Girlfriend very keen to register me at her family home

[elviajero]

45 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

The listing actually translates directly as "house holder". You can take that to mean what you like. I take it to mean "they who hold the house" as in hold the rights of the house. As in "owner".

You don't seem to understand the purpose of the Tabian Baan. Again, it has absolutely no connection with ownership.

 

All Thais should, by law, be registered as living at the property they consider their main home. It doesn't matter whether they own, rent or live with family/friends, etc. One of the people named in the Tabian Baan is considered the Jao Baan (head of household). That would be the owner if they live in the property, but if the owner lets or otherwise allows others to live in the property one of those 'possessors' would be listed as the Jao Baan. That person is referred to as the 'house-master' in the immigration act, however, IMO the most accurate translation is 'head of household'. Whether you translate as 'house holder', 'house-master', 'head of household', or owner, whether they own the property or not is irrelevant.

 

 

 

Edited March 2, 2018 by elviajero

[jackdd]

11 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

When I say the "owner" I mean the one listed in the house book as "เจ้าบ้าน.

 

It was not a mortgage.  A copy of the house book was required and the "owner" had to be present.

Google for this: เจ้าบ้าน กรรมสิทธิ์

You will find multiple articles explaining the difference between เจ้าบ้าน and owner, and also that many people confuse it

One situation also used as an example there: The เจ้าบ้าน in the house book can only be one person. But a house can be owned by multiple people, or a company.

[elviajero]

18 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

So...why, when my wife went to help her aunt borrow some money from the bank, did the bank say they could not do anything until the "owner" of the house, which is the aunt's husband, was there to sign the documents.?

 

9 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

When I say the "owner" I mean the one listed in the house book as "เจ้าบ้าน.

 

It was not a mortgage.  A copy of the house book was required and the "owner" had to be present.

Clearly the lender wanted the Jao Baan's (เจ้าบ้าน) permission to lend to someone living in the property they are the head of household of. That would usually be the owner occupier. However, if the person listed in the house book wasn't the owner they might need/insist on the owner's permission, especially if there is some kind of charge over the property, which is not unusual for Thailand.

[youreavinalaff]

15 minutes ago, elviajero said:

You don't seem to understand the purpose of the Tabian Baan. Again, it has absolutely no connection with ownership.

 

All Thais should, by law, be registered as living at the property they consider their main home. It doesn't matter whether they own, rent or live with family/friends, etc. One of the people named in the Tabian Baan is considered the Jao Baan (head of household). That would be the owner if they live in the property, but if the owner lets or otherwise allows others to live in the property one of those 'possessors' would be listed as the Jao Baan. That person is referred to as the 'house-master' in the immigration act, however, IMO the most accurate translation is 'head of household'. Whether you translate as 'house holder', 'house-master', 'head of household', or owner, whether they own the property or not is irrelevant.

 

 

 

I fully understand the purpose of the Tabianbaan. My questions were to try to seek clarification on some matters. As every example I have ever seen has the actual owner of the house listed as "jaobaan" then it always occured to me that this was the nearest translation.

 

Surely if the "Jaobann" was not the owner then there would have to be some other legal documentation to show that in order to protect the actual owner.???

[elviajero]

25 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

Surely if the "Jaobann" was not the owner then there would have to be some other legal documentation to show that in order to protect the actual owner.???

It seems they were only interested in the 'head of household' as listed in the Tabian Baan to sign the loan documents. Presumably the capacity as 'head of household' was all that was needed.

 

If they wanted proof that the person signing was the owner they would ask to see the 'Chanote' (Title deeds).

Edited March 2, 2018 by elviajero

[jackdd]

30 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

Surely if the "Jaobann" was not the owner then there would have to be some other legal documentation to show that in order to protect the actual owner.???

https://www.samuiforsale.com/other-miscellaneous/translation-condominium-apartment-ownership-title-deed.html

[youreavinalaff]

13 minutes ago, elviajero said:

It seems they were only interested in the 'head of household' as listed in the Tabian Baan to sign the loan documents. Presumably the capacity as 'head of household' was all that was needed.

 

If they wanted proof that the person signing was the owner they would ask to see the 'Chanote' (Title deeds).

But the owner of the house and the owner of the land can be different too.

[Tanoshi]

6 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

But the owner of the house and the owner of the land can be different too.

True, but what's your point in relation to the Tabien Baan?

 

In the case where an individual person is developing a plot of (leased) land the building permit should be issued by the Or Bor or in the name of the person that leases the land (the building permit can be used as proof of ownership of the house).

 

My wife owns our land/house, but her sister is registered as the 'house holder' in the TB.

Why? Because the wife is already registered as the 'house holder' in another property she owns and a Thai can only be registered in one book.

Chanote is proof of land ownership.

[Tanoshi]

54 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

Surely if the "Jaobann" was not the owner then there would have to be some other legal documentation to show that in order to protect the actual owner.???

Chanote.

 

[lamyai3]

13 hours ago, mercman24 said:

4 years ago i walked into Bangkok Bank in Sukhumvit road with a 30 day tourist visa, deposited a thousand quid, i got a visa debit card also ATM usage, and went back to the UK so whats the problem >>?

At that time it was possible. Bangkok Bank tightened up it's account opening procedures in around 2015 for all branches. 

[KiChakayan]

On 01/03/2018 at 2:40 PM, ubonjoe said:

No problem to get a debit card. Most banks issue them when you open an account.

She would not be able to make it a joint account without him knowing it.

Bangkok Bank gave me a Mastercard. Had to deposit a guarantee in a fixed deposit account. Bears interest 1.75%. But be careful the amount of CC security won't appear on the letter for Extension of stay. So your balance must be 400000 + CC security.

[phuketrichard]

19 hours ago, pieeyed said:

You can get a credit card by depositing thai baht to whatever limit you want on the credit card.

 

that is NOT a credit card, that is a debit card

 

Quote

 

• 

 

 

15 hours ago, youreavinalaff said:

Surely if the "Jaobann" was not the owner then there would have to be some other legal documentation to show that in order to protect the actual owner.???

Chanote.

 

EXACTLY!!!

name on the Chanot, (or nor sor sam) is the holder of the land paper >
has nothing to do with who lives at the house, (if there is a house on the land)

I owned my house as the building permit was in my name. No thai names in the blue book. But the land was owned by a thai friend who than gave me a 30 year lease that was registered at the land office.
when i sold the house/land both of us had to sign papers

Edited March 3, 2018 by phuketrichard

[puchooay]

1 hour ago, phuketrichard said:

that is NOT a credit card, that is a debit card

 

 

EXACTLY!!!

name on the Chanot, (or nor sor sam) is the holder of the land paper >
has nothing to do with who lives at the house, (if there is a house on the land)

I owned my house as the building permit was in my name. No thai names in the blue book. But the land was owned by a thai friend who than gave me a 30 year lease that was registered at the land office.
when i sold the house/land both of us had to sign papers

So, in theory, the house holder, house owner and the land owner could be 3 different people.

[overherebc]

On 02/03/2018 at 3:05 AM, warriorbangkok said:

555 Girl wants farang to register at her house. It's simple - it improves her credit rating. Nothing good comes to the farang from this. Must be a stitch up.


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

I'm in agreement with you on this. 

Auntie get's turned down for the loan so lopsided thinking kicks in, get your foreign boyfriend's name on the house book and they will think we have loads of money on tap.

Has the auntie 'borrowed' from somewhere in the past and now sees a way to get a legal loan etc etc.

Could go down a few roads this one and none of them are well paved.

[elviajero]

4 hours ago, phuketrichard said:

On 02/03/2018 at 7:02 AM, pieeyed said:

You can get a credit card by depositing thai baht to whatever limit you want on the credit card.

 

that is NOT a credit card, that is a debit card

It is a credit card. Thai banks will sometimes issue them with a security deposit.

[WeLubThailand]

On 3/1/2018 at 4:24 PM, QPRFC said:

Some context....my gf is a good person, but I'm sceptical about 'the long game'.
She lived in a remote town nearly all her life, farming is the family source of income. Wasn't enough $ so she headed to the big smoke in February 2017, met me in July and we have been together faithfully....so my suspicion is from my upbringing (and this forum) rather than her actual actions.

I'm concerned about what the registration means long term?
I will probably leave in Dec 2018 when school finishes to head 'home' for another 5-15 years of work and who knows?
If nothing substantial re the yellow book registration, then I'll go for it to help with the bank account as I have been to 12 bank/branches over the past week and it appears to be about 'work permits' nowadays for ferang in Chiang Mai.

Maybe I should try bank in her local town before going the yellow book registration?

Does the registration give me any benefits ie free local hospital treatment?

Sent from my [device_name] using http://Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

You are asking a bunch of strangers (who could turn out to be your gf ) about the real motives of your so called girlfriend then you insist she is a good person.Many of your questions regarding visa and banking you could easily find out from the relevant department which makes the answers most reliable, but you prefer to have someone you cant even see spoonfeed you with answers. So what if they gave you a wrong answer and eventually you get into trouble from that? Who else but yourself is going to be responsible? If you dont even have another friend who could help you be an interpreter when making queries from the immigration or the bank, you are seriously target number one for a scam. Just go to bangkok where the authorities could speak English. Even where I live at the Eastern Seaboard, the bank officers could. Did you even move your ass to find things out for yourself?

[phuketrichard]

19 hours ago, elviajero said:

It is a credit card. Thai banks will sometimes issue them with a security deposit.

if u need leave a security deposit its NOT a credit card.....

Credit means the bank is giving you CREDIT for ur use and u pay it the next month

 

Quote

A credit card is a payment card issued to users (cardholders) to enable the cardholder to pay a merchant for goods and services based on the cardholder's promise to the card issuer to pay them for the amounts so paid plus the other agreed charges.^[1] The card issuer (usually a bank) creates a revolving account and grants a line of credit to the cardholder, from which the cardholder can borrow money for payment to a merchant or as a cash advance.

note it says "promise to pay" and bank grants a "line of credit"

Edited March 4, 2018 by phuketrichard

[jackdd]

27 minutes ago, phuketrichard said:

if u need leave a security deposit its NOT a credit card.....

Credit means the bank is giving you CREDIT for ur use and u pay it the next month

 

note it says "promise to pay" and bank grants a "line of credit"

The problem is that the banks use confusing terms them self.

For example the term "Secured credit card" which is made up by US banks.

So you can't really expect that all the customers understand the differences

[bluesofa]

14 minutes ago, jackdd said:

The problem is that the banks use confusing terms them self.

For example the term "Secured credit card" which is made up by US banks.

So you can't really expect that all the customers understand the differences

Surely it is down to the customer to ensure they understand what they are applying for, before signing the form?

It is a subject they need to be pedantic about - it's their money here.

 

There have been so many people in the UK who have been "miss-sold" insurance. What it really means is the the companies did their level best to make the contract in their favour, by making it very difficult to understand.

 

Do US banks really use the term "secured credit card"? That's an oxymoron itself!

Edited March 4, 2018 by bluesofa
misprit

[jackdd]

2 minutes ago, bluesofa said:

Surely it is down to the customer to ensure they understand what they are applying for, before signing the form?

It is subject you need to be pedantic about - it's your money here.

 

There have been so many people in the UK who have been "miss-sold" insurance. What it really means is the the companies did their level best to make the contract in their favour, making it very difficult to understand.

 

Do US banks really use the term "secured credit card"? That's an oxymoron itself!

If i google "secured credit card" i mostly see stuff from US banks / companies, so i assume the term is coming from there.

And if a customer signed up for a "secured credit card" he will of course say that he has a credit card... even if it's actually more like a debit card.

[youreavinalaff]

21 hours ago, overherebc said:

I'm in agreement with you on this. 

Auntie get's turned down for the loan so lopsided thinking kicks in, get your foreign boyfriend's name on the house book and they will think we have loads of money on tap.

Has the auntie 'borrowed' from somewhere in the past and now sees a way to get a legal loan etc etc.

Could go down a few roads this one and none of them are well paved.

Total rubbish. You can't even register a foreigner on the house book.

[jobwolf]

In very short terms. You should be very careful since you will be held responsible for any debts, Credit card or home or any other thing. Check facts not fiction.

[BritTim]

3 minutes ago, jobwolf said:

In very short terms. You should be very careful since you will be held responsible for any debts, Credit card or home or any other thing. Check facts not fiction.

I have never heard of anyone being held responsible for the debts of someone else (even a relative) just because they are registered at the same address. I really think there is a lot of paranoia being expressed in this thread. An address registration (whether certificate of residence or name in a yellow house book) is just that. It may be useful for other purposes, but carries no risk in and of itself. Now, getting a credit card (if you do not handle it carefully) could carry risks.

 

I have read through this thread, and I see all the signs of a girl becoming very attached to the OP. I see nothing to worry about unduly except a relationship that could be hard to break off, regardless of address registration.

[Tony125]

On 3/1/2018 at 2:25 PM, ubonjoe said:

The registration would be getting a yellow house book based upon her mother's house book. Not that easy to get at many Amphoes.

Having a yellow house book does not the exempt you from the TM30 being done.

No need to change your address unless you want to.

Not sure why your are having problems opening another bank account. Just keep trying at different banks and branches of the same bank. 

Not so sure that is true anymore. I went to several branches 5 years ago and even though being denied at Citi and Bangkok Bank because no work permit was able to open accounts at both with my retirement extension after trying different branches.. Tried to open and account for a friend at Bangkok Bank at Mall on   Ngam wan road  (where I have an account)  and at immigration building on Chang Wattena Rd both refused my friend (on tourist exempt) without a letter from the embassy. I showed the requirements from their web site saying what was required including  could use recomendation from a customer but they said new rules as they are being audited now  for checking if farangs are legally in country and want letter from embassy stating passport info is correct and they are on approved visa. Said the web site was not updated to show that yet.

Edited March 4, 2018 by Tony125

[NanLaew]

On 3/1/2018 at 6:53 PM, BritTim said:

The benefit for her is that it makes it easier for you to pay for things.

Huh? How's that work?

 

 

Edited March 4, 2018 by NanLaew

[NanLaew]

13 minutes ago, BritTim said:

I really think there is a lot of paranoia being expressed in this thread.

With your earlier post (above) you aint doing too bad a job on the paranoia front yourself.

[NanLaew]

Pretty simple.

 

The girl likes the OP.

 

But he's been banging on ad nauseuam to her about the difficulties of opening a bank account.

 

So she has suggested getting a yellow book that's linked to her family home blue book will make that easier. It may and it may not, depends very much on the bank, the bank account person working that day and the day of the week. Note the moon phase is less critical here.

 

No ulterior motives, no joint accounts, no risk as it is the formal registration of an alien at a Thai residential address.

 

Just endless paranoia by the usual suspects... many of whom are currently (still) in their mum's bedsit in Ealing.

[overherebc]

1 hour ago, youreavinalaff said:

Total rubbish. You can't even register a foreigner on the house book.

Ok wrong name used. Registered at that address on some bit of official paper.

[chuang]

Another Paranoid farang.....

[Jingjock]

On ‎3‎/‎1‎/‎2018 at 3:58 AM, darrendsd said:

I really can't see the benefit of being on the book however there are far more knowledgeble (sp) people than me on this forum

 

If you follow your plan to leave there is really no reason at all, tell your GF that there is no point as you will be leaving in 10 months, if she kicks up a stink that should tell you something

 

I have no idea if she is playing the long game but bear in mind that in Thailand it's family first, if you're lucky you come somewhere between the house Gecko and the family dog,  

Well said agree 100 %, normally its between the Gecko and the flee (Farang) on the dogs back. She has a motive, keep clear as much as possible