender quotas, pay curbs and workers on boards."

 

One day the people of the UK will wake up and realise that there has been a coup, and that not only did they miss it, they actually enabled it. You have handed our country over to criminals and you don't even realise it.

You fail to understand that many of us have realised that politicians, big business and the like will 'follow the money'....

 

They are mostly corrupt in this respect - so voters have the extremely difficult task of reading between the lines when it comes to their endless lies.

 

Brexit voters (IMO), finally woke up to the 'fact' that what they were being told by the eu and uk govts. didn't reflect their reality of life.

 

The same is now happening in other eu countries.

[RuamRudy]

36 minutes ago, transam said:

Do I recall you wanted Scotland to leave the Union....?

 

Your kin voted the other way, were they all wrong too...?

Of course, it all depends upon what you consider my kin.

 

Please do not lose sight of the fact that the majority of people born in Scotland voted to leave the UK. Take that in and absorb it - most Scots-born voters do not want to be part of the UK.

 

 

Now, we can surely count on that Scottish number not to have decreased much; rather, the utter disaster the Tories are making of an unwanted Brexit and the dismal failure of Labour to hold them to account must be swelling the ranks of Scots-born Yes voters. For those born outside the UK, I would assume the choice is much more stark now - Scottish independence or possibly being sent home. For those born in the rest of the UK it is a bit of a mystery to me as to how they feel, but hopefully we can count on much of them to see the light.

[RuamRudy]

6 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

You fail to understand that many of us have realised that politicians, big business and the like will 'follow the money'....

 

They are mostly corrupt in this respect - so voters have the extremely difficult task of reading between the lines when it comes to their endless lies.

 

Brexit voters (IMO), finally woke up to the 'fact' that what they were being told by the eu and uk govts. didn't reflect their reality of life.

 

The same is now happening in other eu countries.

For all the EU's faults (and I accept there are many), at least there were controls and frameworks that, in the main, provided a support for the common man. The UK out of the EU will strip away all of those - the US has already stated that there needs to be a wholesale removal of the very regulations that keep our our food safe and our workers in decent jobs. The privatisation of the NHS is just the start.

[dick dasterdly]

Just now, RuamRudy said:

For all the EU's faults (and I accept there are many), at least there were controls and frameworks that, in the main, provided a support for the common man. The UK out of the EU will strip away all of those - the US has already stated that there needs to be a wholesale removal of the very regulations that keep our our food safe and our workers in decent jobs. The privatisation of the NHS is just the start.

I agree with you to a certain extent.

 

At least the eu were sensible enough to realise that they needed to appear to protect the 'common man' - unlike various uk govts....  But on the other hand, they had no problem with an open borders policy, that only helped those in the poorest eu countries and businesses in wealthy countries.

 

i.e. It kept wages for those at the bottom in wealthy countries, very low.....

[The Renegade]

18 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

Maybe you want to go back and read my post once again and then may think about it a little more? Private individuals as in the working class people who chipped in 5, 10, 50 pounds - how in the name of god do you think a check-out operator or a bus driver is going to be able to use their donation of a fiver to keep the SG beholden to them???

 

 

Why are you so clueless about what goes on in your own Country ?

 

Quote

£1.2million of the yes campaign's total was donated by three people, 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/scottish-independence-blog/2014/jul/08/scottish-independence-referendum-campaigners-donations-published

 

Do you think those 3 people were check-out operators or bus drivers ? ??

[RuamRudy]

1 minute ago, The Renegade said:

Why are you so clueless about what goes on in your own Country ?

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/scottish-independence-blog/2014/jul/08/scottish-independence-referendum-campaigners-donations-published

 

Do you think those 3 people were check-out operators or bus drivers ? ??

Sigh, - your seeming inability to concede your weak points ties you up in so many knots.

 

2 of the 3 people are a retired couple, lifelong independence supporters who won the lottery and donated 1 million of that 1.2 million,. The 200k was from Brian Souter, the boss of Stagecoach. Hardly the same level of corruption that stinks up every aspect of your beloved Brexit.

[dick dasterdly]

1 minute ago, RuamRudy said:

For all the EU's faults (and I accept there are many), at least there were controls and frameworks that, in the main, provided a support for the common man. The UK out of the EU will strip away all of those - the US has already stated that there needs to be a wholesale removal of the very regulations that keep our our food safe and our workers in decent jobs. The privatisation of the NHS is just the start.

I also agree that the uk govt. may resort to US style policies, that only take into account money - not public health.

 

The eu has been instrumental in protecting food safeguards - unlike the uk govt....

 

The privatisation of the NHS started a long time ago - certainly before brexit!

 

Finally, the lowest paid (and increasingly 'average' workers) have seen their salaries reduced.  "Decent jobs" that have seen their salaries cut - as those 'at the top' decide that their salaries are best increased by reducing the salaries of everyone outside their 'important' sphere....

 

The open doors policy has only helped them in this regard.

[nauseus]

2 hours ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

But it is the money we keep hearing them complain about, isn't it?

 

The "earthquake diplomacy" came a little after the conflict ended and that period of diplomacy is over anyway, if you hadn't noticed, but i am talking about actual peace not two countries having a dialogue, as in them not shooting each other, something that had ended 20 years before that when Greece joined the EU.

 

These "tremors" in the EU were supposed to be earthquakes by now, weren't they?  Or was it a tsunami?  It ain't happening, it doesn't matter how many Leave supporters wet their panties over tabloid headlines, the EU is going to survive.

Always money first but they aren't happy. The influx of migrants is as big an issue. Relations between Greece and Turkey were itchy due to the Aegean issue right up until 1996 when military conflict was narrowly averted - only 3 years before this period of "earthquake diplomacy" - not exactly what most people would call peaceful. But then our definitions of many things are different, eh?

 

The tremors are increasing in frequency and amplitude but you won't want to admit that. Even the BBC just did though:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-44632471    

[Chomper Higgot]

On 2/28/2018 at 8:23 AM, CGW said:

Ah - the "globalist" view point, you were easily swayed! but they are pumping as much time and money into getting their way, despite a clear vote to get out. Why would anyone want to be ruled by non elected officials in another country!

There are no “non elected officials’ in the EU ruling anybody.

 

 

[RuamRudy]

3 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

I also agree that the uk govt. may resort to US style policies, that only take into account money - not public health.

 

The eu has been instrumental in protecting food safeguards - unlike the uk govt....

 

The privatisation of the NHS started a long time ago - certainly before brexit!

 

Finally, the lowest paid (and increasingly 'average' workers) have seen their salaries reduced.  "Decent jobs" that have seen their salaries cut - as those 'at the top' decide that their salaries are best increased by reducing the salaries of everyone outside their 'important' sphere....

 

The open doors policy has only helped them in this regard.

One big concern for me is the possibilty of the introduction of fire at will type rules; Rees Mogg has, I believe, already mooted such ideas, albeit in less stark terms.

The changes in industrial tribunal rules has already made claims of unfair dismissal much harder to pursue; I believe that was the thin end of the wedge.