EEK! What's happened to the 1 year Non I B visas?

[stevenl]

1 hour ago, Prince77 said:

I would object - I am living and working in Thailand since now 13 years and I am travelling back to Europe every 6-8 weeks to refresh mind and some business meetings. Same as if I go for a holiday to any other countries and therefore of course I need a multiple entry visa.

 

Addition: yes, I not got any multiple entry from outside Thailand since about 2 years, however, I got it here in CW last year.

You're objecting to what exactly?

 

Elviajero is recommending an extension of stay + multiple re-entry permit, which is exactly what you seem to have.

 

To those objecting to Elviajero's post and asking for proof: you're not going to get this in writing in Thailand, where immigration officers are granted leeway in their decisions. But the direction it is heading seems obvious: the push to get people living here an extension of stay in stead of a visa seems very clear to me.

Edited March 9, 2018 by stevenl

[wobalt]

You're objecting to what exactly?
 
Elviajero is recommending an extension of stay + multiple re-entry permit, which is exactly what you seem to have.
 
To those objecting to Elviajero's post and asking for proof: you're not going to get this in writing in Thailand, where immigration officers are granted leeway in their decisions. But the direction it is heading seems obvious: the push to get people living here an extension of stay in stead of a visa seems very clear to me.

Hmm...I am living in Thailand for decades and so know both systems - extensions and NON-O/B ME visas. And for me NON-MEs are the best(possibly only) solution. I am getting these visas due to the fact that I am married with a Thai, not to visit her. Due to our work my wife spent most of the time in Europe, myself in Thailand using our properties as base/hub for my business in Asia. I am currently not working in Thailand. Never had any problems with IOs/ consulates when I stated that my purpose to come to Thailand is “to live here”.
Of cause nothing is written, but there are Thai ways to deal with any decision. It particularly depends how good your network in the Thai world is.


Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[overherebc]

26 minutes ago, wobalt said:

Hmm...I am living in Thailand for decades and so know both systems - extensions and NON-O/B ME visas. And for me NON-MEs are the best(possibly only) solution. I am getting these visas due to the fact that I am married with a Thai, not to visit her. Due to our work my wife spent most of the time in Europe, myself in Thailand using our properties as base/hub for my business in Asia. I am currently not working in Thailand. Never had any problems with IOs/ consulates when I stated that my purpose to come to Thailand is “to live here”.
Of cause nothing is written, but there are Thai ways to deal with any decision. It particularly depends how good your network in the Thai world is.


Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

Same almost, contract work overseas and sometimes work in Thailand. Never had a problem getting a WP here when needed and never asked anything when flying in to Thailand. Each visa lasted 15 months.

Retired now so this will most likely be my last 'visa' when it ends. Probably still travel a lot so 90 day reports will be few if any and local office is not pushy on TM30/28 thingys, only if you change full time residence.

[varun]

Technically, you are working illegally (if you are living and working full-time in Thailand on 1 year multi-entry non-B visa)

 

Do you pay income tax in Thailand? Do you have a work permit?

 
If not, then the rules are very clear - best to get everything above board as soon as possible.

[PoorSucker]

9 hours ago, robsamui said:

and while we're at it - I still want to know - 

OH - SORRY - MY QUESTION WAS . . . HOW LONG HAS THIS INSANE 'EMPLOYEE CAN ONLY HAVE 3-MONTH B VISA ' RULE BEEN IN FORCE? Can anyone tell me?

 

Since 22 December 2017.

 

 

[exppenang]

I'm going to call viajero on his BS. Not on the "common worker" vs. manager or director, because the tide is turning in that direction.

 

I call BS on the existence of a re-entry permit. PLENTY of HIGH LEVEL Non-B holders with work permit have a re-entry permit. Think of someone who works as an officer for an MNC - they can and do need to travel out and back in frequently. A simple extension with no re-entry just wouldn't work for them.

 

Believe what you want, but I believe Elviajero is half full of crap.

[anon789561]

Elviajero isn't talking BS. He may well be correct in the actual purpose of the ME visa. I just argue that it's not written in stone and i didn't even know about the ME visa until last year and have found it suits me and saves me doing the extension which i find rather tedious. Nothing to do with money. i can extend and always have until i learnt of this option that just happens to suit my lifestyle. it's an old argument that pretty much gets the same kind of response i suppose but until immo tell me in no uncertain terms that i should start doing extensions again then i think i'll probably do another ME next time. we shall see anyway. one year at a time eh 555

[lkv]

I think some of you people that are calling  what @elviajero is saying BS, do not really understand what multiple entry non immigrant visas have been designed for, and what extensions of stay with re-entry permits have been designed for, from an Immigration point of view.

 

Meaning you have not been reading this thread carefully.

Edited March 9, 2018 by lkv

[JackThompson]

On 3/8/2018 at 7:19 PM, robsamui said:

So this time I go to a local agent to sort out my 14th consecutive 1-year Non Im B Multi visa and it's "Oh sorry - alien underlings who are too low-status to be directors or shareholders of a company, and who are mere employees, can now not  get a 12 month B visa. Only 3 months."

My guess?  They know getting an annual-extension is a pain (hint: they wrote the rules to make it that way), so hope you (or your employer) to go to an agent/lawyer, pay 10x or so more than the "official" cost, and everyone on up the chain, will all get brown envelopes.  Just combine the "Occam's Razor" principle with "Qui-Bono?" and the "why" of things is likely explained in full.

[stevenl]

5 hours ago, JackThompson said:

My guess?  They know getting an annual-extension is a pain (hint: they wrote the rules to make it that way), so hope you (or your employer) to go to an agent/lawyer, pay 10x or so more than the "official" cost, and everyone on up the chain, will all get brown envelopes.  Just combine the "Occam's Razor" principle with "Qui-Bono?" and the "why" of things is likely explained in full.

He's talking about multiple entry non B, not extension.

But hey, you got your rant in again.

[overherebc]

15 hours ago, exppenang said:

I'm going to call viajero on his BS. Not on the "common worker" vs. manager or director, because the tide is turning in that direction.

 

I call BS on the existence of a re-entry permit. PLENTY of HIGH LEVEL Non-B holders with work permit have a re-entry permit. Think of someone who works as an officer for an MNC - they can and do need to travel out and back in frequently. A simple extension with no re-entry just wouldn't work for them.

 

Believe what you want, but I believe Elviajero is half full of crap.

Why would a multi non B holder require a re-entry permit?

[dbrenn]

Rule changes can be annoying, but I can't understand why the OP doesn't just get annual extensions at his local immigration office - he has a work permit so should be eligible to do this. Then, he'd never have to do visa runs, let alone worry about the number of entries he'll be given on whatever whim prevails at the time. He'd also be on a path to PR and citizenship, if he so wished.

 

I've met a lot of people who stay in Thailand on low grade visas, even though they are entitled to more privileged status. My advice is to apply for anything that you are eligible for, just in case they change the rules later on ... 

[Mattd]

19 minutes ago, dbrenn said:

Rule changes can be annoying, but I can't understand why the OP doesn't just get annual extensions at his local immigration office - he has a work permit so should be eligible to do this. Then, he'd never have to do visa runs, let alone worry about the number of entries he'll be given on whatever whim prevails at the time. He'd also be on a path to PR and citizenship, if he so wished.

 

I've met a lot of people who stay in Thailand on low grade visas, even though they are entitled to more privileged status. My advice is to apply for anything that you are eligible for, just in case they change the rules later on ... 

Totally agree, anybody who is entitled to an extension of stay should do it this way, especially work wise, it makes no sense at all to have to go outside of the Country to make visa applications, it is far more expensive that way for one.

 

Like me, right now I am really regretting not applying for PR when I had the perfect opportunity, as the company at that time wanted to sponsor it, but I saw no benefit versus the long application process, it is only when you are in a position where it becomes precarious that you realise the advantages outweigh the disadvantages and having lived here for close on 30 years with children that depend on me etc. it really brings it home.

[JackThompson]

5 hours ago, stevenl said:

He's talking about multiple entry non B, not extension.

But hey, you got your rant in again.

 

He is being denied a Multi-B in Penang, due to new rules, which leaves him no other option (if not married) but an extension.  This was my point. 

 

It's time to get rid of this agent-payoff-IO corruption, so that the "rules" (official or unofficial) quit getting changed to hurt "good guys" and serve the corrupt.

[jackdd]

You live and work here for 13 years but never had the idea to stay here for 3 consecutive years with a visa extension and then apply for permanent residency? Seems to be quite smoother in the long run

[stevenl]

5 hours ago, JackThompson said:

 

He is being denied a Multi-B in Penang, due to new rules, which leaves him no other option (if not married) but an extension.  This was my point. 

 

It's time to get rid of this agent-payoff-IO corruption, so that the "rules" (official or unofficial) quit getting changed to hurt "good guys" and serve the corrupt.

And here we are again. If living here, the system is geared towards getting extensions, and slowly slowly people are pushed in that direction.

[MyFriend You]

On 3/8/2018 at 5:16 PM, robsamui said:

I never knew that - I simply thought it was an option that you could chose, and nobody (in 21 years) ever spelled it our for me, or published it via any government information channels. Thanks for putting me right!

 

 

Jeez, long term stayer on short term Visa, hundreds of stories like this abound.  Have your employer apply for the correct Visa, they have ben getting over on the Govt too long allowing you to work w/o the correct Visa - cheap as chips for them i suppose.

But if you have been here 21 years I am sureyou know a visa mill or two that will straighten it out for you.

[JackThompson]

3 hours ago, stevenl said:

And here we are again. If living here, the system is geared towards getting extensions, and slowly slowly people are pushed in that direction.

Yes, my point is the why of that - because extensions have a big corruption factor, (varying by office and type).  Do high-level people get a payoff if someone gets a visa somewhere?   Even if so, how much more if the applicant must pay 8x to 10x over-cost to an agent for an extension?  No wonder the system is "geared" that way.

[elviajero]

7 hours ago, JackThompson said:

Yes, my point is the why of that - because extensions have a big corruption factor, (varying by office and type).  Do high-level people get a payoff if someone gets a visa somewhere?   Even if so, how much more if the applicant must pay 8x to 10x over-cost to an agent for an extension?  No wonder the system is "geared" that way.

Sorry, but utter nonsense.

 

It is corrupt immigration staff and agents that take advantage of the system. 

 

Extensions are easy to get for anyone that genuinely qualifies, and corruption exists/thrives off the back of those that don’t.

[stevenl]

9 hours ago, JackThompson said:

Yes, my point is the why of that - because extensions have a big corruption factor, (varying by office and type).  Do high-level people get a payoff if someone gets a visa somewhere?   Even if so, how much more if the applicant must pay 8x to 10x over-cost to an agent for an extension?  No wonder the system is "geared" that way.

Nonsense. 

[JackThompson]

On 3/11/2018 at 5:07 AM, elviajero said:

Extensions are easy to get for anyone that genuinely qualifies,

That's what I used to think, until I genuinely qualified for one, and was denied - while those paying 8x more to an agent get one, *without* genuinely qualifying.  This occurred after I genuinely qualified for a conversion at the same office, and was also denied that time - because it was only available to those who genuinely qualify "through an agent."   

 

I think many folks who haven't run into the corruption fail to consider how many millions of baht are involved, and how high up that money must flow, to allow to ads published in the open, by companies offering faked-money extensions.

Edited March 12, 2018 by JackThompson

[stevenl]

3 hours ago, JackThompson said:

That's what I used to think, until I genuinely qualified for one, and was denied - while those paying 8x more to an agent get one, *without* genuinely qualifying.  This occurred after I genuinely qualified for a conversion at the same office, and was also denied that time - because it was only available to those who genuinely qualify "through an agent."   

 

I think many folks who haven't run into the corruption fail to consider how many millions of baht are involved, and how high up that money must flow, to allow to ads published in the open, by companies offering faked-money extensions.

I know quite a few people that had issues with extensions, and always there was something clearly identifiable that they did not meet the requirements. And I have never seen anybody who genuinely met the requirements and was denied.

[NanLaew]

20 minutes ago, stevenl said:

I know quite a few people that had issues with extensions, and always there was something clearly identifiable that they did not meet the requirements. And I have never seen anybody who genuinely met the requirements and was denied.

steven, meet Jack.

[josephbloggs]

On 08/03/2018 at 9:16 PM, robsamui said:

I never knew that - I simply thought it was an option that you could chose, and nobody (in 21 years) ever spelled it our for me, or published it via any government information channels. Thanks for putting me right!

 

 

Lucky that you haven't already had a hissy fit and quit your job!  Wait.......oh.

[varun]

On 3/9/2018 at 4:58 PM, exppenang said:

I'm going to call viajero on his BS. Not on the "common worker" vs. manager or director, because the tide is turning in that direction.

 

I call BS on the existence of a re-entry permit. PLENTY of HIGH LEVEL Non-B holders with work permit have a re-entry permit. Think of someone who works as an officer for an MNC - they can and do need to travel out and back in frequently. A simple extension with no re-entry just wouldn't work for them.

 

Believe what you want, but I believe Elviajero is half full of crap.

You didn't read carefully enough. He said multiple-entry VISA, not re-entry permit..big difference.

If you're living and working in Thailand full-time, you need to: 

1) Obtain a single-entry non-B visa

2) Obtain a work permit

3) Subsequently obtain a yearly extension of stay (linked to your employment/work permit)

4) A re-entry permit (if you wish to travel outside & return back to Thailand, during the 1-year period)

A multi-entry (business) visa is indeed for business-related tasks, not for full-time work/employment,

although it has been misused in this fashion for a very long time.

 

The litmus test is to ask the OP whether he has a Thai WP and/or is paying tax in Thailand.
If he does not, he is working illegally..simple as that.