So here is the dilemma, if not Thailand then where?

[Hummin]

There is some articles I can not link to, since they are not allowed in Thailand, and blocked. Anyway they include europeen as well, and both Phil and Thailand comes out pretty bad. 

 

But this one for American statistic only

https://lifehacker.com/the-countries-actually-most-dangerous-for-tourists-1794002926

[mogandave]

I’ve been to Mexico any number of times working and even more times fishing.

Outside of a few places, it is hideous.

The people seem to hammered down and without hope.

Sure, there are places you can go that are nice enough, but they are certainly not going to be anything affordable.

Owning property and the rule of law is worse in Mexico than it is here. At least here, they do not pretend you can own property, they let you know up front you can’t.

If someone has done hard data generated by an unbiased (if that is possible) source, I wound look at it, but until then, I’ll go with my own experience.

[mogandave]

And I have statistic I can not link to claiming Thailand is one of the most dangerous expat and tourist destination as well Phil. Google and she how many expats living in those ereas you are linking to. Be realistic when you claim facts. 

Can’t link to? That’s convenient...Is is from the Tourist Authority of Brazil?

[thaibeachlovers]

23 hours ago, MaeJoMTB said:

Nothing wrong with the beach in Vietnam (Vung Tau backbeach).

 

Oh my, I'd never stay there. Just look at all the people on it. Awful.

My favourite Thai beach was busy if 10 people were on it at the same time.

The gulf beach I stayed on south of Chumphon often had no other people on it than me and my wife.

Obviously I have been on busy beaches ( Chaweng, Lamai, Jomptien and Naklua ), but they have hawkers disturbing one all that time. As for beaches with jet skis and speed boats, like Larn, no way.

[thaibeachlovers]

20 hours ago, torrzent said:

Not even sure what a "post" sexual is?  Is this about mail order brides?  You should get with the times.

LOL. It means when one doesn't indulge any more, possibly post prostatectomy or suchlike, but still likes looking at pretty ladies.

[torrzent]

1 hour ago, mogandave said:

I’ve been to Mexico any number of times working and even more times fishing.

Outside of a few places, it is hideous.

The people seem to hammered down and without hope.

Sure, there are places you can go that are nice enough, but they are certainly not going to be anything affordable.

Owning property and the rule of law is worse in Mexico than it is here. At least here, they do not pretend you can own property, they let you know up front you can’t.

If someone has done hard data generated by an unbiased (if that is possible) source, I wound look at it, but until then, I’ll go with my own experience.

 

Good points; also many recent case of poisoning tourist with fake booze in mexico not to mention the infamous mexico medical scam

[JAZZDOG]

2 hours ago, torrzent said:

Have to agree.  It is hard to believe that a few name dropping blowhards on here keep talking about these crime ridden cesspools like Mexico, Brazil, Colombia as viable alternative locations.

For an American Thailand is far and away the preferred place to wake up dead. It is not even close, at 81/100,000 that is slightly less than # 2, 3 and 4 combined. The stats for Brits and Aussies are most likely much higher. Another factor which makes Thailand even more dangerous is if you consider the demographics of murder. The countries you state above as cesspools, Pattaya is not a cesspool LOL, the vast majority of crime is narco related and isolated to slums and favelas. As a 55 year old white, non-drug user living in a nice neighborhood in Brazil my chances of getting murdered are less than 5/100,000. That same white guy appears to be a prime candidate for the grim reaper in Thailand. These stats are for Thailand as a whole, I dare say what they would be for Pattaya but 200% higher is a possibility.

 

http://time.com/4250811/travel-safety/

 

Number of American Deaths Reported since October 2002	American visitors in 2014*	American Deaths Reported Annually/1,000,000 visitors
Thailand	348	339,000	80.5
Vietnam	106	246,000	33.8
Costa Rica	339	862,000	30.8
Philippines	259	708,000	28.7
Australia	153	431,000	27.8

*Data obtained from US Department of Commerce, National Travel and Tourism Office, July 2015

[JAZZDOG]

1 hour ago, mogandave said:

 

Can’t link to? That’s convenient...Is is from the Tourist Authority of Brazil?

 

 

http://time.com/4250811/travel-safety/

[simon43]

It means when one doesn't indulge any more, possibly post prostatectomy or suchlike, but still likes looking at pretty ladies

LoL, that sounds like me in Naypyitaw. No prostatectomy or suchlike, look but don't touch is the unwritten rule in town!

[Hummin]

33 minutes ago, JAZZDOG said:

http://time.com/4250811/travel-safety/

Interesting

 

If you are american, you have the same chance to die of suicide and motorbike accident in Thailand 

 

And it is a good idea to learn how to swim before go holiday, and choose your car with care and buckle up. That would saved alot of lifes 

[Jingthing]

In Mexico you can indeed totally own real estate if it is inland. If it is coastal land then there are a lot legal games that are necessary. Really totally different situations and definitely better than Thailand if you want to buy inland.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[mogandave]

In Mexico you can indeed totally own real estate if it is inland. If it is coastal land then there are a lot legal games that are necessary. Really totally different situations and definitely better than Thailand if you want to buy inland.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

Yes, the will indeed pretend you can own property.

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, mogandave said:

 

Yes, the will indeed pretend you can own property.

 

Again, NO, it is not "pretend" for INLAND real estate. I would agree with you about the schemes for coastal. Personally I wouldn't. It reminds me of the company owned schemes here. 

[mogandave]

http://time.com/4250811/travel-safety/

Yes, I’m not worried about committing suicide, dying in a motorcycle accident, bus accident or drowning.

I’m concerned about being robbed, cheated, burgled, assaulted or murdered.

That a US publication like “Time” wants to make a case about what a great place Mexico is does not surprise me.

One of the first things I noticed in Thailand was how much safer I felt than in Mexico.

I managed a manufacturing facility in Thailand for 17 years. Three instances of theft, one fight and virtually no vandalism.

Theft and vandalism in our Mexican plants is a daily occurrence, and fights happen monthly, sometimes weekly.

You go ahead on and have fun there brother, it’s not for me.

[mogandave]

Again, NO, it is not "pretend" for INLAND real estate. I would agree with you about the schemes for coastal. Personally I wouldn't. It reminds me of the company owned schemes here. 

Property rights (including ownership) is only as strong as the rule of law.

If you think you own it, try to sell it or pass it to your heirs.

[jerry921]

22 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

In Mexico you can indeed totally own real estate if it is inland. If it is coastal land then there are a lot legal games that are necessary. Really totally different situations and definitely better than Thailand if you want to buy inland.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

I think the rule is "within 100km of the coastline". In that zone you have to own property via a bank trust. It's not dodgy or pretend, just an extra hoop that you need a lawyer to help you with, and you have to pay the bank to set it up, and then it adds an annual cost of ownership because you pay the bank each year for maintenance/paperwork. A couple hundred bucks a year type magnitude. But it doesn't, AFAIK, impinge in any meaningful way on your rights as an owner, or your ability to sell the property or leave it to your heirs.

 

But I advise renting because the security situation could get worse and you don't want to become trapped in ownership of something you can't live in and can't sell - e.g. the people who own high-end condos in Acapulco.

But then it seems to me there some danger in owning property in Thailand too.

 

 

 

[Jingthing]

Yes, anyway, personally if I ever did move to Mexico I think I would rent unless I came across an offer I couldn't refuse.

 

The actual rule --

Mexico real estate located within the restricted zone of 100 km (62 miles) from the Mexican border or 50 km (31 miles) from Mexican beaches cannot be owned directly by foreigners.

 

BTW -- Merida to the beach is about 28 miles so theoretically there would areas near Merida that would be out of restricted zone, maybe anyway.

Edited May 10, 2018 by Jingthing

[JAZZDOG]

22 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

In Mexico you can indeed totally own real estate if it is inland. If it is coastal land then there are a lot legal games that are necessary. Really totally different situations and definitely better than Thailand if you want to buy inland.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

I owned a waterfront home in Barra de Navidad and as I recall it was a 99 year lease in a subdivision and was easily handled by my attorney via email before I ever arrived. In Thailand a condo is the only game and a poor one at that. You can rent a condo triple the price of one you could purchase leaving your funds in a modest account earning 5% and come out ahead along with being able to leave whenever you want.

[JAZZDOG]

6 minutes ago, jerry921 said:

I think the rule is "within 100km of the coastline". In that zone you have to own property via a bank trust. It's not dodgy or pretend, just an extra hoop that you need a lawyer to help you with, and you have to pay the bank to set it up, and then it adds an annual cost of ownership because you pay the bank each year for maintenance/paperwork. A couple hundred bucks a year type magnitude. But it doesn't, AFAIK, impinge in any meaningful way on your rights as an owner, or your ability to sell the property or leave it to your heirs.

 

But I advise renting because the security situation could get worse and you don't want to become trapped in ownership of something you can't live in and can't sell - e.g. the people who own high-end condos in Acapulco.

But then it seems to me there some danger in owning property in Thailand too.

 

 

 

100% correct, that was exactly the program when I purchased in 2010.

[2008bangkok]

I would like a decent internet connection in Laos

[jerry921]

I think I'm the one who first mentioned Mexico in this thread, and I'm willing to say "enough about Mexico".

It's an option. Some people won't like it, that's fine. Mexico will do fine without mogandave and torrrent.

It's got pluses and minuses. Mexico likely won't tick all the boxes for anyone.

The horror stories need to be taken in context of nearly 26 million US visitors each year, and contrasted with the Thailand horror stories.

 

I will say that in my nearly 2 years here I've not heard a single story about a foreigner committing "suicide" by "jumping" from a high floor condo.

 

I won't post any more about mexico in this thread unless people keep posting incorrect things about Mexico.

[JAZZDOG]

23 minutes ago, mogandave said:

 

Yes, I’m not worried about committing suicide, dying in a motorcycle accident, bus accident or drowning.

I’m concerned about being robbed, cheated, burgled, assaulted or murdered.

That a US publication like “Time” wants to make a case about what a great place Mexico is does not surprise me.

One of the first things I noticed in Thailand was how much safer I felt than in Mexico.

I managed a manufacturing facility in Thailand for 17 years. Three instances of theft, one fight and virtually no vandalism.

Theft and vandalism in our Mexican plants is a daily occurrence, and fights happen monthly, sometimes weekly.

You go ahead on and have fun there brother, it’s not for me.

 

Three points

1- The data was from the US Department of Commerse 

28 minutes ago, mogandave said:

 

Yes, I’m not worried about committing suicide, dying in a motorcycle accident, bus accident or drowning.

I’m concerned about being robbed, cheated, burgled, assaulted or murdered.

That a US publication like “Time” wants to make a case about what a great place Mexico is does not surprise me.

One of the first things I noticed in Thailand was how much safer I felt than in Mexico.

I managed a manufacturing facility in Thailand for 17 years. Three instances of theft, one fight and virtually no vandalism.

Theft and vandalism in our Mexican plants is a daily occurrence, and fights happen monthly, sometimes weekly.

You go ahead on and have fun there brother, it’s not for me.

 

A few points;

1- The data was from the US Department of Commerce

 

2- Statistics based on some place you worked aren't exactly definitive

 

3- When talking about robbery in Thailand if one includes dual pricing, tea money bribes and lawyers then it would appear robbery is the national pass time.

 

I used to own a home in Jalisco State and I agree with you I feel safer here.

[Jingthing]

Yes, it is true that Thailand does feel safe compared even to much of the U.S. 

To add, there is a lot of media that Merida is considered one of the safest areas on Mexico and Mexicans are moving there from Mexico City for that very reason.

OK, enough of my shilling for Merida as I haven't even been there!

Another city that some expats seem to like is Oaxaca. I did visit there and recommend it for that but it didn't click as a place I'd want to live. 

"They say" if you eat a spicy fried grasshopper in Oaxaca you will return. I passed on the insect. 

Edited May 10, 2018 by Jingthing

[JAZZDOG]

34 minutes ago, mogandave said:

 

Property rights (including ownership) is only as strong as the rule of law.

If you think you own it, try to sell it or pass it to your heirs.
 

 

Sold my home in MX and never had to even fly there. It was in a trust, the attorney handled everything. Maybe just lucky?

[torrzent]

15 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Yes, it is true that Thailand does feel safe compared even to much of the U.S. 

To add, there is a lot of media that Merida is considered one of the safest areas on Mexico and Mexicans are moving there from Mexico City for that very reason.

OK, enough of my shilling for Merida as I haven't even been there!

Another city that some expats seem to like is Oaxaca. I did visit there and recommend it for that but it didn't click as a place I'd want to live. 

"They say" if you eat a spicy fried grasshopper in Oaxaca you will return. I passed on the insect. 

Oaxaca (the state not just the city) is best for a Mezcal themed tour, some regional cuisine or for surfing.  Just beware of the sharks.  But sorry, as for Merida , there is no way Chilangos "are moving there from Mexico City for that very reason."  Totally different people and family/social networks and Mexico isn't a geographically mobile place like the states.  It would be like a Bangkok native moving to Roi Et.  Happens, but not so common methinks!

Edited May 10, 2018 by torrzent

[torrzent]

51 minutes ago, mogandave said:

Theft and vandalism in our Mexican plants is a daily occurrence, and fights happen monthly, sometimes weekly.

And one Japanese senior exec was kidnapped and held for ransom!

[torrzent]

22 minutes ago, jerry921 said:

I will say that in my nearly 2 years here I've not heard a single story about a foreigner committing "suicide"

Fake news....one of the highest rates of illegal drugs for foreigner suicides on the planet.

https://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/21/world/americas/21tijuana.html

[Jingthing]

23 minutes ago, torrzent said:

Oaxaca (the state not just the city) is best for a Mezcal themed tour, some regional cuisine or for surfing.  Just beware of the sharks.  But sorry, as for Merida , there is no way Chilangos "are moving there from Mexico City for that very reason."  Totally different people and family/social networks and Mexico isn't a geographically mobile place like the states.  It would be like a Bangkok native moving to Roi Et.  Happens, but not so common methinks!

I didn't say a huge wave. I meant some to highlight the obvious reality that crime is a big problem in much of Mexico and Merida has a reputation of being relatively safer.

Of course, you only need to be murdered once, ha ha. 

Yes, there is a big cultural difference and people from the "regular" Mexico have trouble being accepted there.

Edited May 10, 2018 by Jingthing

[ubonjoe]

Several inflammatory, baiting and bickering posts have been removed. A repeat of them will result in a formal warning.

[Hummin]

I am still considering Portugal for future, since as an Europeen, you have rights, health care, close to family and other relatives, and it is a good center point for travelling west and east especially nice weather of the coastline of Brazil. Only 7 hours away. 

 

But, so far as long I am happy here in Thailand, and the situation stays the same as now or better, life is easy in Thailand. It is mind of state as always.