Declaring cash on arrival at Suvarnabhumi good or bad idea?

[capriole]

Hi guys, 

 

I know that an individual can carry up to $20,000 without the need to declare it to customs when arriving in Thailand but has anyone tried to carry more than that? I would like to bring $80000 (between me and my partner) as we are planning to buy some land. I don't mind declaring it as the money is legit (we both work in bahrain)  and I can carry with me the bank and exchange slips but I am worried whether the customs guys see an opportunity to 'make' some money. The reason I want to do that is to save on the currency exchange rate (which is bad currently) but if it means that I am opening an opportunity for customs then I might as well avoid the hassle. 

 

Anyone has done it recently and if yes what other papers may be required? 

 

Thanks

[simoh1490]

You must declare the money otherwise you cannot buy the land, the money to do that must come from outside Thailand and the customs report is proof of that.

 

BUT only Thai people can own land!

[capriole]

1 minute ago, simoh1490 said:

You must declare the money otherwise you cannot buy the land, the money to do that must come from outside Thailand and the customs report is proof of that.

 

BUT only Thai people can own land!

Hi simoh1940, 

 

Yes I am aware of the ownership rules, the money will come from outside thailand (coming from bahrain) so no issue there either. My only concern is if the customs officers see an opportunity to make money by requesting further document etc, I will be with my partner anyway so I hope that speaking in thai to them might help. I guess what I am trying to find is what else can I do (other than having the bank & exchange slips) to ensure that I will not have any issues with the money declaration.

 

Regards 

 

[lovelomsak]

I hope you see this as advice  if not sorry I apologize now.

  If you do not need the money right away. As in takes time to do all the paper work for land purchase. I would come here then   write checks that would be after exchange less than 500,000 baht in each transaction till i had it all here. The less than 500,000 is to avoid money laundering suspicion.

   You should get the TT  rate also for exchange and cost is minimal. But check before you do this to see how long your bank holds the check before they clear it. For me from Canada it is 6 working weeks.

 Also bring maximum allowed undeclared .

[capriole]

16 minutes ago, lovelomsak said:

I hope you see this as advice  if not sorry I apologize now.

  If you do not need the money right away. As in takes time to do all the paper work for land purchase. I would come here then   write checks that would be after exchange less than 500,000 baht in each transaction till i had it all here. The less than 500,000 is to avoid money laundering suspicion.

   You should get the TT  rate also for exchange and cost is minimal. But check before you do this to see how long your bank holds the check before they clear it. For me from Canada it is 6 working weeks.

 Also bring maximum allowed undeclared .

Hi lovelomsak, 

 

Unfortunately we cant wait six or four weeks as we are travelling to thailand in the coming weekend and we will be going up north immediately to complete the purchase. Actually I will not be taking part in any negotiations or agreement (my role is completely in the background) anywhere near the purchase and that will take place between my thai partner and the sellers in the village. The sellers are in need of the money and thats why this has to be a quick turnaround so the process of waiting is not possible. 

May I ask why you you mean with by "avoid money laundering suspicion", is that from the canadian authorities or the thai authorities?

 

Regards

[simoh1490]

30 minutes ago, lovelomsak said:

I hope you see this as advice  if not sorry I apologize now.

  If you do not need the money right away. As in takes time to do all the paper work for land purchase. I would come here then   write checks that would be after exchange less than 500,000 baht in each transaction till i had it all here. The less than 500,000 is to avoid money laundering suspicion.

   You should get the TT  rate also for exchange and cost is minimal. But check before you do this to see how long your bank holds the check before they clear it. For me from Canada it is 6 working weeks.

 Also bring maximum allowed undeclared .

I don't believe that money laundering is an issue, foreigners frequently transfer large sums to Thailand and state the reason is to buy real estate. The simplest and easiest way is to do a bank transfer if the funds are converted here (which they must be) the difference between the TT rate and the cash rate is going to be very very small plus there will not be any potential security or Customs issues to worry about.

[TerryLH]

1 hour ago, simoh1490 said:

You must declare the money otherwise you cannot buy the land, the money to do that must come from outside Thailand and the customs report is proof of that.

 

BUT only Thai people can own land!

Since a Thai is buying the property, they shouldn't need to show they money came from abroad.

 

Terry

[simoh1490]

2 minutes ago, TerryLH said:

Since a Thai is buying the property, they shouldn't need to show they money came from abroad.

 

Terry

Indeed! Except if at some point in the future the relationship turns sour and the friends part company and end up in court over the purchase (it does happen, believe me), having proof that they actually paid for the purchase will be useful.

[capriole]

The issue is not the property but whether carrying that amount of cash will raise questions for the customs officers (further than normal) and give the opportunity for them making a 'donation' so ta say and causing delays.
As I said we need the cash in order to make the transaction asap hence the choice to carry the cash.

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[capriole]

Forgot to mention that I am planning to bring USD and exchange them in Thailand as the rate is much better y than exchanging Bahraini dinars.

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[simoh1490]

Dunno!

 

If I was a Customs officer in any country's airport and I found somebody carrying USD 80k in cash, I'd wonder why they hadn't used the banking system, like everyone else and answers such as, "I'm saving money on the exchange rate/transfer cost", really don't wash, what that might lead to who knows.

 

 

[simon43]

AFAIK, if you don't declare the money to customs, and it is discovered, then the whole amount can be confiscated.

[capriole]

AFAIK, if you don't declare the money to customs, and it is discovered, then the whole amount can be confiscated.

I am not even thinking to take that risk as I said I don't have anything to hide so no issue presenting to them the bank slips and the exchange slip from Bahrain even a salary payslip if needed but as there aren't any rules describing what they might ask for clarification of funds source everything is open to interpretation and that's something I am not comfortable with when it comes to thai custom officers [emoji6]

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[observer90210]

I would be very cautious if anybody pushed me to rush into a transaction, mainly regarding land and mainly in Thailand. I would take a lawyer to conduct a minimum of dilligence regarding the legitimacy of the land and get some good advice on what would be my interests in case the relationship breaks up with my Thai partner. And definately would not give in all the cash until all the paperwork is done and get it duly translated by an independant lawyer to see exactly in what I am pushing cash. Don't bring the full amount and don't get caught into any story saying the villagers need to money fast. Better loose a deal then loose all your hard earned money,

[beachproperty]

$80,000 = 2,500,000 Baht ....."going north" to purchase the property.

?????? seems kinda of expensive for "Northern" property. Not so sure seller is anxious because he needs the money ....more likely he's anxious because he has a buyer (you) and wants to close as soon as possible before he loses his sucker

[capriole]

1 hour ago, observer90210 said:

I would be very cautious if anybody pushed me to rush into a transaction, mainly regarding land and mainly in Thailand. I would take a lawyer to conduct a minimum of dilligence regarding the legitimacy of the land and get some good advice on what would be my interests in case the relationship breaks up with my Thai partner. And definately would not give in all the cash until all the paperwork is done and get it duly translated by an independant lawyer to see exactly in what I am pushing cash. Don't bring the full amount and don't get caught into any story saying the villagers need to money fast. Better loose a deal then loose all your hard earned money,

 

Let me clarify things a little:

• 90% of the money is my partner's savings so I am only risking a 10% which is not going to break the bank if things go south with my partner :)
• I am assuming that the minimum diligence in this case is taken by the bank who hold the chanote for the land in question, hence the quick need for cash from the sellers to pay back the loan against the land and maybe make some small profit, either way the whole deal will take place between the partner <-> bank <-> seller.
• the price is 2000000 baht for 23 rai, making it ~ 87000 baht / rai for prime rice fields with a small canal running through it giving the advantage of two yields in the year something not easy in that part of issan from what I have seen so I do think its a reasonable price. 

 

So getting back in track, has anyone done what I asked, enter thailand with an amount between 60000 - 100000 USD and declaring in customs, and if yes what type of documentation was required? 

 

Regards

Edited March 4, 2018 by capriole
correction

[NanLaew]

1 hour ago, beachproperty said:

$80,000 = 2,500,000 Baht ....."going north" to purchase the property.

?????? seems kinda of expensive for "Northern" property. Not so sure seller is anxious because he needs the money ....more likely he's anxious because he has a buyer (you) and wants to close as soon as possible before he loses his sucker

Sold my 12 year-old Isaan pile for 12 mill last year when things got a bit tight.

 

Oh sorry, that's northeastern and not northern property.

[SidJames]

Take pictures of the cash & copies of prove of how it was obtained.

Have your phone on & make sure that it's recording sound when you declare the money.

It's your partner who's doing the declaration so you may well be asked to sign documentation stating that you have no claim over it.

Your partner is legally allowed to bring overseas saving back into Thailand.

They may however have to answer to the Thai tax people in the future to see if they are any taxes due to the Thai government.

Does Bahrain have a dual taxation agreement with Thailand?

Maybe you declare the money as your savings & are here with a view to buying a condo then maybe a very good land deal comes up & you decide to lend or gift your partner the money to purchase this land?

 

[NanLaew]

From IATA website.

Currency

Currency Import regulations:

Local currency: up to THB 50,000.- per person or THB 100,000.- per family holding one passport.
Foreign currencies: unlimited. However, amounts of foreign currency exceeding USD 20,000.- (or equivalent) must be declared to a Customs Officer upon arrival by all travelers.

 

From Thai Customs website.

 

Foreign Currency Declaration at the Suvarnabhumi Airport

 

The travelers who bring in or out of Thailand of foreign currency, both a bank note and a coin, with the total aggregate value exceeding USD 20,000 or its equivalent has to report the Customs Department by submitting the following document to Customs officer :

 

1. A completed Foreign Currency Declaration Form;
2. A passport; and
3. A boarding Pass.

 

Inbound travelers who want to file the Foreign Currency Declaration Form can contact a Customs officer at Red Channel Goods to Declare .

 

If you are waiting for any members to offer advice on their experience doing exactly the same rush-job foreign currency import as you are planning, you may be in for a long wait. Typically, a condo or property purchase is better organized with no great rush to bring hard cash in. The paperwork that links a formal inbound remittance of funds from overseas for property purchase is a formality handled by a bank. However, if this is all in your partners name and you are just a partial 'mule' then it doesn't matter.

 

Either way, if a formal declaration is made at the Red Chanel and the declaration approve and signed off by Thai Customs, I don't see that Thai Customs are going to ask for a percentage.

 

As mentioned earlier, if they find the undeclared cash, it's gone.

 

 

[NanLaew]

8 minutes ago, SidJames said:

Take pictures of the cash & copies of prove of how it was obtained.

Have your phone on & make sure that it's recording sound when you declare the money.

It's your partner who's doing the declaration so you may well be asked to sign documentation stating that you have no claim over it.

Your partner is legally allowed to bring overseas saving back into Thailand.

They may however have to answer to the Thai tax people in the future to see if they are any taxes due to the Thai government.

Does Bahrain have a dual taxation agreement with Thailand?

Maybe you declare the money as your savings & are here with a view to buying a condo then maybe a very good land deal comes up & you decide to lend or gift your partner the money to purchase this land?

 

I don't think Thai Customs are into chasing foreigners to sign off on funds for a Thai partners property purchase; that's for land offices and the like. All that Customs need is to see the cash, verify the amount, sight the paperwork stating the origin of the cash and the completed declaration.

[capriole]

45 minutes ago, SidJames said:

Take pictures of the cash & copies of prove of how it was obtained.

Have your phone on & make sure that it's recording sound when you declare the money.

It's your partner who's doing the declaration so you may well be asked to sign documentation stating that you have no claim over it.

Your partner is legally allowed to bring overseas saving back into Thailand.

They may however have to answer to the Thai tax people in the future to see if they are any taxes due to the Thai government.

Does Bahrain have a dual taxation agreement with Thailand?

Maybe you declare the money as your savings & are here with a view to buying a condo then maybe a very good land deal comes up & you decide to lend or gift your partner the money to purchase this land?

 

 

Does a bank statement withdrawing the money (in the name of my partner) account for that? The declaration will be made by my partner as the name in the cash withdrawal slip from the bank for the $70000 its in her name and so will be the slip from the currency exchange (BHD to USD).  My name is only on the remaining amount.

 

There is a dual taxation agreement treaty between  bahrain and thailand and as in bahrain there is no personal tax liability in place I assume that there aren't any taxes due in thailand. Based on that treaty both me and my partner are considered residents of bahrain hence there is a second option available for me to declare the money as mine if needed (and could support that with my salary certificate) and explain that we are planning to buy property as you mention.  

 

 

38 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

From IATA website.

Currency

Currency Import regulations:

Local currency: up to THB 50,000.- per person or THB 100,000.- per family holding one passport.
Foreign currencies: unlimited. However, amounts of foreign currency exceeding USD 20,000.- (or equivalent) must be declared to a Customs Officer upon arrival by all travelers.

 

From Thai Customs website.

 

Foreign Currency Declaration at the Suvarnabhumi Airport

 

The travelers who bring in or out of Thailand of foreign currency, both a bank note and a coin, with the total aggregate value exceeding USD 20,000 or its equivalent has to report the Customs Department by submitting the following document to Customs officer :

 

1. A completed Foreign Currency Declaration Form;
2. A passport; and
3. A boarding Pass.

 

Inbound travelers who want to file the Foreign Currency Declaration Form can contact a Customs officer at Red Channel Goods to Declare .

 

If you are waiting for any members to offer advice on their experience doing exactly the same rush-job foreign currency import as you are planning, you may be in for a long wait. Typically, a condo or property purchase is better organized with no great rush to bring hard cash in. The paperwork that links a formal inbound remittance of funds from overseas for property purchase is a formality handled by a bank. However, if this is all in your partners name and you are just a partial 'mule' then it doesn't matter.

 

Either way, if a formal declaration is made at the Red Chanel and the declaration approve and signed off by Thai Customs, I don't see that Thai Customs are going to ask for a percentage.

 

As mentioned earlier, if they find the undeclared cash, it's gone.

 

 

 

As you are mentioning my name will be nowhere except of the arrival card :)  so its all thai to thai as far as I am concerned and I will just be the 'mule' in that instance. I am not even considering the option to attempt entering without declaring the amount, our only concern is the reaction of the customs officers and the supporting document that we might need as a proof of fund sources etc.

[JimmyJ]

It's my understanding that (unless the procedure has changed) upon declaring over 20k and filling out the form, you are to receive a copy.

 

Very important that you make sure you receive one.

 

The person who told me about that said that he didn't receive a copy and didn't know he was supposed to.

Upon leaving Thailand he explained that he had brought it in.

They asked for a copy of the receipt. When he didn't have it, they asked for a bribe.

When he refused, he ended up spending several months sleeping on the floor getting bitten by insects in a Thai prison.

Edited March 4, 2018 by JimmyJ

[capriole]

25 minutes ago, JimmyJ said:

It's my understanding that (unless the procedure has changed) upon declaring over 20k and filling out the form, you are to receive a copy.

 

Very important that you make sure you receive one.

 

The person who told me about that said that he didn't receive a copy and didn't know he was supposed to.

Upon leaving Thailand he explained that he had brought it in.

They asked for a copy of the receipt. When he didn't have it, they asked for a bribe.

When he refused, he ended up spending several months sleeping on the floor getting bitten by insects in a Thai prison.

Thanks Jimmy, but you are saying that your friend had a problem taking back some of the money he brought in and which he declared if I understand correctly  but in my case I will not be taking the money back, but still I would like to get a paper stating that we declared X amount as that might be needed also in the currency exchange office, plus it gives a sense of security. 

[stament]

It's risky, you could get robbed 

 

What flight are you on....?

Edited March 4, 2018 by stament

[capriole]

9 minutes ago, stament said:

It's risky, you could get robbed 

 

What flight are you on....?

why you interested to give me a lift? 

[HampiK]

It's quite simple. You walk into the red part of the customs and tell them you want declare the money.

Then you have to show them your money, they will count them and write everything in a big book where you have to sign as well.

After that you will become a slip where it states, that you brought the money into Thailand. 

For your security I would bring the paper from your bank where you had the money from (a withdrawal document).

 

And I not sure what will happen, when you exchange large amount as for example superrich, as they also want see your documents for exchanging money. So if you exchanging 80'000$ but you never had declared any money on arrival, this could become somewhere a red alert on some computer system (maybe not I am not sure how good the systems are connected or if for example superrich has to report money exchanges).

 

The main reason to declare would be:

- for bring it out of Thailand again

- for can use to buy something in your name, when you  need the FET

- You are on the safe side, when they would check your luggage. If they check and find the money you can say goodbye to a big part of the money (if not declared).

[Sealbash]

The legal customs requirement is to declare funds over a certain amount. Anything brought illegally across the border is smuggling. Are are looking for advice on smuggling funds across the Thai border?


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[stament]

1 hour ago, HampiK said:

It's quite simple. You walk into the red part of the customs and tell them you want declare the money.

Then you have to show them your money, they will count them and write everything in a big book where you have to sign as well.

After that you will become a slip where it states, that you brought the money into Thailand. 

For your security I would bring the paper from your bank where you had the money from (a withdrawal document).

 

And I not sure what will happen, when you exchange large amount as for example superrich, as they also want see your documents for exchanging money. So if you exchanging 80'000$ but you never had declared any money on arrival, this could become somewhere a red alert on some computer system (maybe not I am not sure how good the systems are connected or if for example superrich has to report money exchanges).

 

The main reason to declare would be:

- for bring it out of Thailand again

- for can use to buy something in your name, when you  need the FET

- You are on the safe side, when they would check your luggage. If they check and find the money you can say goodbye to a big part of the money (if not declared).

good point I was asked for source as over USD5k last time

Edited March 5, 2018 by stament

[capriole]

6 hours ago, HampiK said:

It's quite simple. You walk into the red part of the customs and tell them you want declare the money.

Then you have to show them your money, they will count them and write everything in a big book where you have to sign as well.

After that you will become a slip where it states, that you brought the money into Thailand. 

For your security I would bring the paper from your bank where you had the money from (a withdrawal document).

 

And I not sure what will happen, when you exchange large amount as for example superrich, as they also want see your documents for exchanging money. So if you exchanging 80'000$ but you never had declared any money on arrival, this could become somewhere a red alert on some computer system (maybe not I am not sure how good the systems are connected or if for example superrich has to report money exchanges).

 

The main reason to declare would be:

- for bring it out of Thailand again

- for can use to buy something in your name, when you  need the FET

- You are on the safe side, when they would check your luggage. If they check and find the money you can say goodbye to a big part of the money (if not declared).

 

Hi Hampik, 

 

Thanks for replying, thats  great information. My worry was the customs officers and them asking for a bribe but as I haven't seen that being an issue (so far no-one mention that they had a problem like that on the way in) it seems that is a standard process. Also as you are mentioning declaring will help with the money exchange as even in Bahrain they are asking the bank withdrawal slip for the exchange to USD.

 

 

[capriole]

6 hours ago, Sealbash said:

The legal customs requirement is to declare funds over a certain amount. Anything brought illegally across the border is smuggling. Are are looking for advice on smuggling funds across the Thai border?


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You lost completely my point I am not asking advice about avoiding to declare the money (that is the objective from the start!) all I am asking if anyone has done and if they had run into any problems with customs officers. So where do you see the smuggling is beyond me!