Starbucks CEO says arrests of two black men 'reprehensible'

[webfact]

Starbucks CEO says arrests of two black men 'reprehensible'

 

Interfaith clergy leaders stage a sit-in at the Center City Starbucks, where two black men were arrested, in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania U.S. April 16, 2018. REUTERS/Mark Makela

 

LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - Starbucks Corp <SBUX.O> Chief Executive Kevin Johnson hopes to meet with the two black men arrested at one of its Philadelphia cafes last week to apologise for the incident, which has sparked accusations of racial profiling at the coffee chain.

 

The men, who had not made a purchase, were handcuffed and arrested for trespassing on Thursday after a store manager called 911 and reported them for refusing to leave. Witnesses said the men were calmly sitting in the cafe and in a widely viewed video, some patrons asked police whether they were targeted because they are black.

 

Police released the men, who were not charged.

 

"The circumstances surrounding the incident and the outcome in our store on Thursday were reprehensible ... they were wrong," Johnson told ABC's Good Morning America on Monday, amid protests and calls for a boycott on social media.

 

The female manager who reported the men to police has left the company, a Starbucks representative said.

 

The incident came at a time when the company is grappling with flat traffic and lacklustre sales growth at its more than 14,000 U.S. cafes. It is a high-profile public relations test for Johnson, a former technology executive who took the helm at Starbucks roughly a year ago.

 

Johnson, who was interviewed from Philadelphia, said it was "completely inappropriate to engage the police." He added that Starbucks would conduct training to prevent unconscious bias.

 

Representatives for the two men could not immediately be reached.

 

Protesters crowded the store that was the scene of the arrest on Monday morning. It was closed at around midday. More protests and a news conference are expected in the afternoon.

 

The Reverend Mark Tyler, part of an interfaith group organising a protest on Monday afternoon, said he had not heard reports of similar issues at other area Starbucks. Still, he said, "the idea of black people being unwanted in downtown Philadelphia is not new ... this is the underbelly of gentrification."

 

(Reporting by Lisa Baertlein in Los Angeles; editing by Susan Thomas and Jonathan Oatis)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2018-04-17

[impulse]

Wonder what would have happened of they called the popo on 2 white folks taking up valuable seats, not buying anything, and refusing to move along when asked?  If it becomes a trend, it could put coffee shops and restaurants out of business as non-customers displace the paying customers who actually support the businesses.

 

[bristolboy]

12 minutes ago, impulse said:

Wonder what would have happened of they called the popo on 2 white folks taking up valuable seats, not buying anything, and refusing to move along when asked?  If it becomes a trend, it could put coffee shops and restaurants out of business as non-customers displace the paying customers who actually support the businesses.

 

The question is would they have called the police on 2 white men who said they were waiting for a 3rd party to show up?

[impulse]

1 hour ago, bristolboy said:

The question is would they have called the police on 2 white men who said they were waiting for a 3rd party to show up?

 

I would.  They may be waiting for someone who never shows up- whether they really expected someone or not.  Meanwhile, those seats aren't generating revenue and some people probably aren't buying coffee because there's no place to sit down.  If they were taking up space in my cafe that I paid New York City type rents for, I'd ask them to buy something while they wait or relinquish their seats to customers who had already made a purchase.

 

If they refused, what are my options?  They're, in effect, taking money out of my pocket by sitting there.  You don't pay $5 for a Starbucks coffee.  You pay for a place to sit, rest your buns, and chat.  The coffee's included in the price.

 

[bristolboy]

53 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

I would.  They may be waiting for someone who never shows up- whether they really expected someone or not.  Meanwhile, those seats aren't generating revenue and some people probably aren't buying coffee because there's no place to sit down.  If they were taking up space in my cafe that I paid New York City type rents for, I'd ask them to buy something while they wait or relinquish their seats to customers who had already made a purchase.

 

If they refused, what are my options?  They're, in effect, taking money out of my pocket by sitting there.  You don't pay $5 for a Starbucks coffee.  You pay for a place to sit, rest your buns, and chat.  The coffee's included in the price.

 

The question of whether you would or not is not only not provable, but irrelevant. As for these men refusing to relinquish their seats to customers who had already purchased something, , I've looked that article over and over and nowhere did I read that the place was full and seats couldn't be found.

In addition to which, they were held for nearly 9 hours at a police station.

Sure, white people would be treated just the same way.

[i claudius]

To be honest the whole thing stinks .seems like it was set up the more i read about it.

Sent from my SM-A720F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[impulse]

1 hour ago, bristolboy said:

In addition to which, they were held for nearly 9 hours at a police station.

Sure, white people would be treated just the same way.

 

Your question was whether the cops would have been called had the guys been white, not how the cops would have treated them. 

 

The photo in the OP shows a bunch of people protesting (and disrupting a revenue stream) at a Starbucks.  Why not at the cop shop, or at the legislature that's drafted laws allowing the cops to arrest and detain someone for 9 hours for trespassing?  Maybe the cops were justified, maybe not.  I didn't see the interaction and whether they were baiting the cops to set up a lawsuit.   

 

In either case, the problem -if there is one- doesn't lay with Starbucks.  It lies with the authorities.

 

Edited April 17, 2018 by impulse

[bristolboy]

40 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

Your question was whether the cops would have been called had the guys been white, not how the cops would have treated them. 

 

The photo in the OP shows a bunch of people protesting (and disrupting a revenue stream) at a Starbucks.  Why not at the cop shop, or at the legislature that's drafted laws allowing the cops to arrest and detain someone for 9 hours for trespassing?  Maybe the cops were justified, maybe not.  I didn't see the interaction and whether they were baiting the cops to set up a lawsuit.   

 

In either case, the problem -if there is one- doesn't lay with Starbucks.  It lies with the authorities.

 

The way the cops treated them is just another example of how black men get treated differently.

 And as for irrelevancies what about this "I'd ask them to buy something while they wait or relinquish their seats to customers who had already made a purchase." Introducing how you introduce a completely invented scenario into this. What would motivate someone to embellish a situation like that? I'm sure whatever impulse moved you to invent it, it was an entirely honorable one.

[Jingthing]

These places are meeting places. No, I don't think white customers would have been asked to leave for waiting to meet someone, but I do think most of these places have a customers only bathroom policy, and that's enforced more evenly, though sometimes leeway for children or people that look like they're about to explode.

Edited April 17, 2018 by Jingthing

[poanoi]

i know myself, i either sit elsewhere, or i buy something to justify me sitting there,

they are trying to run a business and its not going well if freeloaders sit as they please for free. its a matter of consideration, of which those two negros had none.

ed: i dont tip either, it encourage corruption IMO,

the police in thailand for instance seem to have picked up on tip-bitching. "i want tea money or i wont do my job which i'm already being paid for"

Edited April 17, 2018 by poanoi

[Scott]

Off-topic posts and replies removed.  

[simon43]

Starbucks ain't no waiting room. Either you buy something or you get out. Simple as that.

[tingtongtourist]

they need to put up notice to say..

 " people taking up seats longer than 15 mins with no purchase will be charged $x service fee".

they should charge them the minimum drink fee.

 

Very similiar to the issue we read many times here on TV.

Farang Kee-noks sitting in a fancy pub for hours on end, sponging free aircon, watching pay tv sports, read free newspaper, use toilets..ands if lucky they buy might buy 1 plain water.

 

as for colour, what about the handkerchief on head mob teaching English?

they had the hide to take students to Starbucks for English lessons and treat the place like there own personal office.

 

digusting. these places are here to make money not cater to deadbeat scroungers.

[samran]

2 hours ago, simon43 said:

Starbucks ain't no waiting room. Either you buy something or you get out. Simple as that.

No, Starbucks are study halls, and start up incubators where they allow one person to buy a skinny full fat grande venti double whipped crappochino soy latte, and then proceeds to drink it slower than the rate of evaporation while they lay out their crap on a four top table and work the entire day. 

 

These blokes were waiting for 15 minutes as they were going to sit down and have a business meeting there, at which point they probably would have bought something had they had a chance. 

 

No differnet to me sitting in an upmarket cafe here in Bangkok last weekend waiting for a friend as his kid to turn up. I reckon I waited there 20 minutes refusing to order something until my friend turned up....you know cause I consider that good manners. Perhaps these bloke thought the same.

[Jingthing]

Sorry, white people in the USA, this stuff is real. 

There is such bias based on color.

If you're honest, you'd just admit it, as that's at least a start.

 

Quote

Black people have always complained about such incidents. Perhaps it's time to start believing them.

 

http://www.paywallnews.com/news/Opinion-|-What-white-people-can-learn-from-the-Starbucks-arrests.H1YrRg0b0mnG.html

[samran]

11 hours ago, i claudius said:

To be honest the whole thing stinks .seems like it was set up the more i read about it.

Sent from my SM-A720F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Clearly a deep state, false flag operation by the BLM mob. :D

[Jingthing]

9 minutes ago, samran said:

Clearly a deep state, false flag operation by the BLM mob. :D

Crisis actors, innit? 

[samran]

Just now, Jingthing said:

Crisis actors, innit? 

Yeah, pretty sure they were failed Hollywood types - scummy liberal types probably on welfare. No doubt illegal immigrants to boot. 

[PhonThong]

16 hours ago, bristolboy said:

The question is would they have called the police on 2 white men who said they were waiting for a 3rd party to show up?

What if they were Muslim? Would Starbucks be charged with a hate crime?

[Credo]

Calling the police should be the absolute last recourse.   They should at least wait a reasonable length of time before calling.   The amount of time should be a part of the store policy.   Once they have used the allotted time, then the store manager should find out if there is a reason and inform that they may wish to wait elsewhere or purchase something.   

 

The use of the restrooms is frequently restricted to paying customers.    

 

Not long ago, I was in a McDonald's where some crazy person was sitting in a booth and talking loudly to himself, with arms flaying.   Eventually he was approached, but he was pretty incoherent.   Eventually, they called someone (perhaps a security guard from a nearby shopping center or hotel -- he wasn't a police officer).   He spent several minutes with the guy and eventually got him to step outside to talk to him.   People were a little afraid to sit in that corner of the restaurant, so he was a real nuisance.   Once he was out, people began sitting in that section.   

 

I assume that eventually the police would have to come and take him out of the parking lot, but a very uncomfortable scene was prevented by trying quite a few things before calling in the police.   

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

13 hours ago, i claudius said:

To be honest the whole thing stinks .seems like it was set up the more i read about it.

Sent from my SM-A720F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

By the evidence of our own statement, the conclusion you draw is reliant upon what you have read.

 

We non of us have any idea what you read, so your conclusion is unsubstantiated opinion.

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

56 minutes ago, PhonThong said:

What if they were Muslim? Would Starbucks be charged with a hate crime?

Let's dream up other scenarios over which we can all be suitably outraged.

 

[scorecard]

16 hours ago, impulse said:

 

I would.  They may be waiting for someone who never shows up- whether they really expected someone or not.  Meanwhile, those seats aren't generating revenue and some people probably aren't buying coffee because there's no place to sit down.  If they were taking up space in my cafe that I paid New York City type rents for, I'd ask them to buy something while they wait or relinquish their seats to customers who had already made a purchase.

 

If they refused, what are my options?  They're, in effect, taking money out of my pocket by sitting there.  You don't pay $5 for a Starbucks coffee.  You pay for a place to sit, rest your buns, and chat.  The coffee's included in the price.

 

 

 

"Meanwhile, those seats aren't generating revenue and some people probably aren't buying coffee because there's no place to sit down. ...."

 

Is that the actual proven facts of this event or just your convenient words?

 

 

Regardless, Starbucks and many other coffee shops and other businesses have this same scenario and realize it's part of doing business. 

 

Further, if I came into your shop and was quickly questioned about why I was there and what I am going to order now, I would probably leave, thousands of other coffee shops with pleasant staff, good coffee and good atmosphere.

 

 

[impulse]

1 minute ago, scorecard said:

"Meanwhile, those seats aren't generating revenue and some people probably aren't buying coffee because there's no place to sit down. ...."

 

Is that the actual proven facts of this event or just your convenient words?

 

Why does that even matter?   

 

[scorecard]

1 minute ago, impulse said:

 

Why does that even matter?   

 

 

Why? Because the facts are the facts of the this event and should be respected in any ongoing discussion.

Not difficult to understand.

 

 

 

[lannarebirth]

1 hour ago, Credo said:

Calling the police should be the absolute last recourse.   They should at least wait a reasonable length of time before calling.   The amount of time should be a part of the store policy.   Once they have used the allotted time, then the store manager should find out if there is a reason and inform that they may wish to wait elsewhere or purchase something.   

 

 

Bingo! The police do not protect, nor do they serve, They wield power and most times it is wielded 

prejudicially and excessively. Any encounter with the police has the possibility of escalating and ending in someone's unexpected and unnecessary death.

[impulse]

26 minutes ago, scorecard said:

Why? Because the facts are the facts of the this event and should be respected in any ongoing discussion.

Not difficult to understand.

 

You mean like the history of the place, and how many others they may have asked to leave?  That also isn't in the story.  I've never seen a Starbucks that isn't jam packed at some point in their day.  Let people abuse the policy when it's not packed, and then you have real problems asking them -and others- to leave when it does get slammed.  All we really know is that they asked some guys to either buy something or leave.  That's happened to me, and I'm not black.  I usually buy something.  Not difficult to understand.

 

And then consider the progression of events that led from them being asked to make a purchase or leave, and them being held for 9 hours?  Think about it.  How many times did they have a clear opportunity to either buy a $1.00 bottle of water, or leave?   First, the manager.  Then, I'd imagine the cops gave them the option of leaving.  

 

I have personally witnessed the discrimination against minorities, and it's despicable.  Elevating something trivial and voluntary like this?  Just fuels the professional victims and alienates other, good people who scratch their heads and wonder why they didn't just pop out $1 for a water. 

 

Edit:  BTW, a water at Starbucks in BKK is 20 baht.  I always order at least that if I'm taking up a seat, even if I'm waiting for friends.

 

Edited April 18, 2018 by impulse

[impulse]

3 minutes ago, lannarebirth said:

Bingo! The police do not protect, nor do they serve, They wield power and most times it is wielded 

prejudicially and excessively. Any encounter with the police has the possibility of escalating and ending in someone's unexpected and unnecessary death.

 

I agree.  But that's no reason to protest Starbucks and disrupt their business.

 

[wwest5829]

16 hours ago, impulse said:

 

I would.  They may be waiting for someone who never shows up- whether they really expected someone or not.  Meanwhile, those seats aren't generating revenue and some people probably aren't buying coffee because there's no place to sit down.  If they were taking up space in my cafe that I paid New York City type rents for, I'd ask them to buy something while they wait or relinquish their seats to customers who had already made a purchase.

 

If they refused, what are my options?  They're, in effect, taking money out of my pocket by sitting there.  You don't pay $5 for a Starbucks coffee.  You pay for a place to sit, rest your buns, and chat.  The coffee's included in the price.

 

And, as a result of not thinking things through, how much business will this cost? I await further info. I would add that in these days and times, I would emphasize that there is more than profits that weigh on my mind.....

[impulse]

20 minutes ago, wwest5829 said:

And, as a result of not thinking things through, how much business will this cost? I await further info. I would add that in these days and times, I would emphasize that there is more than profits that weigh on my mind.....

 

That's a valid question.  But what is the societal and corporate cost when decisions have to be based on avoiding upsetting one group or another?  Thousands of restaurants, cafe's, doctor's offices (I threw that one in for dramatic effect) , and other businesses have policies that limit seating to customers.  I've been in hundreds of places that even post a minimum purchase to sit at a table.  Over a period of decades, that's probably increased revenues by many $ billions in the aggregate, and prevented all kinds of problems with people who have no legitimate business being in the doctor's waiting room (again, dramatic effect- that's a hyperbole).

 

Is anyone suggesting giving black folks a pass, because they're not to be upset?

 

Starbucks called the authorities because people were trespassing.  That's what you do.  After the cops showed up, it was out of their hands.  I'd agree the legal and enforcement system is out of control, but that's not on Starbucks.

 

Edited April 18, 2018 by impulse